View Full Version : Prosecutors consider charging 15-year-old girl in slaying of sexual assault suspect
Ben Lenett
10-06-09, 20:42
Absolutely horrible what happened to her, but...she broke the law. That is not justifiable deadly physical force. Revenge doesn't work in the legal system......
well again this seams to be half the story, no mention was made of what they were doing where he was killed, why they were there, she could have taken his gun he was going to murder her with.
Ben Lenett
10-06-09, 21:10
I agree but based on past experience...I'm putting my money on revenge anbd not self defense.
Heavy Metal
10-06-09, 21:19
Yep, she broke the law but there is zero chance the prosecutor can find a jury that would convict her.
I might not agree but I certainly understand why she did it. Not gonna lose any sleep over it.
Defense attorney Ann P. Kaufman said there are images of other girls as well, some of whom may also be potential victims.
Kaufman said Hazard’s computer also contained a video of him giving pills to her client as well as a 23-page confession and a timeline in the case.
These 2 things stick out to me from that article. However, without knowing hard facts it's hard to determine exactly what transpired. If molestation, rape, etc. is proven than against the law or not I feel it's completely justified. If it were my child it would've been much worse for the guy...
Having a hard time caring that she killed the guy who did those things to her, I really am....
Ben does make a decent point, but I'd still be tempted to just "let it go", revenge or not.
MisterWilson
10-06-09, 22:15
Absolutely horrible what happened to her, but...she broke the law. That is not justifiable deadly physical force. Revenge doesn't work in the legal system......
This is an instance in which what is moral doesn't run parallel to what's legal, in which case I can't help but side with morality.
In trying to formulate a decent response to your statement, I ended up looking into "the purpose of law", in which I found this quote:
Many people think the purpose of law is to promote justice. According to Bastiat, the purpose of law is to prevent injustice.
Just some food for thought...
Gutshot John
10-06-09, 22:59
This one isn't going anywhere near a trial. The DA sounds less than enthusiastic.
Plea bargain, juvenile manslaughter, 6 months parole - suspended sentence, record expunged at 18.
Justice is served.
I did a little reading on what happened and it isn't pretty. In a nutshell, somehow victim out on bond and indicted suspect ended up in the same park, suspect ends up dead, victim leaves the scene and does no reporting. Police put two and two together and ID the victim as the shooter and take case to DA. DA has an oh shit moment and realizes that all though he probably has an airtight murder one case, it has no jury appeal. what to do? Take it to the Grand Jury? Not file? Not filing is a problem for DAs. Not filing on a case always has a way of coming back and biting one in the butt. Think about the next similar case, "How can you file on my client when you didn't on client X"; defense attorneys have a field day with stuff like that and it can undermine every succeeding case out of the DA's Office. You have to remember, DAs are political animals. They didn't get the job they have on accident and are always looking at the next rung up. A case like this doesn't help those aspirations. I think GJ is right on the money, I think a plea deal will come out of this to be followed by an expungement in a few years. Legally, for the system's sake, although what happened to this girl is beyond heinous, she can not take retribution on her own, a just solution will be found.
usaffarmer
10-07-09, 01:12
When ever I get jury duty, I wish I could get a case like this. I would put her on probation for a while (at least 18) and councseling. As for murder charges, hell no. No way.
I do understand 2 wrongs dont make a right, I have 3 girls, let someone touch my kid. All I can say is City, State and Federal Police better catch that person first or they will NEVER find anything.
Nathan_Bell
10-07-09, 07:56
This one isn't going anywhere near a trial. The DA sounds less than enthusiastic.
Plea bargain, juvenile manslaughter, 6 months parole - suspended sentence, record expunged at 18.
Justice is served.
Yup, as kmrtnsn posted the DA has to put this to the GJ, if he no bills he will destroy his ability to enforce the law.
That said he also knows that most folks, at least in the back of their minds, are saying good for her for taking out the trash.
So offering her a plea like GSJ posits makes the most sense for the DA; for political reasons and for him to retain his ability to enforce the laws.
Unpossible. She's only 15. She can't have a gun, it's against the law. Didn't happen.
Seriously, this sounds like misdemeanor murder. Court ordered counseling and have a nice day.
Age is not a factor anymore when the DA can charge a minor as an adult because they did a crime that an adult can do. I think they could try her a million times and someone on the jury would always hang it.
Having a hard time caring that she killed the guy who did those things to her, I really am....
Ben does make a decent point, but I'd still be tempted to just "let it go", revenge or not.
I tend to agree....I'll lift my glass to see the gal get a slap on the wrist and a dirtbag that doesn't get a lifetime of tax dollars to house and feed & mostly no more attacks on kids.
Hoping for good ending. The whole deal is just sad.:(
Only good part is they seem to have this scum nailed down as dirty & he's gone. Having a little girl myself, I'm glad he's 6 feet under.
John_Wayne777
10-07-09, 09:38
Do we know how she came upon the guy in the park? Do we know exactly what transpired in the park?
Given that he'd sexually assaulted her in the past if she happened upon him by chance I think a reasonable case for self defense could be made.
Do we know how she came upon the guy in the park? Do we know exactly what transpired in the park?
Given that he'd sexually assaulted her in the past if she happened upon him by chance I think a reasonable case for self defense could be made.
We'd have to see the unstated facts, but sometimes the best defense is a good offense
MisterWilson
10-07-09, 11:33
Do we know how she came upon the guy in the park? Do we know exactly what transpired in the park?
Given that he'd sexually assaulted her in the past if she happened upon him by chance I think a reasonable case for self defense could be made.
Would it matter? Would premeditated murder in this instance be any less just?
Would it matter? Would premeditated murder in this instance be any less just?
I hear ya amigo....but yeah, I think it would matter only on how this gal gets treated in the eyes of the law.
In regards to the perp, outcome was fine by most I would imagine.
CarlosDJackal
10-07-09, 12:19
Absolutely horrible what happened to her, but...she broke the law. That is not justifiable deadly physical force. Revenge doesn't work in the legal system......
I think I missed something. Could you please point out where it says that the 15-yo victim did this as an act of revenge? I can't seem to find any such details of how the shooting occurred. :confused:
geminidglocker
10-18-09, 17:51
Sure it was against the law, but I commend her. Well done. I am a huge fan of vengeance killings. After all, I joined the Army after 9-11-01 just to get revenge. If they decide to prosecute her than so be it, I don't know her. I hope she gets a medal instead.
This one isn't going anywhere near a trial. The DA sounds less than enthusiastic.
Plea bargain, juvenile manslaughter, 6 months parole - suspended sentence, record expunged at 18.
Justice is served.
I would be surprised to find that a serious violent felony like manslaughter would be so easily expunged. I know some states still have juvenile justice systems this liberal, but many do not.
This would seem to be the kind of case where the system should be looking for a reason to let her walk on some technicality, but I can't say I have much faith in the justice system.
Good for her! I hope the scum bag rotts in hell.I dont think she should plea bargan, as I dont think a jury around would convict her. Does she have a defence fund? I would contribute.
Good for her! I hope the scum bag rotts in hell.I dont think she should plea bargan, as I dont think a jury around would convict her. Does she have a defence fund? I would contribute.
Since we don't have all the facts its hard to make a call. Biggest question is how she got the gun? Still say slap her on the wrist if she went home, got the gun and then shot him? If we start convicting a person well before they have their day in court it can very well serve to undermine our own justice system.
I am not condoning the what the guy did, but its not our job to decide if this was a case of self-defense or murder. The only people who would be qualified would be the jury empaneled and who got to see and hear ALL of the facts and evidence of what happened.
Well if we look at pedophile cases it appears that death is the only thing that cures it. So...case closed.
I agree. However, there are some things I would gladly go to jail for. Harming someone who molested my daughter would be up near the top of that list.
On the other hand, not condoning or even attempting to cast a positive light on the man at all, however, the age of sexual awareness is somewhere near 6 years old now in my estimation.... going on my personal experience. We just had a 6 year old boy admit to having anal and oral sex with his 4 year old cousin.
There is innocent childhood curiosity and then there's.... that.
I've seen 13 year old girls that I swore were 20 put men behind bars because they lied about their age.
Yup, the perverts of the left have succeeded in sexualizing children to an alarming extent. Homosexuals have been working to make pederasty legally/morally acceptable for decades. I predict that within my lifetime child rape will become a non-crime. Shortly after that there will be "hate crime" legislation specifically protecting child rapists from intolerant middle Americans.
That said, if it really was a revenge killing she should be held accountable. Though I can certainly understand the impulse to enact justice when the system clearly won't......
geminidglocker
10-19-09, 18:23
Yup, the perverts of the left have succeeded in sexualizing children to an alarming extent. Homosexuals have been working to make pederasty legally/morally acceptable for decades. I predict that within my lifetime child rape will become a non-crime. Shortly after that there will be "hate crime" legislation specifically protecting child rapists from intolerant middle Americans.
That said, if it really was a revenge killing she should be held accountable. Though I can certainly understand the impulse to enact justice when the system clearly won't......
Exactly, have you heard about that show Toddlers and Tiaras, WTF!!! If she had molested her attacker, she would probably get a lighter sentence than she will for doing the right thing and simply offing him so that no one else has to suffer the way only she knows she did. In these circumstances the victim should have the right to be Judge, Jury and Executioner. I'll donate to her defense fund. I don't care about the facts or legality, she did the world a favor, and saved our tax dollars that would have been spent to put this guy in jail.
FromMyColdDeadHand
10-19-09, 22:32
Surprised no one has mentioned it yet. Fifteen year old girl got the drop on grown man and put him down hard. Even if she did ambush him, kudos to her for taking out the trash with authority.
Hope her one set of nightmares wasn't replaced by a new set.
Beats convicting the guy and him getting out in a decade or so and doing it all again.
Just to play devils advocate, how do we really know what happened? For all we know, she could have decided to get involved with the guy, her parents found and and instead of getting in trouble with them, cried rape and when the chance to shut the guy up for good came along, she took it. Equally plausible scenario based on the info presented in the story.
Submariner
10-20-09, 08:21
... but its not our job to decide if this was a case of self-defense or murder. The only people who would be qualified would be the jury empaneled and who got to see and hear ALL of the facts and evidence of what happened.
Jury? We don't need no stinkin' jury. THIS IS THE INTERNET!
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.