Best way to get a buffer tube off a lower?

[Lucky Strike]

So I've got a factory complete RRA lower that came with commercial tube/stock and I'm wanting to replace it with a milspec setup (Emod). I bought one of those armorers wrenches and just tried loosening it but I couldn't really get any torque on it as I was just trying this in my living room.

I'm going over to a friends house today who has a vise and will try again but was just wondering if there were any tricks of the trade (for getting it off easier and for avoiding damage to the lower/tube) other then pull really hard on the wrench.

[UVvis]

Add heat,

It may have a threadlocking agent applied as well.

[decodeddiesel]

So I've got a factory complete RRA lower that came with commercial tube/stock and I'm wanting to replace it with a milspec setup (Emod). I bought one of those armorers wrenches and just tried loosening it but I couldn't really get any torque on it as I was just trying this in my living room.

I'm going over to a friends house today who has a vise and will try again but was just wondering if there were any tricks of the trade (for getting it off easier and for avoiding damage to the lower/tube) other then pull really hard on the wrench.

Use an armorers block (or leather/plastic to soften to vise) to securely clamp the lower in a vise. I would not attempt to remove the buffer tube without a good vise handy. Then use the correct armorers wrench (lefty loosie) and it should come off. There should be absolutely no thread compound (ie Locktite) on the threads, nor should you place any thread compound on the threads. UVvis is right though, some monkey may have added thread compound, in which case you're going to have to use heat to get it off. When installing the new buffer tube ensure you properly stake the castle nut (I like to use a Starrett punch) after you have it tightened down.

[shadco]

Use an armorers block (or leather/plastic to soften to vise) to securely clamp the lower in a vise. I would not attempt to remove the buffer tube without a good vise handy. Then use the correct armorers wrench (lefty loosie) and it should come off. There should be absolutely no thread compound (ie Locktite) on the threads, nor should you place any thread compound on the threads. UVvis is right though, some monkey may have added thread compound, in which case you're going to have to use heat to get it off. When installing the new buffer tube ensure you properly stake the castle nut (I like to use a Starrett punch) after you have it tightened down.


It's a Rock River so it most likely has some kind of thread locker on it. Mine did. Heat was required.

[decodeddiesel]

It's a Rock River so it most likely has some kind of thread locker on it. Mine did. Heat was required.

Yeah you caught me before I had a chance to edit.

That is some straight crap though. Locktite has no place whats so ever on a damn receiver extension, that's what a castle nut is for.

[bobbo]

I just recently helped my father in law change the stock on his RRA lower. We had to heat it up in order to get it to break lose. In addition to your armorers wrench, I'd suggest you pick up a lower receiver vice block. And while you're online at Brownell's don't forget to pick up a couple extra take down pin springs and detents. When you take off the old tube those puppies are going to go flying. (wear saftey glasses!) and if you have spares on hand you'll save yourself an hour or two of crawling on the floor looking for them.

[Iraqgunz]

Hopefully I am not too late. I HIGHLY ENCOURAGE YOU NOT to remove that lower receiver extension unless you have the proper tools. That means a lower block as well. As others have stated there is probably some Loc-Crap or similar on there. I would have someone apply low heat to it and then you stand by with the wrench.

Depending on what type you are using it may go easy or hard. I have broken 4 wrenches over here due to someone putting crap on there and then over-torquing. It will also be beneficial to have someone hold the buttstock assy. as you turn. Be prepared to get a new endplate/ castle nut.

[ohiorifleman]

Although I use a vice block, I imagine an old magazine would work as well to get your lower clamped in a vice.

[decodeddiesel]

Although I use a vice block, I imagine an old magazine would work as well to get your lower clamped in a vice.

Negative. It will not resist the twisting from the torque.

[decodeddiesel]

Hopefully I am not too late. I HIGHLY ENCOURAGE YOU NOT to remove that lower receiver extension unless you have the proper tools. That means a lower block as well. As others have stated there is probably some Loc-Crap or similar on there. I would have someone apply low heat to it and then you stand by with the wrench.

Depending on what type you are using it may go easy or hard. I have broken 4 wrenches over here due to someone putting crap on there and then over-torquing. It will also be beneficial to have someone hold the buttstock assy. as you turn. Be prepared to get a new endplate/ castle nut.

Man, when I was in the 101st if a "3 shop" or a unit armorer used Locktite on an M4 extension they would get fried over it.

I would agree with having a lower block though. I have swapped many a buffer tube in my armorer days, and having the right tools made the job easy.

[UVvis]

Although I use a vice block, I imagine an old magazine would work as well to get your lower clamped in a vice.Negative. It will not resist the twisting from the torque.

I have seen some people with old mags filled with epoxy to serve as a vice block. Seemed to work, but the time and epoxy used to fill it probably cost more than a block.

[nichud09]

thanks for making this post, i also have a RRA and already have a shopping from bravo co. cart full of goodies to do the same swap to a mil-spec tube. i just gotta get outta this studio first so i get get back to my rifle. man, this is my favorite website.

[Lucky Strike]

Well this sucks.....so wrapping the lower reciever itself in a towel and putting it in the vice and torquing on the castle nut to break the loc-tite (after heating the area up) is going to wreck the receiver?

I'd rather not wait and buy a vice block since I've sold the old stock/buffer tube and need to ship them out tomorrow.

Although it sounds like the buffer tube may get ruined in the removal process so it sounds like i'll have to give the dude a partial refund since only the stock will be good.

[decodeddiesel]

Well this sucks.....so wrapping the lower reciever itself in a towel and putting it in the vice and torquing on the castle nut to break the loc-tite (after heating the area up) is going to wreck the receiver?


Go slow, don't over clamp the lower in the vise. You should be OK.

You could also go to Home Depot and pick up some of those plastic jaw liners for the vise. Those would be better than a towel.

How are you going to heat the tube?

[Lucky Strike]

Talked to my buddy and his vise already has the plastic guards on the vise jaws.....if it has those a towel isn't needed?

I was planning on using a hair dryer for heat....is that going to be sufficient? If not I might be able to borrow a heat gun from another friend this afternoon

[decodeddiesel]

Talked to my buddy and his vise already has the plastic guards on the vise jaws.....if it has those a towel isn't needed?

I was planning on using a hair dryer for heat....is that going to be sufficient? If not I might be able to borrow a heat gun from another friend this afternoon

You may want to just use a towel to prevent scratching. Don't wrap the whole receiver, just use it to line the vise jaws.

A hair dryer won't do a damn thing. A heat gun probably won't work either. Personally I would carefully hit it with a propane blow torch, or remove any plastic from the lower and heat it in your oven.

[SwatDawg15]

I cant understand why the hell RRA adds thread locker to receiver extensions.

[Lucky Strike]

You may want to just use a towel to prevent scratching. Don't wrap the whole receiver, just use it to line the vise jaws.

A hair dryer won't do a damn thing. A heat gun probably won't work either. Personally I would carefully hit it with a propane blow torch, or remove any plastic from the lower and heat it in your oven.



Wow...didn't know it took that kind of heat (never used loc-tite before)....will using a propane torch (not that i have a propane torch anyway) hurt the finish on the lower? Looks like i may have to use the oven method although it's gonna be a pain to take the LPK out and reinstall it...i've never installed a LPK.

[nichud09]

why wouldnt the heat gun work? those things gets hot as hell. i wouldnt take apart your LPK and put it in the oven either. all that work for just for some damn loc-tite?? psshhh fawk that!

[Fireglock]

Am I missing something here or is this some new thing from RRA? My Car4 that's just over a year old didn't have any Loctite or any other adhesives on it. It was well tightened but not nut busting so.

[Lucky Strike]

well hopefully that's the case with mine (i bought it Oct '08 from pete at legal transfers) .....like i said before, when i did a half-ass attempt at getting it off last night i had no way to hold the lower so that i could put any torque on the nut.

Tonight when it's in the vise i'll try and get it off before adding any heat....hopefully it's just on there real snug and i won't need to worry about loctite

[decodeddiesel]

why wouldnt the heat gun work? those things gets hot as hell. i wouldnt take apart your LPK and put it in the oven either. all that work for just for some damn loc-tite?? psshhh fawk that!

Awesome advise! :rolleyes: Have you ever tried to "break" a bolt that has high strength loctite on it?

I made no mention of removing the lower parts kit from the receiver, just remove the plastic.

Here is the damn data sheet on loctite 277 (which is NOT the high temp. If it has the high temp then we're talking way hotter than this.)

https://tds.us.henkel.com//NA/UT/HNAUTTDS.nsf/web/7A2E84224356FE2C882571870000D624/$File/277-EN.pdf
(https://tds.us.henkel.com//NA/UT/HNAUTTDS.nsf/web/7A2E84224356FE2C882571870000D624/$File/277-EN.pdf)
It specifically states that in order to disassemble a part after using this compound you need to heat the part to 250 degrees C which is 482 degrees F. Yes heat guns get hot, I use them almost daily at my work, but they will not heat a part up to 500 F. You need to heat soak the part in order for it to loosen the loctite, this means an oven or a propane torch.

[decodeddiesel]

well hopefully that's the case with mine (i bought it Oct '08 from pete at legal transfers) .....like i said before, when i did a half-ass attempt at getting it off last night i had no way to hold the lower so that i could put any torque on the nut.

Tonight when it's in the vise i'll try and get it off before adding any heat....hopefully it's just on there real snug and i won't need to worry about loctite

I hope you're right. Good luck, let us know how it goes!

[Fireglock]

Before I tried the vice without a proper receiver block I would lay the AR on it's right side on a carpeted floor, put my hand on the receiver at the magwell area and using my upper body weight to anchor it try to break the castle nut loose with my right hand. Much more leverage, much less likely to mar the receiver.

[nichud09]

Awesome advise! :rolleyes: Have you ever tried to "break" a bolt that has high strength loctite on it?

I made no mention of removing the lower parts kit from the receiver, just remove the plastic.

Here is the damn data sheet on loctite 277 (which is NOT the high temp. If it has the high temp then we're talking way hotter than this.)

It specifically states that in order to disassemble a part after using this compound you need to heat the part to 250 degrees C which is 482 degrees F. Yes heat guns get hot, I use them almost daily at my work, but they will not heat a part up to 500 F. You need to heat soak the part in order for it to loosen the loctite, this means an oven or a propane torch.


no i have only removed blue loctite. assuming that RRA does use the high strength red 277(which is apparently made to not be removed) ,271, or 272(which is the HIGH TEMP). any other form of high strength loctite, i have no idea. tooshay, your right(well the damn data sheet) it' technically' needs to be heated to 232c in order for it become liquid form again. but. im sure the nut will 'break' loose before it reaches 449F.

and i also know you never said anything about removing the LPK, he did though. when you mentioned the oven idea, i never knew of such a thing. you might as well sear a filet on that sucker. apologies for the mis-interpretations.

[nichud09]

i vote torch. propane or butane.

[decodeddiesel]

I didn't mean to come off like a dick. Sorry if I did.

The oven is nice because it will gradually evenly heat the part. I would clean the oven out very well before coking food in it though.

A propane torch is the best answer here.

[shadco]

I used a heat gun and heated it in stages until it was very hot to the touch, then a good pop with the wrench and it was undone. Someone else said it, Heat Soak.

[mmike87]

Several years ago I got one off my first RRA rifle just using a hair dryer. Before the heat, it wasn't coming off. After the hair dryer it came off easily.

[Rock-N-Ruin]

Before I tried the vice without a proper receiver block I would lay the AR on it's right side on a carpeted floor, put my hand on the receiver at the magwell area and using my upper body weight to anchor it try to break the castle nut loose with my right hand. Much more leverage, much less likely to mar the receiver.

That's probably your best bet without the proper tools.... Or go put the buffer tube in the vise, crank it down (it may get mangled?) and reef on it that way.. I haven't experienced lok-tite on a reciever extension, yikes!!! Who's brainchild was that at RRA.. They should just put on a mil-spec tube so people won't have to Frak with em!

[Iraqgunz]

The same brain child that did it (or similar substance) to our Bushmaster barrel nuts and castle nuts. All 500 of them.


That's probably your best bet without the proper tools.... Or go put the buffer tube in the vise, crank it down (it may get mangled?) and reef on it that way.. I haven't experienced lok-tite on a reciever extension, yikes!!! Who's brainchild was that at RRA.. They should just put on a mil-spec tube so people won't have to Frak with em!

[Lucky Strike]

Well we finally got it off.

Went to my buddies and he had a heat gun he borrowed. We put it in his vise which had the rubber covers on the jaws. I thought we should try loosening it before heating just in case there wasn't any loctite.....first pull of the wrench (at like a 1/2 strength pull) and one of the teeth on the stupid armorers wrench broke.

So we went to plan B of heating up the tube/castle nut with a heat gun and then put a vise grip tightly on the castle nut and hitting the handle vise grip with a mallet. After about 4 whacks it finally gave and we could get the nut off.

Nut was marred up badly and will be replaced. End plate was unscathed although i'll likely replace it with a QD one (anyone know if the Noveske one will interfere with an Emod closed all the way?).

The threads on the tube were pretty gunked up with burrs and squished threads form the armorers wrench (from my previous attempts) and such. My friend worked it over with a jewelers file and got the threads back to functional status although the black finish is obviously gone over those threads.

Now i gotta wait till a new castle nut/end plate get here (will order some tonight) before my rifle is functionable again.

Thanks for all the tips. Glad to be done with this...once i get my milspec tube in place it'll make it much easier if (when) i decide to experiment further with different stocks.