View Full Version : Unusual problem working the charging handle
I just got my rifle back from a paintjob today. The rifle was bone dry (expected), so I lubed 'er up and went about doing a function check. Using Magpul dummy rounds, after a round is already chambered there is a very distinct (problematic) resistance when trying to work the charging handle.
Only occurs when trying to work the charging handle when a round is already chambered.
Does not occur when charging the handle with no mag in the weapon.
Does not occur when charging the handle to chamber a round.
Buffer still compresses easily into receiver extension.
Once the charging handle gets going it's fine, but it's getting hung up on something that I can't see.
There is a very distinct wear mark on the middle/top of the charging handle.
There is a very distinct corresponding wear mark along the roof of the upper receiver.
To be clear, these were not problems noticed before sending my rifle away. The only things that have changed since then was a paintjob for the rifle and a very light coating of fluorescent paint on the Magpul dummy rounds. Only a little bit of flourescent orange flakes off when chambering and ejecting the dummy rounds.
I'm befuddled. Thoughts?
-B
Sure it's not the paint on the dummy rounds? Seems like it wouldn't take of a layer to make a round a little sticky in the chamber.
I realize that fiddling with live ammo can be bad ju-ju but you could try a spent casing or pull the firing pin and try it with a live round. I'd make sure to eliminate that before assuming it's the gun, since it seems directly linked to removing a round from the chamber. The round itself is really the only thing changing between it working fine, and sticking, if I'm understanding correctly.
Pulling the firing pin is a good idea. I'll try that right now so I can see if the problem persists with live ammo too (I can't seem to find our spent brass...).
Edit/Update: I was hoping it was just the dummy rounds but it's happening to XM193, too. I guess I refocus on the wear between the charging handle and upper receiver...?
-B
Hmm, that's really odd then. On the same train of thought, there's not paint sluffed off on the inside of the chamber that's sticking the rounds? Long shot, but....ya never know. Might be worth a minute to hit it with a chamber brush.
I'm going to have to think a little harder to try and visualize what could be hanging up and where....
I wouldn't pull the firing pin out, it keeps the cam pin from freely rotating. You could get your BCG stuck in your upper like that....I learned the hard way.
This is a dumb question, but is the charging handle painted as well?
Maybe pictures of the marks you're talking about would help with clarification.
Yeah, I just experienced the sticking BCG phenomenon. Lesson learned there. At the same time, putting the firing pin back in and cycling a few spent casings I [finally] found, the charging handle's still getting hung up on something with both them and the Magpul rounds. Give me a few to get a pic or two of the wear I'm talking about.
-B
Here are pictures of the wear marks.
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a213/black_knight_reborn/Firearm-related/DSCF0935.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a213/black_knight_reborn/Firearm-related/DSCF0936.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a213/black_knight_reborn/Firearm-related/DSCF0937.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a213/black_knight_reborn/Firearm-related/DSCF0938.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a213/black_knight_reborn/Firearm-related/DSCF0939.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a213/black_knight_reborn/Firearm-related/DSCF0940.jpg
-B
Is it possible the charging handle got bent? The wear mark makes me wonder. Do you have a different one to try?
Belmont31R
12-14-09, 20:36
For whatever reason (tolerances) some combo's of parts just wear quite a bit more than other. Ive had wear marks like in your pics, and usually everything smooths out like butter after a few months of good use. My SR15 was pretty rough for the 1st 1k rounds, and lots of in home "practice". Now its as smooth as anything Ive owned. The parts just need to wear together, and it wont cause any long term issues.
What I would look for is actual gouges in the upper. If you see gouge lines in the metal then Id take a look, and start swapping parts (easiest to hardest) until the culprit is found. Also do a basic check to make sure the CH is square. Put a couple squirts of oil on top of the CH or a thin line of gun grease on it.
The upper receiver isn't gouged (though it doesn't look like it would take much more to be gouged). I swapped the BCG and CH with another rifle, and the problem is definitely with this one. I just need to figure out what the CH problem is (Jdrimm may be right in it being bent...). I'm worried about the parts just "wearing together," since this wear seems a bit excessive. I'll just keep it lubed to all hell and see how it shoots next weekend.
-B
Is it possible the charging handle got bent? The wear mark makes me wonder. Do you have a different one to try?
I'm thinking this as well. While wear on the finish on the CH and in the upper receiver is normal, your CH has a really concentrated spot that's worn. Usually, the wear is more uniform and distributed with time.
The upper receiver isn't gouged (though it doesn't look like it would take much more to be gouged). I swapped the BCG and CH with another rifle, and the problem is definitely with this one. I just need to figure out what the CH problem is (Jdrimm may be right in it being bent...). I'm worried about the parts just "wearing together," since this wear seems a bit excessive. I'll just keep it lubed to all hell and see how it shoots next weekend.
-B
if it's bent that would be pretty easy to check out, right? can they be straightened once they are bent?
I see no reason to continue wearing your receiver with this CH. might be a good excuse to spring for a BCM Gunfighter :)
I did some more playing around today. With two different charging handles and bolt carrier groups the problem persists; after a couple dozen "cycle twice + mag change + cycle twice" it's not quite as prohibitively stuck, but it's still stuck enough to throw disrupt my cycling of the rifle unless I strong arm it (not something I like doing, since it feels like there's something not moving smoothly and I don't want to exacerbate it).
After having used two different charging handles, two magazines (USGI and Rev M Pmag), and both spent casings and dummy rounds I'm starting to wonder if the receiver itself may be to blame. Thoughts? May I be giving RRA a call tomorrow?
-B
Did you try a straight edge across the top of the receiver? I mean the receiver was out of your hands for a time and nothing against whoever did the painting but poo-poo happens. And as unlikely as it may be is there any chance the two painted surfaces are sticking to each other? Some paints like a longer "cure" time than others.
Have a look on the surfaces that are under that area where the charging handle rides. Some paint may have over sprayed in that location and is forcing the charge handle upwards creating the contact wear that you see. That would take a lot of paint but who knows, just a guess...
No paint looks to be anywhere that the charging handle rests against or on; the charging handle is also not painted. I sent an email to RRA to ask their opinions on the matter and I'll keep this topic updated. This one baffles me.
-B
Let me know what you decide. I am in Florida (about 3 hours away) maybe we could link up and I can take a look at it.
No paint looks to be anywhere that the charging handle rests against or on; the charging handle is also not painted. I sent an email to RRA to ask their opinions on the matter and I'll keep this topic updated. This one baffles me.
-B
I may take you up on that. How long are you going to be down here?
-B
I am here until the 23rd and will be back just before the new year.
I may take you up on that. How long are you going to be down here?
-B
Gotcha. I'll let you know once I get something out of RRA; more than likely I'd have to wait until the second time you're in the area, since I may not get a response until late Monday or Tuesday.
-B
Sort-of-update: No word back from RRA so far. Fun. I'll give them until Monday evening before I start raising hell with them. Iraqgunz, if that's enough lead time I'll pm you by Monday night to see if we can link up before new years.
I tried malfunction drills with several different magazines tonight. With Gen 1 30 round Pmags and USGI (Bravo Co.) mags, the "stuck charging handle" problem is still very evident. With 20-round and Rev-M Pmags and Lancer 1, the problem is noticeably reduced, but still present. With Lancer 2 the problem is basically gone; only a hint of more-than-average resistance. The problem is still present with no mag at all but a round chambered, though not so bad as the older-gen Pmags and USGI mags. I'm not sure what any of this means. Shining a flashlight into the ejection port while trying to work the charging handle shows pretty clearly that the bolt, or BCG, is getting hung up on something (the degree varying depending on what mags, if any, are seated). I just don't know what.
On a side note, the two Lancers both seem to feed fine. The only complaint I have is trying to get one of them to seat with the bolt down (damn near impossible), regardless of how many rounds are in the mag. The other Lancer mag I have seats fine. Is this common?
-B
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