BCM SS410 Ionbond VS. Noveske Recon

[buckshot1220]

I'm looking to build a RECCE type rifle and can't decide between these two barrels. I'd be looking to get roughly 10,000 rounds from each hopefully maintaining MOA accuracy. So, what do you guys think? Please back up opinions with facts/data etc. whenever possible.

Thanks in advance.;)

[Robb Jensen]

I'm looking to build a RECCE type rifle and can't decide between these two barrels. I'd be looking to get roughly 10,000 rounds from each hopefully maintaining MOA accuracy. So, what do you guys think? Please back up opinions with facts/data etc. whenever possible.

Thanks in advance.;)

If you're wanting that kind of accuracy at 10K rounds I'd highly suggest a BCM hammer forged barrel.

[GermanSynergy]

Another option might be the Noveske N-4 Recce barrel. I'm still trying to shoot mine out :)

The only "issue" is that you have to purchase this barrel as part of a complete build, IIRC.

[buckshot1220]

Another option might be the Noveske N-4 Recce barrel. I'm still trying to shoot mine out :)

The only "issue" is that you have to purchase this barrel as part of a complete build, IIRC.


I know. I wish they would just offer the damn barrel:mad:

[Cameron]

Can't you buy the barrel from Noveske's supplier?

Cameron

[buckshot1220]

Can't you buy the barrel from Noveske's supplier?

Cameron


Who's their supplier?

[spamsammich]

As far as I know FN doesn't offer their barrels to the general public.

[FMJ556]

Isn't the Centurion midweight barrel more or less equivalent to the Noveske N4 barrel ? That might also work.

[royta]

I'd like to resurrect this thread as opposed to creating a new one. There is good info here that others may be able to use.

I would like to build a new rifle and am leaning towards a precision type 18" stainless barrel. Which 18" barrel is going to more accurate, the BCM SS410 or the Noveske SPR?

Here are some specs that I know of:

Noveske LINK (http://noveskerifleworks.com/cgi-bin/imcart/display.cgi?item_id=b-18-556&cat=158&page=1&search=&since=&status=)

$465
weight 38oz
10.5" intermediate gas length
1:7 twist - button rifling - improved polygonal rifling
5.56 Noveske Match Mod 0 chamber
416 stainless type
bead blasted finish - I like this

BCM LINK (http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-18-SPR-SS410-Barrel-with-Rifle-Length-Gas-p/bcm-recbrl%2018ss.htm)

$300
weight 40oz - found at TOS (http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=2&f=138&t=179421)
12" rifle gas length
1:8 twist - Button Rifled
5.56 NATO Match Chambers (USMC SAM-R Chamber)
410 stainless type
shiny finish - I don't like this.


Why is Noveske going with the intermediate gas length over the rifle gas length? Which would perform the best? Which chamber is tighter and better designed for accurate .223 Remington loads? Which rifling type is better?


The problem is that this new rifle will be used for coyote and hunting purposes, which means I'll be carrying and hiking with it in the field all day long. Noveske is releasing an 18" stainless lightweight barrel. All specs other than profile and weight will be identical to the SPR barrel. I found out about the LW barrel HERE (https://www.m4carbine.net/showpost.php?p=846237&postcount=68).

Now I'm starting to think the extra $165 to save 1/2 pound over the BCM SS410 might be worth it, that is as long as the Noveske stainless barrels are as accurate as the BCM stainless barrels. Also, the Noveske comes with a pinned gas block and a gas tube. The BCM is dimpled for a set screw gas block, but I guess I could always pay a gunsmith to drill and pin a gas block. The $165 saving is quickly disappearing now.


Suggestions??? Opinions???

[BAC]

The 1 in 7" twist is tighter than a 1 in 8" twist. Both are sufficient to stabilize anything you can feed from an AR-15 magazine. The 1 in 8" twist is pretty close to ideal for An AR in .223 Remington (something like 1 in 7.7"), but the 1 in 7" won't hurt anything. Both are found in some of the finest match barrels out there.

I would bet Noveske went with the intermediate gas system in the interest of dwell time. Going from memory, I believe the distance between the gas block and muzzle on an 18" barrel with intermediate gas system is the same (or nearly so) as that on the M4 and M16. I wonder if Noveske's intermediate is the same as KAC's intermediate...

The 416 vs 410 argument for barrel steel's been hashed out here before I think. A search should turn it up, but I think the short version is 410 has a higher sulfur content and is harder (more expensive) to machine but technically better. This is not to say 416 is bad, as evidenced by the quality of Noveske barrels.


-B

[royta]

The 416 vs 410 argument for barrel steel's been hashed out here before I think. A search should turn it up, but I think the short version is 410 has a higher sulfur content and is harder (more expensive) to machine but technically better. This is not to say 416 is bad, as evidenced by the quality of Noveske barrels.



Also, the Noveske 416 steel is a Rockwell of 30 or 32. John says it's harder than the M249 machine gun barrel stuff if I remember correct.

[BAC]

I think materials is more important for durability than it is for mechanical precision (accuracy potential). BCM, Centurion, Kriegar, Lilja, Lothar Walther, Mike Rock, Noveske, Pac Nor, and others all routinely make sub-MOA barrels using a variety of barrel steels, chambers, crowns, rifling, and twists. I think the important part is to get a barrel from a reputable company that accomplishes what you want for a price you're willing to accept.

Without someone grabbing statistically-significant samples of several versions each company's barrels, it's awful hard to say with certainty whose barrels are most consistently precise, most often.


-B

[royta]

Without someone grabbing statistically-significant samples of several versions each company's barrels, it's awful hard to say with certainty whose barrels are most consistently precise, most often.

Fair enough. Then I hope someone can focus on the pros & cons of chambers, gas length, and rifling type.

Thanks BAC.

[The_Hammer_Man]

I can only input a lil to this conversation about lengths of the two mentioned gas system lengths.

Noveske apparently had some issues with really light ammunition not cycling their weapons when using a suppressor. The shorter, albeit only .5" shorter, system seems to have solved that issue for them.

The standard rifle length (12") gas system appears to work fine, suppressed or unsuppressed.. so to be honest.. flip a coin as to which is "better".

The folks at Noveske turn out some fine weapons. I figure they know what they're talking about and haven't come up with a marketing gimmick but an actual fix to a perceived problem.