View Full Version : Who has fired 20K rounds or more through a single pistol?
We always say that very few people are ever going to fire this round count in their lifetime but it is not so impossible. Let’s say that you fire 200 rounds each month, in ten years that’s more than 20 thousand rounds!
My question here is: Has anyone of you put 20K through a single pistol and if the answer is yes then what parts have you replaced?
Wayne Dobbs
11-04-09, 13:22
I fired 65K through one Second Generation Glock 17 over a 13 year time frame. It was my teaching/training class gun. I replaced the recoil springs, trigger return springs, locking block and trigger pin as far as small parts. The slide cracked at 55K and Glock replaced that for no charge. The locking block and trigger pins were replaced due to breakage (at very high round counts) and the springs were replaced as a PM measure.
The gun had a total of THREE malfunctions in its service life and all of those involved reloaded ammo. It never had a factory round malfunction.
I currently have another G-17 (a Third Generation OD frame) that has 17,318 rounds through it in a three year, five month period. The only parts that have been replaced have been the recoil spring and trigger return springs, again on a PM basis. It's had two stoppages from underloaded reloaded ammo.
Yes, at least two STI 2011 pistols. One is probably around 40K, other 15K-ish. Only thing I ever replace were recoil and firing pin springs. I have many friends with STI pistols with well over 100,000 rounds, some likely around 500K. The latter have been through a couple barrels and at least on the second slide, maybe third.
SWATcop556
11-04-09, 14:28
I have a Gen 3 G19 with about 22k through it. I don't have the exact round count though. All I have replaced is a few recoil and trigger springs and that's just for my own peace of mind.
One malfunction to date and it was shooting reaction hand only while laying across a vehicle front seat. I wussed and had a dreaded "limp-wrist" malfunction. I love that pistol. One of my 3 G19's. That one has the highest round count of the three.
I have a GenII Glock 19 with a little over 23k rounds through it. I replaced the recoil spring at 15k just because. I kept it as a back up. I recently put an NY1 trigger and a 3.5# connector in it but they weren't replacing broken parts. It shows very little sign of wear anywhere. Never had an issue with it. A few ammo related stoppages and a bad magazine I use to intentionally cause FTFs, but that's it...
I have a Glock G35 with 40K+ rounds (didn't keep count 1st yr) through it. I had one Glock OEM part break - Glock Slide Lock Spring
I also have a Gen II G19 with 23,000 rds. Nothing ever needed replacing. However, I would take it to GSSF matches each year and the Glock armorers would replace many of the small parts for free.
I would also replace the recoil springs on both pistols at regular intervals.
I have one pistol that is far far beyond that number. 1 other pistol nearing that mark and one about half way there.
So far this week, between yesterday and today, my highest round count pistol racked up another 750 rounds. And its only Wednesday. Actually I am done shooting for the week, I think. :)
2 1/2 weeks straight of giving classes and I am ready for a break from the range for a few days.
Yes 2, #1 Colt 1991 30,000 rds, replaced the Recoil, mainspring,firing pin springs, Hammer, Sear, disconnector. Sold it and it is still running strong. #2 Kimber custom target 2 Springs every 3,000 rds had it hard chromed at the 10,000 round mark by Tripp Research nothing ever broke traded it for a STI Trojan in .38 Super.
I had a early G34 with over 100,000 thru it before the slide cracked. Glock replaced it free. I have a G17 with over 40000 thru it and a couple of 1911's with over 50000. Have a Browning HP with over 60000 thru it but had to replace the barrel and a cracked slide. I had a S&W 41 that i fired over 150000 round thru it before I sold it. It is still running fine. I have been shooting hand guns for over 43 years and have worn some out some but most keep shooting with proper care and maintenance. Revolvers a rethe hardest to keep shooting especially magnums.
The Dumb Gun Collector
11-04-09, 21:19
I have shot well north of 40k through my oldest pistol, a P7M8. I have shot well north of 20k through my G17.
I don't have my Beretta data at hand. SIG, Smith, and HK:
SIG P220ST (Nov'02 to Sep'03): 24,193
at 18,787 the takedown lever broke, disabling the gun; replaced
SIG P226R 9mm (Feb'03 to Sep'04): 36,783
no broken parts
SIG P229R 357 (Oct'05 to Feb'06): 19,319 ... close enough?
at 13,783 the takedown lever failed and needed to be replaced
at 13,863 the extractor broke, disabling the gun; replaced
SIG P226R-NAVY (Aug'06 to Mar'07): 29,446
at 28,188 the extractor broke, disabling the gun; replaced
at 29,158 began getting hammer follow; deadlined gun
S&W M&P9 (Sep'07 to Feb'09 primarily): 31,165
at 12,432 the mag catch was replaced due to mags dropping in recoil
at 21,690 discovered the slide was cracked; gun still ran fine; replaced
at 26,087 second mag catch was replaced due to mags dropping in recoil
S&W M&P9 (Apr'08 to Apr'09): 66,217
at 32,427 the trigger spring broke; replaced
at 43,361 the right wing of the takedown lever broke; no effect on gun; replaced
at 62,333 discovered the slide was cracked; gun still ran fine; replaced
HK P30 (May'09 to present): 53,482
at ~19,250 the trigger spring broke; replaced
at 36,059 the sear spring broke; gun continued to work in traditional DAO mode; replaced
at 50,002 discovered the firing pin spring was broken; gun was working 100% but primer indents were shallow; replaced
Jason Burton
11-04-09, 23:16
This probably won’t come as a big shock to anyone but all of high mileage pistols are 1911. Only one has more than 20,000 rounds through it but, just for grins, I’ll post info on one other as some may find it useful.
1911 #1 - 50,000 +/- rounds all standard velocity 230gr FMJ... it might be a bit more or less but I stopped counting after about 48,000 so I no longer have an accurate mark. I replaced the recoil spring plug at about 2500 rounds when I noticed the open end starting to deform, the gun never stopped or hiccupped the plug just didn‘t look like it was going to last. At about 7500 rounds the main spring housing pin broke in half, the gun still worked but it was replaced immediately. At just over 40,000 the head of the firing pin began to deform and prevent it from coming completely through the firing pin stop, it never stopped the gun from firing but it was replaced.
1911 #2 - 15,010 rounds all standard velocity 230gr FMJ. The firing pin stop cracked at 12,850 rounds, the gun still worked but the part was replaced. This gun is half of a matched pair and its “twin”, which only has about 11,000 rounds through it, had the firing pin stop crack at just over 5000 rounds.
I had about 47k through my Walther P99 before the fire control assembly broke last summer.
Back in the day when I got ammo cheep where I worked and spent about 3 to 4 months of the year on the range, I managed to put in excess of 25K through my issued Smith 5906. Shot a lot of USPSA at the time as well.
Parts breakage included trigger play spring (2 or 3 times), gun still runs trigger just "floops" forward when in single action. Ejector spring broke, gun still ran, mag disconnect just didn't work. I believe I replaced the extractor once as well. Recoil springs and firing pin springs were replaced on a PM schedule.
I have a 9mm M&P well on the way to 20k as well. 14k right now with recoil spring and trigger spring replaced (PM).
Don't have anywhere near that on my 1911s. 45 ammo is EXPENSIVE!
RetreatHell
11-04-09, 23:57
Okay, dumb question time:
What is the easiest, quickest and most efficient way to keep an accurate round count on a particular firearm?
If you take multiple firearms to the range to get some training in, and you're constantly reloading and bullshitting with your buddies and the pace is pretty fast, how do you guys make sure to keep track of round counts for one or two (or five) guns when you're out training for the day?
With my carbines, if I have preloaded all my mags to 28 rounds, then I simply make a pile of empty mags on the deck next to the carbine that went through all those mags. But it doesn't always work out that easy.
And with handguns it's impossible to do it that way because I only have 6 mags for my Glock 19, and my Glock 26 shares the same 6 mags as well.
I know it's kind of a dumb ass question here guys, but I'm sure there's an easier way to go about it that doesn't give me a headache when I try and think back to how many mags I went through with which gun.
Semper Fi,
Paul
The Dumb Gun Collector
11-05-09, 00:16
I don't think there is one. During my "Break my P2000/Hk45 days" I was pretty scrupulous about separating my ammo, usually by only brining one gun of the caliber, etc. Since I was keeping up with the threads/blogs I was very careful. It ended up being a lot of work.
Precision Rifles is pretty easy for me as I keep very good records (dope book) on the ones I shoot or own.
For personally owned handguns, I only have a good count for 2 of them. Some have what I would consider reasonable estimates, while others I have no clue.
I also keep reasonably accurate round count / records for 75 Carbines, 12 bolt rifles, 75 pistols, 25 shotguns, 25 subguns, which I try to keep on a regular maintenance schedule. I would say that I am probably within +/- 5% or so.
I am not as particular about a true round count of the pistols and our M4A1's, but I can keep a pretty close guesstimate based on weekly averages. I do the ammo requests / ammo management for my particular unit and I know what ammo goes where within the division, so I can come pretty close to knowing my own use, as well as divisional use.
SWATcop556
11-05-09, 01:04
Greg is right it is a huge pain in the ass. I usually take a certain amount of ammo to a class or training session, for example I ran a two-man team tactics class over two days and took 500 rounds. After teaching and shooting I had 50 rounds left. I just round my counts off to the nearest 50 or 100 rounds.
I try to keep a decently accurate round count but it's not down to the exact round.
Okay, dumb question time:
Dumb answer: You can't get there from here.
I rarely bring multiple guns to the range. If I do, I either shoot one at a time (keeping track) and/or I set aside one box of ammo at a time per pistol. Having paper and pen as part of your range kit helps a lot...
The simple reality is that if you want to keep a serious log for your guns, you need to be serious about it.
My first 5906 went well over 50,000 rounds, swapped recoil springs as needed, had to replace the extractor spring once due to getting extractor bounce stoppages.
The steel frame S&Ws are very solid guns.
I've got over 10,000 rounds through my duty G17 in the past three years.
Robb Jensen
11-05-09, 05:01
We always say that very few people are ever going to fire this round count in their lifetime but it is not so impossible. Let’s say that you fire 200 rounds each month, in ten years that’s more than 20 thousand rounds!
My question here is: Has anyone of you put 20K through a single pistol and if the answer is yes then what parts have you replaced?
One custom built ST1 2011, one M&P, two Glock 17s, two Glock 19s, one Beretta 92G Elite, one Ruger 22/45 MkII.
STI 2011: three adjustable rear sights, 1 AFTEC extractor (4 AFTEC springs), 1 bbl link and pin, 1 complete C&S fire control set after it started doubling, 12 recoil springs, 2 slide stops
Glocks (combined): several recoil springs, locking blocks, trigger housing/locking block/ trigger pins, firing pin safety springs, striker springs, extractors, takedown levers and springs.
M&P: recoils springs every 5K, strikers when they break (now I'm replacing them every 7.5K rounds as PM), mag catches every 5K rounds.
Beretta: recoil springs, trigger bar springs, trigger springs, locking block.
Ruger 22/45: Extractor with a Volquartsen Exact Edge, 6 recoil springs, 1 firing pin spring, 1 hammer pivot pin (just this week). Total round count is 25200 rounds.
Okay, dumb question time:
What is the easiest, quickest and most efficient way to keep an accurate round count on a particular firearm?
If you take multiple firearms to the range to get some training in, and you're constantly reloading and bullshitting with your buddies and the pace is pretty fast, how do you guys make sure to keep track of round counts for one or two (or five) guns when you're out training for the day?
With my carbines, if I have preloaded all my mags to 28 rounds, then I simply make a pile of empty mags on the deck next to the carbine that went through all those mags. But it doesn't always work out that easy.
And with handguns it's impossible to do it that way because I only have 6 mags for my Glock 19, and my Glock 26 shares the same 6 mags as well.
I know it's kind of a dumb ass question here guys, but I'm sure there's an easier way to go about it that doesn't give me a headache when I try and think back to how many mags I went through with which gun.
Semper Fi,
Paul
Paul,
I rarely take more than one handgun to the range at a time these days and if I do it's usually because I'm carrying my CCW but that stays in the holster. Usually. From there I make sure I have my ammo separated and if possible in boxes. Having a small notebook and pen in your range bag helps too.
Once I get home I have a speadsheet that I keep for all my guns, ARs & AKs included. That way I can track changes and know when to perform maintenance. I can send you the template of my spreadsheet if you're interested.
Dumb answer: You can't get there from here.
I rarely bring multiple guns to the range. If I do, I either shoot one at a time (keeping track) and/or I set aside one box of ammo at a time per pistol. Having paper and pen as part of your range kit helps a lot...
The simple reality is that if you want to keep a serious log for your guns, you need to be serious about it.
Yup! I'm currently keeping records for three handguns. HK P2000, HK45, P7M8. For me, it's quite simple. I always have a pen on me, and I keep small note book that rides in the pistol's case.
I set aside ammo boxes, count'em and write it down in the appropriate book, before I leave the range.
4 x 50 = 200 rds of.....
We always say that very few people are ever going to fire this round count in their lifetime but it is not so impossible. Let’s say that you fire 200 rounds each month, in ten years that’s more than 20 thousand rounds!
My question here is: Has anyone of you put 20K through a single pistol and if the answer is yes then what parts have you replaced?
I've fired somewhere in the neighborhood of 25K-30K .45ACP through my Colt M1991A1, bought stock in 1997. At some point after 10K rounds the slide release broke, so I replaced that. Later in its life I had a gunsmith add a beavertail, extended thumb safety, and ignition parts, and I got some Novak sights installed. After 25K rounds I replaced the barrel with an Ed Brown Match barrel, though I hadn't noticed any drop in accuracy with the original factory barrel. It's probably got around 3K rounds through it since then, but now I tinker with it frequently. The only original parts are frame, slide, firing pin stop, guide rod, recoil spring plug, and barrel bushing. I expect to have it for the rest of my life and pass it on as a part of my legacy.
Okay, dumb question time:
What is the easiest, quickest and most efficient way to keep an accurate round count on a particular firearm?
If you take multiple firearms to the range to get some training in, and you're constantly reloading and bullshitting with your buddies and the pace is pretty fast, how do you guys make sure to keep track of round counts for one or two (or five) guns when you're out training for the day?
I rarely take more than 1 handgun to the range, and just add up empty ammo boxes since I usually go to the range by myself. Others actually keep little log books, which is a good idea. I should probably start doing that.
I have two "New Roll Mark" Colts purchase new in 2004. A 5" Government Model and a 4.25" Commander Model both Series 80. The Government has more than 20,000 rounds and the Commander has more than 15,000 rounds and both had the exact same parts failure. At 13,000 rounds on the Government and 15,000 on the Commander both pistols had the short rear leg of the ejector break off. Ammunition was 99.9% 230gr standard pressure FMJ.
Both pistols continued to function but the ejector could rotate when the slide was removed. The ejectors were replaced and the pistols still have the original factory extractors. I replace the recoil springs as needed with factory weight recoil springs from Wolff. They have never had a failure to feed, fire or extract that wasn't caused by ammo or magazines.
https://www.m4carbine.net/picture.php?albumid=26&pictureid=729
I have shot well north of 40k through my oldest pistol, a P7M8. I have shot well north of 20k through my G17.
what kind of maintenance/breakage has your P7 seen? :confused:
I have a Sig P220 with over 24,000 thru it. Parts replaced included the recoil spring at 15,000 and the breech block was replaced at 23,000 rds due to shooting steel cases ammo. Caused the fire pin hole to collapse and fray. All springs have been replaced at various times.
i have a glock 26 that has 20k thru it, replaced two extractors and a few recoil springs. i also had a g.19 that over 100,000k thru when the left rear rail failed, the frame and barr. were replaced, it's still chugging along.
davemcdonald
11-06-09, 20:36
I have through a SIg 229. It is an issue weapon so I haven't replaced anything but it had all springs replaced around 12k rounds.
Dave
what kind of maintenance/breakage has your P7 seen? :confused:
Hopefully Greg will chime in soon but I remember reading a thread a while back (believe it was over on PCT) about his P7M8 that stated the gun was sent into HK for inspection and they replaced the barrel and other internal parts although the gun was still functioning and working fine. It was also refinished twice. I remember Greg saying that it has never broken a part and never had a malfunction. That P7M8 has been to hell and back. :D
Hopefully Greg will chime in soon but I remember reading a thread a while back (believe it was over on PCT) about his P7M8 that stated the gun was sent into HK for inspection and they replaced the barrel and other internal parts although the gun was still functioning and working fine. It was also refinished twice. I remember Greg saying that it has never broken a part and never had a malfunction. That P7M8 has been to hell and back. :D
awesome.. i'm kinda suprised they replaced the barrel.. figured those hammer forged polygonal hk and glock barrels pretty much didn't wear out...
maybe chamber damage?
the P7 is on my short list (finally got to shoot one, amazing!) and considering how hard parts are to get for it i was hoping i'd need few. :D
I've fired somewhere in the neighborhood of 25K-30K .45ACP through my Colt M1991A1, bought stock in 1997. At some point after 10K rounds the slide release broke, so I replaced that. Later in its life I had a gunsmith add a beavertail, extended thumb safety, and ignition parts, and I got some Novak sights installed. After 25K rounds I replaced the barrel with an Ed Brown Match barrel, though I hadn't noticed any drop in accuracy with the original factory barrel. It's probably got around 3K rounds through it since then, but now I tinker with it frequently. The only original parts are frame, slide, firing pin stop, guide rod, recoil spring plug, and barrel bushing. I expect to have it for the rest of my life and pass it on as a part of my legacy.
Just yesterday I had this pistol at the range. We're in the vicinity of 30K rounds, and the plunger tube came loose. So, time for me to visit Brownell's!
mike benedict
11-12-09, 07:05
I have a Colt 10mm delta that I shot around 300,000 rounds through in my IPSC days
I used to shoot five 500 round practice sessions per week plus 2-3 matches. It is on its 4th barrel
As best as I can tell the only original parts are the slide, frame, pins and the sear.
I have a Colt 10mm delta that I shot around 300,000 rounds through in my IPSC days
I used to shoot five 500 round practice sessions per week plus 2-3 matches. It is on its 4th barrel
As best as I can tell the only original parts are the slide, frame, pins and the sear.
i thought those guns were known for cracking slides. guess not all of em :cool:
were you shooting full house rounds? or mostly lighter stuff?
mike benedict
11-12-09, 13:32
i thought those guns were known for cracking slides. guess not all of em :cool:
were you shooting full house rounds? or mostly lighter stuff?
It has a cracked frame but that happened when I fired a double charged Norma round in the first month.
When the round detonated it blew a chunk of barrel out the ejection port, and set off 3-4 rounds in the mag
The frame had a small crack and the slide had a big bulge at the ejection port.
My gunsmith hammered the slide and frame flat, installed a new barrel and I did not shoot Norma ammo any more.
I mostly shot 155 gr bullets at 1250 fps
I have over 20k through my Kimber Classic Custom Target.
I've only had to replace the extractor (broken claw due to someone "tuning" it improperly,) and my recoil and firing pin springs. Kimber replaced under warranty the rear target sight assembly after the set screw backed out and got lost.
-B
It has a cracked frame but that happened when I fired a double charged Norma round in the first month.
When the round detonated it blew a chunk of barrel out the ejection port, and set off 3-4 rounds in the mag
The frame had a small crack and the slide had a big bulge at the ejection port.
My gunsmith hammered the slide and frame flat, installed a new barrel and I did not shoot Norma ammo any more.
I mostly shot 155 gr bullets at 1250 fps
impressive gun. :cool: man i bet you can double charge the crap out of a big ol 10mm case :eek:
One of the firearms instructors here has shot out two P7M13s.
In both cases, the frames cracked on the left side of the frame, being a vertical crack, and effecting point of impact.
Estimated number of rounds through the first gun was 60,000 rounds. The second was about the same.
Not many people can say that they shot out a P7.
One of the firearms instructors here has shot out two P7M13s.
In both cases, the frames cracked on the left side of the frame, being a vertical crack, and effecting point of impact.
Estimated number of rounds through the first gun was 60,000 rounds. The second was about the same.
Not many people can say that they shot out a P7.
60,000 rounds is a perfectly acceptable lifespan for a pistol. :D especially when it's that consistent.. 2 guns in a row.. nice.
what's he shoot now? still p7's?
man i want one..
i've got a thing for classic HK's lately...
til i can afford a few i'll keep shooting and carrying my glocks though.
Right, he's on his third P7M13 in twenty years. We must be the only, or one of the last departments, to issue P7s for patrol, with around 100 of them.
They have been great guns and I have been proud to carry mine. However, this may be changing in the near future. Oh well, maybe I'll get grandfathered to carry mine the rest of my career.
Right, he's on his third P7M13 in twenty years. We must be the only, or one of the last departments, to issue P7s for patrol, with around 100 of them.
They have been great guns and I have been proud to carry mine. However, this may be changing in the near future. Oh well, maybe I'll get grandfathered to carry mine the rest of my career.
what are they looking at switching over to?
the P7 is awesome, but i imagine parts and stuff are getting harder to find and expensive.
I've got 133k rounds through a G34 that I bought in 2005. I started shooting it heavily when I started shooting USPSA in 2006. It has had every internal piece replaced multiple times as well as replaced the factory barrel at 19k rounds with a Storm Lake. At 55k rounds I replaced the Strom Lake with a Bar-Sto. I ran the Bar-Sto to 110k rounds and put a KKM in it. The gun now has tolerance stacking issues somewhere. The frame was tightened to the slide twice. Now it gets a dead trigger at least once every 200 rounds and cant seem to figure out why. It has even made a trip to Glock and still has these issues. So I retired the gun and bought a new M&P Pro Series to continue shooting Production in USPSA. I kept the G34 since it is the gun that got me my first GM card. Its got sentimental value.
I've also had an STI VIP in 9mm that has seen 27k rounds from 2004-2006. Aside from regular spring replacements.....no parts were ever replaced.
And my G19 that I bought in 2003 has 37k rounds through it. Only springs were replaced as preventative maintenance.
Thats all I have that I had recorded round counts on.
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