Leupold CQT...

[Hawkeye]

What do you folks think of the CQT in general? How do you think it would do in a semi RECCE type/200-250 yrd overwatch role?

[USMC03]

My response from another post in reference to the Leupold CQ/T on LF.net:


It depends on your application. A lot of competition / 3 gunners use them and really like them. The glass is not bad, just doesn't have a lot of features that lends it's self to being a good optic for *most* military / police / tactical applications:


-On 3x the eye relief is extreemly short (about the width of my index finger),

-the field of view is like looking through a straw,

-the reticle is not visible during day light hours,

-at 3 yards the large circle is touching the "C" on an IPSC target (ie. it's almost too large to be practical),

-it's long and heavy (8.8", 17.5 oz),

-mounting options suck (unless LaRue starts making a mount for them again), the amber lit reticle sucks


-etc, etc, etc, etc, etc.


In short, for my application LEO / SWAT, I don't care for them.


For more info read my responses on page 3 (screen name USMC03)

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=290997&page=3

______________________________________________________________

Hi Xxxx,


My responses are listed in BOLD text below your quote.



Originally posted by SMGXxx:
Jeff,

Always agree with everything you said except on this CQT issue.

Nothing wrong with having a differening opinion, based on first hand experience. If we all agreed all the time, this internet thing would get boring rather quickly :beer:

the eye relief is short but not any shorter then the ACOG 4x.

I was running our Department Quals on the rifle range 2 weeks ago. We have over 200 sworn officers on our Dept. and only 1 of them carries a CQ/T. While this Officer was at the range I used his CQ/T to get familiar with it again, as it's been 18 - 24 months since I last had any trigger time on one.

On 3x, I measured the distance from my eyebrow to the scope. It was the width of my index finger.

I have owned several ACOGs (TA01, TA01NSN, TA31s, and TA11s).

The eye relief on the TA01, TA01NSN, and TA31 is listed as 1.5". Measuring with my fingers the eye relief is the width of my index AND middle finger. For me the eye relief is noticeably more with the ACOGs.

The eye relief on the TA11 is 3" - 3.5". I'm sure you were probably refering to the 4x ACOGs.


FOV is actually better on the CQT then it is on the short Dot. at least at 1X.

I was refering to the FOV on 3x, it reminds me of looking through a straw. On 1x the CQ/T has a wide field of view, I can remember seeing the handguards on the Officer's rifle.

it is true about the poor illuminating reticel and low battery life. but Short dot has about the same low life on the batteries but at least you can see the illumination during the day.

Opinions, applications, and mission statements differ. As I stated above: "The glass is not bad, just doesn't have a lot of features that lends it's self to being a good optic for *most* military / police / tactical applications."

For the square range there is nothing wrong with a non-illuminated reticle, or a reticle that can't be seen during bright day light, with use of white light, etc.

For people who are operating outside the controlled enviornment of a square range, an illuminated reticle that can be seen under all conditions can be more of a "need" than a "want".

A couple examples of this is:

-Consider going up a stair well with your CQ/T a bad guy has on dark colored clothing. You and a couple other members all have your 9 volt surefire lights aimed in on him. He won't listen to commands. You can't find your reticle because the lights are bright enough to wash out the illuminated reticle and the black reticle is blending in with his clothing. This happened to an Officer I know who use to use the CQ/T.

-Often times, when it's bright outside bad guys, like cockroaches, like to hide in dark areas (barricaded gunman inside a dark house, suspect hiding in a salvage lot under a pile of wrecked cars, under a sheets of plywood leaned up against a fence, in a dark secluded breezeway, etc). If you under the bright sun light in the middle of the day and the suspect is in a dark area, you may not be able to see the reticle as the sun light will wash out the illumination and it's extreemly difficult / sometimes impossible to see / find a black reticle against a dark background.


mount does suck.

At least we found some common ground ;)

but as long and heavy, it is no longer and heavier then a Short dot that cost a lot more.

I should have been more articulate. For what it does, the CQ/T is long and heavy.

If a piece of gear has outstanding performance and desireable features I will tolerate a little extra weight or bulkyness. Other optics are on the market that are close to the same features as the CQ/T that are light, smaller, have more magnification, have more features, and have more eye relief.

To compare the a $700 CQ/T to a $2,000+ Short Dot is much like comparing a $20,000 Saturn to a $50,000 Mercedes Benz. They are not really in the same class. With the Benz, you are paying more for attention to detail and performance. The same applies to optics.

I wasn't trying to compare the two. If you read the www.ar15.com (http://www.ar15.com) thread above, a guy on that site stated that the they were basically the same, but the CQ/T just cost less. There was a long discussion about the CQ/T in that thread, and that is why I posted a link to it. Sorry for any mis-comm on my part.

the Long tube is require to reach a true 1x unlike the Short dot which is about as long and it is actually a 1.1x.

The CQ/T is extreemly close to 1x, but it is not a true 1x like an EO Tech or Aimpoint. Look at the front sight post next time you look though a CQ/T and you will see some slight distortion cause by slightly more than 1x magnification.

then again.. no one really makes a ture to life 1X there is always some varations. but CQT is the closest to a true 1X.

Disreguard my last.....I concur

It is indeed ugly....and the damn rail on the tube.


______________________________________________________________


Gear selection is based on mission statement and personal preference. If you gear doesn't work when you need it to, it hinders you ability to proficiently complete your mission and come home safely.

I'm not saying that the CQ/T is a bad optic. Leupold marketed it toward the military / tactical community and in my opinion the CQ/T doesn't have a lot of features that lends it's self to being a good optic for *most* military / police / tactical applications.

I think a lot of the complaints you hear about the CQ/T comes from military guys and cops. Many 3 gun, IPSC, competition shooters love the CQ/T. If Leupold had marketed the scope to a different crowd or given it a different name, I don't think you would hear as much chatter about it. Just my 2 pesos



Take care and stay safe,

Semper Fi,
Jeff

[Hawkeye]

Thanks Jeff. Taking your points into consideration, I can see where it may not be the best optic for patrol or general use. Let me propose this use/situation. If it was mounted on a carbine with a bipod that was specifically designed to be used from a fixed sandbagged position in a perimeter security/short range overwatch position. Would it be suitable for that kind of role? What other options would be a good choice other than a Short Dot, ACOG, or Specter?

[USMC03]

The CQ/T is not a bad optics, it's features just don't lend themselves well to my applications. As with any piece of gear there is a learning curve associated with it and we all have differing likes and dislikes. Only *you* can tell if it will work for you or not. I would try to get some trigger time on one before purchasing one.

A lot of talk about the CQ/T in the following threads (my experiences with the CQ/T):

http://getoffthex.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/182106881/m/8431031271

http://lightfighter.net/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/2811094651/m/7181003862


You may want to take a look at the ARFCOM thread posted above.

[Hawkeye]

Jeff, read the AR15 thread when you first posted. Just checked out the others. Thanks.
I want an optic that can fill this kind of role for my next build. I am just going to be on a bit of a budget and wont be able to drop the $$ for a Short dot, thus I need to look for an alternative that I can swing.

[USMC03]

Posted the wrong thread to LF.net. Sorry. Here is the thread I ment to post:

http://lightfighter.net/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/2811094651/m/9331007652

[C4IGrant]

Owned one and sold it (heavy, low battery life and illuminated reticle no visible in Full Sun).

I do believe that they are making some changes to it and we might see something new out of them at Shot. I know LT is starting to make the mounts for them again, so I wonder if they are improving it.


Best value for a variable optic is the Trijicon TR21. Next is the Horus Talon and then the NF.



C4

[Hawkeye]

The price on the TR21 sure looks nice. Would it be suitable for the role I mentioned above?

[Alpha Sierra]

Look at the Horus Talon 1-4X.

There is a good review by paulosantos in our optics forum.

I'm seriously considering it for my next build.

[paulosantos]

Look at the Horus Talon 1-4X.

There is a good review by paulosantos in our optics forum.

I'm seriously considering it for my next build.

Thanks for the compliment. I have both the CQT and the Horus and I like the Horus much better, especially for a Reece type AR. The eye relief on the Horus is much more forgiving. It has 2" more eye relief and it is lighter and the reticle is much better on the Horus. The CQT is a good scope, but it needs to be updated.

[C4IGrant]

The price on the TR21 sure looks nice. Would it be suitable for the role I mentioned above?

Yes. Naval EOD has been running these in combat for YEARS now. The LT SPR-EER mount was designed SPECIFICALLY for this optic (FYI).



C4

[Hawkeye]

Yes. Naval EOD has been running these in combat for YEARS now. The LT SPR-EER mount was designed SPECIFICALLY for this optic (FYI).



C4

Interesting. Duely noted. Thanks.

[k9dpd]

wait for the Mueller CQB to come out in a few months, price is going to be right it on it I here.

[Bolt_Overide]

So who actually has pricing for the horus? I looked as much as I care to and cant find pricing for it anywhere.

[MerQ]

I think G&R Tactical sells them. PM C4iGrant

[macman37]

Consider the 1.5-5 MR/T as well... IMHO (and I'm not HSLD by any means but I can say I own one!) it's a very nice optic. Reticle would likely be washed out in sunlight in the 1.5x CQ type usage though.