View Full Version : Spikes Tactical?
Mr.Goodtimes
06-30-09, 19:24
whats yalls opinion on spikes tactical? they good, bad, excellent?
what do they compare too in quality? LMT, noveske?
I have one of their uppers currently and have been pleased with it, however, im looking to build another gun and am not sure weather or not i want to go with an LMT or build another spikes using one of their uppers and a stripped lower. from what i understand, they use sabre defense barrels now.
I have a Spikes lower that I bought not too long ago. It has a DPMS parts kit in it, and a M1S upper on it. I've never had an issue with it. Only have about 2,000 rounds through the setup, with no issues other than a couple bad mags causing jams. I think Spikes is good quality.
Thomas M-4
06-30-09, 21:29
LMT is my vote :D
With a Noveske like Larue you are talking a top of the line hand made gun with arguably the best available barrel. With LMT you have a top tier production gun whose IMHO only peers are Colt and now BCM.
Mr.Goodtimes
06-30-09, 23:19
im seeing a lot of Noveske seconds lowers floatin around for less then what spikes wants for a new one, i may go with a Noveske lower. i change my mind about 3 times a day though so weel see.
i keep getting new ideas for builds/ my current build.
dookie1481
07-01-09, 03:46
im seeing a lot of Noveske seconds lowers floatin around for less then what spikes wants for a new one, i may go with a Noveske lower. i change my mind about 3 times a day though so weel see.
i keep getting new ideas for builds/ my current build.
Who cares as long as it's in spec? I have a Spike's, finish seems good, fits my upper well and I can take it down without using a punch, mags drop free, etc.
Jay
Failure2Stop
07-01-09, 04:06
Theoretically, the lower is pretty low on the list of worries.
As long as it isn't one of the dreaded Oly/Hessee nigthmares, whatever floats your boat is almost guaranteed to be fine, and if not any decent company will make it right.
When it comes to LPKs, there are demonstrable differences between the Colt and the likes of DPMS, and more hard-nosed or discerning users will gravitate toward the high-end when possible. Still, breakage of lower parts are much less common that issues with upper receiver components. The nice thing is that they are really easy to diagnose.
Me personally, I mostly go with LMT beecause I trust their QC, machining, and LPK quality. And their roll-mark is simple and modest. They were also available at local shops when I bought them, which certainly was a factor.
Mr.Goodtimes
07-01-09, 05:36
Theoretically, the lower is pretty low on the list of worries.
As long as it isn't one of the dreaded Oly/Hessee nigthmares, whatever floats your boat is almost guaranteed to be fine, and if not any decent company will make it right.
When it comes to LPKs, there are demonstrable differences between the Colt and the likes of DPMS, and more hard-nosed or discerning users will gravitate toward the high-end when possible. Still, breakage of lower parts are much less common that issues with upper receiver components. The nice thing is that they are really easy to diagnose.
Me personally, I mostly go with LMT beecause I trust their QC, machining, and LPK quality. And their roll-mark is simple and modest. They were also available at local shops when I bought them, which certainly was a factor.
thanks F2S. i was considering spikes because I live close enough to drive over there and pick my lower up actually. their a local florida company. however, i've always wanted a noveske lower. Weather i go with spikes tactical or noveske, the build with be getting a quality LPK. i will not be going with a DPMS lpk.
30 cal slut
07-01-09, 07:20
FWIW, i bought several lowers for something like $100 a pop before the election crunch. Great service and no problems with them, not that you'd really expect to with a forged lower.
As far as uppers go, I have no basis to give you an informed opinion, as I'm much pickier about uppers (BCM, Colt).
As F2S said, at some point try to get one of Grant's LPK's. They are very different from DPMS.
whats yalls opinion on spikes tactical? they good, bad, excellent?
what do they compare too in quality? LMT, noveske?
I have one of their uppers currently and have been pleased with it, however, im looking to build another gun and am not sure weather or not i want to go with an LMT or build another spikes using one of their uppers and a stripped lower. from what i understand, they use sabre defense barrels now.
They are not equal to LMT or Noveske.
C4
There is one available in the members sales fourm....:D
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=33545
.
Derek_Connor
07-01-09, 10:51
I genuinely try to avoid anything from spikes.
Mr.Goodtimes
07-01-09, 11:58
I genuinely try to avoid anything from spikes.
derek, just wondering, why do you try to avoid anything from them?
derek, just wondering, why do you try to avoid anything from them?
Speaking personally,
Everything about their operation screams Mall Ninja.
No love lost after they immediately increased the price on their uppers to cash in on the election. The fancy wooden crates for storing a dozen lowers was the cherry on the cake.
I'm sure their products are fine but i avoid them out of principle.
They are not equal to LMT or Noveske.
C4
Any proof to back up this accusation?
Mr.Goodtimes
07-01-09, 14:43
Speaking personally,
Everything about their operation screams Mall Ninja.
No love lost after they immediately increased the price on their uppers to cash in on the election. The fancy wooden crates for storing a dozen lowers was the cherry on the cake.
I'm sure their products are fine but i avoid them out of principle.
it is a little interesting that their selling their lowers for so much now. it looks like their lowers are the second most expensive stripped forged lower next to a noveske.
I genuinely try to avoid anything from spikes.
Even their 37mm???? :D
it is a little interesting that their selling their lowers for so much now. it looks like their lowers are the second most expensive stripped forged lower next to a noveske.
It's just marketting
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giffen_good
Examples of Giffen goods include cars, university educations, products with elastic demand, and AR-15 lower receivers.
Basically, these are good that violate the law of supply and demand, as people prefer to buy them because they are more expensive. Is a private college truly better than a state college? Well, since you're paying 3 times more, it MUST be better... right?
CaptainDooley
07-01-09, 15:54
Any proof to back up this accusation?
Bah, who needs proof? Grant's just a brand Nazi hatin' on anything that's not Colt anyway! DPMS is teh shiznit!!!!
Noveske is probably the #1 custom AR builder in existence right now - their products are incomparable to nearly every thing else available.
LMT is a tier one company with a gov't contract (read: They have and follow the TDP)
Spikes is not either of those things. LMT and Noveske will have some of the best Quality Control which leads to not just quality but also consistency in parts and builds, because they have a reason to do those things. Spikes does not.
Grant sees as much or more AR gear than just about any one and if he says the build quality is not the same, it's not the same...
Grant sees as much or more AR gear than just about any one and if he says the build quality is not the same, it's not the same...
Well I'd need a little more proof than just some guy "says" it's better.
Noveske is probably the #1 custom AR builder in existence right now - their products are incomparable to nearly every thing else available.
KAC?
Well I'd need a little more proof than just some guy "says" it's better.
Dig a little. His credentials are all over this site. :rolleyes:
decodeddiesel
07-01-09, 16:56
KAC?
Exactly what I was thinking.
Well I'd need a little more proof than just some guy "says" it's better.
Devil Dog, 2 each USMC MOS 2111s and 2112s (look up the MOS) sitting within 20feet of me agree with Grant, after I asked them to assess his assessment.
'Bout 72 years combined AR-platform building and repairs experience. And that's just the ones I asked. I know 6 more that work within 10 miles of me that I can ask, and that doesn't even include dudes at OTF or the PWS shop that I know will have answers. Marine SMEs in the know agree with "some guy," and not with you.
Take that as you will, bet bear this also in mind: nobody's saying you should feel bad about the Spike's lower you're making it sound like you bought and are getting all butt-hurt over, just that some other companies have a better record of consistency.
I have no experience with Spikes and like others have steered clear due to the aura that permiates their posts on arfcom. However, their stripped lowers are probably made by one of the major manufacturers and, therefore, as good as any, as long as you don't mind a big spider on the side of it. Everything else they sell, however, I would steer away from.
I have to admit, their FN hammer forged melonite barrels do have my interest piqued. I'd be willing to bite if I could get one minus the other garbage they hang off them.
If I remember correctly Spikes Lowers are made by Aero Precision, LAR, and Kaiser. Decent lowers and worth the $105 they cost on Nov 1, 2008. For some reason Spikes suddenly had to pay more for their forgings than any other company and the price jumped to around $170 immediately following the election. Not worth it IMHO and the shady business tactics lost my future business.
I would stick with LMT, they are becoming readily available again and their alumunium didn't almost double in price like Spikes did. Much better LPK and QC at the factory also.
-Rob
superman07
07-01-09, 21:44
I have several older Spikes lowers and have ordered from them several times. After my last order I have decided to discontinue ordering anything from them. QC has slipped horribly and for what they have been charging lately you could get better gear for the same amount of money and undoubtedly less order screw-ups and delays.
After countless phone calls and e-mails they could never get my order straight the last time. several options were not delivered and I simply gave up and will just do them myself.
Mr.Goodtimes
07-01-09, 22:22
spikes told me they used DD barrels for the melonite barrels? who told you they were FN? thats interesting.
I don't have any experience with their uppers or lowers but the dedicated .22 uppers I have from them have been awesome. I'm also interested in their new hammer forged upper they just came out with.
Any proof to back up this accusation?
Sure. None of their parts meet or exceed the specs called out in the TDP (which is entry level).
C4
Well I'd need a little more proof than just some guy "says" it's better.
You are always welcome to check another source, but just make sure that it is not:
1. A Spikes Company Rep
2. A BARFCOM member that just bought one
3. A gun show dealer that buys and sells them
Now if we are JUST talking about their stripped lowers, I would say that they are just fine. If we are talking about anything else (Barrels, BCG's, etc) I would say they do not come anywhere near Noveske or LMT.
My opinion is based on the fact that I do this for a living. Meaning, build AR's, talk to professionals in the industry about specs and standards, troubleshoot/fix guns via e-mail, phone, errornet and in our shop. It is safe to say that I see more AR's in a week than you will see in a year. ;)
C4
I don't have any experience with their uppers or lowers but the dedicated .22 uppers I have from them have been awesome. I'm also interested in their new hammer forged upper they just came out with.
If we are talking about this upper: http://www.spikestactical.com/z/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59&products_id=234
I would say that it is worth about $599-$625.
Keep in mind that I have ALREADY talked to a meloniting company about doing barrels (more than a year ago) and they advised us that small bore calibers (like the .223) do not do well in the accuracy department (overall).
So if you are dead set on having one, I would first wait to get some REAL accuracy reports (10rd groups at 100yds).
C4
If we are talking about this upper: http://www.spikestactical.com/z/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59&products_id=234
I would say that it is worth about $599-$625.
Keep in mind that I have ALREADY talked to a meloniting company about doing barrels (more than a year ago) and they advised us that small bore calibers (like the .223) do not do well in the accuracy department (overall).
So if you are dead set on having one, I would first wait to get some REAL accuracy reports (10rd groups at 100yds).
C4
I already have 3 Noveskes and 1 KAC in the hammer-forged barrel department so I'm good for now. I just thought it was an interesting upper at that price range. Right now I can only speak for their .22 uppers and they have been a ton of fun shoot in a time when ammo is so ridiculously expensive.
Mr.Goodtimes
07-05-09, 10:24
what exactly about their operation screams mall ninja? from my understanding they use quality parts in their uppers, barrels come from sabre defense, they said their hammer forge barrels are DD, their gas piston parts are made by Adams Arms. They use .mil contract upper recievers and bolts. my upper reciever i have from them is a cerro forge.
the people in their CS department have been great to speak with, and in my experience with them, their employees have gone above and beyond their job for me.
also, how do their products not meet the standards?
my spikes upper has:
- 5.56mm Chromed MP Barrel
-Properly staked gas key
-parkerizing under fsb
-m4 feed ramps
And you can order a weapon from them with a full auto bolt.
im not trying to be a smart ass, im genuinly trying to gather information about this company and make a decision.
my past experiences with them have been excellent.
i was also reading on TOS where they will be soon introducing a billet lower receiver that is being made for them by Seekins precision.
what exactly about their operation screams mall ninja? from my understanding they use quality parts in their uppers, barrels come from sabre defense, they said their hammer forge barrels are DD, their gas piston parts are made by Adams Arms. They use .mil contract upper recievers and bolts. my upper reciever i have from them is a cerro forge.
the people in their CS department have been great to speak with, and in my experience with them, their employees have gone above and beyond their job for me.
also, how do their products not meet the standards?
my spikes upper has:
- 5.56mm Chromed MP Barrel
-Properly staked gas key
-parkerizing under fsb
-m4 feed ramps
And you can order a weapon from them with a full auto bolt.
im not trying to be a smart ass, im genuinly trying to gather information about this company and make a decision.
my past experiences with them have been excellent.
i was also reading on TOS where they will be soon introducing a billet lower receiver that is being made for them by Seekins precision.
I too was under the impression that they made legitimately good products. Their customer service has also been some of the best in the entire industry from my experiences
with them so far. I'm not quite sure why some people have something against them. Perhaps it's because they are part of TOS? Since I don't have any
experience other than with their .22 uppers I can't say they are top tier but they certainly seem like they make better than "mall ninja" status.
superman07
07-06-09, 08:00
I think they are trying to make better products. they used to have several niche products that made them famous so to speak on another site. They have been making strides into other more "professional areas" with quality components. The move to DD and Troy is a step in the right direction. Not sure if I like the piston they use but using Young carriers is a good move.
I have and still shoot several spikes carbines. I have always been happy with them. I do think they are growing too quickly however and still going through growing pains.
My last order was a 9mm. It arrived and looks very good. Too bad it is not what was ordered. Most of the dialog after the order was broken, lacked consistency, and ultimately failed. My CS experience was less than acceptable. Tom still seems nice but the help you get seems like someone trying to help out the window of a moving car on the freeway.
No-one slows down for a second to hear you out. If you have anything more than a quick simple issue forget it.
They charged a old CC, Gave me the wrong grip, did not include the FSP, Provided the wrong rail, and forgot to include a 9mm mag block (which I confirmed several times including a call the day it shipped where I was told it had one), and did not include a 3 lug adapter. So at the end of the day I have a 1300 dollar frankengun I cant shoot, and wasn't expecting. I will pick up the parts I need locally to un fruck this mess. The build quality is very good however. Fit and finish is good. Had I ordered it this way I would be very happy. I can only imagine my face when I picked up the pistol here and it was not what I expected, and then when he told me no mag block..............................
ruined my fourth for sure.
On a side note my 22lr was also not what I ordered, but I liked it better as they used a specter rail and fake can. My son liked the look better so we assumed they did it to provide us more value.
do not do anything with them via a phone, use e-mail to have a record. even then, good luck. I think pre-built configurations will be very good, or make no changes to the original order unless you go directly through Tom.
Spikes-Rep
07-14-09, 21:23
Sure. None of their parts meet or exceed the specs called out in the TDP (which is entry level).
C4
Really, Please explain.
As others stated; I'm not into the name at all. Maybe that's bad, but "Spike's Tactical" is a little over the top for me, nomatter what they are offering.
I bought three Kaiser Defense lowers (they make the Spike's lowers), they are very nice, in spec, and have a modest logo.
If I had it to do all over again, I would definitely by a complete lower from G&R (custom Noveski blem), LMT, or BCM. They are not anymore expensive when things are said and done, and you can not find a comparable quality lower parts kit if you build your own. Lesson learned on my part. I will probably end up buying another complete lower, just to get a quality LPK.
The only problem I have run into was when I was building a Spike's lower for a customer who bought one from us, the hole for the rear take down detent wasn't drilled all the way. Otherwise, their products have been just fine. Their uppers with the Sabre Defense barrels have been a good seller for us, even at the slight price increase.
Really, Please explain.
I won't make unfounded call-outs, but could you say where your LPKs are sourced from?
Does anyone know who makes the Spikes LPK's and how do they compare to say RRA, or DPMS ?
Thanks.
Spikes-Rep
07-14-09, 22:00
I won't make unfounded call-outs, but could you say where your LPKs are sourced from?
Does it matter? Do you know how many MFG's make parts for the same people? OR do you just read a bunch of bull shit? I know the MFG's we deal with and I know who they make parts for.
Here is an example..
Bolt carrier groups, same MFG makes them for-
Noveske
Larue
Daniel Defense
CMMG
BCM
and us. So which one is better? and why?
Lowers-
Same company makes them for-
Noveske
BCM
CMMG
and us. So which one is better? and why?
Another company makes them for-
Arma-lite
LWRC
and us. So which one is better? and why?
Flat top uppers-
BCM
CMMG
and us. So which one is better? and why?
Buffers-
All made by the same company.
Forged F-marked front sites-
All made by the same company.
Flash hiders-
All made by the same company.
Carry handles-
All made by the same company.
LPK's-
There are 2-3 companys who make them, and DPMS isn't one of them.
Soo, carry on with the non-sense.
What matters is the QC of the company that buys them. Certain companies have much higher standards, period. What is acceptable to BM would not be acceptable to Colt.
Does it matter? Do you know how many MFG's make parts for the same people? OR do you just read a bunch of bull shit? .
I think that I was pretty polite, and even stated that I would not push any unfounded information, nor did I state any "nonsense" or "bullshit" that I had read.
Many manufacturers (some very respected on this site) will not state where they source their LPKs from. It was a simple question that you could have politely, and understandably declined to answer. Your attitude is not going to win you any new customers IMO.
ETA: Yes it does matter.
Really, Please explain.
Sure. Your bolts and barrels are not HPT/MP.
C4
Spikes-Rep
07-14-09, 22:11
Sure. Your bolts and barrels are not HPT/MP.
C4
Barrels are, bolts are MP tested by the LOT. We dont electro pencil them like "other" companys do.
Spikes-Rep
07-14-09, 22:13
I think that I was pretty polite, and even stated that I would not push any unfounded information, nor did I state any "nonsense" or "bullshit" that I had read.
Many manufacturers (some very respected on this site) will not state where they source their LPKs from. It was a simple question that you could have politely, and understandably declined to answer. Your attitude is not going to win you any new customers IMO.
ETA: Yes it does matter.
Not trying to give you any attitude it just gets annoying reading everyone's bull shit comments (not refering to your post in anyway).
Not trying to give you any attitude it just gets annoying reading everyone's bull shit comments (not refering to your post in anyway).
Understood. Just thought it was aimed at my comment.
Spikes-Rep
07-14-09, 22:25
Understood. Just thought it was aimed at my comment.
Sorry, it wasn't at all. As for LPK's the same company makes them for Us, DPMS, CMMG and a few others. My Noveske/Magpul gun actually came with the same LPK, Same rounded hammer..
As for LPK's the same company makes them for Us, DPMS, CMMG and a few others. My Noveske/Magpul gun actually came with the same LPK, Same rounded hammer..
That's what I wanted to Know. Thanks.
decodeddiesel
07-14-09, 23:15
Does it matter?
Seriously?!:rolleyes:
Wow dude, way to come in here and professionally represent your company!
There are about a million ways you could have worded your response where you could have presented the truth about where your company sources your parts without coming across in the manor which you did.
I had been thinking about purchasing a dedicated Spike's .22 upper...not after that little tantrum I will take my business elsewhere, thank you.
Not trying to give you any attitude it just gets annoying reading everyone's bull shit comments (not refering to your post in anyway).
That's business my friend. Prove people wrong instead of being a dick. I'm more than thrilled to have another top quality manufacture, especially in my home state. If you guys do in fact have a quality product, I would love to support local business. Coming on here with the attitude however, weak. Take a deep breath and for my ignorant benefit, continue to educate me on why your product should be considered. Thanks.
Spikes-Rep
07-14-09, 23:31
read some of the things said about our company. I wasn't trying to be rude, a dick, ect.. Just trying to stop all the non-sense.
I was at Spikes Tactical Tuesday afternoon. First I emailed them about the new combo grip. They promptly replied I was welcome to come over. Don't try the door bell, its broken lol.
After I got in I was directed to AJ. Nice guy. I told him what I wanted and he disappeared to retrieve it. Leaving me in a room with racks of badass weaponry to ogle. I've been in plenty of gun shops and machine shops where I felt unwelcome. Places that watch you like a street thief. I didn't get that feel or that treatement at Spikes.
AJ returned with my combo vfg and we chatted a bit about guns. He invited me to heft the m14 with troy furniture. Heavy! I don't think they have a cash register because he didn't have a couple bucks change. I think I got a better deal with the hat he offered me instead. $2 hat with my choice of logo? Hell yeah!
In all I am happy with their new combo vfg. Personally I'll choose metal over plastic anytime I can. While we are on the subject of cost I find other vfgs stupidly overpriced for a plastic piece. Spikes vfg is machined aluminum, with two lengths included for half the price!
I'll shop Spikes again if they have something I need and price is right.
read some of the things said about our company. I wasn't trying to be rude, a dick, ect.. Just trying to stop all the non-sense.
Post pictures proving people wrong. Post verifiable specs proving people wrong. Post character references to prove people wrong. Post independent tests and research to prove people wrong. etc.
Microsoft and apple (or colt, noveske, LMT, magpul etc if that hits closer to home) didn't become who they are by throwing tantrums every time some internet personality said their product sucks. Not to mention, this being the internet, what would stop someone from copying and pasting your posts from here all over the place. That wouldn't be good.
Defend the shit out of your product and company, man. I'm all for that. It's your damn livelihood. I would just suggest doing so in a different fashion.
Post pictures proving people wrong. Post verifiable specs proving people wrong. Post character references to prove people wrong. Post independent tests and research to prove people wrong. etc.
Microsoft and apple (or colt, noveske, LMT, magpul etc if that hits closer to home) didn't become who they are by throwing tantrums every time some internet personality said their product sucks. Not to mention, this being the internet, what would stop someone from copying and pasting your posts from here all over the place. That wouldn't be good.
Defend the shit out of your product and company, man. I'm all for that. It's your damn livelihood. I would just suggest doing so in a different fashion.
As much as I LOVE my spikes .22 uppers I have to agree. One Mark LaRue is enough :D
Derek_Connor
07-15-09, 07:13
Seriously?!:rolleyes:
Wow dude, way to come in here and professionally represent your company!
There are about a million ways you could have worded your response where you could have presented the truth about where your company sources your parts without coming across in the manor which you did.
I had been thinking about purchasing a dedicated Spike's .22 upper...not after that little tantrum I will take my business elsewhere, thank you.
As I posted earlier in this thread, this is exactly why I stay away from anything spikes, including anyone who works for them.
Unfortunately the same attitude/demeanor you see here can be the same you will get in person when you question them about their products.
justin_247
07-15-09, 07:20
however, i've always wanted a noveske lower
I didn't see anyone respond to this statement, so I thought I would based upon what I know. I was reading an interview with John Noveske done by David Crane over at Defense Review and Noveske stated that he used lowers manufactured by CMT.
Link here:
http://www.defensereview.com/noveske-rifleworks-n4-light-recce-carbine-john-noveske-interview-part-one/
Does it matter? Do you know how many MFG's make parts for the same people? OR do you just read a bunch of bull shit? I know the MFG's we deal with and I know who they make parts for.
Here is an example..
Bolt carrier groups, same MFG makes them for-
Noveske
Larue
Daniel Defense
CMMG
BCM
and us. So which one is better? and why?
Lowers-
Same company makes them for-
Noveske
BCM
CMMG
and us. So which one is better? and why?
Another company makes them for-
Arma-lite
LWRC
and us. So which one is better? and why?
Flat top uppers-
BCM
CMMG
and us. So which one is better? and why?
Buffers-
All made by the same company.
Forged F-marked front sites-
All made by the same company.
Flash hiders-
All made by the same company.
Carry handles-
All made by the same company.
LPK's-
There are 2-3 companys who make them, and DPMS isn't one of them.
Soo, carry on with the non-sense.
This is the same nonsense that CMMG spouts on the other site when people ask for some verification about their marketing claims. If Spike's wants some transparency and to build customer confidence, then maybe they ought to make it clear why their product is better.
Hiding behind the mantra " we get our parts from the same place as the other guys" is just a bit lame. Hell......Model 1 and M&A Parts still claim that their parts are FNI, but they won't give any proof to that claim.
Selling to the masses on the other site does not inspire me to buy from Spike's. The bottom line is you get what you pay for.;)
Barrels are, bolts are MP tested by the LOT. We dont electro pencil them like "other" companys do.
Every single one of your barrels are HPT and MPI?
and you do understand that "MP tested by the LOT" is not equal to the minimum standard, right?
Not trying to give you any attitude it just gets annoying reading everyone's bull shit comments (not refering to your post in anyway).
Yes you were trying to give him attitude, and it's plain in the way that you wrote your post. If you don't like the questions and comments you get about your products you can:
1) quit working there and go somewhere else
2) raise your standards to meet their expectations
3) be honest about what it is you do and stop being evasive and treating people like shit
Your posts thus far in this thread are all full up with double-speak on par with the way that Olympic talks about their products. Vague and misleading answers (bolts tested by the lot), contradictory statements (your LPK aren't DPMS they're just made by the same company?), and piss poor attitude and customer service.
I've met Spike and like him quite a bit when I've spoken to him at the Miami show and the Lakeland show. I also happen to think that Spike's offers a product at a price point that's attractive to alot of people and that in the complete firearm market the prices are about on par with the quality. But posts like yours in this thread are not winning you any customers, and in fact just cost you one. I was on the fence about a Tactical Solutions upper and a Spike's, and like ZDL was looking very hard at Spike's because of the Florida connection and because I like him, but I'll be ordering a Tac Sol now.
Does it matter? Do you know how many MFG's make parts for the same people? OR do you just read a bunch of bull shit? I know the MFG's we deal with and I know who they make parts for.
LPK's-
There are 2-3 companys who make them, and DPMS isn't one of them.
As for LPK's the same company makes them for Us, DPMS, CMMG and a few others.
Here's a great example of where your attitude screws you.
At best the above is just a poor choice of words and a little vague. At worst it's an attempt to mislead and misdirect and cover things up or outright lie. Had you come here and NOT posted rude responses to people I would have been inclined to believe the former, but based on the attitude shown in your posts I'm leaning towards the latter.
Barrels are, bolts are MP tested by the LOT. We dont electro pencil them like "other" companys do.
Really? Please post the sales receipt for the pressure loads and the certification that issued by the lab that each barrel was MP tested and passed.
Also, what is your exit criteria on MP???
C4
Does it matter? Do you know how many MFG's make parts for the same people? OR do you just read a bunch of bull shit? I know the MFG's we deal with and I know who they make parts for.
Here is an example..
Bolt carrier groups, same MFG makes them for-
Noveske
Larue
Daniel Defense
CMMG
BCM
and us. So which one is better? and why?
Lowers-
Same company makes them for-
Noveske
BCM
CMMG
and us. So which one is better? and why?
Another company makes them for-
Arma-lite
LWRC
and us. So which one is better? and why?
Flat top uppers-
BCM
CMMG
and us. So which one is better? and why?
Buffers-
All made by the same company.
Forged F-marked front sites-
All made by the same company.
Flash hiders-
All made by the same company.
Carry handles-
All made by the same company.
LPK's-
There are 2-3 companys who make them, and DPMS isn't one of them.
Soo, carry on with the non-sense.
Ah, but the part you left out is that you can go to some of these companies and request that a part be made from a cheaper metal (as oly does on their bolts).
There is also a FLOOD of LPK items coming in from Asia. So there are MANY sources and ways to get things cheaper/less quality.
What seperates a lot of companies is what they do with the product after they get it. For instance, Noveske buys everything in the white, inspects it and then has it finished.
BCM (for instance) gets bolts and HPT, MP's them. So while you MAY get them from the same place as they do, they go several steps further to ensure that their's are quality (and meeting their in-house QC).
C4
I didn't see anyone respond to this statement, so I thought I would based upon what I know. I was reading an interview with John Noveske done by David Crane over at Defense Review and Noveske stated that he used lowers manufactured by CMT.
Link here:
http://www.defensereview.com/noveske-rifleworks-n4-light-recce-carbine-john-noveske-interview-part-one/
He does use Lowers by CMT (and at least 2-3 other companies).
Lower receivers are pretty much all the same in my book and I try not to get excited about where they are made.
What matters much more are the internals used in them.
C4
Every single one of your barrels are HPT and MPI?
and you do understand that "MP tested by the LOT" is not equal to the minimum standard, right?
BINGO.
As my favorite saying goes:
"If you are not meeting the BASIC Standard, what Standard are you following?"
C4
Mr.Goodtimes
07-15-09, 09:57
i can understand why the spikes guy got a little heated in his response. while it was a little un professional, i cant really blame him. There has been a lot of negative press against spikes on this site, and i cant seem to find that negativity any where else.
I have done business with spikes before and will probably do business with them at the upcoming tampa gun show. Time and time again their company has gone above and beyond for me.
For the record, my spikes barrel is marked that its been MP tested.
i can understand why the spikes guy got a little heated in his response. while it was a little un professional, i cant really blame him. There has been a lot of negative press against spikes on this site, and i cant seem to find that negativity any where else.
I have done business with spikes before and will probably do business with them at the upcoming tampa gun show. Time and time again their company has gone above and beyond for me.
For the record, my spikes barrel is marked that its been MP tested.
It is 100% ok to defend your company, but do it with PROOF and not hot air.
The reason why you will find more negative opinions on this forum is because the members are better educated on what the .Gov standard is. Most people on other forums have ZERO clue. If it is black and goes bang 100rds a month, they are good with it.
MP testing is worthless without HPT. Also, a lot of companies "batch" MP test and mark their barrels. This is called false advertising in my book and is one of the things that BM got caught up in.
If you like Spikes products, then great!
C4
Derek_Connor
07-15-09, 10:06
i can understand why the spikes guy got a little heated in his response. while it was a little un professional, i cant really blame him.
Maybe because they cater to the "good 'nuff" crowd, and pass them selves off as something else?
I've met, most of them, in person at an industry event. It was comical to say the least. I hate to judge a book by its cover, but with their responses here, and the other encounters I and others have had , it all pretty much lines up.
Nothing positive or technical will come out of this thread from this point on.
*CLOSED*
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