Reloading virgin needs some pointers

[BWYoda]

Fellas,

About to take the plunge and start reloading. I've had a quick look over some of the past posts to see what has been recommended in the form of starter kits. The Lee 50th or Lee turret kit seems popular. I plan to be reloading 9mm/5.56/.308. I'd like to buy quality gear which will last and will be easy to add on to/upgrade as I get more into it. Any pointers would be much appreciated!

[LonghunterCO]

The turret seems to come very recomended. I have several friends that started out on the Lee 50th also. They are both good kit. There will be some that recommed a progressive for your first press. I always recommend a single stage to start out. They allow you to focus on each step, and give you a chance to inspect the round at every stage of the opperation.

[Solomon]

You will never need to upgrade if you get any one of the following from the start:

Redding Ultramag (single stage)
Forster Co-Ax (single stage)
Redding T-7 (turret)

[LonghunterCO]

Even when you feel the need to move up to a progressive press your single stage will be of use for small runs of hunting ammo, breaking loose difficult crimped primer (not sure with the ammo you have mentioned but I load 30-06 and some of them are a bear) , etc.

[jmart]

If you get the turret kit, you'll need to add a rifle charging die, a double disk kit and trim pilots for .223 and .308.

I'd base your selection criteria on how much you think you'll be reloading. If a lot, I'd bite the bullet and get a 550 and just run a single case through at a time until you master the basics and get comfortable. The Dillon, with all the accoutrements will run over $600 (and more if you opt for electric case trimming) but if that's within your budget, I'd swing for that.

If that's too steep, then base your decision on Lee's SS vs Turret press based on your production requirements. If you plan on shooting a lot of any one of the cartridges listed, I'd recommend the TP. If you get a TP, get extra turrets for case prep for your .223 and .308s, or get the TP kit, plus a SS press for case prep.

My reloading history began with a Lee 3-hole TP kit, and along the way I added a Lee Challenger SS and Perfect Powder Measure. All was well until I bought an AR, then my production requirements went up and bought a Dillon. It's not that Lee doesn't produce good products, it's just when you need to crank out 500 rounds or more, you'll really be wishing you had a progressive rather than a SS or TP.

[Mark/MO]

I have loaded on the same RCBS Rockchucker press for 30 years. It was a kit my parents got me for Christmas when I was a teenager and became interested in reloading. Slower than a progressive for sure but IMO when starting out slower is better. The thing is get a quality press and it will outlast you if taken care of.

A Dillon progressive is a great press too. Several good friends have them and I use theirs at times. Someday I will have one as well. I think a single stage compliments a progressive rather than one replacing the other. Again simply my opinion. Good luck.

[BWYoda]

Thanks guys - lots of food for thought. The point is taken about the amount of ammo to be considered. I'll be reloading for a FAL and AR in addition to some precision rifle loads. From what I'm hearing here and from some other sources I think the rockchucker kit might be the way to go initially.

[dave5339]

I'll add another suggestion for the RCBS Rockchucker. Look for the Master Kit, it's almost one stop shopping on everything you need.

Also RCBS has a warranty that is just as good as Dillon's. They are no bullsh*t. I've called them up before, told them I did something stupid, and they still send me the part free of charge. Customer service doesn't get much better than that in my book.

I also find that the single stage press is a good platform to start learning on. It really slows you down and allows you to concentrate and understand each step of the process. Heck, when we first got our press, my wife and I reloaded 9mm by the bucket full one stage at a time.

If you are considering upgrading to a progressive in the future you might start with the Rockchucker Supreme and add an RCBS Piggyback IV on in the future, this will turn your Rockchucker into a progressive press. It may look rather Rube Goldbergish, but it works well. The only reason mine doesn't get used anymore is I caught a Dillon XL650 going stupid cheap on Craigslist.

Semper Fi

[markm]

I think a single stage compliments a progressive rather than one replacing the other.

That's what I hope to have some day. I have the Dillon 550, but I'd love a single stage to help when doing rifle ammo.

[boltcatch]

It's totally worth it. I was looking at reloading tools at Cabelas about 2 years ago and a salesman pointed out that the Lee Classic Cast press was on sale for $69 - the one that is the full 'O' frame and can fit .50 BMG with the proper bits to add on. I got lucky on that.

I don't prime on it, I don't use the various Lee addon-doodads to it, all I use it for is sizing brass and collet pulling bullets. I may start crimping on it, too, since my .223 Lee Factory Crimp die is crimping a little unevenly in my Dillon.

Currently I'm hand priming my .223 brass and then running it through an empty slot - powder - seat - crimp on the Dillon.

[1859sharps]

The turret seems to come very recomended. I have several friends that started out on the Lee 50th also. They are both good kit. There will be some that recommed a progressive for your first press. I always recommend a single stage to start out. They allow you to focus on each step, and give you a chance to inspect the round at every stage of the opperation.

I comprehend what your saying, but this line of thinking has never really made sense to me. My first and only reloading rig is a Dillion 550b. Nothing about it being a progressive has stopped me from being able to focus on each step and inspecting each step/round as I work through each step towards a complete round of ammunition.

I have toyed with the idea of buying a single stage just because I was curious. But the more I thought about it, the more I read and learned, the less that made sense. While I have a progressive, nothing thing says I have to use it in progressive "mode" all the time.

At times I use my "progressive" same as someone would a single stage. Generally when I do this, it's because I am working on a new powder/bullet combo or learning to load a new caliber and I want to "focus on each step".

Then once I have the details worked out, back to progressive "mode" for volume output. But even at this point, nothing say you have to try and set speed records just because you have a progressive. The goal is safe and quality ammunition, not volume speed records.

my 2 cents...(adjusted for inflation of course), if you want a turret, buy a turret. if you want a single stage, buy a single stage. If you want a progressive, buy a progressive. You can learn to reload safely and knowledgeably on any of them, IF you are willing to be patient and learn.

[1859sharps]

Thanks guys - lots of food for thought. The point is taken about the amount of ammo to be considered. I'll be reloading for a FAL and AR in addition to some precision rifle loads. From what I'm hearing here and from some other sources I think the rockchucker kit might be the way to go initially.

A quality progressive will assemble precision ammo for a FAL and AR just fine.

I used my dillion 550b to load some 308 for my son's Rem 700. His rifle is stock sps. original stock, original trigger. Basically as is from the factory. With hand loads off my 550b he shot 5 shot groups that could almost be covered by a quarter at 100 yards.

sierra 168 matchking with 40grains for varget.

I also use my progressive to load for my AR, which I use to shoot at the local CMP club.

A rockchucker is a quality piece of kit. If you think it will satisfy your budget and needs by all means buy one. But I hope your not buying it because you think you can't get precision ammunition from a progressive. I only bring this up because you say your reloading for FAL and AR, which can burn through ammo depending on your type of shooting. Some competitions and training classes for example.

[BWYoda]

Thanks Sharps. I've checked out the 550. A friend of mine has the Hornady AP which he swears by. I think the main reason I was looking at the Rockchucker etc. was because it came as a kit. Being new to this I really don't have much idea about what I would need in addition to the press to get started and one of the kits seemed like a logical first step. If I were to buy one of the Hornaday APs or a 550 what else would I need to start reloading? Checking out the Hornaday site is somewhat confusing and it looks like I could be spending a lot on additional parts and supplies apart from the press itself to get started. I know I need:

1. The Press
2. Caliber specific Dies
3. Case trimmer/chamfer tool
4. Case tumbler

What else would I need? Your point about volume is taken - for the FAL and AR I'll beed something which puts them out at a decent rate.

[LonghunterCO]

I think that the myth (which may have been true a long time ago) of not being able to load accuate rounds on a progressive was dispelled when Dillon started making presses. I am sure that many can run a progressive as a single stage, but for some that is not the case. Cost, for many, drives the purchase of a single stage vs. a progressive.

[1859sharps]

First, my goal is NOT to sell you on the Dillion just because I have one and like it. Just sharing some info, experience and personal opinion. in the end, you have to decide based on the info, your needs and your budget.

*note all prices are manufacture list prices from their web site*

Rock Chucker Supreme Master Reloading kit. $432.95
This kit provides the following

Rock Chucker
Scale
Hand priming tool
poweder measure
case lube pad
case lube
case neck brushes
case loading block
powder funnel
hex wrench set
debur too
loading manual

Extra stuff still need

primer flip tray
tumbler
case trimmer
case gauge
caliper
shell holder (about $8.00)

Dillion 550B
Everything you need to operate your reloader for 1 caliber not including dies for $406.95

extra stuff needed

case lub
primer flip tray
tumbler
caliper
case gauge
case trimmer
loading manual
scale

Dies. Neither the RCBS kit or the Dillion come with dies

Dillion offers carbide and non carbide dies for 223 and 308

Carbide dies = $ 135.95 for 223
$ 140.95 for 308

Non carbide dies set are $62.95


Redding dies run about $63 for a 3 die set.

I didn't list prices on things that "don't matter" as far as progressive vs single stage goes. you need them and they don't come with either kits.

To me the prices is so very close if you really want the Dillion you are not saving that much (if anything) by going with the Rock Chucker kit. But if you think the Rock Chucker is a better fit for you, you aren't making a "bad" choice there either.

With practice a single stage can crank out the rounds too. not at the same pace or "effortlessly" as a progressive, but they can produce too. Example, a guy brought his semi auto browning 1919 to the range and was letting people blast away with it. when asked if he reloaded, he said yes and he used a single stage. once he had is process/routine down he was able to produce at a volume he felt was acceptable.

I hope this helps.

[BWYoda]

Thanks for that Sharps. The leg work is very much appreciated and for the first time I have a comprehensive list giving me the options to get started. I think progressive is the ay to go given the volume I'll need to produce. Looks like I'm in the market for a dillon.

[1859sharps]

before plunking down the money for a brand new dillion, do check around and see if you can pickup a used one with maybe even the dies you need.

my bro-inlaw picked up a used Dillion for a very good price, can't remember how much but it wasn't much more then I paid brand new about 15 years ago. And this was with in the last 5 years or so.

if you go used, just be very clear what comes with it so you can factor in having to buy "missing" stuff.

[mtk]

You can learn to reload on a progressive, just understand that you're learning to swim by jumping into the deep end of the pool. Given the nature of the task at hand, that could be a quite dangerous proposition.

For that reason alone, I'd suggest a single-stage press to start. As was said, it isn't like you're going to throw it in the trash if you later buy a progressive press.

It also has some nice up sides to it.

Find a gun you like, but it is in kind of an oddball caliber? A set of dies and that is no longer a problem.

Inherit an old gun from Grandpa, one that you don't want to subject to full power shots of commercial ammo? Load up some minimum loads for it.

I've used my reloading press to load up 110gr HP loads (110gr hollow point @ ~3600f/s) for my .30-'06, which you can't buy at the store for any price. Lets just say the local ground hog population isn't a fan of my reloading as a result. :D

The down side is that the reloading press leads to a "conventional" powder measure, which leads to an RCBS Chargemaster (fantastic gadget, I might add), and so on.

But then again, I wasn't using that spare bedroom for anything anyway. Now it is The Armory. :cool:

ETA: The advice on used equipment is also spot-on. While almost all my reloading gear bas bought new, I bought my press as a gift for my father when I was maybe 15 or so and it it is still serving me well as I close in on 40 years old. In my case, I don't think he ever pulled the lever on it once; I guess I more accurately gave him free labor and reloaded ammo for the rest of his life. :D