Interested in a 1911...opinions requested [Archive]

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dookie1481

05-13-09, 18:07

I'm looking to get my first (real) 1911, and I'm faced with a dilemma. Either:

a. Get a simple base gun (SA Mil-spec, etc.) and have it tuned by a good gunsmith or

b. Save up and buy a used semi-custom (Wilson, Les Baer, etc.).

I'm leaning towards option B as it seems it would likely be more reliable and probably cheaper.

Opinions?

Jay

decodeddiesel

05-13-09, 19:23

What is your budget?

Is this your only pistol?

What will be the primary role of this gun? Plinker? CCW? Duty Gun?

dookie1481

05-13-09, 19:40

What is your budget?

Is this your only pistol?

What will be the primary role of this gun? Plinker? CCW? Duty Gun?

I guess that info might be helpful.

Budget isn't set in stone, but I would like to keep it around $1500 or so before mags, holster, light, etc.

Not my only pistol, but it would be my only .45.

Mostly range use, but possible CCW piece if I put enough rounds through it to trust it.

Jay

The Dumb Gun Collector

05-13-09, 19:57

LAV said that a good used Wilson CQB was THE bargain in the 1911 world.

dookie1481

05-13-09, 20:00

LAV said that a good used Wilson CQB was THE bargain in the 1911 world.

Definitely interested in one, though they seem to run about $1700 or so used; the Les Baer TRS seems to be a good deal also. I don't care if it's used, scratched, whatever. I'm gonna use the damn thing so finish isn't a big deal.

Jay

d90king

05-13-09, 20:03

IrishDevil

05-13-09, 20:14

With that price range I would buy used, having a gun built would certainly meet or exceed your budget easily. Finding a smith to do the work in a timely manner is hard, but not impossible. While I've gotten out of the 1911 game, I miss my Wilson CQB everyday.

RD62

05-13-09, 20:15

Basic and use the balance for ammo.

You'll need it. .45 ain't cheap right now.

Shoot it, decide what youlike and don't like. Then sell it and upgrade, or upgrade the one you have.

my .02 cents

-RD62

Blake

05-13-09, 20:38

I voted for buying a used semi-custom. I recommend to be sure of the features you want. You can find some great deals for some used 1911s out there. Well under $2,000 for a used ones. I would buy a Wilson, Nighthawk, Springfield Custom Shop, or Ed Brown. I don't care for Les Baer, just my opinion. I believe there are much better guns for the money. If you buy a base model. You will wait and wait. Not a lot of top level gun smiths that are taking work these days. Then you are getting in to some serious money to get a good custom build. Just my worth nothing opinion.

G34Shooter

05-13-09, 20:53

For $1500 I would just buy a Les Baer. To really have a top smith build a gun will far exceed your budget. Baers out of the box are a good value, his parts are very good and the accuracy is second to none.

Exactly, that was what I did and had a TRS sent to Harrison Custom and had it Ionbonded as well... I miss it :(

decodeddiesel

05-13-09, 21:17

I hope this helps:

https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=3096

Rob_s compares a Wilson CQB, Ed Brown SF, and a YB Milspec. All should be close to your price range used.

I know a used Wilson, Les Baer, or Ed Brown may be best here.

However if it were me I would get a Stainless Milspec, then send it off to the SA Custom shop, Steve Mars, Chuck Rogers, Ted Yost, etc. and have them do their best then send it off to drake's gun works for meloniting. This will probably bust the budget based on the purchase price of the milspec, but in the end it would be a one of a kind and totally worth it.

dookie1481

05-14-09, 02:22

Rob96

05-14-09, 03:32

I upgraded a Mil-Spec. I prefered that method because I wanted the 10-8 rear sight and trigger.

For $1500 you used to be able to get the RRA Basic Carry which was a great deal. For $1500 limit I would probably opt for a new Springfield TRP if I couldn't locate a used Wilson or Baer.

JSandi

05-14-09, 03:35

Actually used Wilson CQB's can be found under 2 grand I am currently eyeing one and will most likely buy it by weeks end for about $1500.

I vote for saving up your pennies and buying a solid well built custom gun, one that has everything you want already on it.

For me the CQB fits that bill.

minus the green paint of course... :o

G34Shooter

05-14-09, 07:30

So you think a used CQB for 2K is better than a used Les Baer TRS for $1500 (budget IS an issue but not THE determining factor)?

Jay

Just an FYI, a new Baer TRS can be had for about $1700 (I bought my TRS from www.proload.com for $1631 shipped in 2007) so you may find a nice TRS for ~$1300

jeremy45

05-14-09, 09:29

I also voted for a Semi-custom. I had a pistol build that ended up costing me alot more than a TRS would have been new when all was said and done. Alos should I ever have to sell it I couldn't get what a Baer or Wilson would be worth in value. So, I think it would be wiser to go with a semi-custom in good shape.

Jeremy45

Blake

05-14-09, 09:38

So you think a used CQB for 2K is better than a used Les Baer TRS for $1500 (budget IS an issue but not THE determining factor)?

Jay

That is absolutely what I'm saying. I have never seen a serious 1911 shooter (by serious, I'm referring to combat pistol shooter, defense shooter) shooting a Baer. I'm not saying that people don't. I haven't seen many reputable instructors recommending Baer pistols either. I do realize Clint Smith is associated with them. The Baers that I have seen, have been overly tight, and difficult to function. Try doing a malfunction clearance with a Baer. I'm not saying they are bad guns, but I would easily choose a Wilson over a Baer. That would be a no-brainer for me. If a Wilson isn't in your budget, then that changes things. Make the decision based on what you can afford and want. I would save a few more months to get the Wilson if it was me buying. I like Nighthawk as well.

Business_Casual

05-14-09, 09:40

LAV said that a good used Wilson CQB was THE bargain in the 1911 world.

Everything you need to know.

M_P

decodeddiesel

05-14-09, 09:49

MarshallDodge

05-14-09, 10:07

You should be able to pick up something in the $1200-$1400 range.

My vote would be for the TRS. I have only had mine for a short while but it shoots great and is built really well.

I am also hearing good things about the Dan Wesson Valor. Bud's had them new for $1250: Valor (https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/53553)

G34Shooter

05-14-09, 10:32

That is absolutely what I'm saying. I have never seen a serious 1911 shooter (by serious, I'm referring to combat pistol shooter, defense shooter) shooting a Baer. I'm not saying that people don't. I haven't seen many reputable instructors recommending Baer pistols either. I do realize Clint Smith is associated with them. The Baers that I have seen, have been overly tight, and difficult to function. Try doing a malfunction clearance with a Baer. I'm not saying they are bad guns, but I would easily choose a Wilson over a Baer. That would be a no-brainer for me. If a Wilson isn't in your budget, then that changes things. Make the decision based on what you can afford and want. I would save a few more months to get the Wilson if it was me buying. I like Nighthawk as well.

Don't always believe what you hear or read, Baer's are overly tight until they are broken in and then just smooth if done correctly. I shot 880 the first week from my BNIB TRS and over 5,000 rounds with no malfunctions in just over a year before I sold it (Fantastic Gun, I'm not a 1911 guy). I had a custom 10-8 sight and with the EGW OS FPS and 16# recoil spring, 1 handed functioning was cake. And if you don't think people train or run Baer's hard here's 2 fine Examples:

Jason Burton of www.heirloomprecision.com/

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=53832

-UPDATE- Long term TRS report....

It's been almost 2 years since I bought my hard chrome TRS and I figured it was about time I posted a long-term report on it. I bought my first TRS in July of 2001 and after giving it a good run through of 500 failure free rounds I knew I had to have another for a daily carry and "beat around" gun. This time I wanted the gun in hard chrome.

http://www.louderthanwords.us/smallfoto/picts/ulfls/1705104/20339155701.jpg

I also ordered the gun with a few extra parts that were fit to the gun and chromed. The parts included an extractor, slide stop, and firing pin. The hard chrome TRS was delivered to me in mid September of 2001 and after proving its reliability (500 flawless rounds in the first range session) it became my daily carry piece. Here is how the gun has faired since then...

For the first 1500 or so rounds I was very happy with the gun in its stock form but after that I started to play around with different grips. I liked the thin ones that came on the gun from the shop but for some reason they just didn't seem to suit me..... not aggressively checkered enough for me. I was also somewhat concerned with the rigidity of the plunger tube and with how securely it was affixed to the frame. With the understanding that JMB had designed the grips to support and capture the plunger tube in the event that it came loose I was looking for grips that would do that. So I fit a set of Ahrends Gaboon Ebony full size stocks to the gun.

http://www.louderthanwords.us/smallfoto/picts/ulfls/1705104/20339155702.jpg

This actually proved to be a bit more complicated that a simple bushing and screw swap. It appears that Baer guns use a plunger tube that is a bit larger than normal and thus it was required that the left grip panel be relieved in order to fit over the plunger tube. Not a big deal... just an unexpected delay. The Ahrends grips kept me happy for some time and I also occasionally used a set of full size stocks with the TR logo on them.

http://www.louderthanwords.us/smallfoto/picts/ulfls/1705104/20339155813.jpg

I kept the full size stocks on the gun for the next 1000 or so rounds during which I noticed something strange. The recoil spring plug began to exhibit a bit of peening on the open end, specifically the portion that is directly underneath the barrel and unsupported by the spring tunnel. :confused: The gun only had around 2500 rounds through it and I knew that this was a part that should never wear out so I shipped the gun off the Baer for them to have a look at it. Less than 2 weeks later the gun was returned to me with a new recoil spring guide and plug that have seemed to solve the problem. Once I got the gun back I was again yearning to shoot a gun with thin stocks on it so off came the full size stocks and standard size stock bushings and back on went the TRS thin grips.

The next 5000 were pretty boring.... I switched back and forth between full size and thin stocks and shot the gun equally with both, never really settling on a preference. At about 7500 rounds it was again time for a new recoil spring and having recently shot a custom gun by Ned Christiansen that was sprung with a 16lbs spring I decided to play around with the spring weight in my TRS. I had always used 18.5lbs conventional rate recoil springs in a 5" gun but after a very favorable experience with the aforementioned custom gun I was interested is seeing how the TRS felt with a 16lbs spring. What I discovered was nothing really new or surprising but for me the 16lbs spring definitely feels better to shoot. The gun seems to shoot "softer" and flatter and there have been no ill effects on the reliability or timing of the gun.

So now the gun is at somewhere around 7500 rounds and having always wanted a standard GI "teardrop" thumb safety on the gun I decided to fit one. This was just in time for an up coming class I had and I figured it would be a good proving ground for the GI safety and whether or not I like one in practice and not just in theory. During the class the GI thumb safety worked out quite well and it proved a keeper. It was also during the class that the gun had its first serious problem... well kind of serious anyway. During the second day of the class the mainspring-housing pin broke in half and although it didn't render the gun immediately inoperable it was something that needed to be replaced. Good thing for second guns. :) I hadn't ever though about the pin breaking so I didn't have an extra in my range bag. Luckily one of the instructors had an extra pin for me. Before long the TRS was up and running again and I finished out the class without any further malfunctions or problems and another 800 or so rounds through the gun.

Now the gun has almost 11000 rounds through it and to this day its had only 2 malfunctions that I can say for sure were due to the gun and not a bad mag or bad ammo. The gun is very reliable and has smoothed out very well from the "grit your teeth tight" slide to frame fit to a "smooth as glass, running on ball bearings" slide to frame fit. I like this gun allot and it continues to be my daily companion. It has fed everything I've ever put through it and continues to posses more accuracy than I am capable of. Other than the broken MSH pin there have been no parts breakages major or otherwise and so far the extra parts I ordered with the gun have gone unused. My thoughts that the plunger tube may have needed some type of support have proved unfounded and it is still rigidly fixed to the frame. With the original thin stocks back on the gun and a GI thumb safety I've settled into a configuration that I really like for this gun. The GI thumb safety has proved convenient, practical, and plenty fast and the thin stocks help my midget hands get a good grip around the gun. The hard chrome finish has held up remarkably well. This gun has not been babied and after almost two years of constant carry, getting occasionally banged into things, sweating on the gun, rolling around in range gravel, 11000 rounds, and at least as many draws from a holster the finish still looks new. There are a couple or scratches here and there and sights don't retain all of their original black finish but over all the entire gun looks great. The hard chrome finish has been excellent and there has been no evidence of rust or discoloration and the finish shows no signs of peeling or flaking off in any high wear areas.

http://www.louderthanwords.us/smallfoto/picts/ulfls/1705104/20339155804.jpg

http://www.louderthanwords.us/smallfoto/picts/ulfls/1705104/20339155835.jpg

Yesterday was another beautiful day here in the NW and a buddy of mine and I took advantage of it and headed out to the hills to do a bit of shooting. After our shooting session I again thought about how well my experience with this gun and Les Baer have been. I couldn't be happier with the gun and I have the utmost confidence in it and my abilities with it. As before I will continue to recommend this gun to anyone looking for a semi-custom 1911 and I still believe the TR Special is the best deal in high end 1911s. I think the TR Specials are good to go right out of the box but if I could I would change one thing about them. IMO, the stock thumb safety is a bit too wide and most would be better served with a slimmer safety. I know... it's a pretty small complaint but I had to find one. ;)

Considering a few other topics that are currently being discussed in this forum I thought it might be a good time to update the long-term report on my hard chrome TRS. I originally posted this report about a year ago and, as you can see above, at that time the gun had digested around 11,000 rounds. In the last year that round count has doubled and the gun now has put over 22,000 rounds down range. The gun continues to be a joy to shoot and even though I may own many other â€œhigher endâ€ 1911s my TR Special continues to be my daily companion.

To this day the hard chrome finish has proven indestructible and the gun has shown no signs of rust or corrosion. Holster wear is also a non-issue and the gun still looks almost new. The gun has also been 100% reliable and the extra parts I originally ordered with the gun have still gone unused and are collecting dust. I have had no problems with the gun whatsoever and the originally tight frame/slide/barrel fit has turned into a remarkably smooth gun by which I will probably judge 1911s for so time to come.

In all reality this gun has been one of the wisest if not the wisest purchases I have ever made and I have got my monies worth and then some. The gun still delivers 1.5â€ groups at 20 yards provided Iâ€™m doing my part and so far it has shown no signs of stopping.

I canâ€™t stress enough how impressed I am with the long-term performance of this gun, and donâ€™t think for one minute that I have babied this gun a bit. With the delivery of a new set of carry guns coming due I have been doing my best to â€œwear outâ€ my TR Special... but in all reality I think Iâ€™ll be wearing out first. I may not think the TRS is perfect in every way but it just goes to show that when a 1911 is built right there is simply nothing better. ;)

With a new set of carry guns recently delivered it seems fitting to update this long-term report on my current carry gun the TR Special.

Since my last update I have shot about 8000 rounds through the chromed TR Special and the gun has now digested a total of just under 30,000 rounds. The overwhelming majority of those 30,000 rounds have been 230gr hardball from Federal and Winchester (as well as the occasional 230gr JHP) all fed through a set of 6 Wilson Combat 7rd magazines. These are the same 6 magazines I have been using with the gun since it was delivered to me and they seem to have faired just as well as the gun.

Truth be told there’s really not much exciting to update... The gun continues to be a very accurate and 100% reliable workhorse that has incurred no malfunctions during the last 8000 rounds bringing the total malfunction count to a whopping 2. The hard chrome finish is still proving its utility and durability and the gun continues to look almost as fresh as the day it was delivered. Holster miles have taken no toll on the finish and the gun exhibits only a few scratches or blemishes. Most of the wear on the gun has come from inserting magazines and operating the safeties, although the bluing on the sights is getting pretty well worn on the high spots, as is the finish on the barrel.

The gun has had regular recoil spring changes in intervals between 2000-2500 rounds and was never used with a shock-buff. No cracking, peening, or otherwise has been exhibited on either the frame or slide and the fit of the two parts continues to be very smooth and without play.

The extra extractor, slide stop, and firing pin I originally ordered with the gun have still yet to be needed and the original thin grips continue to wear well. The trigger has stayed consistent over the last 30,000 rounds and the barrel continues to lock up without any movement. Parts left unfinished, such as the hammer and barrel hood, have faired just as well as the rest of the gun and so far I have seen no traces of rust even though the piece has been shot in all weather conditions.

After 30,000 rounds, multiple handgun classes, countless draws from the leather, and loads of shooting in various weather conditions this TR Special is still a winner. The gun continues to show that it can take whatever I can dish out (it almost begs to be abused) and seems to come back asking for more. No big surprises here, as far as I’m concerned the TR Special is still one hell of a good deal. ;)

Yeah I still use 16# recoil springs in my TRS as well as in all my other 5” 1911s. I found I just don’t like the way a 5” gun shoots (specifically how the gun feels when it goes into battery) with an 18.5# and since I don’t shoot anything but 230gr FMJ and change my recoil springs religiously I don’t worry about battering the frame etc.

I think it’s important to point out that, while I have shot a quantity of JHPs in different weights through this TRS, I really only shoot and use one bullet type and always use the same magazines with the gun. I can’t help but think that finding a successful combination and sticking with it contributed at least a little bit to the impressive reliability this gun has shown over the last few years.

Jim – The value to cost ratio of Baer’s guns is certainly in the buyers favor. This particular gun has given back 100 fold when compared to the cost. It was certainly money well spent and for some time to come will be a fitting example of how when one finds a gun, ammo, and mags that work well together the combo can do no wrong.

The gun passed the 40,000 round mark some time ago but in the last year I haven’t shot it much so there’s not really much to tell.

Up to this point it has had no malfunctions other than the previously mentioned two. Parts breakages have still been limited to the MSH pin that occurred at about the 7500 round mark and to this day the gun still remains in service with me… albeit in a lesser role. One thing I can say for sure is that I still do not regret this purchase one bit. ;)

HA!! That's a good one but not quite accurate... actually I'm packing a high-quality Jennings auto stoked with the ultimate in lethality the .32ACP, HA!

Just kidding of course... ;)

Updates?? It's timely that you mentioned it... over the weekend I was at a local SO range training with one of my shooting partners and when one of my main using pieces suffered a squib load I pulled out the TR Special and finished the day. I've lost count of the number of rounds that has been through the gun as it has been used a loaner pistol for a few shooters over the spring. The round count has exceeded 40,000 but is probably no more that the low 41,000 range.

To this day the only necessary parts changes, not including springs, have been the MSH pin referenced earlier and the firing pin at just over the 40K mark. The inserts in the sights are almost dead but at this point the gun is complete and still going strong with the original parts as fit from Baer.

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=229835

The gun is carried in my MS VMII and a Safari Land Kydex for competition in IDPA/TSA.

Moving on to assembled pics:
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb224/Naciones73/TRS%2016k%20Report/15RightRear.jpg

Oh, No! Marks behind the ejection port!! :eek:
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb224/Naciones73/TRS%2016k%20Report/16EjectionPort.jpg

Yes, I drifted the rear sight over...
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb224/Naciones73/TRS%2016k%20Report/17LeftRear.jpg

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb224/Naciones73/TRS%2016k%20Report/18Rear.jpg

'Business' end of the tube:
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb224/Naciones73/TRS%2016k%20Report/19MuzzleFront.jpg

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb224/Naciones73/TRS%2016k%20Report/20FrontOblique.jpg

I really enjoy this gun and it has been phenominal. If I were allowed to carry a personal sidearm during deployment, this would be it.

Thanks for looking and see you in another 5k rounds!

A special thanks to 'Pounder35' for providing his mad camera skills!

[

G34Shooter

05-14-09, 10:33

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=186873

TRS / CQB Range Report

I received my TRS and my CQB last friday (two on the same day-ain't that a b*tch) and spent the weekend shooting the Baer. It's interesting how a design can be around for 100 years and two companies can execute it so differently. Definitely apples and oranges. I finally got around to shooting the Wilson today back to back with the TRS and will start it off with gratuitous pics and then my thoughts...
TRS without front cocking serrations:
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb224/Naciones73/TRLockedCocked.jpg
Wilson CQB w/ single safety:
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb224/Naciones73/CQBLeftoblique.jpg
Fit and Finish as you can see are on par with what one would expect from guns in this price range.
Baer:
The Baer is tightly fit, but not overly tight (as my Monolith is) and was easily disassembled for cleaning after 610 rds. Feels awesome in the hand-like it was made from a solid piece of steel. Bluing is showing a bit of wear (ie; character), but has been drawn from a leather holster several hundred times in the past 5 days. Safety flicks on and off easily, is very positive and is slightly larger then the safety on the CQB. Function for the last 710 rds (total) was perfect with the exception of 3 issues from the #3 mag that came with the gun (that's why I label them) and that was in the first 200 rds. Super, one-hole accurate. Ammo used was WWB, Magtech 230gr ball, GI Ball, 230HydraShoks and my 200gr LSWC reloads. Mags included the LBCs, WC, SA and Wolff. All mags seated easily and flew out of the gun on command including the aforementioned LBC. The thin grips allow me to manipulate the fire controls easily.

Wilson Combat
Fits the hand well (obviously a little "fuller" than the TRS due to the traditional grips) and is smooth as butter. Not as snug as the Baer, rather a buttery feel to it. Where I can feel the barrel "unlock" on the Baer, the Wilson slides back with ease and tracks well. Sights were spot on. In fact it's the only 1911 out of my stable (less than 20) that didn't need adjustment. It was very accurate and smooth with superb build quality. LIttle details like the slight "dishing out" of the bottom of the grip/MSH to facilitate quicker reloads. Total 220 rds thru it, same ammo as the Baer listed above. No issues with any mag/ammo combo. Magazines click in and launch out easily as well by what seems to be an oversized mag release.
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb224/Naciones73/15YdTgt.jpg
IDPA target at 15 yds doing double taps from the holster w/230gr HydraShoks. CQB up top, Baer on the bottom...

Final thoughts:
Baer Positive
-Mega accurate
-Handles superbly with the thin grips (back on target quick, etc)
-Functioned perfectly with my right thumb on the safety (see CQB)
-I'm a sucker for a blued gun
-My wife likes it more and says it feels better in her hand (likely due to the thin grips)
Baer Negative
-Drags a bit coming out of the holster due to rough texture to finish on top of slide and bottom of frame.
-Trigger is a tad heavier than the 3.5# on the CQB
-Comes in a cardbox box wrapped in a piece of butcher paper.
Wilson Positive
-Excellent build quality
-Super trigger
-Armor Tuff allows it to slide out of the holster nicely
-Sights (yellow rear, green front) are perfect
-Smooooooth
-Comes with an embroidered pistol rug/bag, (2) DVDs, test target, signed quality control sheet and a coupon for a free hat, T shirt, etc.

Wilson Negative
-Grip safety is not sensitive enough for me to keep my right thumb on the safety while firing without making a concentrated effort to squeeze the grip safety. GS needs to be "sensitized" a bit. (sent the gun back this winter and they sensitized it for me and had it back in a week. ONly charged me an hour labor as it was a mod that I asked for due to my grip, vice a warranty issue). I'm very pleased.
-Grips give it a totally different feel than the TRS...

Obviously the Wilson cost more, so the extras I got with it are as it should be. Bottom line-I like them both and can't wait for IDPA this month....

ETA: The Wilson comes with a ShokBuff, which as we know is a point of contention for some, but until I take the gun apart at the 500 rd mark, it's stayin. CQB slingshots fine. TRS does not have one and obviously does so as well. My Monolith came with one and the gun would not slingshot until I took it out (in 17 pieces).

Blake

05-14-09, 13:43

Don't always believe what you hear or read, Baer's are overly tight until they are broken in and then just smooth if done correctly. I shot 880 the first week from my BNIB TRS and over 5,000 rounds with no malfunctions in just over a year before I sold it (Fantastic Gun, I'm not a 1911 guy). I had a custom 10-8 sight and with the EGW OS FPS and 16# recoil spring, 1 handed functioning was cake. And if you don't think people train or run Baer's hard here's 2 fine Examples:

I don't base my recommendations from gun magazines, I base them on recommendations from reputable instructors and people who fight with guns for a living. I'm not saying Baer doesn't make a good gun. I'm saying for a carry, duty, or combat weapon their are a few guns I would consider, and that doesn't include a Baer. I don't want it to turn in to a brand bashing thread. It is just my opinion. For the record I have not had extended time with a Baer pistol, but I have the opportunity to shoot and manipulate one.

G34Shooter

05-14-09, 14:05

I don't base my recommendations from gun magazines, I base them on recommendations from reputable instructors and people who fight with guns for a living. I'm not saying Baer doesn't make a good gun. I'm saying for a carry, duty, or combat weapon their are a few guns I would consider, and that doesn't include a Baer. I don't want it to turn in to a brand bashing thread. It is just my opinion. For the record I have not had extended time with a Baer pistol, but I have the opportunity to shoot and manipulate one.

There are some misinformed Instructors out there, one more notorious FI said that they only 1911 that he'd trust is a Kimber (no indication of series 1 exclusively). I'm sure he doesn't know the innards of a 1911 enough to know why the Series II Kimbers are a problem that can be potentially fatal i.e. a timing problem with the Firing Pin Safety that will cause a fail to fire... I've seen this problem with a BNIB Kimber before I actually knew what the problem was.

Blake

05-14-09, 14:57

There are some misinformed Instructors out there, one more notorious FI said that they only 1911 that he'd trust is a Kimber (no indication of series 1 exclusively). I'm sure he doesn't know the innards of a 1911 enough to know why the Series II Kimbers are a problem that can be potentially fatal i.e. a timing problem with the Firing Pin Safety that will cause a fail to fire... I've seen this problem with a BNIB Kimber before I actually knew what the problem was.

I have not had the displeasure of training with instructors that would recommend Kimbers. I would have a hard time trusting their opinion or judgement, but they may have their reasons, I would listen then make my own opinion. I have had the pleasure to train with the likes of Larry Vickers (most would call him a preeminent 1911 expert), as well as others. I mention Larry because, as stated earlier in this thread, he has stated that the Wilson CQB is an excellent gun for the money. He didn't mention any other 1911 makers, other than some discussion about the Springfield custom shop. IIRC, he mentioned they did great work, especially on the 10-8 operator models, great value for a semi-custom gun, under $2000. I don't train with fly-by-night instructors, and I don't take recommendations from gun rags. I do listen to those in the know.

G34Shooter

05-14-09, 15:05

I have not had the displeasure of training with instructors that would recommend Kimbers. I would have a hard time trusting their opinion or judgement, but they may have their reasons, I would listen then make my own opinion. I have had the pleasure to train with the likes of Larry Vickers (most would call him a preeminent 1911 expert), as well as others. I mention Larry because, as stated earlier in this thread, he has stated that the Wilson CQB is an excellent gun for the money. He didn't mention any other 1911 makers, other than some discussion about the Springfield custom shop. IIRC, he mentioned they did great work, especially on the 10-8 operator models, great value for a semi-custom gun, under $2000. I don't train with fly-by-night instructors, and I don't take recommendations from gun rags. I do listen to those in the know.

Nor do I listen to BS from yahoos and I had both John Harrison and Bruce gray do some work on my TRS and asked them to identify any potential problems so that I can have them correct it as needed. They found none :D