View Full Version : Why I prefer an SBR over a can
carried over from this thread (http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?p=459228&posted=1#post459228)
While I have come to find cans to be of virtually no use whatsoever, the SBR is my favorite gun.
Rob (or Caporider), could you expand on this a bit?
This is just my opinion (which generally means I'll offend people greatly with everything that comes hereafter and there will be much wailing and gnashing of teeth) but...
I frankly find suppressors in general, and 5.56 suppressed ARs in particular, to be a complete waste of time, money, effort, weight, and size. and more and more people are figuring this out all on their own. I was in a class two weeks ago where 3 out of 12 were shooting AR shorties with can mounts on them, and all three of us owned the cans that went on them. Only one of us shot the can at all over the course of three days, and he was a dealer that was asked about it and chose to shoot it to show what it does. I know of at least two other training junkies that ran cans, and ran them hard, up until a few months ago and are now off them.
I do absolutely believe that they have a tactical role with teams shooting indoors or other confined spaces. Other than that? I think they have limited use for hunters who can legally use them on certain game and may not want to disturb neighbors, hunting partners, or their next potential kill.
I also think they can be "fun", and may offer some use for folks that are shooting on private property with antsy neighbors.
Like most things people buy for their guns (truthfully including the $200 SBR tax stamp too), they'd be better off putting the money for the can towards ammo and training. Even given that you are already training as much as time will allow, I frankly think the money spent would be better off in the kid's college fund or otherwise invested, even if that investment is nothing more than a cheap diamond for the wife.
SBRs on the other hand are infinitely less expensive ($200 tax and a 1:1 swap for the non-NFA part), lighter, more compact, more maneuverable, easier to pack, easier to deal with on the range, lighter (oh, wait, I said that already)...
This is why I don't own any.
I might get one for a 22LR, for hunting purposes.
But that's a ways down the road, if at all.
Edit: I encountered cans on a semi frequent basis while in the military and was never really impressed with them on rifles. I see the point for some folks, definitely, but not for me. It would basically come down to me owning an $800-$1300 headset or earplugs.
Rob_s,
Haven't you ever bought anything just because it was "cool"?
That's not meant to be flippant. I'd have to agree that their application in hard core training is probably um... muted(?), but they are a source of fun. I like to shoot, I like to shoot and train hard (what I've been able to attend), but most of all, I like to smile. I usually do after every shooting session. It's better and cheaper to just go shooting and learning, than pay a psychologist, and at the end of a good range session, it's just plain fun to pop that suppressor on and get a bit more width outta that smile on my face.
I didn't buy my suppressor for any nefarious reasons, or because I plan on busting down a methlab door. I just wanted one. It was money I had that was extra. All the bullets were bought, all the available training was signed up for... it was just because I wanted it.
Honestly though, probably like you... you won't hear me lauding the use of my suppressor for "hard use". It's a range toy, much like my SBR'd PS90. I call 'em smile makers. Basically, I bought it back when I had more money than I knew what to do with. That's not the case anymore, so now, I buy more bullets.
Last weekend a friend and I were discussing what the advantage of a can on an AR would be. Never having used or been around one I'd think the sonic crack would negate a alot. However there are probably more reasons than I know.
Now on a 22 rimfire, that would be a different animal. I've fired one on a handgun and was impressed at the difference with subsonic ammo (I'm easily impressed). A scoped 10/22 with a suppressor would be something really useful ... and fun.
Realistically, if the primary gun comes out, the suppressor is already on it. I better know how it handles and where it shoots.
Also, when I am shooting around other folks they appreciate the can more than the 10" concussion grenade I could set off right in front of, or behind, them. :D
I like it and what it does. I'm probably in the minority though, and really don't care one way or the other. :cool:
I only own 1 SBR but I think a can would be fun to shoot with to reduce sound levels... whether it's practical in training or not is a different story as I've yet to own one. Subscribed for reading & entertainment... :D
SHIVAN kind of hit on what I wanted to bring up in this discussion.
If I'm using an AR for real, it's in home-defense. An AR indoors sucks. My hearing is valuable to me, even if it's just to confirm that the rest of my family is fine after some dirtbag earned his dirt nap. Suppessors interest me strongly for this reason. For those of you electing not to use cans on your shorty ARs, is it because that's not your primary defensive tool, or because you're not so concerned with the muzzle report?
For my use, I see a can as something that mandates a shorter rifle. I also see my hearing as being valuable enough to strongly consider a can, and an SBR as being useful only in off-setting the added length of said can. To me it's hard to envision getting one of these tax stamps without the other based on how I (currently) envision using them.
-B
I frankly find suppressors in general, and 5.56 suppressed ARs in particular, to be a complete waste of time, money, effort, weight, and size.
I half way agree. I wouldn't reverse my decision to buy my cans. I almost always take one with me and shoot a mag or so through it every shoot. But shooting a can in a class is senseless to me.
Why bother if you have to wear ears anyway. Plus the volume of fire in a class will have your weapon 2 - 3 times filthier than if you had shot unsupressed.
A can is great fun, but you won't see one hanging off the front of my Home D 11.5" carbean.
For those of you electing not to use cans on your shorty ARs, is it because that's not your primary defensive tool, or because you're not so concerned with the muzzle report?
Not concerned. Not even remotely.
Not concerned in the slightest either.
I'm training as much as I can afford to.
I have plenty of ammo.
I know that a can on an AR has it's downsides and will never make an AR as quiet as one of my suppressed 22s or even my suppressed Marlin Camp 45.
I still bought an AR can because I get dealer price on them and they are fun!
Home defense, at least INSIDE the home, would seem to be an ideal use for a suppressor, with many of the drawbacks of a suppressor mitigated by the way the rifle would be utilized in such a scenario.
But suppressors do bring their own set of compromises, that is true. Probably the most useful suppressors I have are my .22 cans, because I can shoot in my basement. But that's mainly for fun, also. I guess if I ever had to shoot a rat or something, they'd come in handy.
Not very useful at all in the home. A suppressor adds at least 5-6" in length to your AR. So if you are running an 11.5" upper you are back to the length of, or maybe even longer than a 16" gun without a can and on a 16" gun you are longer than a full size A2. I have a lot of corners and stairs in my house and it is not fun to clear with anything other than a pistol let alone a 16" AR with a 6" can on the front.
Not very useful at all in the home. A suppressor adds at least 5-6" in length to your AR. So if you are running an 11.5" upper you are back to the length of, or maybe even longer than a 16" gun without a can and on a 16" gun you are longer than a full size A2. I have a lot of corners and stairs in my house and it is not fun to clear with anything other than a pistol let alone a 16" AR with a 6" can on the front.
My intended use for my 10.5" suppressed AR would be to cover the single staircase in my home from the top, while waiting for the cops.
I ain't gonna clear anything.
That presumes I have a reasonable certainty that someone is actually in my home. For investigating the "bump in the night," I will use a pistol with a light and my cellphone. It would be almost impossible for someone to enter my home without me having a pretty good idea they're in here, and it would be almost equally impossible for them to get upstairs without me being certain they're here.
QuietShootr
09-23-09, 21:16
Realistically, if the primary gun comes out, the suppressor is already on it. I better know how it handles and where it shoots.
Also, when I am shooting around other folks they appreciate the can more than the 10" concussion grenade I could set off right in front of, or behind, them. :D
I like it and what it does. I'm probably in the minority though, and really don't care one way or the other. :cool:
Agreed. I've been running my HALO hard the last couple of months in a couple of classes (and you may see me driving it on S.W.A.T. TV in January:cool:) and it does everything I want it to do. Plus it doesn't make everyone else training with me hate me by COB every day.
Me; I'm sure as hell no expert, but in my uneducated opinion, a can could have it's place in a limited number of applications. In these scenarios, it would seem to be quite useful/practical.
Robb Jensen
09-23-09, 21:37
I'm weird I guess. I prefer a SBR with a suppressor....I'm fortunate to have both. It's not like I have to choose one over the other.
I'm weird I guess. I prefer a SBR with a suppressor....I'm fortunate to have both. It's not like I have to choose one over the other.
I'm weirder. I have two 5.56 cans and two SBRs, and I've never even fired my cans on my SBRs.
I did fire Iraqgunz's M4-2000 on his 11.5 and it was very nice. Not as loud as some supressed SBRs I've fired in the past.
Derek_Connor
09-24-09, 08:18
I'll have to agree as well. I fell out of "love" with suppressors about this time last year.
I've owned all the big names, and shot alot of rounds through all of them.
Waste of time, money, and everything else they complicate.
Romeo Foxtrot
09-24-09, 10:26
I disagree. A suppressed SBR is a great home defense weapon. I would hate to light off a 10.5in SBR inside, with no hearing protection.
I disagree. A suppressed SBR is a great home defense weapon. I would hate to light off a 10.5in SBR inside, with no hearing protection.
Have you done it? Have you done it in the midst of a fight?
I've only done it accidentally (in the gunshop where I worked) and in "shoot house" stages in matches where the roof is open. I'll take the more maneuverable and lighter weapon every time.
To each his own, I guess. I prefer a suppressed SBR over a non-suppressed. I don't mind the extra cleaning, I guess I'm just deranged like that, hehe.
I agree with you on the ease of movement without a can on, but losing most of the concussion and fireball is worth the small loss of that.
M2c
Ymmv
:cool:
Romeo Foxtrot
09-24-09, 13:25
Have you done it? Have you done it in the midst of a fight?
I've only done it accidentally (in the gunshop where I worked) and in "shoot house" stages in matches where the roof is open. I'll take the more maneuverable and lighter weapon every time.
no hearing protection on for either? were your ears ringing for days? Ive fired a 10.5in SBR at an indoor range, with hearing protection on and it rang my ears... I dont even want to begin to imagine what it would do to my ears inside my house with out any protection on.
I dont have an SBR yet, or a suppressor... but my 16in gun is plenty maneuverable in my home, and a 10.5in gun with a suppressor would be right about 16in. ill take saving my hearing over a little gained maneuverability.
Granted i do agree that .223/5.56 doesent exactly suppress the best. I would never suppress a 5.56 with the intent of making it some sort of ultra silent ninja sniper weapon. I would put a can on a 5.56, though, to make it tolerable to fire indoors or around others with out hearing protection.
I've fired my SBR without ears accidentally. I meant to shoot, but forgot my muffs were up on my head, above my ears.
I thought the gun blew up. But the ringing was short lived. If it had been an actual fight/shooting and I knew I didn't have ear pro on I wouldn't have been startled by it at all.
I've fired my 14.5 once in anger with no ear pro. Not the same as an 11.5, but I didn't hardly hear a thing.
Thomas M-4
09-24-09, 13:53
I have not fired a 5.56 sbr indoors but I have fired a 16'' barrel 12ga in a hallway was it loud you bet the shock knocked off window glazing where my ears ringing? I don't even remember so if they were ringing must not have been to bad.
I would take the advantage of an SBR with out a can than one with a can.
firing a weapon inside a house with texture sheetrock and carpet and furniture and shit is actually MUCH quieter than firing it basically anywhere else... i guess it seems like it will be worse than firing outside on the range or at an indoor range, but all of the things in the house absorb the sound greatly.
Looks like we are getting into the auditory exclusion phenomenon.
I am waiting on my first batch of silencers and they are pretty much for fun. I don't see me buying anymore after this.
Jay Cunningham
09-24-09, 15:39
Looks like we are getting into the auditory exclusion phenomenon.
Yes, and there is already a big thread about it: http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=34156&highlight=suppressed
Instead of excluding one or the other is there no reason why we can have the best of both worlds? My suppressed SBR is quite maneuverable and quiet at the same time.
I disagree. A suppressed SBR is a great home defense weapon. I would hate to light off a 10.5in SBR inside, with no hearing protection.
In a gunfight, your senses begin to shut down. You wont even hear the gunshots.
ETA looks like "FRINGE" already hit on this topic....
Instead of excluding one or the other is there no reason why we can have the best of both worlds? My suppressed SBR is quite maneuverable and quiet at the same time.
IMHO a "suppressed SBR" is kind of a misnomer. I understand that legally and technically that's what it is, but in terms of size it's really more like a suppressed carbine, since you've gone back up to the same size as a 16" gun. Maybe if someone offered an integrally suppressed 11.5" AR barrel then I might think of that as a "suppressed SBR".
Obviously you can have both, but for me the added size, weight, complexity, reliability, cost, etc. issues aren't worth the trade off of the smaller gun.
That's just me, and what works for me.
rob_s,
I understand what you're saying 100%. Now that I have an SBR and a suppressor, if i had to pic one, SBR over suppressor any day. But, a quick question, more out of curiosity than anything, lets say there's no NFA. You could walk in and pic up a suppressor at the gun shop, right along side a Ruger 10/22, SBR AR, M240, etc. Not trying to make this a fantasy question, but if the NFA/transfer tax/paper work etc. weren't involved, would you buy a suppressor to have for your SBR. Even though, as I take it, you have discovered that a suppressor doesn't really fill any need for you.
ADH
I have to say I love my M4-2000 with my 10.5" LWRC upper. Fun factor is even better if you have a switch that reads "Auto"
Asside from that personal opinion, comes in very handy when worrying about the neighbors when trying not to impose on friends land, masking sound signature, etc.
I really get the most use out of a .22 Pilot on a 10/22 for my kids. Makes its a bit softer and less imposing.
Just as a side note to the whole "auditory exclusion" issue with shooting inside with a loud carbine...
Just because a sound did not hurt (or you didn't notice it) doesn't mean you haven't caused, or are in the process of causing, permanent hearing damage.
For an example, think how there is a distinct lack of pain in the sounds of a leaf blower, lawn mower, weed trimmer, table saw, etc. Then realize that over time all of these have been shown to cause hearing damage.
I hunt without ear plugs, and I do not hear the kill shot. It doesn't mean my ears are perfectly fine at all.
Has anybody lit off a 10.5 or even a 16" rifle in their home?
I have fired a 14.5" and 20" in enclosed spaces- loud is a pretty good description. I also had the displeasure of being shot with a .45 pistol from about 10 feet away without ear pro.
Has anybody lit off a 10.5 or even a 16" rifle in their home?
variablebinary
09-25-09, 04:25
I'll take both please
.... I also had the displeasure of being shot with a .45 pistol from about 10 feet away without ear pro.
Shot by a .45? OUCH
Hope u made a full recovery. Accidental or engaged in a fight for life? (If I may ask)
At least youre here, so I assume you won if it was the latter scenario.
Intentional when I was working bail bonds. Mr. Douche bag wasn't so lucky as he was killed a short time later by the S.O.
Shot by a .45? OUCH
Hope u made a full recovery. Accidental or engaged in a fight for life? (If I may ask)
At least youre here, so I assume you won if it was the latter scenario.
Intentional when I was working bail bonds. Mr. Douche bag wasn't so lucky as he was killed a short time later by the S.O.
You shouldn't give Douche the respect of giving him the title of "Mr"......
Dead Turd Douche Bag is more fitting.
CarlosDJackal
09-25-09, 08:44
I'm weird I guess. I prefer a SBR with a suppressor....I'm fortunate to have both. It's not like I have to choose one over the other.
+1
The fact of the matter is, suppressors are specialized tools meant for specialized work. Nothing new and earth-shattering here because the same can be said for an AR, a handgun, Magpul BAD Lever, Redi-Mag, Aimpoint T-1, etc.
Just because you haven't run into a loose nail, it doesn't mean you will never need a hammer. I have 2 cans and am hoping to buy a few more (my next one will probably be in .30-caliber).
I'm thankful that I don't listen to most people's opinions. Otherwise I never would have joined the Army, the Sheriff's Office, gotten my Airborne and Air Assault badges, attended Flight School, etc. JM2CW.
I like when Steve @ ADCO gets to messin' around:
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=461230
http://www.adcofirearms.com/junkpics/mkcqb.jpg
"This combo with the suppressor is the exact same length as an 11.5" upper with an A2 Flash Hider. "
I prefer both. While I could certainly make the argument that the added weight on the muzzle is a detriment to handling, the weight (and effects of the can baffles) also acts to pretty much completely eliminate recoil and muzzle rise. My hammers and double taps are notably faster. I find I might lose a fraction of a second on something like an El Presidente drill where I have to transition from target to target.
I have permanent hearing damage (mostly tinnitus) from my time in OIF shooting without plugs or ear-pro. While auditory exclusion may happen for some it doesn’t happen for all. Also, auditory exclusion doesn’t protect your eardrum from damage, rupturing, etc. Auditory exclusion is part of your brain selectively deciding what information it needs to process to stay in the fight (or flight).
Stephen
I like when Steve @ ADCO gets to messin' around:
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=461230
http://www.adcofirearms.com/junkpics/mkcqb.jpg
"This combo with the suppressor is the exact same length as an 11.5" upper with an A2 Flash Hider. "
That's a pretty nice solution. Wonder just how effective that particular Ops can is compared to some of the others like the Surefire, AAC, etc.
That's a version that would get me thinking of using a can full time again. Not much reason to take it off, so I'd probably use the muzzle break Ops mount to get the added blast baffle protection.
ETA:
Looks like he's offering the barrel and can combo (http://adcofirearms.com/itemdetails_.cfm?inventorynumber=3825) with an 11.5" barrel.
this is the can in question (http://adcofirearms.com/itemdetails_.cfm?inventorynumber=3823) which at only $215 alleviates a good part of the cost issue as well. Of course at 4.5" OAL (the 15th is 7", the 12th is 8.5") not sure just how effective it would be. Be interesting to meter it.
Derek_Connor
09-25-09, 09:29
That's a pretty nice solution. Wonder just how effective that particular Ops can is compared to some of the others like the Surefire, AAC, etc.
That's a version that would get me thinking of using a can full time again. Not much reason to take it off, so I'd probably use the muzzle break Ops mount to get the added blast baffle protection.
ETA:
Looks like he's offering the barrel and can combo (http://adcofirearms.com/itemdetails_.cfm?inventorynumber=3825) with an 11.5" barrel.
this is the can in question (http://adcofirearms.com/itemdetails_.cfm?inventorynumber=3823) which at only $215 alleviates a good part of the cost issue as well. Of course at 4.5" OAL (the 15th is 7", the 12th is 8.5") not sure just how effective it would be. Be interesting to meter it.
I have this can from OPS being referenced above. I've shot it on my 11inch and 12.5 riles.
It is probably the best compromise in each category (size, cost, length, weight, suppression) and so on.
According to steve it has double digit suppression. Which is interesting to say the least, as it is only one baffle. It takes some of the bite out of the recoil, percussion..
Its obviously no where near as quiet as some of the full size can offerings from the other big 3-4 suppressor companies.
Voodoochild
09-25-09, 11:27
I wonder what the db rating is compared to a full size ops can. Anyone done any db metering on this yet?
I hunt without ear plugs, and I do not hear the kill shot. It doesn't mean my ears are perfectly fine at all.
My ears ring ALL the time as I started hunting birds w/ a 20ga sans plugs since I was 9 or 10.....I now wear them all the time when wing shooting, but you just can't always have plugs in when a quick shot is needed on varmints / deer hunting. I wear those ones that you can hang around your neck but they don't always get used for the quicky shots. A 16" AR w/ the wind blowing in your face is loud, and cannot be good for your ears.
I hear what rob is saying and would shoot an sbr sans can and plugs if things got ugly in a heartbeat, but I'll be honest and say I am chomping at the bit to get my hands on one of grants dedicated suppressed small port sbr's. For me and my type of shooting, I would just prefer the can on an sbr.
$215... holy sheepshit. I think I need my BCM 11.5 to make a trip to ADCO.
I wonder what the db rating is compared to a full size ops can. Anyone done any db metering on this yet?
There's a video up on the ADCO site with a 7.5" M16 with one of these cans mounted. It's reasonable considering it's a 7.5.
Romeo Foxtrot
09-25-09, 14:13
sounded nice on the 16in gun.
I wonder what the db rating is compared to a full size ops can. Anyone done any db metering on this yet?
ADCO video made it sound like it was still unsat for use without hearing protection.
-B
Romeo Foxtrot
09-25-09, 15:59
ADCO video made it sound like it was still unsat for use without hearing protection.
-B
On the 7in gun it sounded like a 16in gun with out a suppressor... on the 16in gun it sounded like it may have been quiet enough to not need hearing protection... if not, it atleast sounded like it wouldnt ring your ears.
I dont think I would buy one, I would opt for a full size can.
I was thinking this as well. I can understand the want for a smaller, lighter, less expensive suppressor, but for me the whole point of a suppressor is something that won't ruin my hearing after a few uses without hearing protection. But, as I said elsewhere here, as nice as it might be to have an M4-2k mounted on an 11.5"-12.5" barrel, there's a lot to be said for $400 in tax stamps, $900 for the suppressor, and a little over a grand for the rifle...
-B
Shooting at pigs using an unsuppressed SBR inside of a vehicle can get a weee bit loud esp if you don't get the muzzel out of the window.
This was one of the articles that spurred my interest in getting a can for my AR: http://www.surefire.com/articles-suppressors_forpolice
Year or so later, I ended up just getting both the SBR and can at the same time. Very manageable if you are used to a full size M4...
Another good article I found after already owning: http://www.tacticalmedicine.com/files/policeaug08.pdf
That said, the .22 can is definitely the most fun. "Stupid fun" as my buddy says...
I do absolutely believe that they have a tactical role with teams shooting indoors or other confined spaces. Other than that? I think they have limited use for hunters who can legally use them on certain game and may not want to disturb neighbors, hunting partners, or their next potential kill.
I also think they can be "fun", and may offer some use for folks that are shooting on private property with antsy neighbors.
Frankly, I have to wonder what other purposes there are besides those?
In addition to the "I need that" and the cool factor, I got mine for that rare possibility I may have to fire a 5.56 rifle indoors in a home defense role. Having shot guns indoors, I know that a can makes a world of difference.
I'm hoping to one day live in a place where back yard shooting is also an option. And with neighbors within 100 yards I wouldn't dream of shooting 5.56 without a can. Just wouldn't be polite.
Interesting thread. I have been considering a can for my 10.5 SBR.
Anyone got more info on the OPs Inc M4-S pictured in the ADCO picture?
Why is it so inexpensive? Does it offer significantly less sound reduction? I would assume so.
Thanks!
-RD62
I love my SBRs suppressed.
Here are the 10.5" and 14.5" rifles, both with a SpecWarII and PVS-14 (which splits time with the 3X).
Night shooting is a great reason for suppressors.
http://bellsouthpwp.net/e/d/edwin907/SBRNF.jpg
http://bellsouthpwp.net/e/d/edwin907/026.jpg
I don't shoot my cans on my assault rifles as much as I thought I would.
The only time I really use them is for prairie dog hunting when I am lying in sandy soil and shooting into the wind so I don't get a bunch of dirt blown back at me from the muzzle blast and wind. It also reduces recoil so I can spot my own hits through my scope.
I use them on my assault rifles when taking some newbie out for the "cool factor" but other than that I don't use them just to use them and wear them out.
The only time I really see a use for them is prone sniping like above or masking your position at night in a gunbattle.
Putting aside issues of cost and the time and effort to acquire a tax stamp, the new Surefire micro/mini suppressors that just debuted may add another wrinkle to the added weight/length debate. Obviously you're not going to get the sound reduction performance of larger suppressors, but do you get enough to enjoy some of the benefits (reducing the blast and noise of a SBR in tight confines) without too many of the penalties (length and weight)? These apparently add only 3.6 and 2.6 inches to the weapon length and 14 and 12 ounces in weight respectively. I'll be interested to see some more information on these.
http://militarytimes.com/blogs/gearscout/files/2009/10/Surefire-Shorty-and-Micro1-500x346.jpg
This discussion is enlightening... The closest I'll ever get to an SBR in this state is a 14.5 with a pinned FS... And I can buy a can, if I want to stare at it all day!
That being said... I just really want an SBR, and a can would just be the gravy, for me.
I'm not military/LEO, so using my carbine indoors, while a remote possibility, is not a huge concern. If I do (in a range/training situation) I'll have ears on anyway. If it were a Fight situation, I would probably give two shits less about my hearing than my life.
I have tinnitus as it stands (wearing radio earpieces all day long where volume fluctuates to unsafe levels, and then walking through heavy machinery areas... not fun for the ol' eardrums) anyway, so... I don't know. I see everyone's point.
talking home defense
the main reason for a can on my rifle would be for my 10 month old and 5 year old so their hearing might not be damaged in a scary chance they might be in the same room with me ?
...I've fired my 14.5 once in anger with no ear pro. Not the same as an 11.5, but I didn't hardly hear a thing.
you mean you didn't hear a thing when you shot it, or afterward?
I'm interested in the concept of auditory exclusion as I had something similar happen to me. I had an ND with an AR in my workshop without ear pro and had almost no concept of a loud noise and my ears weren't ringing afterward. very strange...
another time I was hunting deer with a handgun and fired my 4" .357 magnum twice w/o ear pro and I couldn't hear for a couple of hours and my ears were ringing for the rest of the day.
anyway, I don't want to hijack the thread, I was just looking for clarification of your statement...
I don't shoot my cans on my assault rifles as much as I thought I would.
The only time I really use them is for prairie dog hunting when I am lying in sandy soil and shooting into the wind so I don't get a bunch of dirt blown back at me from the muzzle blast and wind. It also reduces recoil so I can spot my own hits through my scope.
I use them on my assault rifles when taking some newbie out for the "cool factor" but other than that I don't use them just to use them and wear them out.
The only time I really see a use for them is prone sniping like above or masking your position at night in a gunbattle.
hey Scotty, what's an assault rifle? sounds to me like you were either hunting or using a "sporting" rifle, eh?
:D
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