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Tokarev
10-26-09, 12:23
There's an Internet rumor going around that the HK416 can slamfire during the clearance of a stovepipe malfunction.

From what I'm told, the shooter pulls the trigger in an attempt to fire the weapon. This puts the hammer is in a partially released state during the stovepipe. If the casing is pulled from the ejection port, the bolt jumps forward ahead of the hammer. The hammer then has enough inertia to strike the firing pin with enough force to fire a round.

Anybody else heard or seen anything on this?
MarkG
10-26-09, 12:39
Something in your description isn't making sense. The 416 is an "AR-15" type platform from a FCG standpoint. The issue you are describing would be repeatable in an any AR platform. The term "slamfire" is a misnomer when used in the context of your post. Unless your FCG was malfunctioning also, I don't think what are trying describe can happen.
Tokarev
10-26-09, 12:40
Something in your description isn't making sense. The 416 is an "AR-15" type platform from a FCG standpoint. The issue you are describing would be repeatable in an any AR platform. The term "slamfire" is a misnomer when used in the context of your post. Unless your FCG was malfunctioning also, I don't think what are trying describe can happen.

I'm just passing on what I heard. I agree that this shouldn't happen unless there is some type of malfunction in the trigger group.
G-lock
10-26-09, 13:57
I believe 416's also have spring loaded FP's, this should prevent slamfires. Jeff
Ed L.
10-26-09, 21:08
All the modern 416s have the spring loaded firing pins. I believe the very first ones did not have them then they recognized that this caused slamfire problems with some ammo. The HK416 uses a heavy firing pin that could be used to nail someone to a wall.

I will post a picture of my gun's bolt when I get a chance in a few hours.
JohnWilliamson062
10-27-09, 09:48
then they recognized that this caused slamfire problems
Isn't this a well known problem with FPs? It seems they should have been aware of not having a spring causing the problem since it is at least a 50 year old problem.
John_Wayne777
10-27-09, 10:16
Last I knew, (and I'm no expert) 416 bolt carriers included a firing pin safety specifically to prevent slam fires.

Edit: Pic of the FP safety courtesy of KevinB

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v193/EvilKev/2009-10-21011.jpg

If someone has an older carrier that does not include the FP safety a slam fire is not improbably...as I have heard genuine experts on the platform say that the FP safety was added after slam fire issues came up. I don't know how many of the older carriers were made without the safety, but every 416 I've seen (and there haven't been many) have had the safety.
Frens
10-27-09, 11:21
I'm sorry I'm a 416-noob...
why would the 416 need that FS safety (there's already a FP spring right?)? is the FP heavier than a standard M16 FP?
.
please school me :confused:
Ed L.
10-27-09, 23:24
I ran a quick picture of a standard AR firing pin below a 416 one. As you can see, the 416 firing pin is considerably heavier, so I could see it being an issue with slamfiring commercial primers.

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i232/eds-stuff/416vsARfiringpins.jpg

I know that very early in the program they made the conversion to the bolt and firing pin, but not sure when. I know mine is a 2005 version of the upper and it came with the firing pin safety and spring.

I have not had a problem detonating any rounds with mine, including hard military primers like Radway Green. This stuff is very hard to detonate and I keep a small stash of it to test gun functioning i terms of detonating hard primers.

I encountered a similar problem with the FN FS2000. As it originally came, it sometimes produced some slamfires with certain brands of commercial ammo. FN's response, IMHO, was overkill--they lightened the commerial firing pins and added a captive spring. The end result was a gun that would fail to reliably detonate some military ammo because of the harder primers. In order to get mine to function with milsurp ammo I removed the captive spring, and it has detonated 100% of the milsurp ammo I have fired through it since. In this case we are talking about several thousand rounds.
Frens
10-28-09, 02:19
looking at my brass seems like the standard M16 FP is pretty hard on primers...was a heavier FP really necessary? :confused:
Ed L.
10-28-09, 05:42
I could speculate on reasons for a heavier firing pin for the 416, but I really don't know.

I am an HK416 owner, not an HK engineer. (I am not sure whether to follow that line with a smiley icon or a frowning one)
Tokarev
11-01-09, 08:28
A friend on another board directed me to this thread:

http://www.socnet.com/showthread.php?t=89919