View Full Version : Pets and Evac.
I hope people include their pets in disaster plans. Normal pets all have different needs and exotic pets can have extreme needs. Knowing if your pet is better off going with you or sheltering in place is something that needs planning.
Cats- I dont have any, but my mom leaves hers at home. They can deal with being alone for a long time as long as they have food and water. Extra litter boxes are a must if you want to keep your entire house to become a litter box. That is all I have about them
Dogs- My dog will be with me no matter what, regular planned evac or SHTF disaster. I know a lot of people have dogs and they are great pets, AT THEIR HOUSE, but they turn in to a problem/liability if they are taken out of their environment.
Food- Some dogs are on a strict diet or only eat one food, you have to prepare for that and stock up. Some dogs will get sever problems if they have to or get into new food. Mine has always been given some "people" food just so I know she can stomach it. I also always keep a case of canned food for her on hand.
Travel- Some people only put their dog in a vehicle if they are going to the vet, which can also cause problems if they do not like going to the vet. If they need to be in a crate you should know how much space that takes up. You also need to plan for hotels that will allow dogs if that is where you are going to evac to.
You also need to remember normal needs like, a leash, meds, food/water bowls, toys, and whatever else they need. Other things to consider are:
Does your dog get along with other dogs?
Is your dog used to crowds?
Is your dog used to being in strange places?
I think having a dog is one of the best defenses there is.
QuietShootr
08-11-09, 06:54
Dog is included in all BI/BO plans. Has his own food supply, meds, and medical kit. One of my best friends is also my veterinarian, so I have plenty of med supplies (both for the pup and for me and mine).
He is small, so I have a transport kennel for him that secures to the cab of my truck with tiedowns.
I was teaching my wife how to don the pro mask and overgarment, and she said, "What about the dog?" Okay. I got sheet plastic, tape, and rigged an adapter made out of an old regulator jammed partially open to freeflow air from an 80cf Al SCUBA tank to turn the kennel into an NBC enclosure, at least long enough to evac. It takes about 3 minutes to set up with the components already premeasured and cut, and the bottle will provide positive air pressure for around 5 hours at what I have determined to be the minimum safe airflow rate.
Silly? maybe...but I don't want to see my little buddy doing the kickin' chicken, and I had the stuff around anyway. So there it is.
PA PATRIOT
08-11-09, 11:16
All Animals are a liability with maybe the limited exception of certain breeds of dog which can be used as a guard. You have to feed and water them which adds weight and consumes your base supplies. Plus you have to silence them as to not give away your location at times which draws your attention from other duties. All other animals should be discarded as a liability as they serve no role other to consume resources and time. We have two cats which are loving lap fur balls but the best I will do is leave a 50 pound bag a food and the tap water running in the sink. If we make it back in time then we will care for the kitties, if not once things are back to normal then we can get two more at the pound. Cats are cats and my wife and kids come first.
Agree with Phila...
I like and keep pets. They are animals, however. If they interfere with movement, concealment, sheltering, or other survival concern, they must be left behind.
The ability to retain them depends on the particulars of what you're dealing with. If you'll be hunkering down on your own, or moving out under your own power, weigh the merits and liabilities of keeping them. If you'll be moved or sheltered by others, plan that your animal won't be allowed, much less provided for.
Anticipate that when you move with them, and in the rare circumstance they'll be allowed by others, you may have to produce health/vaccination records.
ASPCA, Humane Society, PETA, the Red Cross, and government entities have published advice on how to prep for emergency care of animals.
In the end, they're animals.
Food for survivalist thought: Never have a pet you can't eat in an emergency. Or at least, a pet that doesn't produce some useful byproduct.
Gutshot John
08-11-09, 13:07
All Animals are a liability with maybe the limited exception of certain breeds of dog which can be used as a guard.
Respectfully I disagree. Virtually any dog is better than no dog in a SHTF scenario. They are the best force multiplier available to the civilian. Of course there are liabilities, as with any choice, but all of those can be overcome with a little time and training. While certain breeds are better suited to certain tasks all dogs have the same basic instincts and senses and even a toy dog is more alert than a human being and can guard. Yorkshire Terriers for instance were bred to chase badgers into their dens and drag them out. I'm a full grown man and I wouldn't mess with a badger, never mind in its den. That's a lot of dog in a little package but you won't get the most out of your dog if you don't take the time to train him.
You have to feed and water them which adds weight and consumes your base supplies. Plus you have to silence them as to not give away your location at times which draws your attention from other duties. All other animals should be discarded as a liability as they serve no role other to consume resources and time.
Per pound of bodyweight dogs consume far less than a humans, most dogs can get by with a few ounces of water a day and are quite adapted to find their own. As for food, most dogs can procure more rabbits/squirrels in a day than you can in a year without a firearm. My dogs do it without even having to be trained. In my opinion a dog is an asset in procuring food in a SHTF scenario and is more than capable enough of feeding itself otherwise. There are also packs available from LL Bean, Orvis and made for dogs to carry their own supplies.
As for silencing a dog this is where a modicum of training yields dividends. It's not that hard to teach a dog to alert silently and gives you a significant tactical advantage. Even if a dog barks, you're far better off knowing that someone's there than not knowing. It will ward off those that aren't inclined to mess with you, and alert you to those that are.
We have two cats which are loving lap fur balls but the best I will do is leave a 50 pound bag a food and the tap water running in the sink. If we make it back in time then we will care for the kitties, if not once things are back to normal then we can get two more at the pound. Cats are cats and my wife and kids come first.
No animal should supersede family, but if an animal can help keep my family alive, as dogs have been doing for 10K+ years, I'm inclined to value them as an asset.
I specifically chose my dogs for their "tactical" qualities. I didn't need a big attack dog except as a last resort, but a dog that was intelligent and alert to any threat.
You can get a lot of dog in a 30-40lb package. Add a bit of training and effort and you've got a huge advantage.
I agree that there are dogs that would be a liability in a disaster/survival situation, the only way to know is to train with them just as you would your gear, weapon, etc. My dog goes where ever I go, so I know she is fine around other people, other dogs and has no problem camping/hiking or being in a vehicle for extended trips.
Dogs have amazing survival skills on their own, they will drink water and eat things that even Survivorman would not touch. In a camping survival situation dogs are invaluable as far as I am concerned. Not only will they guard against humans, they will also keep other dogs and animals away from you, and can be left at camp by themselves to protect it. It would suck to leave your camp for a little while only to come back to a tent destroyed by raccoons looking for food.
Granted, if I had a 5 pound dog that I had to carry because it couldn't keep up and it needed special canned food I had to also carry, I wouldn't even consider it. I categorize them the same as I do cats, totally useless.
My dog is part of my disaster planning. He is an Akita mix and is very useful as a watch dog.
My wife has 2 cats & my daughter has a frog. I don't include them any of my plans.
geminidglocker
11-25-09, 18:19
I include my dog in mine, but not my cats. The cats can catch mice, birds, etc;. My dog, a Husky/Samoyed cross, can only catch moles. Dog eats dry food and people food. Plus, last Winter I dug a snow cave and spent the night in it with my dog, she kept me considerably warmer than had she not been there. I plan on doing the snow cave excersize again this year, as last year was my first, and to make it realistic I dug it with a frying pan. I know that I can do it that way, but this year I'm useing a shovel. A single candle lets off enough warmth and light to make a snow cave quite comfy.
rhaswell79
11-30-09, 18:11
When I think of disaster preparation (http://www.bt.cdc.gov), I often forget that you also have to have a plan for your pets. Is there a disaster preparedness checklist for pets (http://www.atwussd.com)? I think that by just having a disaster checklist (http://www.interragate.info/) handy, you won't really have to panic when something really does happen. Anyways, I'm really glad you mentioned pets because I wouldn't have a plan for them. Any suggestions or ideas would really help out! Thanks :)
Belmont31R
12-01-09, 02:10
My dogs would go with me.
There is also the companionship element a lot of people overlook. In a nasty situation "mans best friend" can be a boost to morale.
If it comes down to them being a real burden on my families survivability Id rather just put them down than to leave them somewhere to starve or become a liability to others. Lots of abandoned dogs running around quickly form packs, and can be a bigger situation to deal with.
Somehow people have kept dogs for a few thousand years in living conditions we view as SHTF...I think I can manage too.
Most shelters do not allow animals. Lots of strays in NOLA after Katrina. If you plan on bugging out with an animal, don't figure a shelter into your plans. It is not as simple as saying I'm taking my _____ with me. Lots of people abandoned their animals after they reached a stopping location. You may be welcome somewhere, but not your animal.
Gutshot John
12-03-09, 12:48
Most shelters do not allow animals. Lots of strays in NOLA after Katrina. If you plan on bugging out with an animal, don't figure a shelter into your plans. It is not as simple as saying I'm taking my _____ with me. Lots of people abandoned their animals after they reached a stopping location. You may be welcome somewhere, but not your animal.
In terms of standard disaster evacuation federal laws have been change to mandate evacuation of pets as many people also refused to leave their pets behind. Standards/Practices have changed quite a bit in the wake of Katrina.
It's certainly as simple as saying I'm taking my dogs with me. I'm more secure with them than without them.
GJ- I 100% empathize with someone wanting to bring their pets. I'm not up to speed on the latest protocols for evacs. but even if the gov. says they are allowed to be transported, that doesn't mean the shelter, friend's house, hotel, etc. will allow the animal. As far as feeling more comfortable with your dogs around, most definitely.
I am mulling over the pros/cons of bringing an animal. The space an animal, and it's food, takes up could be used for family food. Can an animal be part of the family? Of course, just ask my cat. But if push comes to shove, the animal stays in favor of human supplies. I also wonder about what percentage of animals would actually be of any use; as in utilitarian(earn it's keep). Most dogs do not seem to be practical guard dogs or hunters. Are there exceptions? Yes. But it would be up to the individual to decide if their particular dog is a family friend, or actually has some use. I do not consider "good for the kids," or "comforting" as a legitimate reason to bring an animal along. This reasoning applies only to me.
On the flip side, I see where a good guard dog that can be aggressive, yet controllable(as in trained) would be invaluable.
I had friends that had to leave pets behind while evac'ing NOLA and it was heartbreaking. I bugged in and had supplies to last a month for the family and animal. The aftermath saw many, many animals left behind that began to roam the city and some became dangerous.
All I can really say is my opinion applies only to me. Each situation is different and the variables will dictate whether one really brings an animal along.
Hopefully none of us will ever even have to worry about it.
In terms of standard disaster evacuation federal laws have been change to mandate evacuation of pets as many people also refused to leave their pets behind. Standards/Practices have changed quite a bit in the wake of Katrina. It's certainly as simple as saying I'm taking my dogs with me. I'm more secure with them than without them.
Interesting. FEMA and emergency management/disaster agencies haven't changed the info they're disseminating. Is that a recent change? Got a pointer?
Gutshot John
12-03-09, 20:46
Interesting. FEMA and emergency management/disaster agencies haven't changed the info they're disseminating. Is that a recent change? Got a pointer?
It was passed into law in 2006.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pets_Evacuation_and_Transportation_Standards_Act
It was passed into law in 2006.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pets_Evacuation_and_Transportation_Standards_Act
Good info, thanks. Interesting that in some FEMA and emergency/disaster briefings since, they've disseminated the same info re: pets as always. I wonder if the full text of the legislation was pretty casual.
MSP "Sarge"
12-03-09, 22:30
I am enjoying this topic. I will take my lab with me. I have taught him some cool stuff that my help my family along the way.
Somehow people have kept dogs for a few thousand years in living conditions we view as SHTF...I think I can manage too.
Very valid point. Great perspective.
RAM Engineer
12-06-09, 15:09
Very valid point. Great perspective.
http://www.beyondhollywood.com/stillsx/2007/10/mad-max-4-fury-road-1.jpg
:D
my male Riot (my avatar) is a useful dog that eats very little. he runs down rabbits regularly and flushes birds, so id take him with me anywhere. hes silent and never barks, but does alert me with body language
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