View Full Version : WA - Girl brutally attacked while security watches. (Video)
Follow link for video or for full size follow 2nd link. http://www.breitbart.tv/caught-on-tape-seattle-security-guards-stand-by-as-teen-girl-brutally-attacked/ Youtube link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHZZdV3woM0&feature=player_embedded
AP: Three security guards watched a group of teens punch, kick and rob a 15-year-old girl in the downtown Seattle Metro bus tunnel without intervening. Security video shows the guards call for help on their radios, but they don't go to the aid of the girl even as she is being kicked in the head. A dispute involving a group of 10 teens apparently started inside a department store the evening of Jan. 28 and moved to the bus tunnel at Westlake Station, where the girl was attacked.
KING-TV reports: The guards are not trained police officers or Metro Transit employees. They're contract workers from Olympic Security Services out of Tukwila. According to their contract, the guards are to "observe and report" problems, not to get involved. Metro Transit General Manager Kevin Desmond says that policy is now out of date.
I would've hoped that somebody, security guard or not, would've stopped this. It also shows that you can't fall for the false sense of security where you have paid guards standing around and that you must always be vigilent and assume responsibility for your own safety.
wow.. Active guard or not, the male instinct & human decency should have kicked in to defend a female. Spineless individuals. Reminds me of Kitty Genovese minus the fatality.
It was reported that the security company's policy is to "observe and report only'. Which is no damn excuse for not helping someone who is getting beat down right in front of them. :mad:
ivanhedrick
02-11-10, 11:17
that's chicken shit. nobody around did anything, they just stood there. wtf? I guess it's just the mentallity of people up north not to get involved with stuff like that.
My question to that Chicken Shit outfit that provided "SECURITY".
WTF is "SECURITY" for? If they are not "SECURITY" then get the hell out of there. I guess they have a totally different definition of "SECURITY". I'll bet if one of those "SECURITY" nitwits was being attacked in the same manor, one of those spineless aholes would have come to "His" rescue!
If "SECURITY" cannot provide "SECURITY" then there is absolutely NO point in them being there to take up tax payers dollars to provide a false sense of "SECURITY".
Can anyone tell my black and white world is a little upset at this kind of shit?
"Security" in this situation were unarmed people under contract to observe and report law breaking only. A statement by a Metro spokesman on the issue said the security did exactly what they were supposed to do. This incident got quite a bit of coverage/discussion on local talk radio 770 KTTH on the David Boze show.
The point was made that since "Security" isn't authorized to do anything to protect somebody being attacked, that their presence actually INCREASED the danger to the girl, who wrongly went to them asking for help instead of running.
that's chicken shit. nobody around did anything, they just stood there. wtf? I guess it's just the mentallity of people up north not to get involved with stuff like that.
As cowardly and sometimes reprehensible as it sounds, it is actually general human nature to not intervene. Part of it is due to a "someone else will do it" mentality. There are many documented incidents of inaction all over the country and the world.
Has to be seen to be believed.
Our inner cities are drowning in their own liberal induced slop.
It was reported that the security company's policy is to "observe and report only'.
No excuse at all for no getting involved, unless you look at it from the idea that they may be feeding their family and not wanting to get fired. Who is more important, your family, or someone you don't know?
We can talk all about it being a mans job to protect others, but there is a flip side to it. I've got no idea if that is what went through their mind, and I haven't watched the video, but I have responded to calls as a cop where a security guard was later fired for doing the right thing.
Our inner cities are drowning in their own liberal induced slop.
Work a high crime city as a cop, or paramedic for a few shifts and you would be for Roman justice on most of these places.
Saw this on another hunting forum and fox picked it up as well.
I think they failed her...don't care about the policy. You don't let an underage girl get treated like that with indifference.
No wonder so much of the world has no respect for us anymore.
"Worthless" doesn't even begin to describe those so-called security guards. The perp probably could have robbed and stripped them and they would probably still be standing around cluelessly in their shorts.
Disclosure--I lived on the Left Coast (and in the &&^% rain) for too long--so this is not hard to believe.
No excuse at all for no getting involved, unless you look at it from the idea that they may be feeding their family and not wanting to get fired. Who is more important, your family, or someone you don't know?
We can talk all about it being a mans job to protect others, but there is a flip side to it. I've got no idea if that is what went through their mind, and I haven't watched the video, but I have responded to calls as a cop where a security guard was later fired for doing the right thing.
I agree with Stickman. I have to put my family first and everyone else second. Of course I would approach this from a CCW standpoint and not a paid security job standpoint.
On one hand my goal is to protect myself if I'm alone and my family if they're with me. Everyone else, including a girl, like that is a distant second. If the security guard got involved he might be fired. If I got involved I might get shot and killed. I don't fault him.
My goal is get arrive home at the end of everyday and if that means not getting involved to help out a stranger then I guess I'll have to live with that. It might sound cold but that's my goal. Family first.
However, I really can't say how I'd react because I've never been in that situation. Maybe I'd realize that my family would want me to help someone and that they'd understand. Maybe I'd think about what I would want someone to do if that was my wife or daughter. I don't know...
I do know that I'm not going to judge those "security" guards. They made their decision and right or wrong they will have to live with this for a long time.
Slight change of subject; maybe this will wake some people up and they'll take responsibility for their own safety?
I agree with Stickman. I have to put my family first and everyone else second. Of course I would approach this from a CCW standpoint and not a paid security job standpoint.
On one hand my goal is to protect myself if I'm alone and my family if they're with me. Everyone else, including a girl, like that is a distant second. If the security guard got involved he might be fired. If I got involved I might get shot and killed. I don't fault him.
My goal is get arrive home at the end of everyday and if that means not getting involved to help out a stranger then I guess I'll have to live with that. It might sound cold but that's my goal. Family first.
However, I really can't say how I'd react because I've never been in that situation. Maybe I'd realize that my family would want me to help someone and that they'd understand. Maybe I'd think about what I would want someone to do if that was my wife or daughter. I don't know...
I do know that I'm not going to judge those "security" guards. They made their decision and right or wrong they will have to live with this for a long time.
Slight change of subject; maybe this will wake some people up and they'll take responsibility for their own safety?
I think this is a rather well articulated way to take the "security" out of security guard. How about we start calling them "radio responders"?
Not trying to be a dick to you, I just wonder where we draw the line sometimes. And yes, becoming a father has surely changed me as well. The incident I had in that parking lot last summer over the rap music blaster gave me a big-time awakening as to how close I came to missing my son grow up as a result of some soulless animal who would have been truly happy to take my life. But they are "security guards", are they not?
I think the answer is to equip them to do their jobs effectively and safely. Either that or just install cameras everywhere and have a couple officers on stand-by in a small sub-office.
apparently i'm the only one who, after watching the video, wants to strangle the stupid ****ing bitch child who had the nerve to not only do this to another person, but do it right in front of security. and her parents, if they're both still alive and/or know she exists.
cowardly on the security guards parts...? i don't know. they probably felt like lumps on a log, and are now probably mortified to be on television securing nothing. but they were doing their jobs as proscribed- observe and report. being the sole provider of a family, i find it hard to hold not getting fired against them... had they intervened, this wouldn't have made the news and they probably would have been fired and possibly sued.
on second though- it might very well have made the news, as the whole rowdy mob of teenagers got involved and someone got hurt and so forth. which would result in the guards' being publicly chastised FOR intervening with no training or authorization to do so.
i'm not playing devil's advocate here- i'm quite sure, if i had somehow ended up as a uniformed OAR guard, that i would have jumped in. job be damned, when we're talking about the defense of a human being.. but dont be too hard on these guys.
Work a high crime city as a cop, or paramedic for a few shifts and you would be for Roman justice on most of these places.
I really like this idea...
B
No excuse at all for no getting involved, unless you look at it from the idea that they may be feeding their family and not wanting to get fired. Who is more important, your family, or someone you don't know?
We can talk all about it being a mans job to protect others, but there is a flip side to it. I've got no idea if that is what went through their mind, and I haven't watched the video, but I have responded to calls as a cop where a security guard was later fired for doing the right thing.
I was thinking the same thing...
The "Security" guards were probobly thinking "Oh great, I go help her, end up hurting one of the kids attacking her, the company I work for and myself get sued, I get fired and cant pay rent"
Because you KNOW, that is EXACTLY what would have happend.
I think that having a security guard that cant help is stupid, might as well have cameras and have the camera operator call the police when they see an incident.
I think this is a rather well articulated way to take the "security" out of security guard. How about we start calling them "radio responders"?
Not trying to be a dick to you, I just wonder where we draw the line sometimes. And yes, becoming a father has surely changed me as well. The incident I had in that parking lot last summer over the rap music blaster gave me a big-time awakening as to how close I came to missing my son grow up as a result of some soulless animal who would have been truly happy to take my life. But they are "security guards", are they not?
I think the answer is to equip them to do their jobs effectively and safely. Either that or just install cameras everywhere and have a couple officers on stand-by in a small sub-office.
Let's be honest, they only have the title of "security guard" to make people feel secure. We know what the reality is but most people are conditioned to feel safe with that. It's like being told to call 911. We know that the whole incident could be over (literally) in a matter of seconds and that's why we take responsibility for our safety. Sadly most people feel that way.
I was thinking the same thing...
The "Security" guards were probobly thinking "Oh great, I go help her, end up hurting one of the kids attacking her, the company I work for and myself get sued, I get fired and cant pay rent"
Because you KNOW, that is EXACTLY what would have happend.
I think that having a security guard that cant help is stupid, might as well have cameras and have the camera operator call the police when they see an incident.
pretty much.. things like EAS devices at stores and uniformed OAR guards are no longer "deterrence." the criminals now know they don't, by themselves, do anything. better to either give them some training and authority to act, even if just limited, or do away with them to avoid a FALSE sense of "security."
For some of us, life and limb take priority over office/company rules (the benefit of being young and not supporting a family I guess). A - someone is is getting hurt, and B - I don't know that the people doing the beating/robbing aren't trying to kill them. If there's an opportunity to intervene, I'm gonna. That girl is someone's daughter.
Three adult men stand and watch a kid get beat and robbed right next to them and do nothing? Unbelievable.
-B
Dirk Williams
02-11-10, 14:47
The up side is that IF SPD catch's this rat pack they have several felony charges to hold them accountable. Robbery, ADW for each kick while on the ground, Conspiracy Etc, Etc.
The down side is that progressive liberals will interpete this as a simple misunderstanding and seek counceling for the poor misguided suspects.
"The security guards are all off on stress leave, and may have to retire from PTSD, They all hired publicity agents for book and movie deals, and they will be on Dr Phil next week."
This shit happens everyday every minute or so, somewhere in the USA. The courts have obsoleted the Constitution intentionally, via case law. Most citizens simply don't give a shit.
We have become a nation of ****ing SHEEP!.
Sorry for the rant, for what it's work I feel much better now.
Dirk
If one has such a thing as "MORALS", then I for one could not work as a "SECURITY" guard and be told ,"You will be a "SECURITY" guard, but just stand there like a dumb ****, because some one might sue you/us. Then find another line of work, or be "SPINELESS".
If they have all these "SECURITY" "CAMS" around, then whoever is monitoring them can dispatch just as fast as some standing there with there thumb up there ass watching.
Were those security guards wearing Blue Helmets?;)
Reminded me of the UN in Bosnia
Its amazing how the badguys always test & push the envelope of enforcement till they know what they can get away with. I'm certain the attacker was fully aware that the security could not do anything.
This is the kind of security that will most likely be provided in Gun Free Zones for protection:(
Until about 2 yrs ago, off duty Seattle PD officers provided security for this location (the metro tunnel).
Sound Transit, in their infinite wisdom, decided to cut costs and employ a private "security" comany to replace the more expensive cops.
It was predicted at that time that things like this would occur.
Big suprise.
The "security guards" are allowed to only "observe and report" would would be fired if they took action.
tracker722
02-11-10, 17:21
******
Cascades236
02-11-10, 17:41
that's chicken shit. nobody around did anything, they just stood there. wtf? I guess it's just the mentallity of people up north not to get involved with stuff like that.
up north? Grass grazers know no boundaries,tho outwest we do cater to the pussification of warriors so that the criminal can prosper
Cascades236
02-11-10, 17:50
[QUOTE=M4arc;569637]I agree with Stickman. I have to put my family first and everyone else second. Of course I would approach this from a CCW standpoint and not a paid security job standpoint.
On one hand my goal is to protect myself if I'm alone and my family if they're with me. Everyone else, including a girl, like that is a distant second. If the security guard got involved he might be fired. If I got involved I might get shot and killed. I don't fault him.
My goal is get arrive home at the end of everyday and if that means not getting involved to help out a stranger then I guess I'll have to live with that. It might sound cold but that's my goal. Family first.
QUOTE]
Thiese are not the words of a man.
Would a man wade blindly into a gang fight? Don't get me wrong, IMO this girl was using deadly force with those head stomps and a bullet would have been reasonable, but if you can pick and choose your fights and choose not to engage when you're disadvantaged or would put your family at risk..why would you?
A general response not a reply directly to the post above:
I have a daughter. I have a son. I need to provide for them and their mother . . . is on one side of the scale
I have a daughter. I have a son. I'd want somebody to step in if it was my kid, how can I want that and not be willing when it is someone else's kid?
Getting fired isn't the worst thing that can happen, watching the world sink a few notches closer to the abyss is worse & I say that from a pretty ugly seat in this show.
As a security guard myself i can attest to the fact that in security work there is a perpetual fear of being fired for acting above and beyond one's specific job description. at my job we are armed even though it is acknowledged by us that even if we were involved in a justifiable shooting we would probably be fired. the company doesn't really want us to be armed however they did arm us at the behest of one of their clients (the US gov't). our bi-annual firearms qualifications are a joke consisting of nothing but fairly static shooting of targets from standing positions. one reason for this is that many of my co-workers are too fat to move quickly or go prone (one guy is so obese he has to have help picking his spent magazines off the ground due to his inability to bend over). we have no clear use of force policy, and no intermediate option between a verbal command and lethal force since we are not given anything like pepper spray or tasers. On one of our job posts we have instructions to "detain" trespassers, but its never been explained how we do that since presumably we are not supposed to do so at gunpoint, we have no law enforcement powers, do not have handcuffs, and are not trained in anything but shooting paper targets. end result is that no trespassers are detained. we are still saddled with 10-round "clinton clips" and I've had the same duty ammo for over three years, many of us are having rounds come apart from being chambered so many times or getting bullets shoved too far into the cases since we were instructed to clear our Glocks at the end of every shift and re-chamber at the beginning of the next. (i rotate my rounds but what is the point after its all been chambered dozens and dozens of times?) but the company insists they "can't get" any more Speer 180 GDHP even though I see it in every shooting supply catalog i get in the mail. at this point i'm planning on buying my own to surreptitiously replace the ammo i currently have. and this security dept. i work for is in house.
a lot of contract security outfits are even worse when it comes to training.
so i use my own experiences in a dysfunctional security organization to perhaps understand the guard's reactions. when you work someplace where nobody trains you properly, does not provide an SOP, and you live in fear of being fired for doing anything, and you have a family to support...well as already stated...who is more important? your family, or a stranger?
this really isn't an excuse for allowing the girl to be pummeled but i can kinda understand why they might have done it given the sad state of security these days.
so i use my own experiences in a dysfunctional security organization to perhaps understand the guard's reactions. when you work someplace where nobody trains you properly, does not provide an SOP, and you live in fear of being fired for doing anything, and you have a family to support...well as already stated...who is more important? your family, or a stranger?
this really isn't an excuse for allowing the girl to be pummeled but i can kinda understand why they might have done it given the sad state of security these days.
This is becoming something a rather pathetic thread, unfortunately. While I respect your opinion, even I as Joe Schmo am not watching a teen girl get pummeled in front of me by another teen throwing only fists and kicks (as in no apparent weapon). And if there was a weapon, I would have to make a quick decision as to what to do there as well. However under no circumstance would I make it a fundamental rule to do nothing no matter what. And God help me were I ever to become so weak.
But especially as a patron being assaulted in front of the companies paid security personnel...well I would sure as fu*k expect a bit more vigilance. Whether the fault of the employer or the employee, someone wake the fu*k up and do their fu*king jobs.
[QUOTE=sabretom;569910]
Would a man wade blindly into a gang fight? Don't get me wrong, IMO this girl was using deadly force with those head stomps and a bullet would have been reasonable, but if you can pick and choose your fights and choose not to engage when you're disadvantaged or would put your family at risk..why would you?
Personally I would rather go down with a spine than not. Like the other poster said, "Would I want someone to help my kid, or to just stand there and record play by play an inhumane act. It was not a big gang fight, there were enough to out number that little bitch that needed to shown that it won't be tolerated on there watch.
Don't be spineless and find all kinds of excuses to abandon your fellow human in a time of need. For GOD so loved the world he gave his only son for EVERYONE.
Circle 10, I am not degrading you and apologize if it appeared that way. I respect the job you do and know it can be thankless. That said, after seeing that video and reading some of these responses, I am very concerned that this type of mentality has permeated any institution designed to protect the public.
No offense intended.
Most of the blame belongs to the Mr. M.T. Suit's who demand a passive one-size-fits-all policy. And fire anyone who violates it.
Circle 10, I am not degrading you and apologize if it appeared that way. I respect the job you do and know it can be thankless. That said, after seeing that video and reading some of these responses, I am very concerned that this type of mentality has permeated any institution designed to protect the public.
No offense intended.
these guys probably have ZERO hand to hand training, ZERO arrest or detention training, have only their own life experience to go on. they've probably never even been in a physical confrontation in their lives, never even been in a situation that called for quick decision making, attended public schools with "zero-tolerance" policies on fighting and have been indoctrinated their whole lives to not interfere with things that are above their station- like public safety. NOW add to to all this the fact that their own employer has expressly forbid them, under pain of termination, from actually intervening in any situation that might arise on their "watch."
makes for people who aren't going to do anything.
and they live and work in Little California.
it's a systemic failure.. i obviously have little respect for the guys, but i find it hard to blame them for the situation. if i'd been a bystander, i most definitely would have interfered, probably attempted some citizens' arrests, and probably screamed at the guards for assistance, and they may very well have complied, with a little motivation. i imagine most of us here would have responded this way too... but we're not these guys.
Circle 10, I am not degrading you and apologize if it appeared that way. I respect the job you do and know it can be thankless. That said, after seeing that video and reading some of these responses, I am very concerned that this type of mentality has permeated any institution designed to protect the public.
No offense intended.
I didn't take it that way don't worry. I was just trying to provide the experiences and perspective of a rent-a-cop who tends to feel like his hands are tied by his own employers.
like i said that sort of mentality and work atmosphere is common in security organizations. it doesn't excuse the behavior of the guards in the video but may potentially explain it.
David Boze (AM 770 KTTH) was again talking about this situation today and supposedly Metro security policies are going to be "reviewed" because of this incident. Whether or not policy will actually change remains to be seen.
http://www.king5.com/news/investigators/County-Exec-orders-review-of-Metro-Transit-security-policies-84035842.html
these guys probably have ZERO hand to hand training, ZERO arrest or detention training, have only their own life experience to go on. they've probably never even been in a physical confrontation in their lives, never even been in a situation that called for quick decision making, attended public schools with "zero-tolerance" policies on fighting and have been indoctrinated their whole lives to not interfere with things that are above their station- like public safety. NOW add to to all this the fact that their own employer has expressly forbid them, under pain of termination, from actually intervening in any situation that might arise on their "watch."
makes for people who aren't going to do anything.
and they live and work in Little California.
it's a systemic failure.. i obviously have little respect for the guys, but i find it hard to blame them for the situation. if i'd been a bystander, i most definitely would have interfered, probably attempted some citizens' arrests, and probably screamed at the guards for assistance, and they may very well have complied, with a little motivation. i imagine most of us here would have responded this way too... but we're not these guys.
i've never had anything like a fight occur at my job, but I can say that situtaions where i'd assist somebody on simple good samaritan grounds when OFF the clock I become apprehensive about when faced with the same scenario while ON the clock. between simple company regulations and the fact that you could wind up the target of a union grievance if you do anything outside your immediate job description it tends to make us very cautious about what we do when at work.
Wow.
I just watched the video, and that girl was getting her head hit hard into the concrete. Wow.
I'm not a tough guy or a large guy, but I would hope that if I were in a situation where that was hapening to your baby girl... I would at least jump on top of the girl on the ground and use my body to shield her from the attack. I know I would likley end up hurt as well, but I could likely take the hits from a smaller/thinner kid better than that small framed child on the ground.
Maybe after it ended I would be charged with sexual assault for jumping on the girl, but damn... I don't think even a softy like me could do nothing. If it's my girl getting attacked...please help her! I'll do it for yours.
Maybe it's a sign of my youth or over exuberance, but can someone explain to me, how in a country that not only generally "roots" for the underdog, backs the underdog physically/financially how shit like this occurs? I also have 2 kids and family to make it home to every night but I'll be damned if I could sit and watch something like that go down without offering some kind of assistance. Even if it meant getting my ass kicked or worse "which in my case is highly likely" i.e. not a ninja.:p I can't imagine explaining to my children how I saw and did nothing when that is precisely the exact opposite set of morals I'm in the midst of trying to teach them! If someone needs help and you know it...help them! I understand jobs are tough to come by, but in my case sleep would be tougher to come by when I went to bed that night realizing I had let my fellow human being down when they needed someone the most. At some point we have to hold ourselves to a higher standard don't we?
i most definitely would have interfered, probably attempted some citizens' arrests, and probably screamed at the guards for assistance, and they may very well have complied, with a little motivation. i imagine most of us here would have responded this way too... but we're not these guys.
I agree...what is most disturbing is why wasn't at least ONE of those guys like us??
I too have zero training and the other experience as you mentioned, but the victim was looking to them for help and not ONE of them had a spine??
a voice with an aggressive tone demanding compliance to stop along with getting between the two gals like a ref at a boxing match could have stopped the situation before the head stomping much less WHILE it was happening??
These guards are ROAD employees...Retired On Active Duty. They need to check what's in their shorts and I hope they are eating a chit load of crap from every person they run across.
i can't speak about security guards anyplace else but in NY most of them are worthless. as someone said in an earlier post it make the grass eaters feel safe. i did not watch any of the videos about this because they drive me nuts when i see crap like this and these guards sit around and call for help. some one should pull their man cards.
pilotguyo540
02-11-10, 21:20
We are a different sort of people on here as a whole. We all have a commonality that tends to be diametrically opposed to inaction and cowardice. The fact of the matter is we should not have to discuss the merits or detriment of employment loss over doing the right thing. The right thing should always be done. This girl needed immediate help and no one was adult or alpha enough to take control of the situation. That is an outrage on every level. I think this lemming mentality can only survive in the urban environment, however that may only be wishful thinking.
The fact of the matter is we should not have to discuss the merits or detriment of employment loss over doing the right thing. The right thing should always be done.
i sometimes forget that i claim to be a deontologist myself. i agree with the above statement 100%
all ethical questions can be answered by this one question: what's the right thing to do, regardless of all other variables? the answer to that question should be the answer to all questions.
It looks really bad because it was 2 girls, and wouldnt have taken much to keep them apart. It wasnt like it was 2 huge guys in a knife fight. That company should be fired and real police used, the few dollars they saved is not going to cover the lawsuit that will be coming from this.
wow.. Active guard or not, the male instinct & human decency should have kicked in to defend a female. Spineless individuals. Reminds me of Kitty Genovese minus the fatality.
exactly.
ThirdWatcher
02-11-10, 22:32
...and they live and work in Little California.
In some respects, Washington is MORE liberal than California. You guys better knock it off before you hurt someone's feelings.
http://www.komonews.com/news/local/84183272.html
Latest news story, the unarmed guards have been replaced by armed uniformed King County Deputies.
"King County Executive Dow Constantine said Thursday at least one uniformed, armed deputy will be deployed at each of five tunnel stations as an interim step during a review of the contract with the firm that employs Metro guards."
Too little too late?
crusader4x
02-12-10, 03:34
Two facts not mentioned on this thread but were reported by local radio show:
1. A metro employee spoke to a local radio host and admitted that he would NOT intervene if a lady was being RAPED in the back of HIS bus. He claimed that, (in my paraphrase), "Someone has got to be on the radio calling for help."
2. The altercation began in a Macy's where the it escalated and the teens were told to leave. The victim approached a Seattle POLICE OFFICER to ask for help, the POLICE OFFICER simply pointed her to the transit station.
From http://www.mynorthwest.com/?nid=11&sid=283173
At the department store, two Seattle police officers noticed the escalating situation and kicked the group out of the Macy's, then brought the girl and her friend to another exit, the victim said. She reported that she asked the officers for an escort to the bus tunnel, just below the department store, but the officers refused.
This is a local story here, and I find it comical that the mother of the attacker blames the girl that got attacked more at fault than her little spawn of Satan she is raising. :rolleyes:
This is a local story here, and I find it comical that the mother of the attacker blames the girl that got attacked more at fault than her little spawn of Satan she is raising. :rolleyes:
thats the nature of the problem with these little ****s.. these are the same parents that'll argue with the principle about why their kid's gotten suspended, the same parents that'll scream at store security that their kid didn't steal something they know damn well the shithead DID steal. zero ****ing responsibility or accountability.
these are also the same people on TANF and foodstamps and state-provided medical (although this last one's going to become more and more common even among non-leeches), they're also the same people in section 8 housing and they're all the same people that would FREAK OUT if anyone tried to tell them they werent 100% entitled to all this tax-paid shit.
so naturally, it's somebody else's fault.
In some respects, Washington is MORE liberal than California. You guys better knock it off before you hurt someone's feelings.
Wow, I don't really want to debate the issue but how do you figure? Most of the idiots in this state moved here from California.
Anyways, on the radio they said the guys involved in this are adults and are being charged with 1st Degree Robbery a class A felony, which could get them some serious time in prison. The minor will probably get probation or something ludicrous like that. I remember reading that you have to steal a bunch of cars here before you do any time as a juvenile, but maybe that isn't the case with a violent crime like robbery.
Our inner cities are drowning in their own liberal induced slop.
Yep. All over the country...
"Observe and report". Then, in all human decency, go the aid of the girl and intervene.
That is the problem with the world, complacency. The "I don't want to get involved, but it is fun to watch" crowd. Screw the security company policy. If they got fired for helping the victim, I'm sure the public outrage would have been loud enough for them to keep their jobs. But these cowards chose the low path making them no different than the attackers and just as complicit.
The problem with that analysis is that there would have been no news report to incite public outrage. Look at the title of this thread to understand why this is a national story: it is very sensational sounding.
If they had intervened, the fight may or may not have been broken up, they would both have been fired, and other than the people directly or indirectly involved would even know it happened.
And I can confirm Circle 10's comments 100%. When I did my security guard training, it was made explicitly clear you are there to observe and report only... and that if you get involved, you do so at your own peril, and short of saving the Presidents daughter or something like that you will be immediately terminated.
I guess it's just the mentallity of people up north not to get involved with stuff like that.
Yeah, based strictly on location we can ascertain how someone will react! :rolleyes: Good call!
ThirdWatcher
02-12-10, 07:22
Wow, I don't really want to debate the issue but how do you figure?
Because I've helped police this state for 30+ years, that's how I figure.
No excuse at all for no getting involved, unless you look at it from the idea that they may be feeding their family and not wanting to get fired. Who is more important, your family, or someone you don't know?
We can talk all about it being a mans job to protect others, but there is a flip side to it. I've got no idea if that is what went through their mind, and I haven't watched the video, but I have responded to calls as a cop where a security guard was later fired for doing the right thing.
That's all well and good, and I can understand one not wanting to lose their job. But I look at it this way, if it was me, I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I stood there and did nothing and that situation ended up with the girl dying from her injuries.
http://www.examiner.com/x-4525-Seattle-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2010m2d11-Charges-backlash-follow-bus-tunnel-beating-what-can-citizens-actually-do
By now, the whole country has seen the brutal bus tunnel beating of a teenage girl that has every talk jock in Seattle gainfully employed and has even made national headlines on Fox News’ O’Reilly Factor and Hannity programs.
It’s a good distraction from the Washington Legislature’s move to raise taxes in the Evergreen State, and it will also distract people – at least locally – from discussing the likelihood that the Obama administration may just go for tax increases on the middle class, as reported by Business Week.
Charges were filed against the 15-year-old girl who can be seen on the video punching, kicking and stomping the victim. She was accompanied by at least three older males, identified as Latroy Demarcus Hayman, 20, Tyrone Jamez Watson and Dominique Lee Whitaker, both 18, all now accused of first-degree robbery.
I am appalled by the sight of uniformed guards standing by while a person was kicked and beaten. ... People have an expectation of safety when riding public transit, and we must take every measure we can to assure that."—King County Executive Dow Constantine
The so-called “security guards” didn’t intervene, and just stood by essentially as spectators. Allegedly, prior to the attack the 15-year-old victim had sought help from two Seattle police officers, and was essentially ignored, according to published reports. That girl also allegedly pepper sprayed one of the men about 30 minutes prior to the attack.
What could a private citizen have done in the presence of such an attack?
The applicable state statute is RCW 9A.16.020, which covers use of force other than lethal force. Under that statute, Paragraph (3), the use of force is legal “Whenever used by a party about to be injured, or by another lawfully aiding him or her, in preventing or attempting to prevent an offense against his or her person, or a malicious trespass, or other malicious interference with real or personal property lawfully in his or her possession, in case the force is not more than is necessary.”
Clearly understandable language; a private citizen may intervene to prevent injury to another person. If you see some 15-year-old getting stomped and beaten right in front of you, it’s acceptable under state statute to intervene. The statute also notes that you can use force, provided that the force “is not more than is necessary.”
This is where we enter a gray area, however, and it is at this legal line in the dirt where private citizens often turn away because they are not willing to face prosecution or civil lawsuit for, say, slamming some thug teenager into a brick wall in order to discourage further physical attack. In this case, pushing the teenage attacker away may have quickly escalated into a gang attack. There is no indication from the video that Latroy, Tyrone or Dominique tried to discourage the beating, and court documents suggest the juvenile suspect was encouraged to mount the attack.
Credit for fleshing this story out must go to KING’s Susannah Frame, and KIRO FM’s Dave Ross weighed in Thursday morning to reveal the background behind this attack, which appears to involve considerable rivalry between the two 15-year-olds. Both did outstanding jobs. Still, teen rivalry does not justify this kind of beat-down, especially with an entourage that outnumbers the “security guards” in close proximity.
Frame’s well-done report revealed additional video before and after the actual attack, including an image of one suspect fleeing with a bag that had been taken from the victim. Ross dug through court documents to find the prelude to this incident.
If convicted as charged, two of the adult defendants, Latroy D. Hayman, 20, and Dominique L. Whitaker, 18, each face a sentence of 2 ˝ years to 3 ˝ years in prison. The third adult defendant, Tyrone J. Watson, 18, faces a sentence of three to four years in prison…One of the male suspects, Whitaker, told investigators that the victim had pepper-sprayed one of his friends before the tunnel beating, charging documents allege.-Seattle Times
Would it have been legal for an armed citizen to intervene and hold the suspects at gunpoint? Probably not, though it might be argued that intervention with the threat of lethal force may have been necessary to stop what could have been a lethal attack, and detain those responsible. Stomping someone on the head can produce fatal injuries, and there is one significant precedent in Seattle – the justifiable shooting death of Daniel Culotti by Kenneth Miller in Westlake Plaza in October 2006 in broad daylight in front of several witnesses – that should have clarified the right of self-defense when someone is being kicked and stomped. Culotti was not armed, but he had knocked Miller to the ground and was brutalizing him when Miller drew his legally-concealed .357 Magnum revolver and fired. Of course, Culotti was an adult and a male, the teenager charged in the bus tunnel attack is a girl, and nobody (especially not me) is suggesting that she should have, or even could have, been shot over this.
It is pure speculation, and this kind of incident would need to be fully sorted out by Prosecutor Dan Satterberg’s office. Bottom line: Don’t go into the bus tunnel looking to play hero in a similar scenario.
The popular expectation is that soon there will be a far more visible presence of police in the tunnel, to make sure that an incident like this never happens again.
This one should not have happened in the first place.
Cascades236
02-12-10, 17:11
[QUOTE=Cascades236;569919]
Personally I would rather go down with a spine than not. Like the other poster said, "Would I want someone to help my kid, or to just stand there and record play by play an inhumane act. It was not a big gang fight, there were enough to out number that little bitch that needed to shown that it won't be tolerated on there watch.
Don't be spineless and find all kinds of excuses to abandon your fellow human in a time of need. For GOD so loved the world he gave his only son for EVERYONE.
Now now, I was just offering some perspective, on why another poster, who was being ridiculed, may have posted what they did. Making absolute statements, such as "you arent a man unless.." about dynamic situations is foolish...which is what I commented on. Keep the religious rhetoric.
I'm with you...we play for the same team. The beating doesn't disturb me, being surrounded by a bunch of on lookers not helping almost does...
The king county sherrifs department is already grossly understaffed, taking even more off the road isn't the answer.
Submariner
02-12-10, 19:05
Think of the many times there has been posted some variant of the following:
Malone: "You just fulfilled the first rule of law enforcement: make sure when your shift is over you go home alive. Here endeth the lesson."
Their duty is to be good witnesses, testifying as to what they saw, to put the animals away.
You just fulfilled the first rule of law enforcement: make sure when your shift is over you go home alive. Here endeth the lesson."
Now you are dragging the police into this? Bad move.
videos like this is why I hope my girl will like some kind of martial arts training and keep at it ? in the small chance it happens I hope she would turn around and crack some bones !!!!!
I dont know the story ? did she deserve it ? or was she innocent ?
still should have been broken up
A buddy of mine has a daughter that is wrestling. She is like 9 yr old and beautiful and after watching her wrestle I now think little girls should not be allowed to wrestle with boys... she is kicking all the boys asses on the mat and probably ruining their confidence and self esteem for life;)
She will definitely never be a date rape victim:p
Guys - these "guards" are not sheepdogs. Sheepdogs are screened out. If they make it through the hiring process and do something against policy (observe and report only), they are removed.
So you end up with the sheeple thinking that a sheepdog will save them from the wolves, when in fact the "guards" are only sheeple dressed in sheepdog attire.
The wolves know this up front.
This stuff didn't happen when there were sheepdogs down in that tunnel, but transit wanted to save money, so they replaced them with "guards".
that's chicken shit. nobody around did anything, they just stood there. wtf? I guess it's just the mentallity of people up north not to get involved with stuff like that.
That is chickenshit but not the cultural northerner thing you might think. Might be an urban thing. Rural north isn't that much different than what you're familiar with.
Seems to me the guards are just as responsible as the girls that did the crime..
BRAVO1
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