View Full Version : EMP (Electro Magnetic Pulse) Question
I have been reading up on this and have learned quite a bit. Seems to be pretty straight forward, the greater the yield and higher the altitude the better. Anything plugged in gets zapped, anything receiving transmissions from something that is plugged in gets zapped (I think). And it seems to go beyond that.
But what are our known safeguards, especially military? Are we prepared?
Any educated feedback would be much appreciated.
I had heard vacuum tube / valve devices aren't effected. I also heard years ago Russia has back up communications using valves in case of emp. I can't verify that though, hear say.
I had heard vacuum tube / valve devices aren't effected. I also heard years ago Russia has back up communications using valves in case of emp. I can't verify that though, hear say.
I also read this, but thank-you. Looking for a more practical means of protection. Or at least a plausible theory. Something fairly low-tech.
There is specific reason I ask this question and it is not to protect my "doomsday bunker". All help is greatly appreciated.
canucklehead
02-12-10, 18:52
Faraday cage around whatever you don't want fried.
Faraday cage around whatever you don't want fried.
Fantastic information, I knew I had missed something like this. Thank-you very much. A foundation that I will need and hopefully utilize to an extent.
Generally speaking EMP will be the highest at the ground zero, common sense. So in any surface detonation if you're close enough to get hit by the EMP you're most likely close enough to experience the blastwave and the fallout, EMP is not going to be at the very top of the list to survive. I can explain more later but the lady's calling me to dinner, got to go...
Generally speaking EMP will be the highest at the ground zero, common sense. So in any surface detonation if you're close enough to get hit by the EMP you're most likely close enough to experience the blastwave and the fallout, EMP is not going to be at the very top of the list to survive. I can explain more later but the lady's calling me to dinner, got to go...
i kinda thought the OP was referring to a standalone EMP device.. ie not a nuclear weapon. as i understand it's basically a big coil antenna stuffed with high explosives. that's at least the cheap and dirty way to make one. :confused: read a thing on popular science about it awhile ago.
edmorseiii
02-12-10, 20:06
Fantastic information, I knew I had missed something like this. Thank-you very much. A foundation that I will need and hopefully utilize to an extent.
Apparently a grounded ammo can protect small electronic devices, but I think you need to replace the rubber gasket with some form of conductive material. Maybe steel wool?
Ridge_Runner_5
02-12-10, 20:55
Generally speaking EMP will be the highest at the ground zero, common sense. So in any surface detonation if you're close enough to get hit by the EMP you're most likely close enough to experience the blastwave and the fallout, EMP is not going to be at the very top of the list to survive. I can explain more later but the lady's calling me to dinner, got to go...
A nuke detonated in the ionosphere (10-25mi above ground) is the most effective means to EMP the widest area...
This (http://www.cecer.army.mil/facts/sheets/FL16.html) was an interesting read when I first found it.
-B
I asked a comms guy about this once, one of those rare, no-kidding 300# brain guys. Only phrase I understood was "gallium arsenide latticework," and then my skull caught fire.
Yep, unless you got the cash to create layers of of conductive material(mesh or not) around protected electronics to absorb enough of it, forget about it. You might as well go lead lining to protect against kryptonite.
hmm - how would an Aimpoint T1 standup against EMP?
dmancornell
02-12-10, 22:21
I asked a comms guy about this once, one of those rare, no-kidding 300# brain guys. Only phrase I understood was "gallium arsenide latticework," and then my skull caught fire.
An EMP produces an intense electric field. When conventional semiconductor fabrication (CMOS, for example) is exposed to such a field, it induces a very short but very large voltage difference across the transistor junction. Think of the junction as a thin film that you can alter the permeability to allow stuff to flow through or not. When a massive pressure is allowed on one side of the film, it will simply burst (i.e. breakdown) and stop functioning.
Protections include manufacturing transistors with highly resilient layout (thick gates in a ring configuration), or using new semiconductor materials such as gallium arsenide or silicon carbide. It is expensive and not available to civilians.
If concerned, build a faraday cage. Wrapping stuff up won't do anything.
Heavy Metal
02-12-10, 22:33
http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1549/1
A nuke detonated in the ionosphere (10-25mi above ground) is the most effective means to EMP the widest area...
Also known as a high altitude burst, you are correct, the EMP would blanket a large area on the ground as well as take out satellites. As far as non nuclear devises, you can shield electronics, but I've never been trained in the military or researched how to do that on my own. My thoughts are to just be prepared, in the event that something like that does happen, to rely on non-circuit board electronics. Just another reason to buy an old American muscle car.
P.S. I also heard at the gun store that EMP will melt Glocks and cause the brakes to fail priuses!
Heavy Metal
02-12-10, 22:46
Also known as a high altitude burst, you are correct, the EMP would blanket a large area on the ground as well as take out satellites. As far as non nuclear devises, you can shield electronics, but I've never been trained in the military or researched how to do that on my own. My thoughts are to just be prepared, in the event that something like that does happen, to rely on non-circuit board electronics. Just another reason to buy an old American muscle car.
P.S. I also heard at the gun store that EMP will melt Glocks and cause the brakes to fail priuses!
Why not read the article I linked to?
Rayrevolver
02-12-10, 22:57
I read on the net you can use a microwave as a faraday cage. I asked a EE buddy and he said that was true.
I just found this:
http://preparednesspro.wordpress.com/2009/06/18/emp-101-part-iv-faraday-cage/
There was an internet story called "Lights Out" that I read a lot of the way through. It was about the US after an EMP attack. Interesting and entertaining.
theblackknight
02-12-10, 23:18
I had heard vacuum tube / valve devices aren't effected. I also heard years ago Russia has back up communications using valves in case of emp. I can't verify that though, hear say.
I believe that.The guitarists of this forum know all about tube power and pre amps. Some missiles might still use preamp type tubes like the 12AX7. EMP wasnt something we really went over alot in NBC school.
citizensoldier16
02-12-10, 23:42
I also heard years ago Russia has back up communications using valves in case of emp. I can't verify that though, hear say.
This may be a spin-off of something else. I believe what you might be referring to is known loosely as "Dead Hand" and sometimes as "Perimeter" by the intelligence community, and has to do more with nuclear missiles rather than EMPs. It's designed, not necessarily around and EMP, but around the possibility of Russia sustaining a massive first-strike attack but yet being able to respond. The idea was that if the top Russian leaders were killed and its command structure disrupted or completely destroyed, Dead Hand would send out launch orders to its missiles via low-frequency antennas. In effect, Dead Hand could launch missiles even with no one left alive to turn the keys. Kinda scary...
Although some theorists and writers insist that Dead Hand/Perimeter does not exist as suggested, most information I have read and/or been exposed to concludes that not only does it still exist but it is still fully functional.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Hand_%28nuclear_war%29
Anyone interested in EMP and it's effects should take the time to read, "One Second After". It is an eye opener to say the least...
Fog
Ridge_Runner_5
02-13-10, 02:09
Anyone interested in EMP and it's effects should take the time to read, "One Second After". It is an eye opener to say the least...
Fog
+1
That book is messed up.
I read on the net you can use a microwave as a faraday cage. I asked a EE buddy and he said that was true.
I just found this:
http://preparednesspro.wordpress.com/2009/06/18/emp-101-part-iv-faraday-cage/
So i read that you can have an instant Faraday cage with a galvanized trash can or a large stock pot. How would you ground those. Also would you have to ground a microwave?
http://www.thespacereview.com/article/1549/1
Excellent, thank-you.
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