Rented a S&W M&P9c, returned in 5 minutes... [Archive]

CaptainDooley

10-04-09, 10:25

I went to my local range, looking to rent an M&P9. For some reason it wasn't available (out for repair or something), so I rented the compact instead. I returned it within 5 minutes due to the following problem. Basically every round that was loaded via firing (versus hand loading/cycling) would fail to feed correctly and the slide would not fully return to battery. I was shooting whatever 9mm FMJ they make you shoot with their rentals. After about 5 shots, I stripped the mag to clear the stuck round and as I did the slide slammed home on the live round and the weapon would not fire, nor would the slide move at all. I promptly returned it and asked for my money back. So much for trying out a gun I was looking at buying...

Anyone have any idea what would cause this. I'm sure it's likely just crappy gunshop maintenance, but thought I'd see if this was a common or easy-to-fix problem.

RogerinTPA

10-04-09, 11:00

Unfortunately, range rentals never receive the TLC that a personal weapon would. Ask them to lube it next time. Mag springs could be worn as well. The pistols they have for rent, rarely or if ever, get lube. Most of the rental ARs (full auto's and semi's) in my range are total disasters, needing to replace gas rings, buffers, gas keys, etc... No preventive maintenance of any kind. When a weapon catastrophically fails, it's off to the Smith.:rolleyes:

maximus83

10-04-09, 12:59

wicked_police

10-04-09, 15:43

Myself and another guy from work put about 150 or so rounds though a 9mm M&Pc last week(using 147gr Winchester Super Unleaded).

It worked perfectly. Only issue was it shooting a bit high from 25m. For 'combat' distances, it was fine.

I'm going to be running it, and a few more, for some testing over the next few months.

But for the limited time I have with the gun, it's an awesome little unit.

RogerinTPA

10-04-09, 16:26

Sorry to hear you had that problem. Like the other poster suggested, I'd attribute that more to range maintenance (or the lack of it)--or to abuse by customers--than to the make/model of the pistol.

I have an M&P9c which, although it did experience the initial "teething" issue that some M&P's had (broken striker assembly due to dry firing), is running like a champ now. That thing is a soft shooter for as tiny as it is, it soaks up recoil in my hands better than a G-19, and is as accurate as my full-sized M&P9. My 9c is a keeper!

Had the same issue with my M&P45, dry firing without snap caps, as it was clearly stated not to do in the operators manual. I wouldn't call it teething issues, more like failure to follow/read instructions. My M&P9c only gets cleaned ever 2000-3000 rounds, if that, just lube. It's one of the most accurate pistols I own and can use my M&P9 17 round Mags in a pinch.

LanceOregon

10-05-09, 05:02

You should have taken this up with the range.

If I had been in your shoes, I would have done a quick breakdown of the gun, and taken a look inside. You can disassemble a M&P real quick. I can take either of mine apart faster than I can my Glock.

--

CaptainDooley

10-05-09, 07:13

I did take it up with the range... When the slide wouldn't move at all I took it back to them, told them what was wrong with it and asked for my money back because I didn't want to rent a gun other than the M&P and I didn't want to pay another $10 for their range ammo in .40 that they would have made me buy if I'd traded up to another caliber.

It wasn't my gun, I wasn't about to go banging on it. I was just wondering if this was typical gun shop maintenance, which is what I thought it was, or a problem that people had seen with the weapon.

John_Wayne777

10-05-09, 07:53

Rental guns, in my limited experience with them, are not maintained well. My local range only has .38 and .22 revolvers that they rent...and those are never cleaned.

Dave Berryhill

10-05-09, 08:25

Not to mention that the ammo that some ranges make you buy is poor quality reloads.

CaptainDooley

10-05-09, 12:18

Yeah, what they made me buy wasn't in a box, just a plastic tray... So I'm guessing that was probably part of the equation as well. It's stupid - they make me pay double what WWB costs and give me crap ammo...

TY44934

10-06-09, 11:53

I can confirm that some ranges do not clean their rental guns until they stop running entirely - because I used to work at an indoor range (Shooters Paradise in Woodbridge; it closed in 2007 after a fire).

I can also confirm that we sold commercially reloaded ammo, AND we sold all the spent casings right back to the commercial reloader. Cases were reloaded over and over again. 10 times? 20 times? 50 times-reloaded on one case? Only God knows.

Point is, the ammo was reloaded with drastically reduced charges of powder since there was no way of telling how many times each cartridge case had been through a chamber.

If you want to evaluate a gun by renting it, then please insist that they first clean it, then lube it properly, and then buy factory NEW ammunition to test fire it.

Yeah, what they made me buy wasn't in a box, just a plastic tray... So I'm guessing that was probably part of the equation as well. It's stupid - they make me pay double what WWB costs and give me crap ammo...

Latimer Jones

10-07-09, 07:12

Had the same issue with my M&P45, dry firing without snap caps, as it was clearly stated not to do in the operators manual. I wouldn't call it teething issues, more like failure to follow/read instructions. My M&P9c only gets cleaned ever 2000-3000 rounds, if that, just lube. It's one of the most accurate pistols I own and can use my M&P9 17 round Mags in a pinch.

Was the dry firing without snap caps only for the M&P 45 or other models? I just looked at the manual for my M&P 9 and didn't find it. I also don't remember reading it when I first read the manual, what page is it on? I went to S&W's website and the only handguns they say not to dry fire were the .22 rim fire guns. I didn't see any mention of not dry firing the M&P in the FAQ area on the website. I'll admit that dry fire with snap caps is going to be easier on a gun no matter what the manual says, but if this is a new update on maintenance and care I would like to know? Thanks, LJ

RogerinTPA

10-07-09, 14:59

Was the dry firing without snap caps only for the M&P 45 or other models? I just looked at the manual for my M&P 9 and didn't find it. I also don't remember reading it when I first read the manual, what page is it on? I went to S&W's website and the only handguns they say not to dry fire were the .22 rim fire guns. I didn't see any mention of not dry firing the M&P in the FAQ area on the website. I'll admit that dry fire with snap caps is going to be easier on a gun no matter what the manual says, but if this is a new update on maintenance and care I would like to know? Thanks, LJ

I don't have access to a manual right now, but it is not a good idea to dry fire excessively with the M&P ( based on my personnel experience) or any pistol for that matter. You'll only end up breaking the striker assembly. You'll save time, money, and not have a broken, unusable weapon, if you use snap caps.

HD1911

10-07-09, 20:46

RogerinTPA

10-07-09, 21:08

Oddly enough....my Brand New M&P .40 was also Failing to Load as you mentioned. Out of the 150 rounds of Federal FMJ's fired, the gun choked on about 12 of them.

With that being said, a simple phone call to S&W Customer Service yielded my M&P a paid over night flight so that they can fix it immediately and return it to my house ASAP.

We will see how it goes, as I'm quite confident in S&W to fix the problem.

S&Ws customer service is probably the best in the industry, beside BCM and Magpul.

My M&P40 locked up several times, with the empty shell still loaded within the first 100 rounds or so. I had to use an alternate technique, racking from the grip, instead of using the slide, to free it up. I had a pistol class coming up the following week and couldn't get it turned around in time, so I lubed the crap out of it and put an additional 200 rounds down range the day before the class, problem free. I was concerned whether it could hold up to the 500 round class, but it held up well. Then I took it to a LAV class. So I lucked out in not having to return it.

HD1911

10-07-09, 21:17

S&Ws customer service is probably the best in the industry, beside BCM and Magpul.

My M&P40 locked up several times, with the empty shell still loaded within the first 100 rounds or so. I had to use an alternate technique, racking from the grip, instead of using the slide, to free it up. I had a pistol class coming up the following week and couldn't get it turned around in time, so I lubed the crap out of it and put an additional 200 rounds down range the day before the class, problem free. I was concerned whether it could hold up to the 500 round class, but it held up well. Then I took it to a LAV class. So I lucked out in not having to return it.

So you would say, that it just needed to "break-in"?

They did mention something about possibly needing to polish my feed ramp...it gave me the feeling that they've had to do that before.

TMMT

10-07-09, 21:27

For 'combat' distances, it was fine.

What exactly are combat distances... :confused:

RogerinTPA

10-07-09, 21:28

So you would say, that it just needed to "break-in"?

They did mention something about possibly needing to polish my feed ramp...it gave me the feeling that they've had to do that before.

I would say it was a break in issue, and a foolish one on my part for shooting it at the range/gunstore the very instant I bought it without lube. My other M&Ps never had this problem, but I did clean them and lube them very well before shooting them first. Guess the excitement of shooting a new toy got the better of me.:p

RogerinTPA

10-07-09, 21:35

Was the dry firing without snap caps only for the M&P 45 or other models? I just looked at the manual for my M&P 9 and didn't find it. I also don't remember reading it when I first read the manual, what page is it on? I went to S&W's website and the only handguns they say not to dry fire were the .22 rim fire guns. I didn't see any mention of not dry firing the M&P in the FAQ area on the website. I'll admit that dry fire with snap caps is going to be easier on a gun no matter what the manual says, but if this is a new update on maintenance and care I would like to know? Thanks, LJ

Having read through 2 manuals, one for the 40 and the 9, it appears you are correct. They both don't mention anything about dry firing or the use of snap caps. S&W did have problems with their striker assemblies on their earlier models with folks breaking them while dry firing, and introduced a more robust one in later models. Curious, I'll have to find my 45 manual and check it again.

HD1911

10-07-09, 21:35

I would say it was a break in issue, and a foolish one on my part for shooting it at the range/gunstore the very instant I bought it without lube. My other M&Ps never had this problem, but I did clean them and lube them very well before shooting them first. Guess the excitement of shooting a new toy got the better of me.:p

It happens :D

Latimer Jones

10-13-09, 20:53

Having read through 2 manuals, one for the 40 and the 9, it appears you are correct. They both don't mention anything about dry firing or the use of snap caps. S&W did have problems with their striker assemblies on their earlier models with folks breaking them while dry firing, and introduced a more robust one in later models. Curious, I'll have to find my 45 manual and check it again.

Thanks for checking on the info.

LJ