M&P 22 Pistol

[FVC3]

I haven't seen any traffic about this here, but I doubt that I'm the first M4C member to know that Smith will be introducing a 22 lr M&P pistol. I have it on good, first-hand authority (no net shenanigans) that the new gun will be available in "1st Q 2010" and will almost certainly be intro'd at SHOT.

I am as enthusiastic about this as I can remember being about any new product. Sure hope they do as good a job as they did on the M&P 15 22. Any other inside info?

[Alpha Sierra]

I hope that intro includes a slide kit for the centerfire pistols.

[Buckaroo]

I will believe it when I see it and then buy the first one I find.

Buckaroo

[znztivguy]

going to be lots of stuff...hope to see this there as well

[RadioActivity]

PLEASE don't be like the Sig mosquito or Colt .22 AR. Please dont be cheap and function horrible. Puh-lease dont screw this very simple concept up...

[NCPatrolAR]

I'd prefer a conversion kit instead of an entire new gun

[Gewehr3]

A .22 conversion kit would be great.

[John_Wayne777]

I haven't seen any traffic about this here, but I doubt that I'm the first M4C member to know that Smith will be introducing a 22 lr M&P pistol.

Many of us have wished that S&W...or somebody...would introduce a decent conversion kit so we could practice more with our M&Ps...but this is the first I've heard of a dedicated .22 LR pistol. If it's the same dimensions and basic system as the standard M&P's, that would be fine.

If they want to make some 3/4 scale thing that doesn't work like the regular M&P it's a fruity concept.

[FVC3]

Many of us have wished that S&W...or somebody...would introduce a decent conversion kit so we could practice more with our M&Ps...but this is the first I've heard of a dedicated .22 LR pistol. If it's the same dimensions and basic system as the standard M&P's, that would be fine.

If they want to make some 3/4 scale thing that doesn't work like the regular M&P it's a fruity concept.

I could not get details - my source would not elaborate. I didn't know until recently that I knew someone in a position to know things. I will not burn this person, so this info is on a take it or leave it basis. But the exact quote was " They (an M&P 22 pistol) should hit the market around the 1st Quarter of 2010". This person is in a position to know, had nothing to gain by shining me on, and has been nothing but professional since we re-connected after many years out of touch.

[wes007]

First the ar now the m&p.

I couldnt be any happier with S&W right now. Its going to be great to be able to train with both systems without breaking the bank.

Any word on the price range?

[MichaelD]

If this pans out, I'll be ordering one immediately after the announcement.

[C4IGrant]

I'd prefer a conversion kit instead of an entire new gun

Would like to see both actually.

S&W will most likely introduce a complete weapon first and then offer slides.


I have some e-mails into my contacts at S&W and will see if I can get any info.


C4

[C4IGrant]

Ok, just got off the phone.

S&W IS making this pistol. :D





C4

[Buckaroo]

Ok, just got off the phone.

S&W IS making this pistol. :D





C4

Any details? Inquiring minds want to know! :cool:

[C4IGrant]

Any details? Inquiring minds want to know! :cool:

Nothing yet other than confirmation. Will try and get more info on Monday.

My guess is that the frame will be narrower than a standard M&P (because of a single stack mag). I could be flat out wrong though.



C4

[LonghunterCO]

Would love a slide/mag combo that would allow me to use my regular holsters...failing that a small frame set up that can be threaded would work too.

[MichaelD]

Grant, I want to be on the list for one of these.

[SeriousStudent]

Ok, just got off the phone.

S&W IS making this pistol. :D





C4

Excellent, thank you for the confirmation.

[wantsum]

I'd be all over a conversion kit, but if they only introduce a complete pistol it wouldn't keep me from picking one up.

[FVC3]

Update: The pistol will be "dimensionally similar" enough to a full size M&P 40 to fit "most" holsters.

I've been told that is all the info I'll get. Maybe one of you guys can do better.

[NCPatrolAR]

Ok, just got off the phone.

S&W IS making this pistol. :D





C4

Ohhhhhh, think I might know what my next pistol purchase is going to be.

[The_Biased_Observer]

Please, please, please don't have a POS zinc slide....

[milosz]

Not 100% encouraged by "dimensionally similar," but if it's close I'm good.

Found an Advantage Arms LE 17 kit for my Glock that arrived today, put 100 rounds through it. Would love to have something equal to it for my M&P, even if it only comes in entire-pistol form.

[John_Wayne777]

If it really is very similar to the M&P I'll buy one. I guess I'll have to let Grant tor Todd ake a look at it at SHOT, send me some pics and give me their impressions.

[Boss Hogg]

A slide conversion would be a more serious training tool. A 22LR pistol would be more of a plinker.

Advantage Arms' Glock kits are scarce as hen's teeth, so if S&W can offer a widely available 22LR conversion kit, think of all the existing M&P 9/40 users they could reach.

Advantage Arms is also limited by their 10-round capacity, thanks to being in California. S&W wouldn't have these limitations.

[ToddG]

A .22 conversion top end for a 9mm/40/45 pistol is a much greater engineering challenge than a gun that was built as a .22 from the ground up. Smith is also looking at the success it's had with the M&P15-22 and figuring the pistol equivalent will sell just as well.

[John_Wayne777]

...if, like the rifle version, it gives me the ability to put the same sights on it and has a reasonably similar trigger, that's a good bet on their part.

[rob_s]

This is one of the things that kept me from going with the M&P when I went back to plastic guns. If there was a .22 M&P that may have influenced my decision.

However, if it is not dimensionally identical and does not work in ALL holsters designed for the fullsize gun, it wouldn't have impacted my decision in the slightest and I would have still gone with the Glock.

[DrMark]

I'd rate a conversion kit higher than a dedicated pistol on my want list.

That said, a dedicated pistol (sufficiently similar to the centerfire version) would be nice.

[C4IGrant]

A .22 conversion top end for a 9mm/40/45 pistol is a much greater engineering challenge than a gun that was built as a .22 from the ground up. Smith is also looking at the success it's had with the M&P15-22 and figuring the pistol equivalent will sell just as well.

Agree.


I spoke to S&W about this pistol the other day. It is really still in the "infancy" stages and could go a couple different ways.

We MIGHT see something at shot or we might not.


C4

[C4IGrant]

This is one of the things that kept me from going with the M&P when I went back to plastic guns. If there was a .22 M&P that may have influenced my decision.

However, if it is not dimensionally identical and does not work in ALL holsters designed for the fullsize gun, it wouldn't have impacted my decision in the slightest and I would have still gone with the Glock.

Agree. I have expressed my thoughts on the subject and told them that a conversion is the way to go so that guys can use all their same gear with it.

S&W is in the business of making guns so making a conversion might not interest them.


C4

[rob_s]

I don't mind if they do a complete pistol, and would prefer it if in the market in many ways, but it needs to EXACTLY match the dimensions of the real gun, down to the magazines.

Their .22 AR is a great example. It's 99% there, but by continuing the rib under the receiver extension and making the RE one piece with the lower they made it impossible to use the TD PR-4, or any receiver endplate replacement sling attachment. That's the kind of bad decision that I'd like to see them avoid on the pistol side.

[glockeyed]

it better not be a "rebadged" P22 or even P22 size.

90%-100% size of an M&P and it might the icing to sway me to the m&p line.

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

I don't mind if they do a complete pistol, and would prefer it if in the market in many ways, but it needs to EXACTLY match the dimensions of the real gun, down to the magazines.


I have a 22/45 for practicing my 1911, but those funky Ruger mags just don't handle like a 1911 mag. Really a lost opportunity for practing and grooving that mag loading skill.

[Alpha Sierra]

Advantage Arms is also limited by their 10-round capacity, thanks to being in California. S&W wouldn't have these limitations.
If you are saying that AA cannot produce magazines with greater than a 10 round capacity for sale elsewhere because they are based in California, then you will be disappointed in S&W as well since Massachusetts has the same onerous magazine capacity laws as CA.

I think your conclusion about the reason for a lack of AA mags with more than 10 rounds is not correct.

[GLOCKMASTER]

If you are saying that AA cannot produce magazines with greater than a 10 round capacity for sale elsewhere because they are based in California, then you will be disappointed in S&W as well since Massachusetts has the same onerous magazine capacity laws as CA.

I think your conclusion about the reason for a lack of AA mags with more than 10 rounds is not correct.

Straight from Advantage Arms website:

Are you going to offer High Cap Magazines?

NO. High cap magazines are illegal to manufacture or sell in California, which is where our factory is located.

I have high hopes for the M&P .22 pistol as I really like the M&P 15-22 rifle. I finally found a AA conversion kit for my G19 and so far I have found it to be a great training tool espcially when used in conjuction with the .22 rifle. The M&P pistol would be just icing on the cake.

[DrMark]

From the Advantage Arms site:


Frequently Asked Questions for Glock Kits

Are you going to offer High Cap Magazines?

NO. High cap magazines are illegal to manufacture or sell in California, which is where our factory is located.

[John_Wayne777]

IIRC making a magazine that holds more than 10 rounds of .22LR in a handgun is difficult from a reliability standpoint. Most .22 semi-autos hold in the neighborhood of 10 rounds because double stacking them is an invite to pain and woe.

[RogerinTPA]

Anyone find any pics of this pistol?

[GLOCKMASTER]

Anyone find any pics of this pistol?

I doubt very seriously you will find any. If they have one at SHOT between SMGLee and myself I'm sure we will get some taken.

[maximus83]

If S&W delivers the pistol, and if Tactical Solutions actually delivers a conversion this year too, given the reputation of TacSol for usually doing quality work, I'll go with the conversion. However, if TacSol delays in their conversions delivery, and if the S&W pistol ships and looks solid, I'll get one.

[skyugo]

any word on pricing? i'd be interested if it was ~300 dollars... would blow the p22 out of the water.

[Rotor Talker]

About a threaded 1/2 X 28 version.

Allow for use with the Outback 2.

Thanks

Bob

[C4IGrant]

About a threaded 1/2 X 28 version.

Allow for use with the Outback 2.

Thanks

Bob


They are aware of the importance of doing a threaded barrel option.


C4

[C4IGrant]

any word on pricing? i'd be interested if it was ~300 dollars... would blow the p22 out of the water.

No idea and we might not even get pricing at shot.


C4

[orionz06]

IIRC making a magazine that holds more than 10 rounds of .22LR in a handgun is difficult from a reliability standpoint. Most .22 semi-autos hold in the neighborhood of 10 rounds because double stacking them is an invite to pain and woe.

That has also been what I had heard. The curve of the AR conversion magazines enables a greater capacity, but I cant imagine how a curve could be implemented in a pistol while keeping the manufacturing process as simple as it is.

I cant wait to see where this goes, as I was looking into a full size pistol, and this would definitely sway may towards S&W.

[scottryan]

They are aware of the importance of doing a threaded barrel option.


C4



Are they going to screw it up like they did on the M&P Spec Ops?

[C4IGrant]

Are they going to screw it up like they did on the M&P Spec Ops?

No idea. I would assume no, but then again, I didn't know that the "spec ops" was screwed up (never saw one as it is NOT an LE gun).



C4

[scottryan]

No idea. I would assume no, but then again, I didn't know that the "spec ops" was screwed up (never saw one as it is NOT an LE gun).



C4


The MP Spec Ops has its shoulder .020" too far forward and will not allow the proper installation of most silencers.

SW couldn't just get on the same industry 9mm standard that HK, SIG, Steyr, Glock, and Walther are on.

The buyer of a SW MP Spec Ops needs to have the shoulder turned back on a lathe if they want to use a silencer.

[FlyAndFight]

They are aware of the importance of doing a threaded barrel option.


C4


That is good to know.

[FVC3]

Here's hoping those who made it to SHOT can give us the straight story on this.

[DMR]

I cruised the S&W booth yeasterday and did not see one.

[LonghunterCO]

The MP Spec Ops has its shoulder .020" too far forward and will not allow the proper installation of most silencers.

SW couldn't just get on the same industry 9mm standard that HK, SIG, Steyr, Glock, and Walther are on.

The buyer of a SW MP Spec Ops needs to have the shoulder turned back on a lathe if they want to use a silencer.

I saw a post on a SWR industry forum (posted by SWR) that they made some adjustment to their Trident 9's threads that allow for the Spec Ops barrel to fit without issue.

[C4IGrant]

I cruised the S&W booth yeasterday and did not see one.

Correct. They didn't make it to Shot.

C4

[M&P45]

IIRC making a magazine that holds more than 10 rounds of .22LR in a handgun is difficult from a reliability standpoint. Most .22 semi-autos hold in the neighborhood of 10 rounds because double stacking them is an invite to pain and woe.

For what it's worth Kel-Tec just announced a 30 round .22magnum pistol.


Back to the conversion debate. I will not buy a dedicated .22 M&P pistol. I would buy a conversion for my PRO for cheap practice. I had my trigger tweaked by Dan Burwell and don't want to have to do that for the .22 as well. Practicing with two distinctly different triggers wouldn't fit my needs as a competitive shooter. I'll hold out for the Tactical Solutions conversion.

[maximus83]

For what it's worth Kel-Tec just announced a 30 round .22magnum pistol.


Back to the conversion debate. I will not buy a dedicated .22 M&P pistol. I would buy a conversion for my PRO for cheap practice. I had my trigger tweaked by Dan Burwell and don't want to have to do that for the .22 as well. Practicing with two distinctly different triggers wouldn't fit my needs as a competitive shooter. I'll hold out for the Tactical Solutions conversion.

Ditto. It's just me I guess, but I have no more interest in another dedicated .22 "look alike", which will likely have a totally different trigger and internals. Same thing on the AR platform. I understand S&W's business position which is that apparently, it's expensive and technically complex to implement "conversion" uppers and the like, but I think that a conversion unit is really what I want, both on my AR's, and on my M&P's.

[JohnnyMcEldoo]

Is there any more information out there regarding an M&P .22lr pistol?

[LandCruiser]

I would like to know as well....we are now past the first quarter of the year...

[LandCruiser]

Any word on this?

[JHC]

I think signals got crossed about an M&P pistol.

It's been out for a good while now. :D

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_766315_-1_757996_757781_757781_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

[skyugo]

I think signals got crossed about an M&P pistol.

It's been out for a good while now. :D

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_766315_-1_757996_757781_757781_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

ah crap, so no 22 pistol based on the M&P handgun then? bummer.

[JHC]

ah crap, so no 22 pistol based on the M&P handgun then? bummer.

Oh hell man, I don't know. I was half tongue in cheek and half serious. Maybe 60/40.

[LHS]

I think signals got crossed about an M&P pistol.

It's been out for a good while now. :D

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_766315_-1_757996_757781_757781_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

Kind of off-topic, but will the upper for this interchange with the normal M&P-15/22 lower? If so, I can see another Form 1 in my future...

[LandCruiser]

I think signals got crossed about an M&P pistol.

It's been out for a good while now. :D

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_766315_-1_757996_757781_757781_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y


ah crap, so no 22 pistol based on the M&P handgun then? bummer.


Oh hell man, I don't know. I was half tongue in cheek and half serious. Maybe 60/40.

I am definitely only interested in the M&P .22 handgun that mirrors the rest of the full size handgun lineup. Is there any word on that? It was rumored to come out in the summer of 2010 and it is officially now fall....

[shadowrider]

Here ya go guys.

Now lets see if it really happens...

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2010/12/20/sw-mp22-22-pistol/

[LonghunterCO]

Here ya go guys.

Now lets see if it really happens...

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2010/12/20/sw-mp22-22-pistol/

Outstanding! Very cool! Hope that we can get one threaded too!

[5566]

Any word on whether this will have interchangeable backstraps?

[longball]

This is the first I have heard of this. I'm game. Any new ideas on a release?

[virtualpm]

Saw this the other day over on the MP-Pistol forum.

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/72002

Rumor is it should be on dealer shelves around April 2011.

Scott

[scottryan]

Well an MSRP of $419 doesn't sound very promising and seems to put it in with other trash products like the Walther P22 and the Sig Mosquito.

I wonder if SW will **** up the threading for the 3rd time, since they couldn't get their other previous two threaded barrel pistols correct.

[longball]

I have high hopes that S&W will put out a better product than Sig and Walther did. If they do, I'll pick up the first one I can get my hands on, if not I'll leave it alone and keep practicing malfunction drills with my Misquito. To date, that is about the only thing I've found it is good for. Any idea on how close the dimensions will be to the rest of the M&P line?

[virtualpm]

I have high hopes that S&W will put out a better product than Sig and Walther did. If they do, I'll pick up the first one I can get my hands on, if not I'll leave it alone and keep practicing malfunction drills with my Misquito. To date, that is about the only thing I've found it is good for. Any idea on how close the dimensions will be to the rest of the M&P line?

Looks like it's pretty darn close to the FS in size. According to posts at MP-Pistol, it will be formally announced at SHOT in a couple of weeks. Rumor has it, they will also be announcing a single-stack M&P. I was hoping for a mid-size double-stack, ala Glock 19/23, but it doesn't look like that's gonna happen (though I imagine the single-stack will likely be "mid-size"). Can't wait for SHOT.

Scott

[Trumpet]

Aluminum slide. I hope TS makes one with a steel slide.

[TheSmiter1]

Aluminum slide. I hope TS makes one with a steel slide.

Aluminum is considered sufficient for a .22 most of the time. The Advantage Arms conversions are aluminum, and while mine is finicky, it certainly is durable enough.

[LonghunterCO]

Wonder if Grant has the 411 on this pistol?

[MichaelD]

Wonder if Grant has the 411 on this pistol?

Actually, there's a lot more info about the M&P22 in this thread: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=69145

[LonghunterCO]

Actually, there's a lot more info about the M&P22 in this thread: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=69145

Thanks man- I subcribe to this thread and did not realize that there was yet another.

[hals1]

IIRC making a magazine that holds more than 10 rounds of .22LR in a handgun is difficult from a reliability standpoint. Most .22 semi-autos hold in the neighborhood of 10 rounds because double stacking them is an invite to pain and woe.

What he said.

[hals1]

From S&W web site.
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_785503_-1_757781_757781_757781_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

[LonghunterCO]

From S&W web site.
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_785503_-1_757781_757781_757781_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

Excited to see it in their site, but was really hoping that the thread barrel was going to be available right out of the shoot!

[ElrodCod]

From S&W web site.
http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product4_750001_750051_785503_-1_757781_757781_757781_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

It's interesting that they're saying it's single action instead of DAO.

[znztivguy]

Is it out yet? Is there anyone out there that has a lead for me.
THanks

[sro579]

I'm crossing my fingers this turns out to be a good one. It will keep me from buying another advantage arms kit.