View Full Version : Wilson Combat Spec Ops 9MM pics!
Got it in last week, went out a few times shooting it
let lots of people fondle it, everyone was really impressed
a few guys shot it and were all like "man, this is SWEET"
25 yard groups
headshots were slow
center shots were quick and dirty
fed everything I gave it
I am not a great pistol shot.....
http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/7905/wilsonspecops9001.jpg
http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/7296/wilsonspecops9006u.jpg
http://img96.imageshack.us/img96/9137/wilsonspecops9007.jpg
http://img691.imageshack.us/img691/3/wilsonspecops9005.jpg
http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/1830/wilsonspecops9004.jpg
In a Wilson Lo Profile holster (nice leather)
http://img63.imageshack.us/img63/4277/wilsonspecops9009.jpg[/img]
Nice pics. Can you take some of the internals of the pistol?
Brother Rat
12-20-09, 14:54
What are your first impression thoughts on it? Is this going to be a daily carry piece with a high round count? It's interesting to me that they don't come with a picatinny rail given the "Spec-Ops" stamped into the slide.
carry piece and some IPSC and IDPA
my guess is no rail to keep in very thin for carry
Brother Rat
12-20-09, 15:05
Well that's cool man, enjoy it! 9mm 1911's are some of the most pleasant to shoot pistols I've ever fired.
Is it a 1911 or did they do some re-engineering ?
Business_Casual
12-20-09, 15:39
Is it a 1911 or did they do some re-engineering ?
LOL, that is quite good.
M_P
I'd be real interested in that gun if they made it...
in a 5" version with a rail
in a 4.25" version without a rail and with an officer's-length grip
for about half the price
with magazines that cost under $25
I figure I wind up spending nearly $1k on a Glock to get it the way I want ($500 gun, $250 grip reduction, $100 sights, other small incidentals get it to $850 or so) so I'd be willing to spend about $1k on this.
But at $2k I have to admit I'm not sure I see the point.
Dave Berryhill
12-20-09, 17:13
Hey, I shoot at Red's in Pflugerville!
It looks sorta kinda like a BUL
LOL, that is quite good.
M_P
Considering that 1911s don't really like 9mm and the fact that Wilson has been designing his own non-1911 guns that are in 9mm (the ADP) & this gun has a polymer frame it would not be far fetched for Bill to re-engineer a more reliable 1911-styled gun in 9mm. Bill thinks outside of the box;)
run it and keep us updated. I be interested in one on a smaller scale as well.
except STI already makes the VIP..................
and we know 2011's can run
I had a KZ45 once, it sucked, bad. I wonder what changes they made to the KZ line to make this not suck?
and I have a Springfield 9mm government 1911, it runs just fine, great for low cost practice, steel challenge, minor scoring USPSA, ect. I put am aluminum buff in there and it shoots soft like a lullabye
Nice, but did they really have to call it "Special Ops"? They could at least not have put it on the slide...
Nice, but did they really have to call it "Special Ops"? They could at least not have put it on the slide...
lol. its pretty cheesy, and IIRC they even had a naming contest for it.
I can't speak for Wilson Combat of course...
my .02 cents, and worth probably less than 1/2 of that!
I love my steel 5" 45 (started life as a basic Springfield loaded custom stainless, added a few things)
but 45 ACP ammo has been so scarce and I don't feel like loading for it
I have had a bunch of sigs, glocks, m&P, etc.. glocks work great, but even after grip reductions, trigger jobs, etc.. I still don't like them and never kept any of the probably 15 I have had longer than a few months
my 1911 I have had for years and it will never go away
I just love the way a 1911 feels, points, trigger, etc...
I don't get into cost justifications for stuff, I drive an older pickup but have always had custom mountain bikes that run 6K because cheaper ones just don't work well enough for me (I owned a custom mountain bike shop, so, I am certainly biased)
This Wilson is a quality piece, expensive? yep
Do _I_ think it's worth the price?
yeah...
I have got to know Bill over the last year through hog hunting and he takes his stuff seriously and I know if I ever have a problem with it, it will be handled with a simple phone call and no BS, that is worth a lot to me
if I am going to be carrying a gun I may have to trust my life with, I want something that just feels right and goes on target instinctively and goes bang every time I pull the trigger
as far as the name, well, there was a contest and that was the one Bill chose
It can be ordered "naked slide" with out the name on it
frankly, caring what a gun is called and having that influence your buying decisions seems ridiculous.. it's a tool, I don't care if it's called the poop factory
I had a KZ45 once, it sucked, bad. I wonder what changes they made to the KZ line to make this not suck?
I asked that question elsewhere on this forum at one time and the answer I got seemed disappointingly vague to me.
I know two guys that have KZ45s and both love them
I have never shot one....
I bet they are aware of the fact that the previous polymer framed guns weren't the greatest and make sure this one is
I have read a few reports on them and haven't heard a single complaint
FromMyColdDeadHand
12-20-09, 19:56
Makes me feel better about my Sig X-five Tactical at 2/3rds the price. 15 round std mags, aftermaket 18s, and extended baseplate 20s. Not a 1911, but still pretty nice.
I don't see them coming any cheaper. Even at $1000, I'm guessing they won't get any LEO contracts, so you might as well not dilute your brand with some 'cheap' $1000 guns. Wilson guys will be more than happy to shell out $2k, I'd think.
I really don't know the market? Are they trying to keep Wilson guys from buying an STI? This gun won't threaten S_I guns, since they have all that third part after support.
I love Bill Wilson's 1911, just wish I could afford one.
I'd be real interested in that gun if they made it...
in a 5" version with a rail
in a 4.25" version without a rail and with an officer's-length grip
for about half the price
with magazines that cost under $25
I figure I wind up spending nearly $1k on a Glock to get it the way I want ($500 gun, $250 grip reduction, $100 sights, other small incidentals get it to $850 or so) so I'd be willing to spend about $1k on this.
But at $2k I have to admit I'm not sure I see the point.
The point is it is a 9mm with a sweet trigger pull, great reliability and a WC warranty to back it up. Plus, if you are a 1911 shooter and want a great 9mm in a 1911 platform you have to look no further. After all, what is the point of learning a whole different platform when you already have time and money invested in training on a 1911?
Think of it this way...a Glock and a 1911 have different controls, different trigger pulls and hold differently in your hand. If you spend ten years shooting a 1911 and want a 9mm, would you rather learn a completely different handgun or stick with something that has the same grip, same trigger pull and same operation as what you know reflexively? I'd rather stick to the tool that I already have muscle memory with. I'm not a huge fan of this pistol (uber gay name) but if I were currently looking for a 9mm I would consider one, being that I am already a 1911 shooter.
btw, I really like the contrasting green front site and light yellow rear night sights
very effective of making the front sight pop out
the camera focused on the rear sights I think, in person, they are subdued and the green really pops
before anyone asks.. that's my reflection in the mirror, finger off trigger, gun unloaded, etc.. etc..
http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/7576/frontsight003.jpg
FromMyColdDeadHand
12-20-09, 20:10
If you spend ten years shooting a 1911 and want a 9mm, would you rather learn a completely different handgun or stick with something that has the same grip, same trigger pull and same operation as what you know reflexively? I'd rather stick to the tool that I already have muscle memory with. I'm not a huge fan of this pistol (uber gay name) but if I were currently looking for a 9mm I would consider one, being that I am already a 1911 shooter.
So buy an S_I in 9mm? I'm not saying that there isn't a place for a Wilson 9mm 1911, its just they plopped it right down on top of the STI Tactical 5.0 9mm.
I didn't enter, but I would have called it the:
Wils9mm
- but make the "o" part of the 9 an the "n" part of the first "m" in the same color as the "Wils", but the rest of the "9mm" in another color. Tell people it's pronounced "Wilson 9mm".
That's still gay, but better than Special Ed 9mm. If I had know this was the best they were going to get, I would have spent more than 5 seconds on it.
Ccocker- Nice write up on a nice gun. Thought you had stranger danger for a second in your night sight shot!
The point is it is a 9mm with a sweet trigger pull, great reliability and a WC warranty to back it up. Plus, if you are a 1911 shooter and want a great 9mm in a 1911 platform you have to look no further. After all, what is the point of learning a whole different platform when you already have time and money invested in training on a 1911?
Think of it this way...a Glock and a 1911 have different controls, different trigger pulls and hold differently in your hand. If you spend ten years shooting a 1911 and want a 9mm, would you rather learn a completely different handgun or stick with something that has the same grip, same trigger pull and same operation as what you know reflexively? I'd rather stick to the tool that I already have muscle memory with. I'm not a huge fan of this pistol (uber gay name) but if I were currently looking for a 9mm I would consider one, being that I am already a 1911 shooter.
I was a 1911 shooter, but having to spend $2k+ to get one I trusted soured me on that, hence my desire for a less expensive option. I don't want an expensive Glock, I want a less expensive, but reliable, 1911. I'll go ahead and hold my breath. :rolleyes:
I made the choice to ditch years of "muscle memory" and am not looking back. Last 1911 is up for sale already, and the dozens of magazines plus .22 LR conversion will be up as soon as I can take pics.
I'm curious as to how you can comment on the trigger pull and, especially, the reliability of this gun. As posted above the KZs were total dogs and the changes made from that (ironically less expensive) gun to this one are vague at best. So far we have a horrendous history, with no real evidence of improvement, and a sample of one in this thread with a few dozen rounds through it at best. Call me when one of these things lasts through a Frank Garcia 2k-rounds-in-two-days class like I'll be attending next month and we'll talk about reliability. If Wilson wants to send me one I'll be happy to give it a go. :p
So buy an S_I in 9mm? I'm not saying that there isn't a place for a Wilson 9mm 1911, its just they plopped it right down on top of the STI Tactical 5.0 9mm.
I'm obviously not exactly sold on the new KZ, no matter what you name it, but I don't really see this in the same ballpark as the "Tactical" STI (talk about a silly name, while we're at it). That monster magwell is the first clue. Maybe more like the VIP (http://stiguns.com/guns/vip/vip.html) or the Eagle 5.0 (http://stiguns.com/guns/vip/vip.html) (if it can be had with a fixed sight).
I was a 1911 shooter, but having to spend $2k+ to get one I trusted soured me on that, hence my desire for a less expensive option. I don't want an expensive Glock, I want a less expensive, but reliable, 1911. I'll go ahead and hold my breath. :rolleyes:
You only have to spend the money once....and when you shoot a pistol that is sex on your fingers and a true joy to shoot it is well worth the money!
I'm curious as to how you can comment on the trigger pull and, especially, the reliability of this gun.
I own two Wilsons. I have learned to trust them after pushing thousands of rounds of my reloads through them and I understand what Wilson quality is. I spoke with Matt Riker on Friday about this Special-ed-9mm pistol. He says it is worth the Wilson name and I trust that he knows what he is talking about. I still won't buy one but I believe what he says based on my experience with their products and services.
You only have to spend the money once
No, actually you don't, which is exactly the problem. If you only "need" one pistol, then yes you only spend the money once. But my lifestyle, and family situation, necessitate at least 3 handguns (his, hers, bedroom), and warrant at least another 3 (car, safe, elsewhere in house) if not more. Less expensive yet serviceable firearms allow you to do this for less overall cost.
Any concerns over "feel" or other subjective matters are training issues at best. Attending matches and watching more than one shooter with a stock G19 or M&P or XD smoke the snot out of geezers with $2k+ 1911s taught me that much. So did owning a YB 1*, Wilson CQB, and Ed Brown Special Forces (which, until the release of the pistol in question in this thread, was the single stupidest named gun ever). A $500 gun, a $500 class, and $1k worth of ammo will get you a hell of a lot further than a $2k gun, no ammo, and no training.
This isn't about Glock vs. 1911. I concede that 1911s "feel" nice in the hand and make shooting well easier, but they do nothing more than mask shortcomings that other guns may not mask as well. I'd love to have something that covered up the fact that I can't shoot so good at a price point that allows me to have 3 (or 6) as I need. ;)
So as originally posted, I'd love for this gun to be more accessible in terms of price, and more than a rebadged KZ in terms of design.
I spoke with Matt Riker on Friday about this Special-ed-9mm pistol. He says it is worth the Wilson name and I trust that he knows what he is talking about. I still won't buy one but I believe what he says based on my experience with their products and services.
I had to google this name because I had no idea who that is. What else but "it's the best thing since sex" would you expect a Wilson employee (http://www.wilsoncombat.com/about_us.htm#Matt_Riker) to say, and what in his bio other than the fact that he's worked there for 4 years would lead you to believe that he's giving you anything other than the party line? I'm sure he's a great guy, and I'm sure he believes what he's telling you, but as I said I'll wait until someone gets a couple of thousand rounds on one over a short period of time before commenting on the reliability of this thing.
a few dozen rounds?
you don't me very well
I like to churn through ammo, ask my dad about me as a kid :)
first day out, 300 rds
2nd day out same
nary a hickup with several types of ammo
I would love to have more money to spend on ammo!
I agree it needs more shooting to be deemed "good to go"
I plan to let my buddy whos an instructor take it to a few classes, he works here:
http://www.krtraining.com/
as well as a few of the guys at the local LE/Mil/ supply shop take it out and put it through it's paces
another buddy is on the County SWAT team, going to let him burn ammo through it and another buddy works for Signature Science and we go out to the facility and do drills and burn through ammo
Hey, I'll be the first to complain if it doesn't work right
I am not one of those guys that needs to feel good about his purchase decisions and overlooks issues.. if they arise, they will be dealt with quickly and if not resolved to 100% satisfaction it will be gone like a bad girflriend!
No, actually you don't, which is exactly the problem. If you only "need" one pistol, then yes you only spend the money once. But my lifestyle, and family situation, necessitate at least 3 handguns (his, hers, bedroom), and warrant at least another 3 (car, safe, elsewhere in house) if not more. Less expensive yet serviceable firearms allow you to do this for less overall cost.
That's a lot of pistols. If you feel you need that many I can see how the cost is an issue.
Any concerns over "feel" or other subjective matters are training issues at best. Attending matches and watching more than one shooter with a stock G19 or M&P or XD smoke the snot out of geezers with $2k+ 1911s taught me that much. So did owning a YB 1*, Wilson CQB, and Ed Brown Special Forces (which, until the release of the pistol in question in this thread, was the single stupidest named gun ever). A $500 gun, a $500 class, and $1k worth of ammo will get you a hell of a lot further than a $2k gun, no ammo, and no training.
I did not imply that shooting an expensive 1911 will make a person shoot better. I used to play competitive paintball (before I grew tired of the cheating on the tournament scene) and personally proved the gun doesn't make the player by using stock class guns in open class tournaments -and winning. The gun does not make the shooter. The shooter makes the shooter.
This isn't about Glock vs. 1911. I concede that 1911s "feel" nice in the hand and make shooting well easier, but they do nothing more than mask shortcomings that other guns may not mask as well. I'd love to have something that covered up the fact that I can't shoot so good at a price point that allows me to have 3 (or 6) as I need. ;)
I agree it isn't a anything vs 1911 thing, but the way you worded this makes it sound as if you feel anyone that shoots a 1911 has dysfunctional shooting habits or lack of some sort of skill. I'm curious, what shortcomings are you referring to?
a few dozen rounds?
you don't me very well
I like to churn through ammo, ask my dad about me as a kid :)
first day out, 300 rds
2nd day out same
I didn't see a round count in the initial post and had nothing but the target to go by. Not knowing you at all I had to assume it was a typical "look what I bought" internet post where the one target is all there is.
And even if it was only a couple dozen rounds, it would still be more than panzerr has through it (or me either, for that matter) :p
I didn't see a round count in the initial post and had nothing but the target to go by. Not knowing you at all I had to assume it was a typical "look what I bought" internet post where the one target is all there is.
And even if it was only a couple dozen rounds, it would still be more than panzerr has through it (or me either, for that matter) :p
gotcha
no hard feelings, it's just the internet :)
I had to google this name because I had no idea who that is. What else but "it's the best thing since sex" would you expect a Wilson employee (http://www.wilsoncombat.com/about_us.htm#Matt_Riker) to say, and what in his bio other than the fact that he's worked there for 4 years would lead you to believe that he's giving you anything other than the party line? I'm sure he's a great guy, and I'm sure he believes what he's telling you, but as I said I'll wait until someone gets a couple of thousand rounds on one over a short period of time before commenting on the reliability of this thing.
Actually, I said that shooting a Wilson is like sex on your fingers.
I agree it isn't a anything vs 1911 thing, but the way you worded this makes it sound as if you feel anyone that shoots a 1911 has dysfunctional shooting habits or lack of some sort of skill. I'm curious, what shortcomings are you referring to?
I'm not "implying" anything. I'm stating (very clearly now) that anyone that thinks they need a 1911 (or any other specific platform) to shoot well has a crutch supporting bad shooting habits they should overcome.
I'm not talking about exclusively shooting a Sig for 10 years and then picking up an M&P one day and expecting to shoot just as well, but I learned for myself and watching others that most treat the 1911 as a crutch and every top-notch shooter I've seen can shoot a Glock, M&P, Sig, or even a revolver just as well if given a bit of time to familiarize themselves with it.
If you're taking this personally or thinking that I'm saying you can't shoot, I'm not, I don't know you and haven't seen you shoot, nor do I really care. I know what I've found out about myself after nearly 6 years and several thousand rounds through various 1911s, and what I've observed in others after that revelation, that's all. Why do it with $2k if you can do it at 1/4 the price?
Which, to make sure this doesn't get hijacked further, is why I would like to see this gun at $1k instead of $2k. While not 1/4 it's still a hell of a lot better.
Rob, I agree, most guns can out shoot the shooter
and I too wish it were 1/2 the price!
I like the M&P and own one
like I said earlier, they all work, I just really LIKE the feel of a 1911 and enjoy shooting them them most
I hunt with a Smith Performance center 44 and like it a lot and have killed a number of hogs and deer, but I still prefer shooting a 1911
Rob,
Didn't we talk about this awhile ago?:D
I'm with ya..
Bob
Considering that 1911s don't really like 9mm and the fact that Wilson has been designing his own non-1911 guns that are in 9mm (the ADP) & this gun has a polymer frame it would not be far fetched for Bill to re-engineer a more reliable 1911-styled gun in 9mm. Bill thinks outside of the box;)
The ADP was just a crappy South African import.
My dad got suckered into one, it had the worst DA pull I've ever experienced.
lol. its pretty cheesy, and IIRC they even had a naming contest for it.
I'd have taken one for T&E had they chosen my entry. . .
No, actually you don't, which is exactly the problem. If you only "need" one pistol, then yes you only spend the money once. But my lifestyle, and family situation, necessitate at least 3 handguns (his, hers, bedroom), and warrant at least another 3 (car, safe, elsewhere in house) if not more. Less expensive yet serviceable firearms allow you to do this for less overall cost.
Any concerns over "feel" or other subjective matters are training issues at best. Attending matches and watching more than one shooter with a stock G19 or M&P or XD smoke the snot out of geezers with $2k+ 1911s taught me that much. So did owning a YB 1*, Wilson CQB, and Ed Brown Special Forces (which, until the release of the pistol in question in this thread, was the single stupidest named gun ever). A $500 gun, a $500 class, and $1k worth of ammo will get you a hell of a lot further than a $2k gun, no ammo, and no training.
This isn't about Glock vs. 1911. I concede that 1911s "feel" nice in the hand and make shooting well easier, but they do nothing more than mask shortcomings that other guns may not mask as well. I'd love to have something that covered up the fact that I can't shoot so good at a price point that allows me to have 3 (or 6) as I need. ;)
So as originally posted, I'd love for this gun to be more accessible in terms of price, and more than a rebadged KZ in terms of design.
Your transition interests me. I currently train with and carry the 1911 in .45, but, in the back of my mind, always want to experiment with other platforms for full time carry for numerous reasons, like the Glock or M&P. I imagine the transition as far as muscle memory would be easier to step to these other platforms, than moving from them to the 1911, just because of the safety. How was you transition Rob?
Your transition interests me. I currently train with and carry the 1911 in .45, but, in the back of my mind, always want to experiment with other platforms for full time carry for numerous reasons, like the Glock or M&P. I imagine the transition as far as muscle memory would be easier to step to these other platforms, than moving from them to the 1911, just because of the safety. How was you transition Rob?
Difficult, but only because I didn't go about it right. What I should have done, and eventually did, was retake a basic handgun class with the Glock and then keep up my dryfire, live-fire, and competitive practice.
I cant believe they didnt pick my winning name for it " Fugly" . :) That being said, if its shoot and stays shooting, then I have no issue with it. I shot a couple hundred rounds thru a KZ several years back . I liked the feel in my hand and the fact it was 10 rnds of .45acp vs. the 8 in the gun I carried at the time. I will wait on a long term evaluation of this pistol before I pass judgement on it.
I was a 1911 shooter, but having to spend $2k+ to get one I trusted soured me on that, [....] I want a less expensive, but reliable, 1911.
Rob, though I still hang onto a couple of favorite 1911's, the niche you describe is filled for me by a CZ SP01 (the ambi safety version--you can also get with decocker, and in .40 or 9mm versions). All steel, very robust and accurate design, 4.7" barrel, extremely accurate out of the box, and with a $100 trigger job, they have a SA trigger pull that is second only to a tuned 1911. On top of all that, they cost about $585, and have a 19rd capacity. I don't know of anything that comes closer to fulfilling the vision of a cost-effective 1911-like shooter, while dispensing with some of its unnecessary details (like the grip safety).
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