View Full Version : New Colt has standard pins
I believe my new Colt 6920 has the standard pins. I also noticed a posting on another site where all new Colt 6920s and 6940s are getting the standrad pins. No more .170s. Sorry if someone has posted this already, as I didn't have the time to look through the recent posts.
I believe my new Colt 6920 has the standard pins.
Are you affraid to check? :confused:
Yes, I am afraid. I have never taken those pins out before and don't want to foul something up. They appear to be the same size as the FCG pins on my LMT (measured from the outside).
SwatDawg15
03-09-09, 18:01
Ok, first off you need to earn how to remove the FCG (trigger/hammer,ect). If you have a primer pop back and jam up the trigger, you need to be able to fix that right there. It will take you all of ten min. to learn.
don't be scared ,it is a lot easier than you think and after you do it once you will be thinking to yourself "man! that was so simple":D you need to learn to tear that weapon down as stated above a primer pop back it will jam up your FCG.YOU CAN DO IT!!!!!!
I started hearing this rumor at SHOT. It's too bad this comes at a time when prices are through the roof.
I look at it like this. My Colt has the STRONGER, THICKER pins. :cool:
OldNavyGuy
03-10-09, 08:49
Ok, first off you need to earn how to remove the FCG (trigger/hammer,ect). If you have a primer pop back and jam up the trigger, you need to be able to fix that right there. It will take you all of ten min. to learn.
if that long !!
Razorhunter
03-10-09, 09:42
Yes, it is true. Colt is now offering the standard .154" pins on the 6920, and also on the newly released Colt LE6940 Monolithic Advanced Law Enforcement Carbine.
Not sure if the .154" pins will be solely used from here on out or not however.
Of course, I never really cared anyhow. .170 pins were never a disadvantage for me, as all my Colts get used as carbines, and I maintain either the stock USGI trigger, or a slightly modified USGI trigger.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=124379284
I look at it like this. My Colt has the STRONGER, THICKER pins. :cool:
Yes, my Colt Pins also have more GIRTH than the standard.
I have confirmed the new 6920 (53xxx) has the standard pins.
Do any of you have a good link with detailed instructions for removing the FCG? Thanks
Nice to hear Colt has joined the standard in this feature.
I look at it like this. My Colt has the STRONGER, THICKER pins. :cool:
"Colt Classic" ;)
It is a good idea to know how to take out the FCG but remember if you work in LE you could bring liability down on yourself in a bad way if things go wrong in a shooting and you did work on your own gun without the "proper certification".:(
Razorhunter
03-10-09, 20:06
Guys, removing the FCG in an AR is not worthy of instructions.
You simply push the pins out with a punch, or the tip of a strong ink pen, etc.
I prefer to use a non-marring punch, but it's honestly difficult to mar up those steel pins even if using a metal nail set/etc.
Push the pins out and realize that there is a good bit of tension on them, as the hammer spring/etc is holding them in via the "e-clip-like" grooves in the pins.
Just pay a little bit of attention to the way the springs are oriented.
The simple instructions for learning how to do this, would be "look down into your receiver and apply common sense".
It's really that simple guys.
Medicine Calf
03-10-09, 22:44
My LEO4 has the .170. knew it at first glance when I pulled it out of the box, but just measured it anyway. If it had .154 pins, there would be either an SSA installed, or the fcg I pulled from an LMT.
Razorhunter
03-10-09, 23:46
What is an "LEO4" ???
Also, what is an SSA? Single Stage Adjustable?
Why would you have put an LMT in IF it were .154? Did you mean an "LMT 2-Stage" trigger? The stock Colt and LMT FCG's are basically the same.
I saw 2 fresh rifles from colt today a 6920 and a 6940 both had the .154 (smaller) fcg pins.
SSA is one of the newer non adjustable 2 stage triggers from Geiselle. Not sure what the acronymn is but there is an SSA for semi autos and an SSF for select fire. They also have several adjustable models for NM (national match) and DMRs (Designated Marksman Rifles)
It sounds simple until someone starts beating on their trigger pin not realizing that it is held in place by the hammer spring and they possibly damage the spring.
Guys, removing the FCG in an AR is not worthy of instructions.
You simply push the pins out with a punch, or the tip of a strong ink pen, etc.
I prefer to use a non-marring punch, but it's honestly difficult to mar up those steel pins even if using a metal nail set/etc.
Push the pins out and realize that there is a good bit of tension on them, as the hammer spring/etc is holding them in via the "e-clip-like" grooves in the pins.
Just pay a little bit of attention to the way the springs are oriented.
The simple instructions for learning how to do this, would be "look down into your receiver and apply common sense".
It's really that simple guys.
It sounds simple until someone starts beating on their trigger pin not realizing that it is held in place by the hammer spring and they possibly damage the spring.
Indeed. And if some dumb ass tries to drive out the selector in the same fashion. :eek:
(Some imbecile over on TOS actually did this a few years back)
Most people don't really need to be monkeying around with a gun's internals. There seems to be a romantic fantasy that you'll pull and extra hammer out of your crye camo chest pouch and change it out in the middle of a firefight with 87 zombies or some such nonsense.
Jay Cunningham
03-11-09, 09:31
When someone who has first-hand experience with a new LE6920 can confirm the pin size without a doubt, please contact me and I will re-open this thread. Until then it is locked for safe-keeping.
Jay Cunningham
05-03-09, 17:05
Now that we have some first-hand experience on this subject I have unlocked the thread.
Forgive me if this is an ignorant question, but I am when it comes to AR's. I freely admit this. Is there/what are the advantages of the .170 pin vs. the .154 pin? If there is an advantage, should I be looking to replace them? I have a Colt 6933 waitng at my local Class III dealer for the ATF to send my stamp to them. Thanks for the info. So far, I have nothing but praise for this site. MUCH better than another AR site I was on.
Forgive me if this is an ignorant question, but I am when it comes to AR's. I freely admit this. Is there/what are the advantages of the .170 pin vs. the .154 pin? If there is an advantage, should I be looking to replace them? I have a Colt 6933 waitng at my local Class III dealer for the ATF to send my stamp to them. Thanks for the info. So far, I have nothing but praise for this site. MUCH better than another AR site I was on.
The .154 pin is more common so there is more availability in finding those sized pins should you ever need to replace them (not really a big deal at all as these pins should outlast the rifle - and along this line of thought - the .170 pin should be stronger as it is thicker). This first notion here is moot and not a consideration in my mind. However, the .154 is better if you are looking to install certain aftermarket triggers as some only come with the .154 size pin size. Outside of this, people seem to like the .154 better because it is the AR-15 industry standard (compatibility). To others, it does not matter one way or the other.
Mine is serial 34xxx with .170 pins. Seems the 6920s with standard pins are serial ~5xxxx.
Can someone else with standard pin post up their serial ?
.154 pins - LE0571XX - confirmed at ADCO using digital calipers.
From researching tonight these are the serials that have the standard pins. Keeping posting them up if you have standard .154 pins.
46XXX
49XXX
53xxx
571XX
58xxx
The .154 pin is more common so there is more availability in finding those sized pins should you ever need to replace them (not really a big deal at all as these pins should outlast the rifle - and along this line of thought - the .170 pin should be stronger as it is thicker). This first notion here is moot and not a consideration in my mind. However, the .154 is better if you are looking to install certain aftermarket triggers as some only come with the .154 size pin size. Outside of this, people seem to like the .154 better because it is the AR-15 industry standard (compatibility). To others, it does not matter one way or the other.
You state the pins should outlast the rifle, oddly hammer pins are the only AR part I've had fail on me. To each his own, I guess. As always YMMV.
Jeff
I am curious about one thing. Why are they referred to as .154 in. pins when Colt refers to them as .155? That includes the material in their armorer courses as well.
Mine is LE056XXX and it has the .154 pins. In a previous thread GOTM4 said that the pins are the same and that the difference is very very minuscule in size.
OldNavyGuy
05-05-09, 10:04
If you have a primer pop back and jam up the trigger, you need to be able to fix that right there. It will take you all of ten min. to learn.
very true.., BUT ! sometimes that "popped" primer can cause the gun to go full auto.., and trust me on this, it COULD land you in a federal prison for a long time. this happened to me a few years ago, a primer popped and i had two 4 round bursts in a row, there was a FedLeo shooting next to me when it happened, he was very nice in that he helped me clear the spent primer from the FCG, we continued our shooting bullets then turned to shooting the (s)hit for the next hour or so, damn nice fellow, one with a heart and a brain.., rare among FedLeos :D :D
I am really curious as to how a popped primer can induce full auto fire. We have had umpteen of those issues here with our Bushmasters when shooting a particular type and lot of Prvi Partizan SS109 and they never went auto. Unless I am wrong (and someone correct me) you would have had to have had the appropriate fire control parts installed in your lower. Primarily they would be a trigger, hammer, disconnector and the key component a full-auto selector lever.
very true.., BUT ! sometimes that "popped" primer can cause the gun to go full auto.., and trust me on this, it COULD land you in a federal prison for a long time. this happened to me a few years ago, a primer popped and i had two 4 round bursts in a row, there was a FedLeo shooting next to me when it happened, he was very nice in that he helped me clear the spent primer from the FCG, we continued our shooting bullets then turned to shooting the (s)hit for the next hour or so, damn nice fellow, one with a heart and a brain.., rare among FedLeos :D :D
It sounds simple until someone starts beating on their trigger pin not realizing that it is held in place by the hammer spring and they possibly damage the spring.
Out of curiosity I want to check my pins. So can I just tap them out or what? Iraqgunz makes it sound like there's a little more to it than just tapping them out. I see the hammer spring resting up against what appears to be the trigger pin... what's the proper way to perform this work?
JH
Out of curiosity I want to check my pins. So can I just tap them out or what? Iraqgunz makes it sound like there's a little more to it than just tapping them out. I see the hammer spring resting up against what appears to be the trigger pin... what's the proper way to perform this work?
JH
Tap out the hammer pin first. Remove the hammer and spring. Then tap out the trigger pin.
Iraqgunz says that you must remove the hammer pin and hammer first before you remove the trigger pin/ trigger. If you try and punch out the trigger pin first eventually you will cause some damage.
Out of curiosity I want to check my pins. So can I just tap them out or what? Iraqgunz makes it sound like there's a little more to it than just tapping them out. I see the hammer spring resting up against what appears to be the trigger pin... what's the proper way to perform this work?
JH
Ok great makes sense remove the hammer pin & assy first then the trigger pin, etc. The hammer & trigger pins are usually the same size, right?
JH
Razorhunter
05-28-09, 17:25
Iraqgunz wrote:
" BUT ! sometimes that "popped" primer can cause the gun to go full auto.., and trust me on this, it COULD land you in a federal prison for a long time."
-Not true at all. You cannot go to prison, nor can you even be sentenced for having a completely legal, SEMI AUTO weapon that just happened to malfunction and go F/A on you. That's not illegal at all. No law was broken, and no illegal items are even in the shooters possession....
The hammer & trigger pins are usually the same size, right?
Yes, they are.
Iraqgunz wrote:
" BUT ! sometimes that "popped" primer can cause the gun to go full auto.., and trust me on this, it COULD land you in a federal prison for a long time."
-Not true at all. You cannot go to prison, nor can you even be sentenced for having a completely legal, SEMI AUTO weapon that just happened to malfunction and go F/A on you. That's not illegal at all. No law was broken, and no illegal items are even in the shooters possession....
You quoted the wrong person. OldNavyGuy wrote that ...not Iraqgunz.
Razorhunter
05-28-09, 17:27
Iraqgunz says that you must remove the hammer pin and hammer first before you remove the trigger pin/ trigger. If you try and punch out the trigger pin first eventually you will cause some damage.
What kind of damage? I would like to know. If you actually do try to punch out the TRIGGER pin FIRST, then what kind of damage are we talking about?
I will have to open up an AR in a few minutes, to refresh my memory, but I'm just wondering what kind of damage can occur?
Thanks.
What I said was that I was HIGHLY doubtful that it would even be possible for a popped primer to cause such a malfunction. I won't even go into the legal issue part of it.
Iraqgunz wrote:
" BUT ! sometimes that "popped" primer can cause the gun to go full auto.., and trust me on this, it COULD land you in a federal prison for a long time."
-Not true at all. You cannot go to prison, nor can you even be sentenced for having a completely legal, SEMI AUTO weapon that just happened to malfunction and go F/A on you. That's not illegal at all. No law was broken, and no illegal items are even in the shooters possession....
What kind of damage?
You can bend/damage the hammer spring. You can also deform the trigger pin by using excessive force to push it past the hammer spring. You also risk damaging the trigger pin holes.
Eventually you will damage the leg of the hammer spring if you do it often enough. Since the pin is hard to move people also tend to get a BFH and then start pounding on the pin. YMMV.
What kind of damage? I would like to know. If you actually do try to punch out the TRIGGER pin FIRST, then what kind of damage are we talking about?
I will have to open up an AR in a few minutes, to refresh my memory, but I'm just wondering what kind of damage can occur?
Thanks.
Razorhunter
05-28-09, 17:48
You quoted the wrong person. OldNavyGuy wrote that ...not Iraqgunz.
Oh my bad. Ok, well then by all means, my apologies to Iraqgunz! I honestly didn't think that he would have made an incorrect statement such as that!
I got you guys now though.
Thanks gentlemen.
On the issue of the pins/springs, and the order in which they are to be removed, I will definitely check out my lowers pins/springs, to make absolutley SURE I have never done any pin-removal in the improper method.
I have only ever removed the pins, one or two times per each of my lowers, and that was only for KNS pin installations. Now IIRC, I *THINK* I have always followed the KNS instructions EXACTLY, and if this is indeed true, then I will have no issues. HOWEVER, one always has to wonder if one of the pins COULD have possibly been removed in the improper order, and THIS is what gives me a little cause for concern, given this newly learned information.
SO, I will soon look over all of my lowers, in an attempt to check for any damage to springs I guess?
It sounds like I just need to peer down into each lower, and specifically observe the "LEGS" of each hammer spring, to see if there is ANY sign of a BEND.
I think this is right. I will check, and although I'm 99% certain all will be well, I just have to check, to be sure. Can't go losing any sleep tonight!!;) :p
J/K guys. Seriously though, I WILL be checking!
Indeed I did not know that damage could be caused if you remove the pins in the incorrect order. I'm glad to have learned this. Regardless of your experience, you can always learn something new every day, especially on this forum.
I do appreciate it guys. We are so blessed to have some of you guys on the forums, posting daily!
If you disassembled your lower once or twice then I highly doubt that there is any damage. If you are one of those who has to do all the time to make sure it's clean then there may be issues.
Oh my bad. Ok, well then by all means, my apologies to Iraqgunz! I honestly didn't think that he would have made an incorrect statement such as that!
I got you guys now though.
Thanks gentlemen.
On the issue of the pins/springs, and the order in which they are to be removed, I will definitely check out my lowers pins/springs, to make absolutley SURE I have never done any pin-removal in the improper method.
I have only ever removed the pins, one or two times per each of my lowers, and that was only for KNS pin installations. Now IIRC, I *THINK* I have always followed the KNS instructions EXACTLY, and if this is indeed true, then I will have no issues. HOWEVER, one always has to wonder if one of the pins COULD have possibly been removed in the improper order, and THIS is what gives me a little cause for concern, given this newly learned information.
SO, I will soon look over all of my lowers, in an attempt to check for any damage to springs I guess?
It sounds like I just need to peer down into each lower, and specifically observe the "LEGS" of each hammer spring, to see if there is ANY sign of a BEND.
I think this is right. I will check, and although I'm 99% certain all will be well, I just have to check, to be sure. Can't go losing any sleep tonight!!;) :p
J/K guys. Seriously though, I WILL be checking!
Indeed I did not know that damage could be caused if you remove the pins in the incorrect order. I'm glad to have learned this. Regardless of your experience, you can always learn something new every day, especially on this forum.
I do appreciate it guys. We are so blessed to have some of you guys on the forums, posting daily!
Just picked it up from my FFL yesterday. :D
Serial number 61,xxx with .154" pins
http://mysite.verizon.net/resreu7d/sitebuildercontent/sitebuilderpictures/6920web3.jpg
It's about time they did that.
So the only difference is the size of the pins? what about the stuff the pins hold in place, are they a different size?
If I had a lower with .170 pins, i can use any parts kit as long as use .170 pins?
ETA: Do you suppose colt will ever stop making .170 pins?
So the only difference is the size of the pins? what about the stuff the pins hold in place, are they a different size?
Yes, the FCG parts in the previous Colt 6920's have .170" pivot holes -vs- the .154" pivot holes in "standard" FCG parts.
If I had a lower with .170 pins, i can use any parts kit as long as use .170 pins?
If you have a 6920 with .170" pins, you'll have to use .170" FCG parts. All the other parts are standard size. There are a few aftermarket suppliers of FCG parts that will fit the oversize 6920's.
Does anyone know if the 6933 has gone to the .154" pins, or is this just true of the 6920?
Only ones I can confirm are the 6940, 6920 and 6721.
WyrTwister
06-01-09, 06:41
I look at it like this. My Colt has the STRONGER, THICKER pins. :cool:
Politically Correct ?
God bless
Wyr
Someone on arf said their 6520 has .154" pins as well. It would appear the entire "LE" line is going to standard pins. I wonder what they will do with the Match Target line? Not that it matters to me, I live in a free state and will only buy LE rifles. :D
Someone on arf said their 6520 has .154" pins as well. It would appear the entire "LE" line is going to standard pins. I wonder what they will do with the Match Target line? Not that it matters to me, I live in a free state and will only buy LE rifles. :D
I read on other sites that they have also changed those too.
I read on other sites that they have also changed those too.
It would make sense, no need to make two different size pins. That would probably cost more money.
WyrTwister
06-01-09, 13:48
It would make sense, no need to make two different size pins. That would probably cost more money.
More significant , perhaps , make two different receivers with different holes ?
God bless
Wyr
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