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LOKNLOD
12-09-09, 15:57
Wow, we're a ghost town since the change to regular forum format. I thought it would be the other way around. I see Josh-L on sometimes, but where is everyone else?

Where's everyone at? Has anyone been doing any shooting or training? I know the time change (lack of daylight after work) and busy weekends have been keeping me from doing much. Not to mention gift money cutting into the ammo budget. Plus I've been just slammed at work, too.

I should have some time off around the holidays, and I hope to make good use of it. Maybe we can plan something during the week after Christmas.

bratch
12-10-09, 15:21
I'm around. I'm taking the Farnam defensive carbine class this weekend. We need to try and get a group together at OKCGC.

LOKNLOD
12-11-09, 10:06
I'll be interested to hear your thoughts after the Farnam class. He's one that despite a fairly famous name I've heard very little about his training.

Which range is it on? I was considering heading out for a little pistol practice on Sunday if it warms on up like it's supposed to.

stage2
12-11-09, 10:08
I know I have the 23rd through the rest of the year off....I will be getting to know my new rifle very good over the course of those 12 days :p

LOKNLOD
12-11-09, 10:27
I know I have the 23rd through the rest of the year off....I will be getting to know my new rifle very good over the course of those 12 days :p

Yeah but you probably aren't willing to drive up here to OK just to shoot with us in the Okie regional forum ;)

stage2
12-11-09, 10:31
Yeah but you probably aren't willing to drive up here to OK just to shoot with us in the Okie regional forum ;)

your right....LOL I was just using the New Posts feature, didn't even look at the sub forum ;)

bratch
12-11-09, 13:43
I'll be interested to hear your thoughts after the Farnam class. He's one that despite a fairly famous name I've heard very little about his training.

Which range is it on? I was considering heading out for a little pistol practice on Sunday if it warms on up like it's supposed to.

It's at the gun club. With the weather looking better it should be a good time.

Josh-L
12-15-09, 16:53
I'm here just been busy with work, school and baby.

I'll wait for that aar too bratch. He has a lot of hype behind him for some reason from a small group of people but I know very little about what he actually teaches.

bratch
12-16-09, 00:23
it was a really good class. I plan on posting a full AAR but it'll probably be Friday before I can. I'm trying to get ahead at work so I don't come back from the holidays slammed and it's cutting into my writing time.

I've got pictures up on another site but it's password protected shoot me a pm if interested and I'll get you a link and the password.

bratch
12-18-09, 14:32
AAR Defensive Training International Urban Carbine
Oklahoma City, OK December 12-13, 2009
Instructors: John Farnam and Spencer Keepers

Students: 8 Students; 6 were civilian shooters; 1 was law enforcement; and 1 was Army Reserve

Gear: Noveske N4 upper, home build lower
Aimpoint M4 in a Larue Mount
VTAC Padded Sling
Wolf 62gr .223
C Products Mags
Mini Sneaky Bag
Glock 34

Class:

Saturday started out in the club house to go over a variety of materials, none of the students complained about delaying the range time since it was 27 degrees outside and the warmth of the club house was welcomed. John had everyone introduce themselves and their experiences and then went into the safety lecture. Gun manipulations and handling were covered next; this was an important part of the morning since we were running a hot range everyone needed to know how to handle their rifle safely. John then gave a legal and shooting aftermath lecture so that everyone had a basic understanding of what might happen after a defensive shooting. The next classroom topic was preventative maintenance, John broke down an AR, XCR and an AK to show where to clean and lube and what parts were prone to break or wear. After a wonderful lunch provided by Spencerís wife we hit the range.

Once we were at the range we ran some dry drills working on trigger reset and movement. After the dry drills we made the guns hot which is how they would remain for the rest of the day. We began by confirming and adjusting zeros at 40m to give everyone a good battle zero. After zeroing we ran a 100 round drill to get the guns hot and make sure they ran without issues. We then ran some drills with shoot and no shoot targets at 40 and 70 meters. After this we moved in close and ran mother-in-law drills to demonstrate the sight offset at close range and allow everyone to practice overcoming it. Next was a battle field pickup drill to get exposure to different platforms.

Sunday morning started out on the range, it was a little cool but turned into a beautiful day with a high near 70. We once again reconfirmed zero, ran another 100 round drill, and worked on some more MIL drills. The class was split into two teams of four and we ran relay races at 40 m. The shooter had to run about 15 yards and engage multiple targets without hitting any innocents, the team to finish first with the most hits won. Any hit on a no shoot target was a DQ. After running the drill at 40 m it we moved back to 55 m and ran it again. The class ran relay races on Saturday as well but I had to miss them due to another obligation. After the relay races John demonstrated various shooting positions and had the class shoot from each of them. We then covered transitions to a pistol or knife. The main point of emphasis was staying in the fight. These drills included engaging with the rifle, pistol, knife, and then back to the rifle after reloading it. The use of cover was the introduced and drills were ran shooting from behind cover in different positions both strong and support side. This proved to be more challenging than it sounds due to the positions that had to be assumed to stay behind the cover while engaging threats. We ended up the day by running Johnís final drill. What seemed like it would be a simple 5 shot pass or fail drill turned into something much more. Not a single shooter passed after their first attempt. By the end of the day however many had passed the drill and received the coveted DTI pin.


Observations/takeaways:

Red dot sights are a game changer; in normal shooting positions their value is not truly realized. It is in roll over prone shooting support side around cover that they shine. Improvised positions around cover and obstacles do not lend themselves for a traditional sight picture being able to put the dot on the target greatly simplifies getting hits on target.

Try your gear in different situations both strong and support side. When we first started transitioning to support side I had my Sneaky Bag strap over my sling which kept me from getting out of the sling to transition. By putting the bag on first and the sling over it the problem was alleviated. I had not tested everything in different settings so this was the first time I ran into this. It is an easy fix but could have been disastrous if it hadnít been in a training setting.

I also learned about a major eye dominance issue I have. I tried shooting support side with both eyes open; I had to cant the rifle inward and roll my head over to find my dot, in improvised positions I sometimes could not find it. After working on it at home I realized my right eye was trying to do all of the work. By closing my right eye I was able to keep the rifle vertical and position my head similar to how I do shooting strong side. Once again an easy fix that was a good thing to learn in training.

The Sneaky Bag worked great. I could carry 4 extra AR mags, 2 pistol mags, a flashlight, and a knife (still need to order my med kit)in a simple easy to use package. However I'm going to add a single mag carrier to my belt. I think it will speed up a single reload and if I was to ever lose the Sneaky Bag I'd still have one reload on my person.

Conclusion:

This is a good well-balanced class. If it is your first class it will give you a great foundation and the instructors are helpful if you are having any difficulties, nothing was dogmatic and at least one student had to do things a little different to get them to work for him. Youíll get to do things that youíve never been able to do on a square range and the lecture will provide lots of information from configuring a rifle to legal and moral implications.

If youíve trained before youíll get the basics reinforced and get to run a carbine at speed and on the move that is hard to do on most square ranges.

This class reinforced the importance of the carbine and how effective it can be from contact distance to several hundred yards.

Josh-L
12-18-09, 18:29
Wow only 8 shooters. How many rounds did you shoot? I've never heard of a 40m zero either did he explain the significanse of that?

bratch
12-18-09, 18:59
Round count was in the 500-600 range. We did alot of drills shooting doubles so I think that helped keep round counts reasonable.

The 40m zero was a battle zero with a maximum rise of 1.8" at 180m a second zero of 240m and a far end around 270m still in the kill zone. We didn't spend too much time getting perfect zeros just got the rifles close enough for government work.