View Full Version : NJ - Preacher's toe touches school lawn, gets arrested.
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=122604
A New Jersey judge has dismissed a criminal case against a volunteer who was preaching the Gospel on public property in front of the Edison, N.J., High School when his toe inadvertently brushed the grass and he was arrested.
The case has been detailed by the Alliance Defense Fund, which takes on civil rights and religious rights cases nationwide.
The order dismissing the case against Robert Parker was signed by Judge Travis Francis.
"Christians shouldn't be arrested and charged as criminals for expressing their beliefs on public property. They have the same First Amendment rights as anyone else in America," said ADF-allied attorney Demetrios Stratis of Fair Lawn.
"A person cannot be charged with a crime just because a school official has a complete misunderstanding of the First Amendment or doesn't like what that person has to say. We are pleased that we prevailed in court in getting these unwarranted criminal charges dropped," he said.
According to the report issued yesterday by the ADF, Parker "was taken into custody after his toe touched the grass on the school's side of the sidewalk. He was charged with trespass and disorderly conduct."
It was last May when Parker was sharing the Gospel from a public sidewalk outside the high school after students were dismissed for the day.
The school principal came out and told him to leave, whereupon Parker explained his First Amendment free speech and free exercise of religion protections. Dissatisfied, the principal called police.
According to the ADF, when officers arrived they took control of the situation and instructed students "not to go near Parker."
The principal then insisted that Parker be arrested.
"While speaking with officers, Parker's toe brushed against the grass along the school side of the sidewalk. The officers arrested him and issued him a summons for 'defiant trespassing,'" the ADF reported.
The events leading to the arrest were recorded on video.
Stratis later filed a motion to dismiss the charges with the Superior Court of New Jersey, Middlesex County, and the court ordered the dismissal. The Edison Municipal Court later followed the order.
Are you ****ing kidding me?!?!
Persecution of Christians and Christianity is a much too common occurrence now and days. The fist amendment has almost been totaly forgotten. What ever happened to "In God We Trust".
Wait I forgot, we are no longer a nation founded on christian values but a nation of politicaly correct drones. I wonder if a buddhist monk would have recieved the same treatment on the side of the road? Really?
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=122604
Are you ****ing kidding me?!?!
Now you know why I avoid that state like the plague. Several powerful attornies have told me to steer clear. In their words "its a police state".
Ruski, about that pesky 1st Amendment thing, according to Rahm Emmanual, he stated just the other day that " the 1st amendment is over rated ". Interpet that statement however you will but to me it shows utter contempt and total disrespect to the Constitution and our Rights.
The assholes that locked the preacher up should be fired if not incarcerated for breaking their oath they swore to, which is is part to" uphold and protect the Constitution"
The preacher should lawyer up asap because there's a whole slew of charges these ****heads can be sued for. ( lawyers/lawsuits aren't my preferred method of solving problems but in todays litigous society, it seems the only recourse)
aaaaah.... I love my state!
Now when I say that most of the local PD in NJ are a bunch of tool bags you guys can not come down on me. This is but one example of how dumb some if not most of them can be. I make a very importnat distinction between the small town PD like Edison and the town I live in and the State Police of LEOs in areas like Newark, Trenton and Camden. Those guys have to deal with some hardcore sh*t. But towns like Edison, cops have nothing better to do.
Having said that, For those of you who are not familiar with NJ. Edison is about 95% Indian. This was most likely due to a non-christian having a problem with christian values being spread in front of the school.
tracker722
01-22-10, 10:04
******
Heavy Metal
01-22-10, 10:22
If those LEO's are going to let the Principal make them his personal lap-bitches, they need to consider a career re-adjustment.
Brushing grass defiant tresspass? Give am an effing break!
FromMyColdDeadHand
01-22-10, 10:30
1. Preaching on the sidewalk in front of a high school has to be about as effective as a ROTC table in the commons at Berkley.
2. How much you want to bet the grass had grown over the sidewalk a bit.
3. Jesus freaks creap me out, but it freedom of religion, not freedom from religion.
4. I bet ACORN gets invited in.
rubberneck
01-22-10, 10:37
Indian? As in Hindu? Or native American? Come on, religious intolerance is still a violation of civil rights.
My great-grandmother was a full-blooded Creek. Because of intolerance my grandfather would not let my cousins and I play "cowboys and indians" because of the racial predjudice he had to endure as a boy. He would also not allow us to even speak of our heritage. Now it seems as though every other person you talk to has native American blood.
If they are native American, they of all people should know better. If they are Hindu, once again, they should know better if they remember the caste system in India and Pakistan.
India Indian not native American.
As much as I want to get worked up over this report I have to consider the source. WND is almost as reputable as the National Inquirer. They might have gotten parts of the story right but I wouldn't be shocked if they left out some important facts to push their story line.
rubberneck
01-22-10, 10:52
FWIW a quick check of google shows that the group defending him, the ADF, is an anti-gay group masquerading as a religious freedom group. They also have ties to that piece of shit Fred Phelps. I think there is much more at play here than some innocent preacher just trying to spread the word of god. I wouldn't be surprised if he was trying to provoke the police so that he could then claim religious persecution and they stupidly fell for it.
My facts:
1st Amendement: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Board of Education of Kiryas Joel Village School District v. Grumet, 512 U.S. 687 (1994), Justice David Souter, writing for the majority, concluded that "government should not prefer one religion to another, or religion to irreligion."
Persecution of Christians and Christianity is a much too common occurrence now and days.
I believe that this is just a backlash for all of the the things the Christians have gotten away with in complete disregard of the first amendment over the years. (See next)
What ever happened to "In God We Trust".
This was added to our coins in 1864, requested in a letter from Reverend M. R. Watkinson, Minister of the Gospel from Ridley Township, Pennsylvania. The last line from his letter: "This would make a beautiful coin, to which no possible citizen could object. This would relieve us from the ignominy of heathenism. This would place us openly under the Divine protection we have personally claimed. From my heart I have felt our national shame in disowning God as not the least of our present national disasters."
It wasn't out national motto, on our linen currency until 1954, at which time "Under God" was added to the pledge of allegiance as well. This was during "The Red Scare"
I think it's pretty obvious that these actions do show preference to not only religion, but a religion in specific. These things should have never happened and are unconstitutional in my opinion.
Wait I forgot, we are no longer a nation founded on christian values but a nation of politicaly correct drones.
This nation was NOT founded Christianity. Nor was is founded on Christian Values. Just because a majority of our values are common with Christian values, does not mean we had to take them from Christianity. For the majority of societies, Murder, Rape and Stealing were considered bad long before Christianity ever even existed.
This link has some interesting information about God and the founding of our nation. http://www.earlyamerica.com/review/summer97/secular.html
With that said, I would expect for some preaching any religion or irreligion to be treated the same way. You can preach across the street or you can go through the proper channels and obtain permission to hold an event on school property. Do I think arresting someone after their toe touched the grass is a little extreme? Yes. Do I think that the account of the events show some obvious bias in defense of the trespasser?
"when his toe inadvertently brushed the grass and he was arrested."
Yes, where is the video?
As much as I want to get worked up over this report I have to consider the source. WND is almost as reputable as the National Inquirer. They might have gotten parts of the story right but I wouldn't be shocked if they left out some important facts to push their story line.
Ask John Edwards how reliable the National Enquirer is :p They are the ones who broke the story on his "love child" years before anyone else had even thought of it. Outside of that I think it's a shit rag, but hey, they did get something right.
JLSKIP, bear my children.
My facts:
This nation was NOT founded Christianity. Nor was is founded on Christian Values. Just because a majority of our values are common with Christian values, does not mean we had to take them from Christianity.
Just saying I wanted to play along with this nonsense, have you ever heard of a Freemason? Know how many of our founding fathers were just such? Do you have any clue as to their documented influence on the Constitution and Bill of Rights?
Your statement is completely false. Judeo-Christian values are the foundation of America.
Let's NOT get this thread closed due to religious arguments, like the Trijicon thread, thay are endless and will not change anyone's minds. My intention was to discuss the merits of his being arrested for "defiant trespassing.
And in case you didn't hear Trijicon is removing the Bible references http://www.13wmaz.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=73979&catid=155 DO NOT COMMENT ON THIS! It's simply here for a reference for you to read on your own time since that thread was closed.
Just saying I wanted to play along with this nonsense, have you ever heard of a Freemason? Know how many of our founding fathers were just such? Do you have any clue as to their documented influence on the Constitution and Bill of Rights?
Have you ever heard of the YMCA? I'm not of the Christian faith, but I'm a member. :) Get my point?
I take it you did not read the link I posted with piles of facts that support my position.
I don't want the tread closed due to religious arguments, but if someone brings up the theory that this nation was founded on Christianity or Christian beliefs, I feel that it is completely in line to post facts that refute such claims.
Thomas Jefferson:
In a letter to Peter Carr, 10 August 1787, he wrote, "Question with boldness even the existence of a god."
In a letter to Ezra Stiles Ely, 25 June 1819, he wrote, "You say you are a Calvinist. I am not. I am of a sect by myself, as far as I know."
John Adams:
Adams, a Unitarian, flatly denied the doctrine of eternal damnation. In a letter to Thomas Jefferson, he wrote:
"I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved -- the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced!"
James Madison:
"During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution."
"What influence, in fact, have ecclesiastical establishments had on society? In some instances they have been seen to erect a spiritual tyranny on the ruins of the civil authority; on many instances they have been seen upholding the thrones of political tyranny; in no instance have they been the guardians of the liberties of the people. Rulers who wish to subvert the public liberty may have found an established clergy convenient auxiliaries. A just government, instituted to secure and perpetuate it, needs them not."
Benjamin Franklin:
"If we look back into history for the character of the present sects in Christianity, we shall find few that have not in their turns been persecutors, and complainers of persecution. The primitive Christians thought persecution extremely wrong in the Pagans, but practiced it on one another. The first Protestants of the Church of England blamed persecution in the Romish church, but practiced it upon the Puritans. These found it wrong in the Bishops, but fell into the same practice themselves both here [England] and in New England."
Thomas Paine:
"Of all the systems of religion that ever were invented, there is no more derogatory to the Almighty, more unedifiying to man, more repugnant to reason, and more contradictory to itself than this thing called Christianity. "
You were saying . . .
That being said, I have no reservations about buying a Trijicon product. When it comes to the civilian market, aka private funds, Trijicon has the right to put whatever they want on it and I have the right to buy it or not.
rubberneck
01-22-10, 13:06
Ask John Edwards how reliable the National Enquirer is :p They are the ones who broke the story on his "love child" years before anyone else had even thought of it. Outside of that I think it's a shit rag, but hey, they did get something right.
That's why I said WND is almost as reputable as the national inquirer. While they occasionally get a scoop they are wrong too often to take them at face value.
I don't know how you can write a story like this and not give any background? Why was he protesting at a high school? What was he protesting? Was it a peaceful protest before arrests were made? Was he yelling at children as they arrived or left school grounds? If he was out there carrying God loves you signs that is one thing but if he was pulling a Fred Phelps move and carrying a sign saying that god wants the kids of that school dead because they have a gay student organization than it is a different story IMHO. Either way the coverage was crap and it deliberately gives one side of the story while ignoring the other.
Indian? As in Hindu? Or native American? .
Dot, not feather. :eek:
JLSKIP
I have to respectfuly disagree with you. Though I agree with you one some points such as some values have existen before Christianity, I would have to agree with SafetyHit.
Though some of the founding fathers shared by opinion and posibly yours and were infact atheists, a great many of them were very faithful christians. And though most government symbols are Masonic in nature and not Christian, to be a Freemason, from what I know, you do not have to believe in any specific god, be it Christ, Budha or Yahweh, but you have to believe in a gad. Seeing as how the founding fathers were most likely all of some christian denomination or another, I would say its a safe bet that this country was founded on Judeo/Christian values.
Now, Personaly I am an atheist, but I am in no way offended when people say this country is a christian nation. If anything, my parents being Jewish this could posibly upset me more, but it does nothing of the sort.
If this guy was prectching christianity and he got arested for it, then the cops who did it need stern kicks to the junk. However, if more facts come out to show that this guy was on the school lawn screaming "God Hates Fags" then the cops did the right thing.
You were saying . . .
I said Judeo-Christian values, not Christianity the religion specifically. I am aware of the shortcomings many founding fathers had with organized religion, sometimes Christianity itself. But this for the most part was not based upon their disdain of the long established core principles. I think you know this but are splitting hairs just to do so. However, I could be wrong.
And are the ten commandments part of our nations woven fabric? Perhaps you would dismiss their relevance as well?
Anyway, as far as the man preaching outside the school, it really is not the appropriate venue regardless of whether it's legal or not.
So, when I hear a story like this, knowing what I know about LEOs and my experience with street preachers, I simply :rolleyes: and assume he probably was doing something else to warrant his arrest and the media simply ignored it. (a shock to be sure)
Agreed. I bet there's more to the story.
"Toe brushing the grass." Really?
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