View Full Version : Daniel Defense Carbine
What is the scoop on these. They don't sell out like the others but seem quite similar to me. Can anyone give me a heads up? Thanks!
thopkins22
04-18-09, 00:27
Quality specs, new, not a lot of people have them yet, hence not a lot of threads.
Despite that...
I searched for both "DDM4" and "Daniel Defense M4" and got lots of pertinent results. One of them.
(http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=24616&highlight=ddm4)
That's the beauty of M4C. Most of the info is readily available and accurate.
I like mine.:D
I'm fond of mine as well. I would buy one again in a heartbeat.
These are a great deal, especially now. I think that the somewhat unconventional rail is turning people off. If they were selling them with Omega rails ( - $100.00) I seriously doubt they would still be in stock anywhere.
thopkins22
04-18-09, 10:32
I think that the somewhat unconventional rail is turning people off.
I love the rail. People don't know what they're missing if that's what's holding them back.
SecretAgentMan
04-18-09, 10:40
I love the rail. People don't know what they're missing if that's what's holding them back.
That rail is definitely holding me back -- they don't make it in a mid-length version! :D
Seriously, though, the Omega X makes a ton of sense. Sign me up for two in a mid-length version. Do you hear me, Daniel Defense? :)
These are a great deal, especially now. I think that the somewhat unconventional rail is turning people off. If they were selling them with Omega rails ( - $100.00) I seriously doubt they would still be in stock anywhere.
Yeah, I'm not a big fan of the rail past the FSB. Other than that it appears to be pretty good deal, especially with prices on everything else like they are now.
Out of curiousity what is it about the rail past the FSB that bothers you?
Yeah, I'm not a big fan of the rail past the FSB. Other than that it appears to be pretty good deal, especially with prices on everything else like they are now.
I like the extended rail; it's very similar to the KAC MRE. It gives you the extra real estate out front to mount an X300 or whatever at 12:00.
Cant say I have ever used one with the rail extended as such. Just going off of looks.
thopkins22
04-18-09, 16:17
Cant say I have ever used one with the rail extended as such. Just going off of looks.
Looks should be secondary, tertiary, or not considered at all when putting anything on a defensive rifle.
I've bought things for no other reason than they looked badass. Most of those things now sit at the the bottom of the safe or got sold. Looking badass should be a bonus, not a limiting factor.
With that said, I think the small amount of exposed barrel that the Omega X provides, looks badass.
That is what I suspected. As it has already been pointed out, the additional rail area in front of the FSB will allow you to mount certain lights that will allow them to be used to their full potential. Though I haven't fired mine yet, I believe that this carbine is a sleeper and they are probably one of the best deals on the market right now.
Cant say I have ever used one with the rail extended as such. Just going off of looks.
Just to be clear, I wasnt saying that the rail isnt top notch. Just saying that I would prefer their standard rail without the extensions because to me it looks better , and I personally have no use for the extra rail space. Now to someone else that likes the way it looks or has use for the space it may be perfect. I suppose I should have been more clear in my wording in my previous posts.
adrenaline151
04-18-09, 19:21
I love mine. I sold my Noveske Recce lo-pro to get it and I don't regret it a bit. The fit/finish of the DD is every bit as good as the Noveske, and I can't see a difference in accuracy, having shot both only with irons. I like that the FSB is protected by the Omega X, and I keep even flip up BUIS up all the time, so the ruggedness and simplicity of the DDM4s irons works well for me. I have a Surefire G2 in a VTAC light holder on the left hand side of the rifle, and it tucks in between the FSB and 12 and 9 rails nicely. The light comes flush with the end of the Omega X and there is hardly any shadow from the barrel. I changed the A2 grip for a MIAD, put a FSC556 and a Vltor Modstock on mine. I love it.
I've got 2 of them. They are a first class weapon. I've put several hundred rounds through one, but haven't shot the other. So far not enough to tell the tale but no surprises either. I also have 2 Noveske's and have only fired one. FWIW, my Noveske shoots tighter groups but I expect it to with the SS barrel and match trigger. I have considered selling my unfired Noveske but will keep one as it's a quality example of a small AR shop. I feel like it's still the best of it's type bar none. I have said it before and will say t again; I prefer the DD M4 to the Colt 6920. No questions about it.
I just bought one from ADCO with no rail, just standard M4 hanguards.
They also had one with a DD 7 rail, which one, I'm not sure.
I did it because it was the best carbine I could afford, not because of any dislike of the rail.
fruitjacket
04-18-09, 23:00
I haven't owned a different AR style weapon before, but I purchased a DDM4 in February and I love it. I have had 2 FTFeeds, but they were both in the same magazine with Wolf ammo, so I'm not overly concerned yet. Have fired probably 200 rounds or so through it.
For the money, I think it's a pretty good weapon, but my opinion is based on limited experience, so take it with a grain of salt.
That being said, I would recommend it to a friend. It's been very reliable and the finish is quite good. When you add in the accessories to a stock AR, it's WELL worth the $1600.
Matter of fact, I HAVE recommended to all of my friends.
I love the gun. I just havent shot it yet. Cant find any damn ammo.
That rail is definitely holding me back -- they don't make it in a mid-length version! :
the FSPM is midlength.. it doesn't wrap around in front of the FSB, but it comes around it
SecretAgentMan
04-19-09, 07:53
the FSPM is midlength.. it doesn't wrap around in front of the FSB, but it comes around it
True, but the thing I probably like best about the Omega X is that I don't have to remove the FSB to install it. Basically, it's a combination of what I like about the Omega (easy installation) and what I like about the Lite (no delta ring, seemingly more robust attachment to the barrel nut).
thopkins22
04-19-09, 09:51
True, but the thing I probably like best about the Omega X is that I don't have to remove the FSB to install it.
You have to remove it for the initial installation.
You have to remove it for the initial installation.
I'm unclear on why you would need to? It is a 2 piece like the standard omega. Does it use a propietary barrel nut?
Edited to add: Nevermind, I think I got it got it...If you don't want to cut off the D-ring.
SecretAgentMan
04-19-09, 16:09
You have to remove it for the initial installation.
Why? It's a two-piece rail.
This new offering from Daniel Defense is one of the best carbines available regardless of price point. Really well spec'ed & quality control appears to be on par with what we should expect from a quality AR manufacturer.
Last night at work, I accessorized a co-workers DD M4-2000 with an Eotech 512/LaRue QD mount combo, a Surefire X300 light mounted in the 12 o'clock position in-front of the FSB, and a TangoDown QD "Stubby" vertical grip. It is still ridiculously lightweight for a fully accessorized carbine. My home built carbine is set up nearly identical to how I did the DD M4-2000, and there is a significant weight difference between the two.
I'm unclear on why you would need to? It is a 2 piece like the standard omega. Does it use a propietary barrel nut?
Edited to add: Nevermind, I think I got it got it...If you don't want to cut off the D-ring.
If you could buy one, You would need to remove the FSB in order to install a new barrel nut. Per the DD rep in this thread (https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=24616):
The Omega X 12.0 FSP does require pulling your Front Sight Base for initial installation. This rail system uses a proprietary barrel nut (Same as the RIS II and AR15 Lite Rails. Once installed, the rail system can be easily removed with out any special tools or gunsmithing.
It will be available seperatley down the road. But for now they are being dedicated to complete rifles.
If you could buy one, You would need to remove the FSB in order to install a new barrel nut. Per the DD rep in this thread (https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=24616):
Thanks!
trunkmonkey
04-19-09, 21:39
without a doubt the DDM4 is one of the best deals going on in the market right now.
I think that the only reason the gunshop I go to has them in stock but is backordered in the hundreds for bushmaster m4A3's is lack of most peoples knowledge on what a quality rifle is.
i'm totally un-familiar with the Omega X's... i was talking about the M4 12.0 FSPM... it's a one piece
SwatDawg15
04-21-09, 01:24
I agree, it is a good weapon system, however the rail does turn the majority of people away from it. The boards are covered with posts about how ugly the rail is, ect. Had they made it with the lite rail, and FSP, or the extended lite, or M4 rail, they would be flying of the shelves. I prefer the low pro gas block, and extended rail on my systems, along with flip up Troys. Thats just personal preference. The DDM4 is a very good deal for what you get.
I'm not crazy about the look of any extended rail but pretty is as pretty does and the extended rail is very practical.
And those same people would probably buy a Bushmaster or DPMS if it was all dressed up with lipstick without regard to how it functions. What they should be looking at are the features that you get for that price and its availability.
I agree, it is a good weapon system, however the rail does turn the majority of people away from it. The boards are covered with posts about how ugly the rail is, ect. Had they made it with the lite rail, and FSP, or the extended lite, or M4 rail, they would be flying of the shelves. I prefer the low pro gas block, and extended rail on my systems, along with flip up Troys. Thats just personal preference. The DDM4 is a very good deal for what you get.
I'm not crazy about the look of any extended rail but pretty is as pretty does and the extended rail is very practical.
So true. If a longer rail - which does nothing but increase your mounting options - is still light and well balanced, who cares how it looks?
I'm pretty sure the DDM4 was not marketed to the sort of folks who would gripe about the rail's looks. I'm glad they're available - I may grab another one!
Can't stand the looks either. There's just something about it.:(
adrenaline151
04-21-09, 21:51
Just wondering out loud if the people who don't like the looks of the rail past the FSB are the same people who want to know how to color in the letters on their rifles... lol.
I emailed daniel defense re: the barrel nut.
It is the same barrel nut used by the lite rails, however if you wanted to install a lite rail you'd have to remove the muzzle device, FSB, and install the lite rail's bolt on plate.
As Iraqgunz pointed out, you're already getting a lot of bang for your buck with this rifle. The price is roughly the same as a Colt with plastic handguards.
Shadow1198
04-22-09, 00:36
And those same people would probably buy a Bushmaster or DPMS if it was all dressed up with lipstick without regard to how it functions. What they should be looking at are the features that you get for that price and its availability.
Hey! I wouldn't buy a DPMS or Bushmaster that was only "cosmetically" gussied up! ;) lol j/k
In all seriousness though, from an aesthetics standpoint I don't really dig the look. That being said, after handling one (didn't get to shoot it though) from Talon Arms (thanks Rob!) at my forum's last shooting range event, I was impressed with the overall balance. As superficial as I can be about looks, I could have cared less about looks after handling it as it felt very well balanced and the overall package seemed to be top notch quality. I've been looking for a nicer quality AR around this price range, and while I'm considering a few others (M&P15 VTAC), my stance is kind of shifting to the DD carbine a bit as it is just such a well rounded well put together gun.
I can't believe all the hoopla about the rail. I have a LMT that I mounted a DD 12.0 FSP and I love it. I allows me to extend my support hand, have infinitely more options for mounting a light, and still uses a standard fixed front sight. I think DD hit a homerun with their new rifle. The facility I currently work at has several and so far they seem to be top notch.
Speaking of painting roll marks.....though unrelated. Can anyone tell me what's wrong with this lower? I found this on another site. Apparently it was assembled by the owner and from what I can tell he has very little experience with the weapon.
2333
Just wondering out loud if the people who don't like the looks of the rail past the FSB are the same people who want to know how to color in the letters on their rifles... lol.
So much for staking.
he'll be glad he didn't stake it when he realizes the endplate's on backwards..
You mean that hole at the end of the receiver isn't a lightening hole? :D
adrenaline151
04-22-09, 05:47
That must be the new Noveske QD end plate. Those roll marks look awesome, though.
Sold, thanks to Steve at ADCO.
He's breaking down a DDM4 and neutering the upper and lower for me before shipping them out to the local FFL shop that's taking delivery.
Among the modifications being done are:
Welded Miculek brake.
Gas block replaced with PRI flip-up.
Magpul MOE stock being replaced with an ACE ARFX-E skeleton stock.
Of course, I'm paying for parts and labour associated with the chopping up of my new AR, and it isn't cheap.
Things would be so much easier without the NYS AWB.
trunkmonkey
04-22-09, 08:29
I agree, it is a good weapon system, however the rail does turn the majority of people away from it. The boards are covered with posts about how ugly the rail is, ect. Had they made it with the lite rail, and FSP, or the extended lite, or M4 rail, they would be flying of the shelves. I prefer the low pro gas block, and extended rail on my systems, along with flip up Troys. Thats just personal preference. The DDM4 is a very good deal for what you get.
I love those fools that shy away from a weapon system because they thing it's "ugly". Are you frigging kidding me? tools
And the rail system is so light most would never guess how long it is.
Actually he had no idea until someone pointed out to him after he posted the pic. Maybe had he spent less time filing in roll marks and spent more time on putting the lower together he would have been better served.
Hopefully he didn't FUBAR anything else......
he'll be glad he didn't stake it when he realizes the endplate's on backwards..
My wife made the same comment. She said it was not as heavy as my Novekse or my PD15-LMT carbine and she was pleasantly surprised.
I love those fools that shy away from a weapon system because they thing it's "ugly". Are you frigging kidding me? tools
And the rail system is so light most would never guess how long it is.
Hey guys,
I just picked up a DDM4 rifle. Being a GA boy, I have wanted one of their lowers marked Savannah, GA ever since they posted a picture of one on their website a couple of years ago. First, I have to say this is one of the most well put together rifles I have ever seen. the combination & quality of components plus the quality of the build are excellent. The lower & upper were tight, like they were one piece of forged aluminum! It may be bothersome to some, but I thought it was impressive.
While it is one sexy rifle, especially the rail, I am selling the upper half. I just don't need another 16" upper. I thought my Dad was going to take it, but he just bought a Noveske Recce Basic and a middie BCM upper from Grant.
I have a quick question for you guys. I was adding my favorite accessories to the lower and I am having some trouble with the trigger. I wanted to swap it out for a Geissele SSA that I've had rat holed for just such an occasion. When I installed it, it would not work. I can't get the trigger to break. It's like having the safety on, but it has some movement, then it hits a solid wall & the hammer just won't fall.
Any ideas?
It seems like a fine carbine, I just don't need the rail. I won't pay the added premium for a $300+ rail when the basic M4 handguards suit me fine. For others I'm sure this is an ideal purchase, especially at such a great price.
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