View Full Version : Pittsburgh Police Shootout - 3 LEOs Shot Dead
Gutshot John
04-04-09, 08:41
Details are forthcoming but apparently they were responding to a domestic call in Stanton Heights.
http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/04/04/pittsburgh.officers.shot/index.html
I pray that the officer's and their families will be ok.
Even worse there are officers down that they can't reach because the shooter has them covered.
This one is going to be bad.
Our prayers are with them now, take this guy out.
---Update----
Three of Pittsburgh's finest died on the job today. We all mourn for them and their Families.
Godspeed, RIP
ICANHITHIMMAN
04-04-09, 09:01
man what the heck is going on I dont know if there is acctualy more shootings of if the mainstream media is just foucusing on it latley.
The will be in my prayers
AK-47 used.
Live streaming RIGHT NOW.
Man aprehended.
3 LEO dead
5 LEO injured.
http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/5839843/index.html
Now they say 5 LEO passed away. But while saying that the screen showed 3 LEO passed away as the text scrolled past. I think the number of murdered LEO quoted as 5 may be wrong......
RogerinTPA
04-04-09, 10:30
AK-47 used.
Live streaming RIGHT NOW.
Man aprehended.
3 LEO dead
5 LEO injured.
http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/video/5839843/index.html
I saw that on Fox this morning. Prayers sent to the LEO's involved and their families. I hope, because of the economy, these kind of incidents will not be the sign of the times.
Updated. 3 LEO murdered, 2 in hospital injured or shot.
When swat arrived at about 8AM there was a trade between SWAT and the perp with a constant run of about 80 rounds between SWAT and the perp.
About an hour later, swat and the perp traded a total of another 8-10 rounds.
2 officers left laying shot dead in the street since 7:30am until the scene ends at about 11:10am. Perp has cover fire preventing other LEO from retrieving bodies of the killed LEO.
Perp taken alive, 1 shot to his leg. He was talked down.
We should hang him in front of the county court house. If we don't get tough on criminals they will continue to do shit like this.
22-23 year old male perp.
1 "assault rifle"AK-47 style, one long hunting rifle, and one pistol and a large ammo supply on hand.
His mother was in the house during the event. She was not being held as a hostage.
Littlelebowski
04-04-09, 10:45
Wish these losers would do us all a favor and shoot themselves first.
Gutshot John
04-04-09, 10:46
WTAE just reported that the shooter was a "gun activist" quoting the asshole's "best" friend.
The above media is playing up that the shooter had a "stockpile" of a "high-powered, assault rifle and pistol".
what the ****...
i mean seriously
what the ****....
thats, what, 6 mass shootings in a month?
i agree with lebowski, i wish these ****ers would just off themselves....
last night I took my mom out to dinner, and in compliance with VA Law, I uncovered my G17 to eat...
my mom asked why I carried it to dinner
i said in case someone like that **** in New York comes in here.,...
all she did was nod....
According to the asshole "best pal" he says:
He was in fear of govt intervention, military police, the politics.... he felt that his home was approached by officers to disarm him due to a domestic dispute. He had said many times that any one that tried to disarm him would be fighting him just they fought our forefathers. He told everyone he fears gun bans, fears the political situation.....
Basically, this "best friend" just hammered home every fear we have. This guy is one of us in the fact that he loved his firearms and he like some of you.... was willing to fight to the death (nearly) for his possesion of guns.
This is VERY bad for all of us. This may well cause a pressure wave to rip through the government that will empower things that are VERY, VERY bad for our rights. This is bad. OMG, it is bad.
The perp was allegedly a 2 year active MARINE.
NOT A MARINE.
THe United States Marine Corp. tossed him out during boot camp. He is not and was not a real Marine. He was a wanna-be.
THe 80 round gun shot heard at about 8AM was LEO suppression fire as SWAT members attempted to get to the bodies of the 2 officers that where head shot and left in the street. They were not able to make it to the bodies.
Gutshot John
04-04-09, 11:02
This guy is one of us in the fact that he loved his firearms and he like some of you.... was willing to fight to the death (nearly) for his possesion of guns.
I don't think you can know what was in his head at this point and what he was or wasn't shooting for.
Three officers are dead and three families are devastated, let's wait before we jump to any conclusions.
This is bad, but let's focus on the families of the dead officers. No point in making the same mistake as the media.
I don't think you can know what was in his head at this point and what he was or wasn't shooting for.
Three officers are dead and three families are devastated, let's wait before we jump to any conclusions.
This is bad, but let's focus on the families of the dead officers. No point in making the same mistake as the media.
I am not making assumptions or accusations. All I did was typed what I heard.
Me saying
This guy is one of us in the fact that he loved his firearms and he like some of you.... was willing to fight to the death (nearly) for his possesion of guns. was what his BEST FRIEND said pretty much word for word. I added the "this guy is one of us" because what he had told his best friends many times (according to the best friend) was about his right to bare arms, his disdain for current federal direction and other things that this and other forums talk about each day. I am only repeating what I hear for those that can not get to the streaming video. Most companies do not allow streaming video.
I'm just sharing what I'm hearing.
variablebinary
04-04-09, 11:13
I'd like to get more info on this one. This case is a bit different than Oakland, as the Oakland shooter was a clear scumbag with a clear motive
In this instance, are we dealing with a Marine that snapped and started spraying LEO while screaming Molon Labe? Who called the cops? Lots of questions.
The more info there is, the more than can be learned.
As usual the media morons to include Fox News is reporting that he was armed with an automatic "assault rifle" an AK47. The same type of weapon that is favored by the drug cartels.
I am getting sick and tired of the assholes not getting their facts straight before they spout off stupid shit that John Q. Public will hear and not realize the difference.
You are Marine if you make it through the training and actually serve. He did not.
I'd like to get more info on this one. This case is a bit different than Oakland, as the Oakland shooter was a clear scumbag with a clear motive
In this instance, are we dealing with a Marine that snapped and started spraying LEO while screaming Molon Labe? Who called the cops? Lots of questions.
The more info there is, the more than can be learned.
I'd like to get more info on this one. This case is a bit different than Oakland, as the Oakland shooter was a clear scumbag with a clear motive
In this instance, are we dealing with a Marine that snapped and started spraying LEO while screaming Molon Labe? Who called the cops? Lots of questions.
The more info there is, the more than can be learned.
HE IS NOT MARINE! He was originally said to be Marine, but later they announced he was in boot camp for less than a couple weeks before they tossed his butt to the curb. He never became a United States Marine. The news media even recanted that fact.... they said that they had wrongly announced him as a Marine, but later discovered that he was kicked out of high school, in police trouble and well known by police, and thrown out of the Marines during boot camp.
Heavy Metal
04-04-09, 11:17
Fear a domestic violence conviction would deprive him of his RKBA?
Could Lautenberg be a co-conspirator in these murders?
variablebinary
04-04-09, 11:19
HE IS NOT MARINE! He was originally said to be Marine, but later they announced he was in boot camp for less than a couple weeks before they tossed his butt to the curb. He never became a United States Marine. The news media even recanted that fact.... they said that they had wrongly announced him as a Marine, but later discovered that he was kicked out of high school, in police trouble and well known by police, and thrown out of the Marines during boot camp.
Good to know.
Keep posting updates people. I am very curious how this shooter will be handled in the press compared to the poor Asian, laid off, immigrant shooter in N.Y.
FYI: The Binghamton shooter had a permit for both his pistols. So it looks like he was a legal gun owner.
Gutshot John
04-04-09, 11:20
Me saying was what his BEST FRIEND said pretty much word for word.
he like some of you.... was willing to fight to the death for his possesion of guns
You paraphrased his best friend than added your own words creating a different impression than what the friend actually said. Language is a precision instrument...not a broad brush. I'm sure it wasn't your intent to create a flawed impression but the language needed to clarification lest some get the wrong idea.
Don't make the same mistake as the media by projecting your thoughts/feelings onto the situation...just the facts.
THey are saying he lived at this house with his mom. He was having a domestic dispute with his mom. The media hopes to get a chance to talk to his mother. Police say they will be doing a public press conferance at 3PM eastern time.
5 total LEO shot and 3 of the 5 died of the shots.
Folks that went to school with him said he was a very nice guy and are shocked to hear such things.
His best friend said that even though this guy talked about his anger with govt. and fear over future gun control or gun bans... his pal said flat out when asked... that he did NOT feel that his buddy would act on anything and did not feel that there was a warning sign to violence.
1 officer murdered was off-duty and responding while on the drive home after working a night shift.
Neighbors say it felt as if a war zone had broken out.
Neighbors hid in basements with children. Police called it "A gun fight for sure".
No one yet knows what prompted this situation.
Police cars had slammed and backed the cars partially over top each other to form a wall across the front of the property. The rear of the police cars were slammed into and over the hood of the car behind it. This was done to create a larger barrier.
Police Chief Nate Harper says:
Call at 7AM. 4 Officers respond and all 4 injured. Actor injured, taken to hospital. Not confirming if or how many officers died. Chief says he used assault rifle and long rifle and had a great deal of ammo. Still investigating the scene. At this time we will hold information until the 3PM press release. Original call was a domestic dispute only.
Reports say the guy feared a gun ban by the Obama Administration. Well this jackass, if its true he used an AK, just gave more "ammo" to the antis for a new AWB.
He called his best friend "ED" at 9am and told Ed that he would die today. Ed heard gun fore in the background and asked Richard Poplawski to please stop.
He told Ed he was shot 2 times, one in the chest, one in the leg. His bullet proof vest stopped the shot to the chest.
He keeps saying Zionist political stuff.
Ed says that him and his mother have frequent domestic disputes where police are called.
Ed says that Richard only owned a total of 4-5 firearms.
variablebinary
04-04-09, 11:50
Reports say the guy feared a gun ban by the Obama Administration. Well this jackass, if its true he used an AK, just gave more "ammo" to the antis for a new AWB.
The antis dont need more "ammo"; they think what they think, and it isnt like a lack of public shootings is going to steer them in a different direction
FromMyColdDeadHand
04-04-09, 11:55
This guy and the Oakland guy didn't shoot themselves because they are different kind of shooters than the other recent mass shootings. The other mass shooters were 'zombies' on a mission with a plan. These other guys didn't seem to be on a mission, just really violent guys who lashed out. Hopefully this guy will bleed out so that we don't have to listen to years of his RKBA rantings.
Not to offend anyone here, but how about a law making it illegal to own a gun if you are over 25 and living with your Mom. Is the mom the victim in the domestic dispute?
Glad to see that the FBI (http://in.reuters.com/article/topNews/idINIndia-38883420090404) has in 24 hours cleared the Taliban in the NY shooting. I don't think 2A supporters will be so quickly exonerated if this guy ends up being the loud mouth he seems to be.
Crap, it seem lately we'd be better off if more guns ended up in Mexico.
The antis dont need more "ammo"; they think what they think, and it isnt like a lack of public shootings is going to steer them in a different direction
This is true, however, a paranoid "gun-loving" wanna-be m**********r gunning down LEOs with AK is not an ammo, it is a JDAM-guided bomb for their cause.
My thoughts are with families of lost officers.
Gutshot John
04-04-09, 12:07
A friend claims that police were coming to get his guns and that shooter was concerned about "zionist control of the government." :rolleyes:
This guy has "loser" written all over him. Sorry but if you're not responsible enough to pay your own rent/support yourself, you're not responsible enough to own firearms.
I think more and more that the police were responding to a simple domestic dispute and got ambushed. Had they been coming for his "guns" or similar, they would have come much heavier. Friend I think is sensationalizing and running through his 15 minutes at an alarming rate. There is some speculation that alcohol was involved. Surprise.
***DISCLAIMER PURE SPECULATION*** I'm curious if there are potential issues with the SOP. I've HEARD from LEO friends that Pittsburgh SWAT officers have to go to staging points rather than having all their gear in their vehicles. News reports imply that it took 45 minutes to mount a rescue of the wounded officers.
Is the mom the victim in the domestic dispute?
According his buddy "Ed" it sounded as if his mother and he are commonly in disputes.
When called for the domestic dispute, the LEO were warned that the suspect has weapons. WHen they arrived, they knocked on the door and the suspect popped his head out and began firing. He was wearing body armor and did take shots from the initial 4 officers.
Police say 23 year old Richard was there with mother and possable Grand-Mother. Police knew of the potential firearms.
The off duty officer lived a block away and heard the shooting, he responded based on hearing gunfire. He was shot and is thought to be dead. He had 12 or 13 years experiance on the force and wanted to back up and support his brother LEO when he heard gunfire in his home area. He lived on that street or an adjacent street very near to this home.
The two other officers murdered were hired in 2007.
1 officer broke leg climbing fence trying to get to the area.
1 officer sustained hand injury.
When officers were pinned down while perp was perched in good vantage point, SWAT was called in and SWAT was trying to hold perp at bay and perform LEO rescue menuvers.
Richard was out all night and came home intoxicated and got into a verbal altercation. He had been out and came home, later police are called for an altercation at the house. As police were walking to the house this guy sticks head out window and the police were "AMBUSHED" before they even got to the house. The perp began taking shots at the LEO with no warning or any interaction with the LEO.
News Media has researched his background and has not been able to find any public data on past issues. Police did say that they do have past domestic issues on Richard.
My thoughts and prayers are with the fallen officers and their families, and also with the Pittsburgh Police Department after this great tragedy. I also pray that the negative impact of these events do not impact the responsible and sane, as this was clearly an example of an act of the insane. Though I do not know all of the facts I would guess that the acts of the murderer prior to this incident (what he did) clearly dictacted the circumsatnces of why he would fear loosings his RKBA.
Like all of you, I feel TERRIBLE for the loss of the great Americans, our LEO members. My heart and prayers go out to the surviving family members and LEO that must deal with the loss. God bless you all and please Lord, help carry these loved ones during these difficult times.
Also, live coverage is over. Updates will be available at 2PM and 3PM.
This is another of a recent list of bad days for sane and legal owners. We will take the damage from the insane and illegal by sacrificing our rights. A terrible day indeed for all involved.
God bless you all.
This is terrible and in my home town no less :(
My prayers go out to the families of those officers. I'm really getting tired of these a-holes shooting people up lately. They're going to eff things up for the rest of us. :mad:
Has anybody heard if this a-hole had several dozen copies of "Catcher in the Rye" piled up around his house?
Just wondering...
***DISCLAIMER PURE SPECULATION*** I'm curious if there are potential issues with the SOP. I've HEARD from LEO friends that Pittsburgh SWAT officers have to go to staging points rather than having all their gear in their vehicles. News reports imply that it took 45 minutes to mount a rescue of the wounded officers.
45 minute + SWAT response times are 100% normal.
C4
Gutshot John
04-04-09, 13:49
45 minute + SWAT response times are 100% normal.
C4
45 minute minus bleed outs are similarly 100% normal.
Pittsburgh isn't exactly a huge city and Stanton Heights is very close to any number of Police Stations including a large one in the Strip District about 2 miles away, nor is there that much traffic at that time.
On the main page of the Fox News mobile website the headline reads "Shooter kills 3 officers, may have feared gun ban" but when you click on the story it turns into "2 Pittsburgh officers injured in shooting" and very little info. CNN mobile says nothing at all about the gun ban angle.
WTF?
ETA: Fox News TV just had a update on the half hour, said the shooter was worried about his gun rights.
John_Wayne777
04-04-09, 13:56
Basically, this "best friend" just hammered home every fear we have. This guy is one of us in the fact that he loved his firearms and he like some of you.... was willing to fight to the death (nearly) for his possesion of guns.
We don't have any cop killers on M4C. This guy was a ****stick of the highest order...not some "patriot" fighting against an oppressive government.
Jesus...
Anybody who thinks Fox is "on our side" is delusional. Fox is only on Fox's side - whatever sells advertising. In many ways they seem to have turned into the National Enquirer of television.
The only thing they have going for them is Glenn Beck.
Now Fox has some ****tard firefighter who lives nearby on the phone, rambling on and on about Obama, gun bans, and how the guy fired 600 rounds. This is all that idiot Rendell needs, is more anti-gun ammo to use in PA.
John_Wayne777
04-04-09, 14:25
Anybody who thinks Fox is "on our side" is delusional. Fox is only on Fox's side - whatever sells advertising. In many ways they seem to have turned into the National Enquirer of television.
The only thing they have going for them is Glenn Beck.
They are better than the rest of the press....in the same way that a slap in the face is better than a kick in the nuts.
Gutshot John
04-04-09, 14:37
Greg Jarrett on Fox has to be one of the dumbest journalists on the face of the planet. I hate that tool.
He said that the shooting was "premeditated" because the killer called his friend during the course of the shooting and said "I"m going to die today". :confused:
I remember him during the persian gulf war showing video of an "F-16 taking off from an aircraft carrier".
:rolleyes:
Here's a clue Greg...if you don't know what you're talking about STFU.
Police Chief updated weapon list as AK-47 ASSAULT RIFLE, .22 Long Rifle, and pistol.
Police did in fact knock on door, and as they stepped over threshold they were head shot from within the house and killed. All 3 front door officers were killed in the threshold, first 2 were the responders on duty, 3rd was coming up from behind to attempt to get his fallen brothers pulled back... he was nopt attacking, he was attempting to rescue his brothers. He was off duty, responding as such just in case.
Suspect then goes to 2nd floor bedroom. SWAT pulls in, and as SWAT pulls in the armored truck is under fire from the rifle being fired out the bedroom window on the 2nd floor.
Eric Kelly was the Off-Duty officer that was murdered. Another 4th officer recieved a bullet wound to his hand as he retreated from the ambush.
As far as premeditated... when the LEO arrived, this shitbag was positioned for ambush while wearing bullet proof body armor. THe LEO knocked, announced themselves, and were gunned down by an armored perp. If that is not premeditated ambush of the Pittsburgh police force.... I may need re-educated in the meaning of that word. How was it NOT premeditated?
Gutshot John
04-04-09, 14:48
As far as premeditated... when the LEO arrived, this shitbag was positioned for ambush while wearing bullet proof body armor. THe LEO knocked, announced themselves, and were gunned down by an armored perp. If that is not premeditated ambush of the Pittsburgh police force.... I may need re-educated in the meaning of that word. How was it NOT premeditated?
No you're right. I was thinking premeditation in terms of thought-out and executed the ambush planned well in advance. His folks called the cops and he decided he was going to fight.
His actions don't strike me as particularly well thought-out...though no less deadly.
In terms of Fox, Greg Jarrett said that the phone call to the friend was indicative of the premeditation of the act...after the shots had already been fired. Explain that to me, because it's a bit counter-intuitive. I mean why not say "wearing the body armor indicates premeditation"? Why go the sensational, speculative, nonsensical, moron route?
the1911fan
04-04-09, 15:03
45 minute minus bleed outs are similarly 100% normal.
Pittsburgh isn't exactly a huge city and Stanton Heights is very close to any number of Police Stations including a large one in the Strip District about 2 miles away, nor is there that much traffic at that time.
If all the SWAT equipment is on the truck it takes time to get the truck to the location and SWAT officers to all get to the truck and get suited up. Not many cities the size of Pittsburgh have a SWAT unit on duty ready at all times.
Maybe the SWAT truck w/ equipment was at the other end of town.
I can't for the life of me understand why more LE Dept.'s do not have trained scoped riflemen patrol officers with a simple Rem 700 or Savage FP10 dialed in with a good scope. Patrol AR's are nice but they do not possess the ability that a .308 has through barriers (double paned glass, etc.) and most patrol AR's have 1x optics or irons.
restfortheweary
04-04-09, 15:09
All we can do is remember them and their sacrifice. My thoughts are with their loved ones.
These are the kind of horror stories they tell you in mandate. Makes me want to respond to every call for service with my patrol rifle slung.
They are better than the rest of the press....in the same way that a slap in the face is better than a kick in the nuts.
I would say they are "less bad", not "better"... but that's just me.
I really wonder if these kinds of things are picked up more by the media in times when the "gun control" debate has been in the news recently, or if the whackos just coincidentally start shooting after the "gun control" debate gets started.
It is rather convenient for the hoplophobes how these kinds of shootings always happen AFTER the "we need more gun control" trial balloon has been floated... hence my previous tongue in cheek reference to "Catcher in the Rye".
Gutshot John
04-04-09, 15:18
If all the SWAT equipment is on the truck it takes time to get the truck to the location and SWAT officers to all get to the truck and get suited up. Not many cities the size of Pittsburgh have a SWAT unit on duty ready at all times.
Exactly my point.
I can't for the life of me understand why more LE Dept.'s do not have trained scoped riflemen patrol officers with a simple Rem 700 or Savage FP10 dialed in with a good scope.
You mean like in the back of their patrol cars?
That makes way too much sense.
He was in fear of govt intervention, military police, the politics.... he felt that his home was approached by officers to disarm him due to a domestic dispute. He had said many times that any one that tried to disarm him would be fighting him just they fought our forefathers. He told everyone he fears gun bans, fears the political situation.....
Basically, this "best friend" just hammered home every fear we have. This guy is one of us in the fact that he loved his firearms and he like some of you.... was willing to fight to the death (nearly) for his possesion of guns.
WOW!
Thats a stretch.:rolleyes:
We don't have any cop killers on M4C. This guy was a ****stick of the highest order...not some "patriot" fighting against an oppressive government.
Jesus...
Thank you.
RIP officers
This guy is one of us in the fact that he loved his firearms and he like some of you.... was willing to fight to the death (nearly) for his possesion of guns.
Uh....no. This guy is NOT one of us. He IS an evil piece of shit that ambushed and murdered three LEOs, and deserves to be put to death for it. I don't give a rat's ass what his "excuse" is or any other bullshit reason his friends and family come up with. :mad:
RIP to those officers and condolences to their families.:(
montanadave
04-04-09, 15:55
First and most importantly, my thoughts are with the families of those officers murdered today and also with the wounded officers and their families. I can only imagine the loss, suffering and pain they are experiencing at this very moment.
A previous post stated. "We don't have any cop killers on M4C. This guy was a ****stick of the highest order...not some "patriot" fighting against an oppressive government."
How can the writer defend such a blanket statement? Can anyone personally vouch for the mental stability or moral character of every person viewing a public domain website? And it doesn't take a great deal of imagination (or time reading internet forum posts) to realize that the dividing line between "****stick of the highest order" and "patriot fighting against an oppressive government" is pretty fluid and arbitrary.
It seems to me that we, collectively as a nation, need to take a deep breath and tone down some of the inflammatory rhetoric that passes for political discourse these days. It's a sure bet that, in a country of 300 million people, there are more than a few who are a gnat's ass away from stripping their gears entirely and it's anybody's guess what might tip 'em over the edge.
I'm not saying people shouldn't voice their dissent and remain vigilant in the defense of their civil liberties and constitutional rights. However, we have to draw a distinction between vigilance and paranoia as well as between voicing dissent and advocating armed revolt. Most folks on this forum aren't real pleased with the outcome of the last election. Tough shit--a lot of folks weren't too happy with the election before that. And guess what? They'll be another election in 2012 and a good number of people are going to be pissed off regardless of how that one turns out too. But that's how this country works and that's why the world often stands in awe of how the United States can lurch back and forth across the political spectrum like a drunk and do it without firing a shot.
So the next time we get pissed off about something we see on the news or hear from a guy at work, maybe we should think twice before posting some half-baked conspiracy theory about how "they" are gonna ruin this nation and it's time to head for the brush. It might just be all the push some confused, sick, delusional **** needs to go off the deep end.
John_Wayne777
04-04-09, 16:13
How can the writer defend such a blanket statement? Can anyone personally vouch for the mental stability or moral character of every person viewing a public domain website? And it doesn't take a great deal of imagination (or time reading internet forum posts) to realize that the dividing line between "****stick of the highest order" and "patriot fighting against an oppressive government" is pretty fluid and arbitrary.
What. The. ****.
This guy wasn't George Washington. He was a dumbass who beat up his mother (according to witnesses) on multiple occasions, and who, when confronted with the consequences of his stupidity, decided to murder a bunch of people. Idiots like him are the reason 90% of these idiotic laws exist in the first bloody place. If the line between this guy and George Washington looks fuzzy to anybody, have your eyes checked.
Like I said: The M4C membership isn't comprised of assclowns like this guy. When we as moderators and staffers find somebody who even SOUNDS like that kind of a dumbass, we come down on him like the fist of an angry God. On M4C we KNOW who the good guys are...and without the slightest bit of hesitation I can tell you it was the 3 officers who didn't go home today.
Not the assclown who murdered them.
RIP Officers, prayers out to the family and friends of the fallen.
This turd is a scum sucking vermin of the highest order. I would have pumped some diesel fuel into the house and fix the issue, then again I am not a LEO.
The dividing line between this guy and Patriot is about 5000miles wide.
1) shitbag was busted out of Corps.
2) shitbag gets drunk and repeatedly gets into it with his family
3) shitbag lives under his mom's roof
4) shitbag gets drunk and realizes he is looking at loosing his right to firearms - nothing is an absolute right, and he forfieted his
5) shitbag who is not fit to lick the boots of the LEO's that are doing their duty to the country and community, mows them down in a premeditated ambush
I hope he roasts slowly in hell.
*this is the personal feeling of Kevin Boland and should not be taking to be a blanket statement for M4Carbine or KAC.
** however I think both would feel very similar.
montanadave
04-04-09, 16:59
What. The. ****.
This guy wasn't George Washington. He was a dumbass who beat up his mother (according to witnesses) on multiple occasions, and who, when confronted with the consequences of his stupidity, decided to murder a bunch of people. Idiots like him are the reason 90% of these idiotic laws exist in the first bloody place. If the line between this guy and George Washington looks fuzzy to anybody, have your eyes checked.
Like I said: The M4C membership isn't comprised of assclowns like this guy. When we as moderators and staffers find somebody who even SOUNDS like that kind of a dumbass, we come down on him like the fist of an angry God. On M4C we KNOW who the good guys are...and without the slightest bit of hesitation I can tell you it was the 3 officers who didn't go home today.
Not the assclown who murdered them.
Don't misconstrue my meaning. What I was attempting to say was the individual you or I might readily acknowledge as "a ****stick of the highest order" may well see himself as "a patriot fighting against an oppressive government." However ****ed up this murderer's actions were, I'm guessing he had convinced himself he was justified in committing this heinous act and no one (except perhaps himself) is capable of knowing how and with what he constructed that delusional state of mind.
And I appreciate the time and effort that the moderators and staff of the forum put in to keep this site up and running. But not everyone says what they're thinking and plenty of folks don't say anything at all.
Don't misconstrue my meaning. What I was attempting to say was the individual you or I might readily acknowledge as "a ****stick of the highest order" may well see himself as "a patriot fighting against an oppressive government." However ****ed up this murderer's actions were, I'm guessing he had convinced himself he was justified in committing this heinous act and no one (except perhaps himself) is capable of knowing how and with what he constructed that delusional state of mind.
And I appreciate the time and effort that the moderators and staff of the forum put in to keep this site up and running. But not everyone says what they're thinking and plenty of folks don't say anything at all.
There were cops killed today! They went there to stop a crime. All this other talk is nonsense.
montanadave
04-04-09, 17:21
There were cops killed today! They went there to stop a crime. All this other talk is nonsense.
Agreed. In no way did I intend to diminish the sacrifice of these officers or show disrepect.
RIP to the fallen officers. Thoughts and prayers to their families and wounded fellow officers.
BushmasterFanBoy
04-04-09, 17:26
This guy wasn't fighting for his gun rights, and this guy wasn't defending anything other than his zero-responsibility lifestyle of sitting at home using his mother as a punching bag. He wasn't one of us at all.
As for anyone who wants to defend his actions, would you feel the same if he had simply killed 3 random innocent people at their place of work? Of course not, and that's exactly what he did, he killed 3 men who just happened to be at work at the wrong place and the wrong time. He's a murder, clear and simple.
This isn't a gun rights issue, its not a legal issue, its not even a political issue. The guy killed 3 people doing their jobs because he was afraid of being taken to task for not getting his s&*t together.
Wake up. He isn't a hero, or a patriot. He's a murderer.
Heavy Metal
04-04-09, 17:29
RIP Officers, prayers out to the family and friends of the fallen.
This turd is a scum sucking vermin of the highest order. I would have pumped some diesel fuel into the house and fix the issue, then again I am not a LEO.
The dividing line between this guy and Patriot is about 5000miles wide.
1) shitbag was busted out of Corps.
2) shitbag gets drunk and repeatedly gets into it with his family
3) shitbag lives under his mom's roof
4) shitbag gets drunk and realizes he is looking at loosing his right to firearms - nothing is an absolute right, and he forfieted his
5) shitbag who is not fit to lick the boots of the LEO's that are doing their duty to the country and community, mows them down in a premeditated ambush
I hope he roasts slowly in hell.
*this is the personal feeling of Kevin Boland and should not be taking to be a blanket statement for M4Carbine or KAC.
** however I think both would feel very similar.
Pretty much speaks for me.
If this assclown wanted to defend gun owners, he could have first joined the human race.
MarshallDodge
04-04-09, 18:07
My prayers go out to for the fallen, the wounded, and the families involved.
Gutshot John
04-04-09, 18:45
CNN didn't waste any time to get an "FBI Investigator" sock puppet to spout the AWB line.
Sensationalism.
FromMyColdDeadHand
04-04-09, 18:49
Marines weeded him out, to bad society couldn't.
Wonder what he got tossed for.
Marines weeded him out, to bad society couldn't.
Wonder what he got tossed for.
According to Yahoo for tossing a food tray at a DI....
Link (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090404/ap_on_re_us/pittsburgh_shooting)
RIP and thanks for your sacrifice gentleman. You will not be forgotten.
My prayers go out to my fallen brothers and their families.
The AP said
Poplawski had feared "the Obama gun ban that's on the way" and "didn't like our rights being infringed upon," said Edward Perkovic, his best friend.
I've been on some forums with folks that are so "hardcore" about RKBA that it is just crazy. Those are the ones that scare me in general. Their thought process is just out of this world. My question is when is the next shooting going to happen?
I'm pretty sure there are nut jobs out there that agreed with what he did.
He's a probably a martyr to them.
BushmasterFanBoy
04-04-09, 19:18
My prayers go out to my fallen brothers and their families.
The AP said
I've been on some forums with folks that are so "hardcore" about RKBA that it is just crazy. Those are the ones that scare me in general. Their thought process is just out of this world. My question is when is the next shooting going to happen?
I'm pretty sure there are nut jobs out there that agreed with what he did.
He's a probably a martyr to them.
Listen, I'm probably one of those "hardcore" about gun rights. I think the laws on the books are way too overbearing, as a matter of fact, I think everything up to and including the 1934 NFA ought to be repealed.
This murderer wasn't about gun rights, he was about dodging responsibility. And when it came knocking, he shot back, killing 3 innocent people. That's not the freedom I stand for, and I'm gonna speak for the rest of the RKBA community and say that's not the freedom we stand for. It has nothing to do with being hardcore. These officers weren't coming to take his guns, they were responding to a service call. It wasn't a SWAT team in a stack waiting to take his WASR 10, it was 3 innocent people doing their jobs, responding to a call for help. There's nothing about that related to gun rights. Not one bit. :mad:
I understand what you are saying and I never grouped your principles into his.
None of us were there so we can't say for sure what his thought process was at the time. Maybe in his ****ed up brain they were really trying to take away what he believed in..
We (the community) can arm chair quarterback this all day long. I'm going to let God sort this one out.
Listen, I'm probably one of those "hardcore" about gun rights. I think the laws on the books are way too overbearing, as a matter of fact, I think everything up to and including the 1934 NFA ought to be repealed.
This murderer wasn't about gun rights, he was about dodging responsibility. And when it came knocking, he shot back, killing 3 innocent people. That's not the freedom I stand for, and I'm gonna speak for the rest of the RKBA community and say that's not the freedom we stand for. It has nothing to do with being hardcore. These officers weren't coming to take his guns, they were responding to a service call. It wasn't a SWAT team in a stack waiting to take his WASR 10, it was 3 innocent people doing their jobs, responding to a call for help. There's nothing about that related to gun rights. Not one bit. :mad:
Well said.
My heart aches for the families of the slain officers. Prayers for a speedy recovery to the wounded and to the three sheepdogs in heaven.
May we all STAY SAFE..
As crude and insensitive as this sounds, this teaches us LEO's to ALWAYS keep our eyes peeled and never take any call as "routine".
Never get complacent...
RogerinTPA
04-04-09, 19:32
According to Fox, he had a history of being rough with his girlfriend and stalking her. He violated a court order to stay away from her. Domestic disturbance = no firearms.(right). That's why he was afraid of the cops. He knew he was going to jail, because he wasn't supposed to be in possession of a firearm.
According to the Post-Gazette he had a Dishonorable Discharge.
Link (http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/09094/960662-455.stm)
Littlelebowski
04-04-09, 21:35
I am going to write this little turd a nice letter in prison and tell him how much of a piece of shit he is.
ICANHITHIMMAN
04-04-09, 21:38
My wife got stuck in a diffrent PSA tonight beacuse of a shortage of officers and her partner was best friends with one of the three men. Its hard some times when you still have to soldier on.
Littlelebowski
04-04-09, 21:39
Don't misconstrue my meaning. What I was attempting to say was the individual you or I might readily acknowledge as "a ****stick of the highest order" may well see himself as "a patriot fighting against an oppressive government." However ****ed up this murderer's actions were, I'm guessing he had convinced himself he was justified in committing this heinous act and no one (except perhaps himself) is capable of knowing how and with what he constructed that delusional state of mind.
And I appreciate the time and effort that the moderators and staff of the forum put in to keep this site up and running. But not everyone says what they're thinking and plenty of folks don't say anything at all.
Who the hell cares? Hitler justified what he did too. I'm sure mad dogs think they're right as well but that doesn't mean we shouldn't shoot them. This little coward couldn't make it through Marine Corps Boot Camp and beat his mother. He's delusional and not representative of any of us. I don't give a damn what was justified in his little mind. I'd happily pull the trigger on him or help down the long ladder on the short rope and say "hot as hell down there, isn't it?" to his copse afterwards.
the1911fan
04-04-09, 21:39
As crude and insensitive as this sounds, this teaches us LEO's to ALWAYS keep our eyes peeled and never take any call as "routine".
Never get complacent...
Even with that helpful reminder you can still get your ass handed to you. Meaning you can do everything correctly and still get shot..it's a dangerous business. And lets not assume every officer that gets killed made mistakes.
Littlelebowski
04-04-09, 21:41
My wife got stuck in a diffrent PSA tonight beacuse of a shortage of officers and her partner was best friends with one of the three men. Its hard some times when you still have to soldier on.
Tell that to the servicemen in Iraq/Afghanistan.
Very sad day again in America,sad day for Leo's in America,sad day for the Leo's families. What is it about spring time in this crazy world? Seems to happen in these places the most. Schools,churches,offices,etc.
The shooter's face is now the headline of the Drudgereport with the headline:
"PITTSBURGH COP KILLER FEARED OBAMA GUN BAN"
http://www.drudgereport.com/
Littlelebowski
04-04-09, 21:49
Coward. The world would be a better place if he had inserted said AK into his mouth.
Today I listened as two of our guys were dispatched on a "Domestic In Progress" between father and son. "Son is intoxicated, there are weapons in the home". Pretty "standard" call for our agency. Often times it is a house we've been to mutliple times for the same stupid shit.
Today was different.
It made me worry about the two officers sent on the call and have this urge to begin investigating Domestics with the 6921 strapped to my chest.
These Pitt Officers were doing the same thing....and were slaughter because Mommas boy doesn't want to face the consequences of his pathetic actions.
I have said this before, and I'll say it again; As a LEO I feel "safe" coming here. Thanks guys.
RIP Officers Eric Kelly, Stephen Mayhle and Paul Sciullo.
Prayers out.
Six in one month?
Sht this has been a bad month for us :eek:
My prayers go out to those officers that have fallen in the line of duty :(
There were actually six in total just this month?
One, ya. Two, ya. Three, maybe....but six? That's crazy.
The little pos was taken alive after a gsw to the leg. One of our guys was shot in the hand while dragging Eric off the street as the shitbag continued to pump rounds into him. Rest in peace brothers. Our partol rifle program has been bogged down for two years because the Fop and the city can't agree. My 6920 sits at home in my safe. Roll call at 1600, See ya. Thanks for the thoughts and prayers, They were good men.
Its sad that a governments known history of being anti-gun may have contributed to this, well that and it seems when Dems are in Power in one aspect or another, and in states w/ severe gun control these things happen as often Dem policies destroy peoples lives and those close to the edge slide over.
Its a shame:(
Gutshot John
04-05-09, 14:20
Its sad that a governments known history of being anti-gun may have contributed to this
Despite what the murdering coward said, Allegheny County/Pittsburgh is NOT anti-gun. In fact we have one of the highest rates of CCW permits issued in the country and certainly for any urban city. I seem to remember something like 1:10 or 1:15.
This wasn't about fear of losing his guns...all he had to do was NOT be a criminal.
woodandsteel
04-05-09, 14:25
The little pos was taken alive after a gsw to the leg. One of our guys was shot in the hand while dragging Eric off the street as the shitbag continued to pump rounds into him. Rest in peace brothers. Our partol rifle program has been bogged down for two years because the Fop and the city can't agree. My 6920 sits at home in my safe. Roll call at 1600, See ya. Thanks for the thoughts and prayers, They were good men.
There were definitely some inredible displays of heroism that day. Up to, and including, off duty officers responding to a call for help, and rushing in to save fellow officers.
Thanks for what you do. I can only imagine what it will be like to go to roll call and then handle calls for service after something like this. Stay safe out there.
Sorry to go off topic here, but Why In the Hell, in this day in age, would any agency refuse to allow officers to carry rifles?!?!? :mad:
An AAR may tell wether or not a rifle in the hands of patrol officers would have ended this event earlier than it did. Unfortunately though, I do not believe it would not have helped the initial responding officers.
Despite what the murdering coward said, Allegheny County/Pittsburgh is NOT anti-gun. In fact we have one of the highest rates of CCW permits issued in the country and certainly for any urban city. I seem to remember something like 1:10 or 1:15.
This wasn't about fear of losing his guns...all he had to do was NOT be a criminal.
Where did I say anything about the Police in this case being Anti-Gun?
I said 'The Government' IE, the Federal Government, the Liberal or any other Government who wants to violate the 2A and his stated concern over Obama
BTW how many permits get issued is irrelevant, we are supposed to already have the right to bear arms but I digress
Sorry to go off topic here, but Why In the Hell, in this day in age, would any agency refuse to allow officers to carry rifles?!?!? :mad:
For the same reason we have to get permission to excercise a right, its liberal mentality that guns are bad or some other such crap etc
Its stupid.
LE should carry rifles same as we should carry if we choose, and permission shouldnt be necessary in either case
Gutshot John
04-05-09, 14:32
Where did I say anything about the Police in this case being Anti-Gun?
It was the police that got shot up. He wasn't concerned that they were going to take his guns...he just didn't want to go to jail.
I said 'The Government' IE, the Federal Government, the Liberal or any other Government who wants to violate the 2A and his stated concern over Obama
It wasn't the "National" government that came knocking. So assclown's concerns about Obama's stance is pure B.S.
All he had to do was obey the law. Had he done so, no one, not local, state nor federal would have been at his door.
BTW how many permits get issued is irrelevant, we are supposed to already have the right to bear arms but I digress
Irrelevant? Right. It indicates a municipality whose police don't come knocking on people's doors to take their guns. No matter what a murdering scumbag might say.
I have no idea why you are taking my words out of context, everything I have said is factually correct on what the guy said and what happened
I know your bent because someone killed some cops, but dont take it out on me
AFA "he was breaking the law thats why the cops were there", that remains to be seen because it was just a call for service and no one know what happened inside before he started shooting and saying so is heresay as people are innocent until proven otherwise in our legal system
Gutshot John
04-05-09, 14:42
I know your bent because someone killed some cops, but dont take it out on me
No one's taking anything out on you. I'm just tired of people making excuses for assclowns who gun down cops.
I don't like Obama any more than anyone, but you can't put this on him nor the government.
For the record:
1. He was given a dishonorable discharge, I'm pretty sure that's on the state and federal questionnaire. I also thought it qualified as a felony conviction.
2. He was subject to a restraining order for violence and threatening to kill his girlfriend. I KNOW that's on both the state and federal questionnaire.
3. The police weren't coming to take away his guns. Had he simply talked to them instead of opening fire...they'd still be alive and there might even be a possibility he wouldn't even be in jail today.
4. If he feared the loss of his firearms, it was because he knew he had broken the law. That he couldn't take responsibility for his own actions, should preclude him from being responsible enough to keep and bear arms.
No one's taking anything out on you. I'm just tired of people making excuses for assclowns who gun down cops.
I don't like Obama any more than anyone, but you can't put this on him nor the government.
For the record:
1. He was given a dishonorable discharge, I'm pretty sure that's on the state and federal questionnaire. I also thought it qualified as a felony conviction.
2. He was subject to a restraining order for violence and threatening to kill his girlfriend. I KNOW that's on both the state and federal questionnaire.
3. The police weren't coming to take away his guns. Had he simply talked to them instead of opening fire...they'd still be alive and there might even be a possibility he wouldn't even be in jail today.
4. If he feared the loss of his firearms, it was because he knew he had broken the law. That he couldn't take responsibility for his own actions, should preclude him from being responsible enough to keep and bear arms.
Once again, All Im saying is HIS BELIEF in the fact that Obama wants guns banned may have contributed, I am NOT saying the Police were coming after his guns, I am NOT saying its reality they were after his guns on behalf of Obama, just that HIS belief in the fact that Obama and the Government is anti gun MAY have contributed to this, and is a side effect amongst OTHER issues w/ this POS that could have helped make this happen, as well as other issues he evidently had
Thats all, so i think we agree really after all
Its bad all around, all theses sudden shootings and a sure to come cry for banning of guns, as well as LE and citizens being on different pages these days, it just sucks
woodandsteel
04-05-09, 14:54
For the same reason we have to get permission to excercise a right, its liberal mentality that guns are bad or some other such crap etc
Its stupid.
LE should carry rifles same as we should carry if we choose, and permission shouldnt be necessary in either case
It was a rhetorical question. And a statement.
I hear what you are saying. But this is not a post about the Second Amendment. Police officers, troopers and deputies have to abide by their departmental rules, or face possible termination.
I just have to wonder.......If Officer Kelly, while off duty and responding to the call for help, had a rifle in his car, would he have been able to protect himself better while helping his fellow officers? Could Officer kelly have been saved had another patrol officer had a rifle at the ready?
I just think that it is stupid, this day in age, after Columbine, Beslan, Virgina tech .....etc., that individual departments refuse to allow officers to carry patrol rifles.
Again, to you Pittsburgh Police Officers, I applaud you for going back to work tonight. It has to be hard, working patrol with this on your mind.
Stay Safe
Sorry to go off topic here, but Why In the Hell, in this day in age, would any agency refuse to allow officers to carry rifles?!?!? :mad:
Same reason some agency's policies actually prohibit carrying a BUG:rolleyes:
RIP brothers:(
No one's taking anything out on you. I'm just tired of people making excuses for assclowns who gun down cops.
I don't like Obama any more than anyone, but you can't put this on him nor the government.
For the record:
1. He was given a dishonorable discharge, I'm pretty sure that's on the state and federal questionnaire. I also thought it qualified as a felony conviction.
2. He was subject to a restraining order for violence and threatening to kill his girlfriend. I KNOW that's on both the state and federal questionnaire.
3. The police weren't coming to take away his guns. Had he simply talked to them instead of opening fire...they'd still be alive and there might even be a possibility he wouldn't even be in jail today.
4. If he feared the loss of his firearms, it was because he knew he had broken the law. That he couldn't take responsibility for his own actions, should preclude him from being responsible enough to keep and bear arms.
So in other words, he was a poster child of why "gun control" laws DON'T F-ING WORK.
Why doesn't the media spin the story that way for a change?
The fact is, sh*t happens. Good guys get killed by bad guys sometimes and it might or might not have anything to do with anything other than timing and sheer luck. If this a-hole's parents had told him to get his sh*t together or hit the road when he was about 12, and then the govt wasn't standing there to tell him what a "victim" he was, I can almost guaranty you this would not have happened. F-ing whiners these days want to blame everything on somebody besides themselves... From kindergarten forward the govt is teaching them that all their troubles are somebody else's fault. Then when a few of them flip out and pull shit like this, the bed-wetters who contributed to their mindset whine that we need more "gun control"....
sorry for the rant, but this stuff just pisses me off. Some cops died that didn't need to and the hopolphobic lefties who contribute to the "poor me" mindset that a lot of these whackos have are the first ones to jump up and start trying to neuter those of us who ARE taking responsibility for our own lives and actions.
http://www.mercedsunstar.com/nation/story/775064.html
Sunday, Apr. 05, 2009
Fight over urinating dog got police to Pa. ambush
By JOE MANDAK
Associated Press Writer
Police official: 3 officers killed in Pa. shooting
Gunman 'lying in wait' kills 3 Pittsburgh officers PITTSBURGH A 911 call that brought two police officers to a home where they were ambushed, and where a third was also later killed during a four-hour siege, was precipitated by a fight between the gunman and his mother over a dog urinating in the house.
The Saturday argument between Margaret and Richard Poplawski escalated to the point that she threatened to kick him out and she called police to do it, according to a 12-page criminal complaint and affidavit filed late Saturday.
When officers Paul Sciullo III and Stephen Mayhle arrived, Margaret Poplawski opened the door and told them to come in and take her 23-year-old son, apparently unaware he was standing behind her with a rifle, the affidavit said. Hearing gunshots, she spun around to see her son with the gun and ran to the basement.
"What the hell have you done?" she shouted.
The mother told police her son had been stockpiling guns and ammunition "because he believed that as a result of economic collapse, the police were no longer able to protect society," the affidavit said.
Friends have said Poplawski was concerned about his weapons being seized during Barack Obama's presidency, and friends said he owned several handguns and an AK-47 assault rifle. Police have not said, specifically, what weapons were used to kill the officers.
Autopsies show Sciullo, 37, died of wounds to the head and torso. Mayhle, 29, was shot in the head.
A witness awakened by two gunshots told investigators of seeing the gunman standing in the home's front doorway and firing two to three shots into one officer who was already down. Sciullo was later found dead in the home's living room, and Mayhle near the front stoop, police said.
A third officer, Eric Kelly, 41, was killed as he arrived to assist the first two officers. Kelly was in uniform but on his way home when he responded and was gunned down in the street.
Kelly's radio call for help summoned other officers, including a SWAT team. The ensuing standoff included a gun battle in which police say Richard Poplawski tried to kill other officers.
Poplawski is charged with three counts of criminal homicide and nine counts of attempted homicide - one each for the eight officers who were shot at in an armored SWAT vehicle, plus a ninth who was shot in the hand as he tried to help Kelly.
Poplawski also was charged with possessing an instrument of crime: the bulletproof vest he wore during the gun battle. The criminal complaint doesn't say how Poplawski obtained the vest.
Police Chief Nate Harper Jr. has said the vest kept Poplawski from being more seriously wounded, but police have not specifically said how many shots were stopped by the vest.
A district judge arraigned Poplawski at UPMC Presbyterian Hospital, an arraignment court worker told The Associated Press on Sunday. Poplawski was being treated there for gunshot wounds to his extremities and remains under guard. Police and hospital officials have not released his condition, though he is expected to survive.
It was not immediately clear if Poplawski has an attorney. A preliminary hearing, at which Poplawski could challenge the charges, wasn't immediately scheduled.
Poplawski is also charged with firing weapons into two occupied neighboring homes and with recklessly endangering four people, two in each home, with gunfire. No civilians were wounded.
Police did not immediately say why Poplawski fired toward the homes, but some officers were seen going into nearby homes and perching on rooftops.
Police did not immediately release any information on funeral arrangements for the officers, though a memorial was held Saturday night outside the police station where all three slain officers worked.
Bagpipers played near a black wreath hung outside the station and an Allegheny County 911 dispatcher did a roll call for the 11 p.m. shift change. Various officers responded when their car numbers were called, but there was silence when the names, unit numbers and badge numbers of the slain officers were called out.
Chief Harper radioed back in each instance that the officer had been killed in the line of duty as hundreds of officers and other mourners stood listening nearby.
Rot in hell Poplawski.
mskdgunman
04-05-09, 15:51
R.I.P my brothers
http://www.forumjpg.com/userImages/12313848267142.jpg (http://www.forumjpg.com/clicked.asp?img=12313848267142.jpg)
I hope that shitbag burns.. long, slow and painful. RIP Officers.
The mother told police her son had been stockpiling guns and ammunition "because he believed that as a result of economic collapse, the police were no longer able to protect society," the affidavit said.
The 'media' will repeat that over and over and over and over......
The guns will get blamed, conservatives will get blamed for the 'bad economy', and everyone but the shitbag who did this will get blamed.
Prayers out to the families of the Officers.
Dont suggest the government is anything less than perfect, I received an infraction for suggesting such a thing in this thread, just FYI
Later guys
??????????????? :rolleyes:
Thomas M-4
04-05-09, 16:20
I was comming home from school when this happened http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/06/17/national/main624591.shtml 3 cops killed while serving a warrant
the youngest police officer used to come by my house and talk to me every 2 or 3 months or if I wasnt home he would stop to talk to my mother.Good guy I miss talking to him.
BushmasterFanBoy
04-05-09, 16:36
Dont suggest the government is anything less than perfect, I received an infraction for suggesting such a thing in this thread, just FYI
Later guys
It's not about that, its about making this case of murder into a political statement. That's what the MSM wants to do, don't fall into their trap. This guy wasn't one of us, his views were his own damn business, and had nothing to do with the fact he was a murderous POS.
It's not about that, its about making this case of murder into a political statement. That's what the MSM wants to do, don't fall into their trap. This guy wasn't one of us, his views were his own damn business, and had nothing to do with the fact he was a murderous POS.
Exactly my point to a T. I think 99 percent here understood what I meant. They have a bad habit of not letting facts get in the way of their agenda.
JediMindTricks
04-05-09, 18:09
We don't have any cop killers on M4C. This guy was a ****stick of the highest order...not some "patriot" fighting against an oppressive government.
Jesus...
EXACTLY, he is not, nor will he ever be one of "us".... He's a paranoid physcopath that flipped his lid because of his dilusional view that the gestapo were coming for him... Jesus Christ what's going on...??? Prayers to family of the fallen.
I don't have anything to add that has not already been said. I offer my sincerest condolences to the families of the fallen officers and offer my most vehement hope that the scumbag burns eternally.
Littlelebowski
04-05-09, 19:44
My condolences to the fallen officers' families. It would be nice to see this sort of outcry and emotion over every fallen servicemen, would it not? Sadly, the police/firefighters garnish much more publicity than the servicemen.
My condolences to the fallen officers' families. It would be nice to see this sort of outcry and emotion over every fallen servicemen, would it not? Sadly, the police/firefighters garnish much more publicity than the servicemen.
The Progressives that run America's media outlets cry when police die because in furthers their cause. When soldiers die they don't care, unless it furthers their cause.
Some of this BS rhetoric needs to stop. Good men were slain in the line of duty by a p.o.s. who will hopefully pay for his crimes. All this shit about the media and who they like and don't like have no place in this thread.
The Progressives that run America's media outlets cry when police die because in furthers their cause. When soldiers die they don't care, unless it furthers their cause.
Sure, the guy concerned about his right to possess firearms kills 3 officers responding to a domestic resulting from a urinating dog. Makes perfect sense.
The POS ends his worthless life as well as those of the innocent due to his delusion, and gives the anti's valuable ammo during a time when we desperately need a break from these horrific mass shootings.
If he was collecting guns and ammo for an impending societal disaster, then he should have waited for just that. Stupid insane f*ck that he is.
I read a quote where he says "Yes, I am hit. Come help me." to the officers just after the exchange. Gives arrogance a new name.
Sure, the guy concerned about his right to possess firearms kills 3 officers responding to a domestic resulting from a urinating dog. Makes perfect sense.
The POS ends his worthless life as well as those of the innocent due to his delusion, and gives the anti's valuable ammo during a time when we desperately need a break from these horrific mass shootings.
If he was collecting guns and ammo for an impending societal disaster, then he should have waited for just that. Stupid insane f*ck that he is.
I read a quote where he says "Yes, I am hit. Come help me." to the officers just after the exchange. Gives arrogance a new name.
Well spoken, sir!
Well spoken, sir!
Yes, it was. Very well spoken.
My condolences to the fallen officers' families. It would be nice to see this sort of outcry and emotion over every fallen servicemen, would it not? Sadly, the police/firefighters garnish much more publicity than the servicemen.
As a society, we expect this from our service members. I offer nothing here to detract from the service of either profession but LE denotes some degree of civility. One does not expect to see what has happened this week. I am 4th generation military. I guess I don't expect much when we have casualties, we signed up for it.
Again, I express my sincerest respect and offer condolences to the families of the fallen. I am aware that nothing can thank you enough.
the1911fan
04-05-09, 22:41
My condolences to the fallen officers' families. It would be nice to see this sort of outcry and emotion over every fallen servicemen, would it not? Sadly, the police/firefighters garnish much more publicity than the servicemen.
I think it's pretty basic. It's b/c when the local LEO's or Firemen die it is so close to home..it happens in the neighborhood ..LEO's from the neighborhood are dying and people in the neighborhood are doing the killing...not in some far off foreign country..it's in your front or backyard
A theory
My condolences to the fallen officers' families. It would be nice to see this sort of outcry and emotion over every fallen servicemen, would it not? Sadly, the police/firefighters garnish much more publicity than the servicemen.
Yes sir. It would be nice.
The_War_Wagon
04-06-09, 09:35
No one's taking anything out on you. I'm just tired of people making excuses for assclowns who gun down cops.
I don't like Obama any more than anyone, but you can't put this on him nor the government.
For the record:
1. He was given a dishonorable discharge, I'm pretty sure that's on the state and federal questionnaire. I also thought it qualified as a felony conviction.
2. He was subject to a restraining order for violence and threatening to kill his girlfriend. I KNOW that's on both the state and federal questionnaire.
3. The police weren't coming to take away his guns. Had he simply talked to them instead of opening fire...they'd still be alive and there might even be a possibility he wouldn't even be in jail today.
4. If he feared the loss of his firearms, it was because he knew he had broken the law. That he couldn't take responsibility for his own actions, should preclude him from being responsible enough to keep and bear arms.
Thanks for that John - we're DEFINITELY gonna need to remember that around town, once the funerals are over, because our lefty media is gonna go after this with a vengeance. :mad:
I wish more departments would adopt a rifle program. I don't know if that would have helped. Though to put our officers in a position where they don't have the equipment they need is unexceptable and does not need to be the case.
RIP to the fallen. They sounded like good guys and solid cops. Hopefully the ****tard that shot them will get his.
I wish more departments would adopt a rifle program. I don't know if that would have helped. Though to put our officers in a position where they don't have the equipment they need is unexceptable and does not need to be the case.
RIP to the fallen. They sounded like good guys and solid cops. Hopefully the ****tard that shot them will get his.
A carbine definitly would have helped. How could it have possibly hurt? Tim McManaway is a friend, and a shooter. He acted heroicly with his Glock 17. Put himself in the line of fire with the lowest limit of firearm force, a pistol. Well this has been discussed rabidly for about two or three years. Now we know how pistols stack up against carbines. During the Swat response time, Timmy was the only one who put himself into a position to fire on the pos. Timmy kept returning fire at the pos when ever he presented a shot. Unknown if his bullet hit him, but Timmy kept him rattled and covered his fallen brother. Timmy got shot in the left hand during this and continued to poke pistol bullets at the pos at every oppurtunity. I talked to him last night night, he told me he longed for his AR that is sitting in his safe at home. Said he wanted it so bad he could taste it. No tool solves all problems, but it is nice to know you have the right tools for the job approved and available and you have a chance. It has never been clearer to me, my pistol is what I'm carrying when I don't expect trouble.
SeriousStudent
04-06-09, 18:51
Additional prayers sent for the three fallen officers. May their families, friends, and fellow officers receive peace and strength during this terrible ordeal. May the wounded officers make a full and complete recovery, and have a rapid return to duty.
May the courage and brotherhood shown that day be a warm memory for the survivors. May the fallen be remembered with fondness, for their contributions.
To those of you that knew them, may you someday look back with a smile, and be proud that you knew them, and experienced their love.
And may the Devil have an extra bag of coal, for the murderer to clutch in his lap when he arrives in Hell.
Anybody seen this shit? The guy who writes the column is a liberal ****tard, but at least he called out his own people.
http://news.aol.com/political-machine/2009/04/06/caught-on-twitter-daily-kos-founder-jokes-about-pittsburgh-cop/?icid=webmail|wbml-aol|dl1|link5|http%3A%2F%2Fnews.aol.com%2Fpolitical-machine%2F2009%2F04%2F06%2Fcaught-on-twitter-daily-kos-founder-jokes-about-pittsburgh-cop%2F
ETA: 2 other posts about it, one from the above writer, and another from his conservative counterpart:
http://www.redstate.com/absentee/2009/04/05/kos-kompany-cop-shooting-equals-twitter-fun/
http://tommychristopher.wordpress.com/2009/04/05/twitter-badness-dailykos-frontpager-kos-joke-about-pittsburgh-cop-shooting/
Anybody seen this shit? The guy who writes the column is a liberal ****tard, but at least he called out his own people.
http://news.aol.com/political-machine/2009/04/06/caught-on-twitter-daily-kos-founder-jokes-about-pittsburgh-cop/?icid=webmail|wbml-aol|dl1|link5|http%3A%2F%2Fnews.aol.com%2Fpolitical-machine%2F2009%2F04%2F06%2Fcaught-on-twitter-daily-kos-founder-jokes-about-pittsburgh-cop%2F
Interesting reading. No idea who the man is, but nice to witness a liberal wake up and see things as they really are.
Are these random bloggers so powerful as stated in the article? I fail to see how this could transpire. Who or what establishes their credibility? Them? How do they even get traffic to their site?
Seems odd, that's all.
Gutshot John
04-07-09, 12:06
Apparently the gun shop that I frequent sold some of the weapons seized though I don't think the source of the AK has been determined. I know the owners personally I can tell you that they feel awful, but that much of the media reports about them have been giving false impressions. For instance they don't even display AKs, ARs or other eveeel rifles their shelves (they keep a few select models in back for their informed customer base, if you're looking for some SP1s) and that they're very selective about who they sell them to, you have to be a regular before you even get clued in that there is additional stock in the rear. More to the point even the media acknowledges that the scumbag lied on his paperwork.
My friend and one of the owner's daughter, a charming little 8 yo little girl, is obviously being harassed at school by children of antis who've thought it would be wise to make an innocent child a victim of circumstances.
dirksterg30
04-07-09, 12:28
My friend and one of the owner's daughter, a charming little 8 yo little girl, is being harassed at school by children of antis who've obviously thought it would be wise to make an innocent child a victim of circumstances.
That's despicable, but not surprising.
endorphin rush
04-07-09, 13:46
My condolences to the fallen officers' families. It would be nice to see this sort of outcry and emotion over every fallen servicemen, would it not? Sadly, the police/firefighters garnish much more publicity than the servicemen.
LittleLebowski,
I am a LEO and I think I understand what it is you're saying. You are absolutely correct. Each and every one of our fallen service members should get this same amount of attention. Each of them are heroes in their own right, not so much because of how they died, but because of how they lived.
I think you realize, however, that even though the media may not recognize each service members sacrifice individually, there are those of us who do. We are the ones who matter. LEO/FF/MIl...we are all brothers. We do different jobs but live according to a very similar code. When one brother dies, we all feel the pain.
RIP Pittsburgh Officers, and most sincere condolences to their family and friends.
And here's to remembering each of the others, LEO/FF/MIL, who have served and made that sacrifice.
LittleRedToyota
04-07-09, 13:52
A carbine definitly would have helped. How could it have possibly hurt? Tim McManaway is a friend, and a shooter. He acted heroicly with his Glock 17. Put himself in the line of fire with the lowest limit of firearm force, a pistol. Well this has been discussed rabidly for about two or three years. Now we know how pistols stack up against carbines. During the Swat response time, Timmy was the only one who put himself into a position to fire on the pos. Timmy kept returning fire at the pos when ever he presented a shot. Unknown if his bullet hit him, but Timmy kept him rattled and covered his fallen brother. Timmy got shot in the left hand during this and continued to poke pistol bullets at the pos at every oppurtunity. I talked to him last night night, he told me he longed for his AR that is sitting in his safe at home. Said he wanted it so bad he could taste it. No tool solves all problems, but it is nice to know you have the right tools for the job approved and available and you have a chance. It has never been clearer to me, my pistol is what I'm carrying when I don't expect trouble.
Tim McManaway is a true hero.
the idea that any patrol officer should not be able to be trained with and carry an AR is absurd...it's like limiting firemen to using garden hoses.
I would like to jump back in say a few things.
I do feel my early post was taken wrong. I said he was one of us in the understanding that PRIOR TO THAT DAY he was pro-2A, he enjoyed buying firearms, and he was aware of the current political situation. Tha is it. I intended nothing more. I dod not intend to suggest that he or the users here are all walking about wishing for a gun fight, crazed, or criminal.
Next, as I read here I keep seeing "dishonorable discharge" thrown around. They researched and found it was not a dishonorable, it was an "other than". So as for that part of the argument, he was able to legally buy a firearm.
He does appear to have a PFA from his ex. This should have come out during any legal gun shop purchase during the phone call. If this did not... why? There is a problem that should be investigated right there. What is the point of the insta-check if it is a broken system? Fix it.
Everyone weeps for the dead. The LEO that were taken from thier wives/children/mothers/fathers is a terrible loss that will hurt and stay on the minds of many individuals for a long time. Some will suffer a lifetime of pain over this. The loss of all good men weighs heavy on society. It weighs much heavier on his family.
This "kid" (to me any ways) is broken. He has a short circuit, a crossed wire. He is damaged and will never be able to be fixed.
I still wonder how the mother did not know of his danger, did not recognize he was getting prepared with firearms and body armor...... AND CALL 911 BACK AND WARN THEM! This one thing... this kids mother could have CHANGED EVERYTHING! She then would have been a hero.
The 911 call taker was told that guns are at the home. That 911 person (according to FOX news last night) did not note it and pass it to the dispacher. Even if that note had passed... what would have changed? Even if each officer had a Colt AR in the car.... what would have changed? I honestly feel nothing. Police go to homes many times each day where they are very aware guns may and do reside along side the occupants. They do not put on full SWAT gear and knock on the door. Even had these men done just that... what would have changed? Nothing. This asswipe shot them at 6 feet towards the head. I was told in another post here that a ballistic helmet will not stop a rifle round, it is intended to stop pistol or fragmentation from hitting the head.
I thought that 4 officers showing up a scene for a domestic disturbance was covering the bases as well as can be expected. The officers did not make errors, and even had the dispatcher warned them that the home occupants owned firearms... I don't think things would have been different.
These men were ambushed because they assumed that they were going to be visiting the home of a sane human being, just like every other day on the job. THey had no magic spells or crystal ball to show them what hid just a few feet inside the walls of that home. They were coming over to talk, to ask a few questions, and determine what needed to be done to deflate this mother/som argument. I bet they had no visions of a crazed and potentially intoxicated man whos sanity was long gone by the time they arrived to be waiting in the shadows. Who would expect that? How would you defend against that? You can not always be prepared for this type of animal. He did not play by the rules of sane men. Sane men sometimes have a hard time even grasping the insane mind AFTER THE FACT.... how do you out-think an insane mind prior to its actions?
Larry, with all due respect. It couldn't have hurt anything. And we may not have lost all three. I can't really explain that, it's an open case.
Larry, with all due respect. It couldn't have hurt anything. And we may not have lost all three. I can't really explain that, it's an open case.
I completely agree that it would not hurt. I was talking to my pal who is an LEO North of the burgh and he told me that reporting to domestics and various "normal" shot like this is what he does all night long. Yes, he works nights because his wife is in a medical field, makes 5 times what he does, and works days. This LEO raises 2 babies during the day and works the street at night. Anyways, he mentioned that a call such as that is something pretty routine and normal, he is assigned those calls all the time. We talked about what he would done different..... he said only one officer would have been killed, because only one officer is in a car, and only one officer would have came to answer the call at the house in our smaller town. But he said that he does think about this "unheard of" kind of thing, but he just pushes it away and goes on. He says if you dwell on it, you start to panick.
Anyways, my point was that I doubt these LEO would have assumed ambush and attack even if the 911 center told them there were firearms in the home. To assume or even think of something like that.... you have to be able to understand the insane mind and its way of reasoning. Most of us in this conversation can not grasp the concept of what an insane mind will "logically" do. We are sane here.... I hope.
Anyways, this post has pretty much petered out. Funerals are underway. And it is time to move forward and wait for the next nut-case to pop his head up and do damage to our future. I have grim feelings about our 2A future with all these crazy folks running about.
Once again for the reading impaired.
This thread is not for 2A discussion or the armchair quaterbacking.
I am editing and infracting.
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