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Dave L.
01-28-07, 05:20
In 2002 I bought a Kimber Eclipse Pro II. For quality and price you couldn't beat it. Because the Eclipse was such a damn good gun, I bought a Warrior in 2005. The Warrior is reliable and accurate but it seems the tolerances of the receiver and slide are not near as tight as the Eclipse. When I wiggle the Warrior in my hand you can feel the slide vibrating on the frame.
Also, the SS barrel on the Warrior looks like sh*t, it pitted with rust within the first month of owning it- the pits are so small I cannot remove the rust. I haven't seen such a poor display of barrel finish on a thousand-dollar gun in my life... At least it shoots straight.

Can someone explain what, if anything happened to Kimber's QC?

I also heard a rumor that Kimber was having parts contracted out to Brazil...and that they are not 100% USA Made anymore.

Striker5
01-28-07, 05:53
I am completely talking out my rear end, but perhaps the tolerances are looser because it is the commercial clone of the Det 1 pistol? Maybe SYSCOM wanted a little more play for use in adverse conditions. That would be my guess.

Rob96
01-28-07, 06:00
When I still had 1911s, I prefered the slight "looseness" of my Colts. My Colts NEVER suffered a stoppage, while 3 different Kimbers (one full size and two different Pro Carry's) suffered many failures to feed no matter what mag used.

Nathan_Bell
01-28-07, 09:25
My Stainless Kimber's finish did the same thing. It is a 17 Mach2 that was having issues with reliablitly. It was sent back and Kimber did make it run correctly, new barrle, bushing, trigger, and hammer. Sadly they left the pitted up slide with it.
It is going to be getting cerakoted soon, as every time I look at it now I get annoyed.



ETA Before shipping it I had spoken to Kimber and described the problem of function and of their SS pitting up, I then attached a note saying the same thing. When I got the gun back with the slide still messed up. I called them again, and the very polite person on the other end of the phone told me that there was no mention of an pitting on any paperwork they had.

TOrrock
01-28-07, 09:46
In my last 3 years in the retail end of the firearms industry, we sent more Kimbers back for warranty work than Springfield or Colt combined.

They got too big too fast I think.

I don't think they're barrels are really stainless.

DrMark
01-28-07, 10:40
I don't think their barrels are really stainless.
I don't either. In fact, I've never heard them described as stainless.

I have one Kimber (pre Seires II), and it's been reliable. I've kept some type of CLP on the barrel, and no rust yet.

Boris
01-28-07, 16:13
Consider the end user for which the Warrior was designed and you could justify looser tolerances. I isn't expected to be a bulls-eye gun . . . I can't speak for QC on their newer guns, but my Series 1 has been extremely reliable and is still pretty tight after tens of thousands of rounds.

My barrel has seen some slight oxidation from sweat due to IWB carry, but a good cleaning has taken that off every time.

Dave L.
01-28-07, 16:27
I also believe Kimber proprietary coating is probably the weakest in the industry. The rail area where I have my X200 attached is almost bare metal. Kimpro II is CRAP.

Dave L.
01-28-07, 16:29
The barrel...even says on their website "steel barrel" and "stainless steel bushing"

http://www.kimberamerica.com/pistols/custom/warrior.php

Shihan
02-09-07, 00:25
I just sent my brand new Derert Warrior back as I had 10 jams on my first 150 rounds during breakin. I used 6 differnt mags and 4 types of ammo and still had problems. For the high price of their guns I think they need to spend more to make sure their products stand up to their "Out Of the Box Reliability" advertisement.


Thanks

DrMark
02-09-07, 07:54
I just sent my brand new Derert Warrior back as I had 10 jams on my first 150 rounds during breakin. I used 6 differnt mags and 4 types of ammo and still had problems.

Keep us updated, please.

SuicideHz
02-09-07, 18:09
I just sent my brand new Derert Warrior back as I had 10 jams on my first 150 rounds during breakin. I used 6 differnt mags and 4 types of ammo and still had problems. For the high price of their guns I think they need to spend more to make sure their products stand up to their "Out Of the Box Reliability" advertisement.


Thanks

That's not bad at all. What type of jams were they? FTFs? If they were FTFs I wouldn't have worried about it right away. maybe not FTEs either.

Shihan
02-09-07, 23:00
Not that bad? I gotta disagree my friend;)

Well Dennis at Kimbers custom shop said it would take 6 weeks to get it back. I let him know I was military and that I had purchased it as a sidearm. He called today and said it was fixed and would be back in my hands by Monday, which is quick as they picked it up this past Wednesday.
He said the chamber was way too tight, they fixed that, polished the feedramp(im not sure why it wouldnt come that way) taking the Kimpro off the feedramp, tuned the extractor and a half a dozen other things. I was half asleep when he called this morning. Im sure she will work like a charm now.
I initially had out of batteries and failure to feeds.

Thanks

SuicideHz
02-10-07, 01:02
Not that bad? I gotta disagree my friend;)

Well Dennis at Kimbers custom shop said it would take 6 weeks to get it back. I let him know I was military and that I had purchased it as a sidearm. He called today and said it was fixed and would be back in my hands by Monday, which is quick as they picked it up this past Wednesday.
He said the chamber was way too tight, they fixed that, polished the feedramp(im not sure why it wouldnt come that way) taking the Kimpro off the feedramp, tuned the extractor and a half a dozen other things. I was half asleep when he called this morning. Im sure she will work like a charm now.
I initially had out of batteries and failure to feeds.

Thanks

Sorry, for military that's a no-go, i agree.

I'm just used to seeing much worse and have dealt with much worse- SW is one I will never buy from again. They'd rather not even fix their own problems...

madryan
02-10-07, 02:40
The two Kimbers I've owned were very nice. The first thing I did was ream the chamber on both (Kimber has issues with tight chambers) and install an EGW oversized firing pin stop and Wilson Bulletproof extractor. IMO, these things will prevent about 90% of issues with the 1911, the remaining 10% being mags and ammo.

My current Kimber (Full size stainless II) is about half way between sloppy loose and tight match fit on the frame/slide rails. I prefer it this way so I never bothered to tighten it up.

Shihan
02-10-07, 02:57
Did your Kimber come with the slide fit that way from the factory or from use?

RobG
02-10-07, 11:51
I just sent my brand new Derert Warrior back as I had 10 jams on my first 150 rounds during breakin. I used 6 differnt mags and 4 types of ammo and still had problems. For the high price of their guns I think they need to spend more to make sure their products stand up to their "Out Of the Box Reliability" advertisement.


Thanks


I am having the Same problem with my Desert Warrior out of every 50 rnds 3+ jams different types of ammo and different mags... even does it with wilson combat mags. Both FTF and FTE but more on the FTE side. I heard through the grape vine that alot of people are replacing the "POS" extractor that kimber uses. I am going to send it back as well. :( -Is my third and will be my last Kimber ... until I start seeing better things out of the company.
Wilson Combat here I come!

Great post... I was beginning to wonder if I was the only one!

madryan
02-10-07, 12:49
I am having the Same problem with my Desert Warrior out of every 50 rnds 3+ jams different types of ammo and different mags... even does it with wilson combat mags. Both FTF and FTE but more on the FTE side. I heard through the grape vine that alot of people are replacing the "POS" extractor that kimber uses. I am going to send it back as well. :( -Is my third and will be my last Kimber ... until I start seeing better things out of the company.
Wilson Combat here I come!

Great post... I was beginning to wonder if I was the only one!

Virtually none of the "manufacturers" use high quality extractors and fitted firing pin stops. STI is the only one that seems to use parts that aren't MIM everywhere. If you get a Wilson you're still getting a manufactured gun but it's going to be fit better due to the fact that rather than use all MIM parts which can be dimensionally iffy Wilson uses CNC machined barstock and forged stuff which is much easier to fit due to increased control over the manufacturing process. You most likely don't need to do that much "fitting" with the pile of parts that becomes a WC pistol.

That being said, every "production" gun I've owned has had a crappy extractor and a firing pin stop that rattles around in the slide unless under tension. Since an EGW FP stop is about $15 and a good extractor is $25 I don't see it as a big deal to take a production gun and fix it like the factory should have. IMO WC and some others are waaaay overpriced.

If your extractor is free to rotate very much it's going to jack your feeding and ejection all up.

SuicideHz
02-10-07, 15:33
EGW stops are nice and cheap but mine took a lot of filing for it to fit in my Loaded. I understood that might be the case but there are a lot of places to file and fit. The EGW trigger had less to worry about as far as places to file and fit but then again, you want the trigger to fit even tighter and it's very easy to foul that whole operation up and end up with not much better than stock...

SGB
02-10-07, 16:19
I've got a Custom II and a Warrior and they both run 100% so far with the stock extractors.

Shihan
02-12-07, 03:43
Kimber says my D warrior will be back tomorrow so I hope it works. They tuned the extractor and a bunch of other stuff, well see what happens. You would think the would skip the parts on guns that retail for 1400.00 bones?
I had a new Sig Revolution which was a major piece of crap. Sigs customer servie had the nerve to ask for pics of th weapon if I wanted to expedite getting it fixed. they kept sdaying let us send you new mags as thats probably the problem. I explained I used 6 differnt mags with bad results and then they asked for pics. I spoke to spoke to the supervisor as I wanted to hurt the rep badly who was giving me the hard time and he said just send it in but I needed to pay its way there. I was so disgusted I sold it the next day to a store and only lost 50 bucks. Kimber may be having problems but atleast their customer service is good.

RobG
02-12-07, 08:32
Kimber says my D warrior will be back tomorrow so I hope it works. They tuned the extractor and a bunch of other stuff, well see what happens. You would think the would skip the parts on guns that retail for 1400.00 bones?
I had a new Sig Revolution which was a major piece of crap. Sigs customer servie had the nerve to ask for pics of th weapon if I wanted to expedite getting it fixed. they kept sdaying let us send you new mags as thats probably the problem. I explained I used 6 differnt mags with bad results and then they asked for pics. I spoke to spoke to the supervisor as I wanted to hurt the rep badly who was giving me the hard time and he said just send it in but I needed to pay its way there. I was so disgusted I sold it the next day to a store and only lost 50 bucks. Kimber may be having problems but atleast their customer service is good.

Agree with you there! Good customer service and a true desire to fix whatever problem you may have goes a long way. ------

I think I was just ranting b4... b/c of many gun related problems I have had recently.

Shihan
02-12-07, 14:08
Rob I feel for you I have had some back luck with new guns lately. I just purchased a Smith AR that is going back to the factory this week, the Kimber Warrior was a dud, my Sig Revolution a dud, I have a new Springfield that is going back for a faulty extractor 4 bad guns in a month is driving me nuts. What the bad thing is its always the expensive guns that do it to me. All of my less expensive Glocks, XD', Olympic arms etc never have a hitch.


Thanks

Dave L.
02-12-07, 22:17
I took my Warrior to the range Saturday and I shot 150 Magtech 230gr. FMJ's. I didn't have one problem with it, I never have. However, I started this thread because my Kimber Warrior doesn't resemble the quality control kimber was known for about 3 years ago. The fact that they didn't use a Stainless Steele Match-grade Barrel really pisses me off- my barrel looks like shit.

To address another problem I noticed, the mags were not dropping free when I hit the button, they were sticking like crazy. I was using Tripp 8 round Cobra Mags. A mag which is highly recommended on 10-8. I'm thinking I will go to WC mags and see what happens.

Doesn't it suck to spend $1,000+ on a gun, and then just want to gut it and replace it with parts that should have been used in the first place.
Some WC guns are up to almost $4,000. Are they even selling at that price?
Nobody should have to pay that much for a fighting 1911.

Shihan
02-12-07, 23:44
Raining Brass, yep it sucks big time. I have a ugly barrel in mine also, but I thought they always a non-stainless barrel? Those Tripp mags are good stuff but at almost 30bucks each they are crazy expensive. Most places that I know of that sell Wilson sell for a couple of hundread over cost. They sure are nice but for me to spend that much on a 1911 it better give back massages. I cried when I dished the money out on the Kimber.
Now dont laugh but out of all of my 1911''s I love my TAURUS, yep I said Taurus.

Thanks

Dave L.
02-13-07, 00:45
Raining Brass, yep it sucks big time. I have a ugly barrel in mine also, but I thought they always a non-stainless barrel? Those Tripp mags are good stuff but at almost 30bucks each they are crazy expensive. Most places that I know of that sell Wilson sell for a couple of hundread over cost. They sure are nice but for me to spend that much on a 1911 it better give back massages. I cried when I dished the money out on the Kimber.
Now dont laugh but out of all of my 1911''s I love my TAURUS, yep I said Taurus.

Thanks

Being that the Marine Corps is a Maritime Fighting Force (always around salt water), why the hell would the Warrior come with a non-stainless barrel other than for kimber to cut corners?:mad:

Bushytale
02-13-07, 01:19
the warrior we get is not the same one the MC gets!!!!

:eek: Billy

Dave L.
02-13-07, 01:35
the warrior we get is not the same one the MC gets!!!!

:eek: Billy

Believe me- I know, Even the MARSOC 45's are barely a Springfield anymore...the only thing original is the frame and slide.

Bushytale
02-13-07, 01:36
even the high end semi custom guns like Wilson don't get all the attention they should for the money. Read some of the reviews in Gun-Tests and they mention things like sharp edges on guns with $300 finishes. The Kimbers are a good starting point for the money. If you are worried about rust get a good finish like hard chrome.
If you want a gun that is 100% out of the box get it from one of the premier builders in 2-4 years. Otherwise you will have to tune it yourself or pay someone you know that can do it for you.

:cool: Billy

Rob96
02-13-07, 03:40
Man am I glad I decided long ago Glock is what works for me.:D

rhino
02-13-07, 14:32
To address another problem I noticed, the mags were not dropping free when I hit the button, they were sticking like crazy. I was using Tripp 8 round Cobra Mags. A mag which is highly recommended on 10-8. I'm thinking I will go to WC mags and see what happens.


If it's happening with all of the mags, it's probably not the magazine's problem.

You might want to check your grips screws. If one or more of them is a bit too long, they can protrude inside and drag on magazines. You may or may not see scratches on the mag tubes because of this.

Your mag catch may also be the problem. Some of them are a bit oversized on the inside, so that when you push the button fully, they actually push against the magazine tube and trapping it. You can fix this with some needle files and patience, or try a different brand of magazine catch.

Shihan
02-13-07, 19:32
even the high end semi custom guns like Wilson don't get all the attention they should for the money. Read some of the reviews in Gun-Tests and they mention things like sharp edges on guns with $300 finishes. The Kimbers are a good starting point for the money. If you are worried about rust get a good finish like hard chrome.
If you want a gun that is 100% out of the box get it from one of the premier builders in 2-4 years. Otherwise you will have to tune it yourself or pay someone you know that can do it for you.

:cool: Billy

Its really funny but the cheap Taurus 1911 has been 100% reliable with 2000 rounds fired. The stainless version comes out in a month or so which is good because the Taurus finish is really poor. I cant wait for the railed versions.

RobG
02-13-07, 19:41
Its really funny but the cheap Taurus 1911 has been 100% reliable with 2000 rounds fired. The stainless version comes out in a month or so which is good because the Taurus finish is really poor. I cant wait for the railed versions.


ARGHHH!:confused: :mad: :rolleyes:

Dave L.
02-13-07, 21:17
If it's happening with all of the mags, it's probably not the magazine's problem.

You might want to check your grips screws. If one or more of them is a bit too long, they can protrude inside and drag on magazines. You may or may not see scratches on the mag tubes because of this.

Your mag catch may also be the problem. Some of them are a bit oversized on the inside, so that when you push the button fully, they actually push against the magazine tube and trapping it. You can fix this with some needle files and patience, or try a different brand of magazine catch.

You are right about one thing, when I push the mag release all the way in it does actually grip the mag and wont drop at all!

Shihan
02-17-07, 18:26
Well I got my jamming D Warrior back in Tuesday and took it to the range today with the same function problems I had before. Im soooooooooo fed up I wanna cry like a big fat baby.

madryan
02-17-07, 19:45
Well I got my jamming D Warrior back in Tuesday and took it to the range today with the same function problems I had before. Im soooooooooo fed up I wanna cry like a big fat baby.


I'd call them and tell them you want a new gun. That's crap. They probably didn't actually do much of anything to it. I'd still check your firing pin stop fit because if it's really loose in there your extractor is fairly free to rotate. Slide it in to its groove and see how much play you have. A properly fitted high quality part will slide in and out without being hard to do but won't move around much or at all.

IMO, the best thing to do if they're not going to play ball is to get someone who actually knows about 1911's to look at it and test fire it.

ETA... Can you shoot some good pics of the breech face and firing pin stop from under the slide and post them?

Shihan
02-18-07, 02:41
Hello I will see if I can get some pics posted, the wife is the only one that knows how to operate this evil thing, so I have to wait for her to get back.
This is the work that they said they did.
1. Push rod pollished
2. Breech face polished
3. Chamber polished
4. Chamber reamed
5. Feed ramp polished
6. Extractor adjusted
7. Disconector raceway polished
8. Barrel throat polished

It has 350 rounds through it now and after being sent back it should work and oh yeah they sell them for 1400 bucks.

Thanks

Dave L.
02-18-07, 03:41
Hello I will see if I can get some pics posted, the wife is the only one that knows how to operate this evil thing, so I have to wait for her to get back.
This is the work that they said they did.
1. Push rod pollished
2. Breech face polished
3. Chamber polished
4. Chamber reamed
5. Feed ramp polished
6. Extractor adjusted
7. Disconector raceway polished
8. Barrel throat polished

It has 350 rounds through it now and after being sent back it should work and oh yeah they sell them for 1400 bucks.

Thanks

That sounds like a "punch-list"; obviously they didn't trouble-shoot it with ammo otherwise they would know it's still F'ed up.
I move to boycott Kimber, I wont buy another gun from them.

Shihan
02-18-07, 04:26
According to them they fired 12 mags without a hitch??? I think they are blowing smoke!

Rob96
02-18-07, 04:53
Well I got my jamming D Warrior back in Tuesday and took it to the range today with the same function problems I had before. Im soooooooooo fed up I wanna cry like a big fat baby.

We had a similar experience with a Pro Carry we sent in, only it came back worse.:eek:

I myself would not mess with them anymore. Cut your losses and dump it.

A guy I know has had this with a Raptor. Traded the Raptor towards a Colt Commander that was customized by Wilson. He is now very happy.:D