View Full Version : Rob, how about adding BCM to the chart?
Sure you can't grab a complete rifle off the shelf, but you can very easily build a complete BCM gun as I did. Just add in the notes that you must buy the components separately.
Was thinking the same thing....
parishioner
07-14-09, 15:56
I thought about this as well but I figured it is not on the chart because BCMs are not sold as complete weapons.
I thought about this as well but I figured it is not on the chart because BCMs are not sold as complete weapons.
That was my guess too.
Yeah, but it'd sure be nice to see them there. They should rival LMT, no?
........
Bread is People
07-14-09, 19:19
I think this is a great idea, just be sure to put in somewhere that complete BCM rifles aren't available (yet).
I know its probably a pain to add many more brands but I would like to see BCM added to the list. I would also like to see KAC up there with the others but with their proprietary parts they don't really fit the features correctly.
CryingWolf
07-14-09, 19:43
Sure you can't grab a complete rifle off the shelf, but you can very easily build a complete BCM gun as I did. Just add in the notes that you must buy the components separately.
+1
I know people hate that :D
justin_247
07-14-09, 20:39
The idea of putting parts for home-built rifles on the chart is sort of silly because the chart was obviously designed for complete carbines ready-to-shoot out of the box.
A better idea than adding all these different components to the chart is for somebody to make a separate chart in a similar format to Rob's that lists all the different companies on the top and then breaks it down as to whether each component, if made by that company, is mil-spec. Making such a chart is a pretty easy thing to do ...
... the hard part is in gathering accurate data, especially from the Tier-3 companies who have crummy quality control procedures.
It should be fairly simple to cross reference the chart with the BCM website. That's what I did before I ordered my middie. I'll save you some time; BCM is ALL BLUE.
I hate to speculate, but I would not be surprised at all if you see Grant announcing BCM complete carbines once the demand has finally subsided a bit. I believe [BCM] offers everything necessary to do so, just not currently at the same time.
thespyhunter
07-15-09, 00:19
It should be fairly simple to cross reference the chart with the BCM website. That's what I did before I ordered my middie. I'll save you some time; BCM is ALL BLUE.
I hate to speculate, but I would not be surprised at all if you see Grant announcing BCM complete carbines once the demand has finally subsided a bit. I believe [BCM] offers everything necessary to do so, just not currently at the same time.
That would be awesome :D
That would be awesome :D
I would expect that to be coming somewhere down the road. I mean, why not? Besides the massive headache and hassle of producing a complete rifle - I am sure there are more PITA things (paperwork, procedures, documentation, demand, parts supply flow, shipping, etc) than one thinks about on the surface - much more than just put the two parts together and ship them.
......
I would like to see an upper chart or companies that make uppers included in some way. I would like to see both BCM and Larue on there.
My understanding of "the chart" is it is only for commercially built "rifles"... I hope it stays that way.
RogerinTPA
07-15-09, 13:03
My understanding of "the chart" is it is only for commercially built "rifles"... I hope it stays that way.
They are not sold as "complete" rifles yet (Just essentially milspec parts), nor are they mass produced or a common item in the market place (Like KAC), but they would fair very well if added to the chart. Hell, most gunstore owners never heard of Noveske, BCM or KAC, let alone the general population!
BravoCompanyUSA
07-17-09, 10:20
If the chart is to reference Mil-Spec features offered by AR manufacturers, then for reference BCM would be a blue line from top to bottom.
If the chart is to reference complete semi auto carbines offered for sale in the commercial market, then we will have to wait until Grant gets the first batches. :D
(No ETA right now, but a best guess would be sometime next year as we have a very full plate of new projects going on right now)
Thanks !
Paul
:D
Technically speaking, the Chart is intended for complete carbines, as mentioned above. I'd have to go back and check my notes, but I think we went through this with LMT in the early days, and eventually they came out with their complete guns which nullified the argument.
Not including BCM in the Chart should not be seen as any kind of slight against BCM or Paul in any way. BCM is the company I send everyone to first, and I have always been impressed with their service.
As I keep trying to stress, the Explanation of Features is the important information, the Chart is simply a quick reference guide AFTER one has read and understood the E of F. Virtually anyone that's going to purchase a BCM upper, lower, and BCG is going to know enough about the E of F, the Chart, and BCM to not need their inclusion to tell them they are buying great products.
the Chart shows what comes standard with the purchase of a complete M4 clone. since BCM doesn't produce a complete M4 clone to have standard parts, that would pose a problem
RetreatHell
07-17-09, 11:29
I'm sure this has been asked before, but why exactly isn't KAC on the chart?
Fire_Medic
07-17-09, 11:40
If the chart is to reference Mil-Spec features offered by AR manufacturers, then for reference BCM would be a blue line from top to bottom.
If the chart is to reference complete semi auto carbines offered for sale in the commercial market, then we will have to wait until Grant gets the first batches. :D
(No ETA right now, but a best guess would be sometime next year as we have a very full plate of new projects going on right now)
Thanks !
Paul
:D
Or you could do like me and build one! :D
SWATcop556
07-17-09, 14:35
I'm sure this has been asked before, but why exactly isn't KAC on the chart?
My understanding is that the KAC rifles, while they are very high quality and having many of the desired features, there is not a model that closely models an M4 clone.
Let's give Rob the benefit of the doubt since he has clearly earned it due to his experience and research. If he decides to add/or not to add any gun to the chart, he has solid reasoning behind his decision.
Let's not knock one of our valuable resources. Not saying anyone is, just making sure people understand we have one.
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