View Full Version : Marketable skills
I love the fact that after serving my country for 8 years as a navy firefighter I get out to find that I have no marketable skills, not even in civilian firefighting! I should've been a G-----mn Jarhead, at least I'd have desirable experience for law enforcement or security and had more fun while I was in.
Don't mind me guys I'm just venting, as the bills are piling up and I'm not good at this college shit.
Business_Casual
02-18-10, 17:10
I suppose you have rejected the idea of rejoining and getting an MOS that would transfer to the civilian world?
M_P
I'm 31 and kind of wanting to plant roots up here in washington. I've served my time, 4 deployments, achieved the rank of E6 in 6 1/2 years, been there done that. I just wish I had more show for it other than good stories.
My best friend was an AB in Crash & Salvage for 8 years and was able to go to the hot shit Federal Fire Academy in Texas. He recently passed away at 34 years old and was unable to pursue his civilian dream of becoming a firefighter but this could be an option for you as well if you were to reenlist and get it in your contract, just a thought. FYI - We both did our first 4 years on the Lincoln based out of Everett and did a yard period in Bremerton getting kicked out of every bar in town :)
At the fire academy.
http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/7259/lfa7d865a1d86ddc7bf61c3.png (http://img297.imageshack.us/i/lfa7d865a1d86ddc7bf61c3.png/)
http://img203.imageshack.us/img203/5922/l57ced041df8342a7059655.png (http://img203.imageshack.us/i/l57ced041df8342a7059655.png/)
High Desert
02-18-10, 17:48
A word of encouragment.
You do have marketable skills.
1. You know how to show up to work everyday, ontime.
2. You know how to follow direction.
3. You know how to do it right the first time.
4. You know the importance of team work.
5. You understand their is a big picture and you have a part in that mission.
There is no doubt its the toughest market in a long time.
However, when I am hiring people, if skill set is close to equal.. I take the veteran every time.
I know this does not pay the bills, but you need to know what you learned in the service has value.
Best Regards,
HD
It might be that jobs simply don't exist, I know a lot of cities have but a stop to all new hiring since their budget are all f$%ked up due to loss in tax revenue. So I wouldn't worry.
SeriousStudent
02-18-10, 20:54
As a former Jarhead 0331 (M-60 machine gunner) I feel your pain. I was qualified to be an outstanding janitor when I graduated from the University of Science, Music and Culture.
High Desert is right, though. You learned a great deal as a Sailor.
And in case no one else will tell you, I appreciate your service to our country, and thank you for it. I wish you the best of luck in school.
Belmont31R
02-18-10, 20:56
Glad I went Army commo.... :cool: $$$
glockshooter
02-18-10, 21:05
Why don't you look into one for the federal jobs in the firefighting field. I have a friend that is a fireman on a military post here in Va. He is a civil service guy not military. You as a mil veteran do get a leg up on federal jobs versus a non veteran.
Matt
Hang in there - it is a very tough economy.
High Desert is right - you have proven to have the core skills people will want. I too would higher a vetran over a non vet.
You never know when you might come across another vetran.
Go to community college as long as you can, get 60-90 credits, preferably in some career track that isn't going away anytime soon (IE the medical field, criminal justice, etc). It's cheaper, more laid back, don't buy books unless you have to, copy them or get them through the inter-library-loan. Go to school year round and you'll be through it in no time. If you can only take a little bit of it at a time, that's fine too.
I've met former LEO's who were on oral boards, they were just looking for smart, level headed people with good ethics, and a reasonably clean record. Sounds right up your alley. Some areas of the country are still hiring for it.
High Desert had some sage advice.
tracker722
02-18-10, 22:20
******
I was aviation life support for 5 years in the Marines, kind of in the same boat. Except I want to get into law enforcement. Shit happens man, use that GI Bill to get an education in what ever you want to do, go to a fire academy and be a fireman. Whatever. GI Bill it up and use those skills mentioned above, showing up to work on time, following orders and so on.
I truly appreciate all your guys encouragement, as I said earlier I'm just venting a bit. On good news, I was chatting with a former marine in class tonight and got a lead on job, it's nothing spectacular but it'll hopefully be enough to keep the bills at bay while i'm in school and I start volunteering with a FD when they hire in a few months.
tracker722
02-18-10, 23:44
******
Preferred User
02-19-10, 08:15
FWIW USAJOBS has numerous positions listed with the Interior, Bureau of Land Management and National Park Service for fire fighters. Unfortunately not in WA, just ID & UT. But it is a good place to watch.
In WA:
East Pierce Fire and Rescue (http://www.eastpiercefire.org/file_viewer.php?id=606&dt=pdf)
Spokane County Fire District 8 (http://www.scfd8.org/divisions/human_resources.asp)
and 28 hits on Indeed including Bonney Lake, Everett, San Juan County, Bainbridge Island and more
Firefighter Washington State (http://www.indeed.com/q-Firefighter-l-Washington-jobs.html)
Outlander Systems
02-19-10, 09:43
Chillax, dude.
For what it's worth, this is quite possibly the worst job market in 80 years.
Don't sell yourself short...like others have mentioned.
I got out in 1972 after 3+ years as a BOMB LOADER in the USAF. Try finding a job with those qualifications. LOL.
Best of Luck and Thanks for your Service!
FN in MT
FWIW USAJOBS has numerous positions listed with the Interior, Bureau of Land Management and National Park Service for fire fighters. Unfortunately not in WA, just ID & UT. But it is a good place to watch.
In WA:
East Pierce Fire and Rescue (http://www.eastpiercefire.org/file_viewer.php?id=606&dt=pdf)
Spokane County Fire District 8 (http://www.scfd8.org/divisions/human_resources.asp)
and 28 hits on Indeed including Bonney Lake, Everett, San Juan County, Bainbridge Island and more
Firefighter Washington State (http://www.indeed.com/q-Firefighter-l-Washington-jobs.html)
This is nice, unfortunately that fact that I was a Navy Firefighter for 8 years doesn't count to a single hour of work experience leaving me at the same level as an 18yo high school grad. It takes on average 1.5-3 years to get hired onto a fire dept. Military experience gives you an extra 5 or so points during that process no matter what your MOS or rate was in service.
VooDoo6Actual
02-19-10, 12:43
Sorry to hear of your circumstance and situation.
I hear your frustration w/ ruthless compassion.
Your right it does SUCK big time.
If it's it's any comfort YOU are not alone, as there are MANY people are in your shoes.
WE need to get the right people in office to make it happen next time around.
I hear and see it all the time in my travels. I travel a lot and I cannot believe our own government is so misinformed and disjointed.
I feel very forutnate to be working at something I enjoy.
I hope you get some breaks and find some good opportunties etc.
Stay focused and positive, tough times don't last BUT tough men do....
This is nice, unfortunately that fact that I was a Navy Firefighter for 8 years doesn't count to a single hour of work experience leaving me at the same level as an 18yo high school grad. It takes on average 1.5-3 years to get hired onto a fire dept. Military experience gives you an extra 5 or so points during that process no matter what your MOS or rate was in service.
I was an 11B. I go out in 1990. I spent 3 years doing odd jobs (worked at a health club and worked as a rent-a-cop. During that I was going to school. Community college at first and then on to a university. Along the way I started at IBM as an academic part timer. By the time I left IBM in 2004 I held the titles of Systems Analyst, Network Engineer, and Project Manager. My point is all is not lost.
I understand your frustration a bit. I went through this with my best friend. He went in as a 95B (MP) and got out thinking that he would be picked up by a local agency. I recall his frustration and anger when he found out that the agencies looked at him as if he had no experience and he had to go to the academy (on his own dime). Thankfully he had the GI Bill.
So my advice, be frustrated, but while you are working through that, apply to an academy and college and put your GI Bill to work. Right or wrong, you ain't the only one to go through this and you won't be the last.
A word of encouragment.
You do have marketable skills.
1. You know how to show up to work everyday, ontime.
2. You know how to follow direction.
3. You know how to do it right the first time.
4. You know the importance of team work.
5. You understand their is a big picture and you have a part in that mission.
There is no doubt its the toughest market in a long time.
However, when I am hiring people, if skill set is close to equal.. I take the veteran every time.
I know this does not pay the bills, but you need to know what you learned in the service has value.
Best Regards,
HD
Amen. And these are the hardest things to find these days. It's amazing how many people I know have Master's Degrees and can't show up for work on time. I don't give a damn how smart you are, if you're not here at work you are of no use.
You do have to find an employer that appreciates these things, however.
Military experience gives you an extra 5 or so points during that process no matter what your MOS or rate was in service.
Not necessarily.
Wednesday I was offered a job at Ft Leonard Wood only to have the offer rescinded the next day because I did not qualify for veterans preference. The reason was that I did not serve at the right time, 84 to 88. So don’t assume that just because you served for four years that you will get VP.
tracker722
02-19-10, 15:39
******
If you're really interested in a law enforcement career, I guarantee your military experience will help you. I can also state with confidence that NO specific military branch or MOS is more desireable than another when applying for police jobs. What is important is the fact that you served and gained from your experience and that you were able to work within a command structure.
I've been a cop for 22 yrs in Washington and had to spend 6 months on administrative duty about a year ago. I spent that time in recruiting so I have a good handle on what agencies (at least ours) are looking for. If you or anyone else is interested in talking about it, feel free to send a PM. Even in tough economic times we're always looking for GOOD recruits. FYI we are one of a few police agencies I know of that have firefighting positions within the department.
Whatever you decide remember that you make your own way in life and very few people are ever handed anything.
I am not a fan of trade unions due to politics, but I have known a few guys that went through apprentice programs and learned great skills and did very well. You have to be willing to travel to wherever the next project is (could be cross state or cross nation depending on union) and be flexible for the apprentice years but after that your pay goes way up and you start getting more choices. Metal working (welding, cutting etc.), electrical and I believe pipe fitting (gas lines, etc.) are the trades I have seen work out well.
You earn money while being trained. Kind of depends on your region and the type of trade but I would at least ask around and see if there are trades in demand and looking for hard working apprentices. I bet many union guys would have above average respect for an E6.
Besides the other "skills acquired" listed previously I suspect you also have:
- proven leadership of xx number of personel on a daily basis
- delivering OJT and formal training, and managing the training of your subordinates (perhaps even developed training class or materials)
- MSDS expertise? Hazmat?
- Communications skills (like writing reports, updating superiors with status, briefing suboirdinates or officers, etc.)
- Planning and organization
You would be flabbergasted at the abysmal level of "worker skills" in corporate America these days. I have worked with several former active duty military and I have always been impressed about several aspects they take for granted but are not typical in the commercial workplace:
- SOP to keep superiors and subordinates informed in a timely and organized manner
- .mil folks usually have responsibility for much more equipment and personnel than vast majority of commercial workers at the same pay rate or skill level
- military does far more training year in and year out than most companies: you are probably used to going to lots of classe and as an NCO I bet you had to organize or assist subordinates in planning and acquiring training
My suggestions:
- check out the trade unions no matter what you think of them politically, or how bad you think they are hit by the economy. check out every union local in your community as some are obscure and who knows what opportunity lies therin (just don't come back and tell us how great Obama is)
- Put a lot of thinking and REVISING/EDITING into your resume even if looking for a trade job; this will force you to think of what you learned and practiced in the military in terms that are applicable to any organization
- Keep in touch with your military buds; the guys I know could always count on a bud in the reserve or active duty for unclassified technical information or troubleshooting ideas or ideas in general
- Can you start your own business? Do you have hobby skills or skills you picked up in the Navy that could be applied to a business offering? Could you provide a service (training?) to the local fire depts? Can you sell products or consulting in some ares you have above average knowledge? I think small business is one of the best ways to get around the poor jobs market if you have the knack for doing this. Selling products or services to a few businesses that themselves cater to well-to-do clients is often more successful than straight consumer retail.
Thank you for your service to our country and I wish you every success, soon!
theblackknight
02-19-10, 17:56
Not necessarily.
Wednesday I was offered a job at Ft Leonard Wood only to have the offer rescinded the next day because I did not qualify for veterans preference. The reason was that I did not serve at the right time, 84 to 88. So don’t assume that just because you served for four years that you will get VP.
I hope that pay was good, FLW is a friggen hole.
This is nice, unfortunately that fact that I was a Navy Firefighter for 8 years doesn't count to a single hour of work experience leaving me at the same level as an 18yo high school grad. It takes on average 1.5-3 years to get hired onto a fire dept. Military experience gives you an extra 5 or so points during that process no matter what your MOS or rate was in service.
Most fire departments are not going to accept ANY prior experience, and you will start at the very bottom. For example I was a paid firefighter in the same state as the new department I joined, also had prior volunteer experience and a 4 year fire science degree. I still had to go through rookie school with everyone else, I also had to retake every certification even though I was already certified by the state.
I love the fact that after serving my country for 8 years as a navy firefighter I get out to find that I have no marketable skills, not even in civilian firefighting! I should've been a G-----mn Jarhead, at least I'd have desirable experience for law enforcement or security and had more fun while I was in.
Don't mind me guys I'm just venting, as the bills are piling up and I'm not good at this college shit.
11 year Navy Veteran here....I feel your pain...and it PISSES me off that the civilian sector does NOT do MORE to help folks like you out.
theblackknight
02-19-10, 19:12
Most fire departments are not going to accept ANY prior experience, and you will start at the very bottom. For example I was a paid firefighter in the same state as the new department I joined, also had prior volunteer experience and a 4 year fire science degree. I still had to go through rookie school with everyone else, I also had to retake every certification even though I was already certified by the state.
Really? WTF? Im a CBRN guy and i figured all these HazMat Tech certs I have would be friggen money if I decide to kick out. Ive kinda been thinkin about going coast gaurd. I dont see the economy getting better anytime soon.
To the OP... Thank you for your service! I know the good wishes don't pay the bills. As many have said, stay positive follow a goal and things will work out. Best of luck in your future.
Civilian fire departments might take certs from NPQ or IFSAC, but like I said most are going to retrain you their way even if you have already been through it. I dont know if anyone watched the Fox reality show- The Academy, a bunch of those guys were certified paid fire fighters from CA and they had to go through rookie school just like the new guys.
The part your experience plays in, you have a better chance of getting hired which helps alot if there are 5000 applicants for 20 jobs. It will also help you get through rookie school, and through out your career.
I hope that pay was good, FLW is a friggen hole.
Well it paid better then unemployment, and Spokane isn’t exactly paradise.
QuietShootr
02-19-10, 21:35
I love the fact that after serving my country for 8 years as a navy firefighter I get out to find that I have no marketable skills, not even in civilian firefighting! I should've been a G-----mn Jarhead, at least I'd have desirable experience for law enforcement or security and had more fun while I was in.
Don't mind me guys I'm just venting, as the bills are piling up and I'm not good at this college shit.
Aw, bullshit. Outside of a very narrow niche of jobs, being an infantryman doesn't mean shit to anyone on the outside.
dookie1481
02-20-10, 01:08
Aw, bullshit. Outside of a very narrow niche of jobs, being an infantryman doesn't mean shit to anyone on the outside.
ain't that the ****in truth
variablebinary
02-20-10, 09:54
There is a shit load of tuition assistance and scholarships available to those in the military, and veterans
Take advantage of it. Go to school and get the skills you need to become more employable.
I personally didnt care about gaining marketable skills when I joined, and think it's a mistake for anyone to assume that being a great soldier translates to be being a successful citizen on any level. A significant portion of employers dont give two shits that you risked life and limb while serving.
Plan accordingly, especially for those that want a combat arms MOS.
Take a look at some of the fire fighting jobs in Iraq and A'stan. The pay is good and I am pretty sure your MIL experience will count.
Take a look at some of the fire fighting jobs in Iraq and A'stan. The pay is good and I am pretty sure your MIL experience will count.
I have been thinking about getting a job in the middle east my self. Probably should get the passport process going.
99superduty
02-21-10, 00:39
I dont think vets jobs are a hot button issue right now because of the contract opportunities available overseas.
Guys right out of the service have the chance to make 6 figures right off the bat.
If you think its bad now wait until all this work dries up..........
^^Former Marine infantryman. Enlisted swine, busted back from Sgt two times. Work for Lockheed, high 5-figure salary that climbs every year. I'm doing a lot of the same stuff I did in the Corps; developing junior Marines, but for a buttload more money and now with the ability to tell 1stSgts to go F themselves.
There are 5 others on my team, all combat-arms backgrounds. We work around other combat-arms-background people (VGS, O'Gara Group, NEK, and others) who can tell you a similar story, make the same or better salaries. Given the current conflicts this nation is involved in, positions within the defense industry (while currently subject to the same maladies as other job areas given the state of the economy) do NOT represent a narrow field. If you're thinking of gigs outside the defense industry, then saying that nobody gives a shit is "Villiage of Duh, population: You."
Being Infantry, if you can't find a gig where your skillsets are considered desirable, I submit that you aren't looking hard enough in the right employment area, or that you need to rock that GI Bill and develop some new skillsets.
I can't swing a dead cat over my head at work without hitting some other 03xx jerk like myself.
Aw, bullshit. Outside of a very narrow niche of jobs, being an infantryman doesn't mean shit to anyone on the outside.
What are you looking at doing? Here is a link to check out.
http://www.fluor.com/CAREERS/PROFESSIONAL/Pages/logcap_iv_opportunities.aspx
I have been thinking about getting a job in the middle east my self. Probably should get the passport process going.
dookie1481
02-21-10, 03:08
^^Former Marine infantryman. Enlisted swine, busted back from Sgt two times. Work for Lockheed, high 5-figure salary that climbs every year. I'm doing a lot of the same stuff I did in the Corps; developing junior Marines, but for a buttload more money and now with the ability to tell 1stSgts to go F themselves.
There are 5 others on my team, all combat-arms backgrounds. We work around other combat-arms-background people (VGS, O'Gara Group, NEK, and others) who can tell you a similar story, make the same or better salaries. Given the current conflicts this nation is involved in, positions within the defense industry (while currently subject to the same maladies as other job areas given the state of the economy) do NOT represent a narrow field. If you're thinking of gigs outside the defense industry, then saying that nobody gives a shit is "Villiage of Duh, population: You."
Being Infantry, if you can't find a gig where your skillsets are considered desirable, I submit that you aren't looking hard enough in the right employment area, or that you need to rock that GI Bill and develop some new skillsets.
I can't swing a dead cat over my head at work without hitting some other 03xx jerk like myself.
I've heard this from a few other combat arms types over the last few years. I guess I just don't know where to look.
Jay
ETA: If you were busted down from Sgt. twice I think that you and I would get along LOL
What are you looking at doing? Here is a link to check out.
http://www.fluor.com/CAREERS/PROFESSIONAL/Pages/logcap_iv_opportunities.aspx
Small arms repair. It’s what I did when I was in the service.
Hit me up on PM. That's my field.
Small arms repair. It’s what I did when I was in the service.
Hey I know somebody already talked about it, but the resume is key. When I got out I worked at frickin Olive Garden for 6 months, it was a job and my kids enjoy eating daily:rolleyes:. While I was there I got some help with my resume from a dude that writes them for a living and once I got it sent out to a few folks I was able to pick which job I wanted.
A lot of military guys have trouble seeing how what we did matters on a resume, but there's ways to word your experience to make you look like Pimp-Master General.:D
I'd say take a class or ask some folks to look over it and make suggestions for you. You've got a lot more going for you than you realize.
PM me if you want and I'll show you what I'm talking about on my resume.
I've heard this from a few other combat arms types over the last few years. I guess I just don't know where to look.
Funny thing; you'd figure that when I push the usual end-of-class "Are there any questions?" that I'd get something having to do with one of the more obscure aspects about thermal or I-square theory and employment, how lazerz can cause permanent eye damage, or why the pellet thing that comes out of the open end of the boomy whatsis interacts with a reticle pattern the way it does.
No. 40% of the time it's a variation of "How do I get a job like yours?" For Marines, their first stop should be here: http://www.marineea.org/
Even if you don't network through it, they'll red-pen your resume for you and suggest other ways to word or format it to give you the most punch possible. You can hang your resume there, so that former Marines in the industry and companies that like hiring Marines can find you. You can get notifications of job fairs in your region. I'm sure that the other branches have similar organizations, though I don't think that MEA cares too much where you are matriculating from, jerkoff (sorry, but one shouldn't end a sentence with a preposition, so I add jerkoff or asshole, or Oprah...).
Monster, of course. I actually got hired onto my current program because somebody was tooling around Monster and I'd very recently updated my resume there. Which is a wonder to me, as I've NEVER heard of anybody getting anything besides the usual junk-mail insurance agent offers from Monster.
Other than Monster: http://www.militarystars.com/
Another place to hang the resume, and you get notifications of job fairs in your immediate area, even areas you might desire to relocate to.
If you have an active clearance (call this one for those 6mos or so out from transitioning): http://www.clearedjobs.net/
For those with clearances, only. Hang the resume here, too. Clearance-specific hiring events, though it'll be a LOT of network-security/IT wog gigs. If that's your bag, hit it like the fist on an enraged god.
I can't speak to the PSD, and similar, side of the house, so when I say "defense contract gig," I'm talking about training, curriculum development, T&E (engineering types, mostly, not always), logistics, budget analysts, acquisition specialists, technical writing (TM authoring, validation & verification), even warehousing. Hint: President Erkel has been "creating" something like 20-30k "new" jobs in the DoD. In reality, it's been encouraged that contractors get transitioned over to gov't jobs and fill the same slot, hence the jobs being "created" are really just some schlub getting his/her paycheck directly from Uncle Sam. Shuffling deck chairs on the Titanic that makes the administration look like they're Doing Something.... It usually also means cutting your brain stem so that you're incapable of thought or fine motor function, but while going for a gov't job can be a long, drawn-out process, it's more attainable these days because the positions are there.
Contractors generally make more $$$ for a given billet, but are the first cut if a program gets reduced or goes totally TU, which seems sorta unfair since they're the ones actually expected to be productive. Gov't GS positions are the Holy Grail, as you can hardly ever be fired except for stuff like fraud or getting into fist-fights with co-workers.
I can't stress the importance of personal networking during your active time, prior to your decision to retire or just get out because you can't take this @^#$%&^^@ any more! Whether it's biggies like Lockheed, General Dynamics, BAE or smaller ones like Columbia Group, MKI Systems (before L-3 gobbled them up) and the like, they tend to advertise their open positions on their own websites. Knowing where something you think you might like is often only possible because one of your pals that got out and landed a gig thinks something he found out about is right up your alley. Often, all he can do is get your foot in the door so that you can let your resume/character/bribe money (kidding!) speak for itself, but that's generally what it takes. If you've been out of the loop, you suck up your pride and call up old buddies. If they refer you, they often get a bonus from their company for the referral, so it can be a win/win for everybody. It's how I landed my first job, and I've gotten three of my brethren hired on to positions that fit their backgrounds; they are now my slaves.
Lots of words, but that's a thumbnail. Hit those sites, search for others, apply shotgun theory to your resume. Buy a decent suit. Cough up for a seminar on how to interview well. It can be frustrating, but with the application of diligence and an "inch toward daylight" mindset (be patient, don't stop plugging away), you can land a pretty decent job.
http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/8976/beefcake.jpg
dookie1481
02-23-10, 21:19
Wow, thanks for all the info. I will get to work on it!
Jay
YW. You end up landing something, you gotta let me know. I'll have the papers for indentured servitude drawn up by some Philly shyster.
the Bamster
02-23-10, 21:35
I'll see about one of those 2.5 million jobs I've created......... there has to be another one sitting around here somewhere.
These people worry about skills while you worry about doing the job right.
Napoleon Dynamite: I don't even have any good skills.
Pedro: What do you mean?
Napoleon Dynamite: You know, like nunchuku skills, bow hunting skills, computer hacking skills...
Pedro: Like what are my skills?
Napoleon Dynamite: Well, you have a sweet bike. And you're really good at hooking up with chicks. Plus you're like the only guy at school who has a mustache.
Update: still looking, very discouraged. I've stopped looking specific jobs and am now just looking for anything even entry level, haven't applied at Mcdonalds or any other fast food yet, "yet" being the key word there.
I did find my civilian equivalent in fire systems service companies, but 6 out of 7 companies I drove over to see were no longer there. Since I no longer have money to pay for college and wait for the reimbursement I'm no longer in school. Now I'm just a bum feeling sorry for myself but that'll only last till the morning when I gotta pull up the bootstraps and keep looking.
P.S. On a lighter note, I did find some old vinyl stickers I had made and thought I'd put them to good use.
http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/3382/dsc03669d.jpg (http://img30.imageshack.us/i/dsc03669d.jpg/)
http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/3708/dsc03668h.jpg (http://img526.imageshack.us/i/dsc03668h.jpg/)
Fire service companies quickly go out of business when the economy goes bad, it is the first thing cut out of budgets. Not the most stable industry even though the fire codes require it, there are not enough fire marshals to enforce it.
Getting on a fire dept is a long process, I am going through it now, but I hear that a lot are hiring now since there were so many hiring freezes last year.
Update: still looking, very discouraged. I've stopped looking specific jobs and am now just looking for anything even entry level, haven't applied at Mcdonalds or any other fast food yet, "yet" being the key word there.
I did find my civilian equivalent in fire systems service companies, but 6 out of 7 companies I drove over to see were no longer there. Since I no longer have money to pay for college and wait for the reimbursement I'm no longer in school. Now I'm just a bum feeling sorry for myself but that'll only last till the morning when I gotta pull up the bootstraps and keep looking.
P.S. On a lighter note, I did find some old vinyl stickers I had made and thought I'd put them to good use.
Dude I know it sucks but you will find something. I worked as a busser at Olive Garden for 6 months when I got out. Sometimes you just gotta take a crappy job to keep your head above water and keep looking. It's a serious blow to your pride but it definitely keeps you searching for something better.
QuietShootr
05-22-10, 09:12
If this hasn't already been said: This is an excellent time to plunk your ass in school. There are ways of getting the money.
That said:
DO NOT, I say again, DO NOT **** around with a criminal justice degree program unless you plan on going directly to law school. A CJ/criminology degree is just on this side of a sociology degree for being worthless, and probably ranks below an English degree. Screw the soft degrees. In this economy, they are a lot of time and money invested for very little return.
What should you do? Depends on how much time and effort you intend to put into school. Regardless, you want to do something that A) is relatively difficult to train on, i.e. a professional job and B) can't easily be outsourced to India, and finally C) will be useful after the inevitable societal collapse/restructuring that is going to happen sooner or later.
Answers:
A) medical. The higher the better. a good goal is RN/BSN. Nurse anesthetist is better. Radiology technician. Research this carefully - some things are going to go away (i.e. respiratory therapy).
B) Chemistry. You can get a good job with a BS in Chemistry. This is not true of biology or other science degrees, in which a MS/MA is usually the starting point to be able to get some kind of a job, even if it's teaching.
Your job is to make yourself MORE valuable than the next schmuckatelli on the street. If you can learn to do a job in six months or less, it's likely something that can be easily outsourced or eliminated. You want to be the brain that they can't do without, not the hand that they can always get more of.
this side of a sociology degree for being worthless, and probably ranks below an English degree. Screw the soft degrees. In this economy, they are a lot of time and money invested for very little return.
This is a crap mindset to fall into, that any given degree is "worthless." That's simply bullshit. Better than half of any class of graduating seniors ends up in a field that's outside of their field of study. Ergo, a degree isn't worthless in and of itself, it may be merely non-applicable. Calling a degree worthless is both snobbery and a cop-out. Having the diploma, of any type, is enough unless a given position's requirements are pretty specific.
Degrees aren't worthless. People are worthless. Get the degree, and don't be a worthless person who blames their out-of-field degree for their lack of employment status. What's often referred to as a "douchebag," or a "Democrat."
At the job fair aboard Quantico in March, whole metric assloads of people with "worthless," "soft" degrees got hired to boss around the pencil-necks with the "hard" degrees. Don't fall for the "Bachelor of Science degrees are the only ones that matter!" hype. Huuuuuuge myth, that those jobs can't be outsourced; they already are, and people from the Eastern cultures who are better, smarter, and willing to start for less pay than an American are very competitive in those fields. It's not an automatic ticket to employment.
Study something you're interested in, which makes you far more likely to complete the program. If you have to push an Idiot Stick (a stick with a shovel on one end and an idiot on the other) to eke out an existence until the GI Bill and the stipend that comes with it comes through, it's worth it.
good luck in your hunt for a new job
Update: still looking, very discouraged. I've stopped looking specific jobs and am now just looking for anything even entry level, haven't applied at Mcdonalds or any other fast food yet, "yet" being the key word there.
Seriously? Why not?
Listen; I spent 1999 - 2003 with a head injury, basically unemployable, and a family to feed. I delivered pizzas and cleaned toilets. And did odd jobs, and collected junk from the curb and repaired it and resold it. And did whatever I could.
I came off Active Duty twice, and here is the no shit problem I see with 99% of former military folks:
First, there is not personnel reassignment department for the real world. Get off your ass and get thee a job, no matter what it is. Employers can smell your unemployed-ness on you.
Second, very few former Active Duty military types really understand how to work. There is no 3 hours for PT in the morning and 1 1/2 hours for lunch and time off during the day for ****ing appointments any more. And just sitting in the squad bay, pretending to clean weapons doesn't earn a living. You may think humping is work, but it's not. Staying awake 20 hours a day doesn't count any more, either. You are now paid to earn the boss money. Until you realize this, you are ****ed.
Frankly, you may THINK you're looking hard, but trust me; from reading your posts I can tell you're fooling yourself. You are not.
It's a freaking numbers game. Get off your ass, and start knocking on doors. If you don't talk to 5 potential hirers (not their secretary or somesuch) a day, you are slacking. To do that, you need to actually get out, and knock on doors, and talk to potential employers face to face. More than once. And drop that shitty "I'm too good for THAT job ****ing attitude."
You know, you and others on this board think I might be being hard on you, but if you look into your heart, you'll realize you are shitting yourself if whateverthehell you've done so far has been good enough.
Now get the **** up and get moving!!!!
(And don't for one God-damned minute think I haven't been where you are right now.)
If this hasn't already been said: This is an excellent time to plunk your ass in school. There are ways of getting the money.
That said:
DO NOT, I say again, DO NOT **** around with a criminal justice degree program unless you plan on going directly to law school. A CJ/criminology degree is just on this side of a sociology degree for being worthless, and probably ranks below an English degree. Screw the soft degrees. In this economy, they are a lot of time and money invested for very little return.
What should you do? Depends on how much time and effort you intend to put into school. Regardless, you want to do something that A) is relatively difficult to train on, i.e. a professional job and B) can't easily be outsourced to India, and finally C) will be useful after the inevitable societal collapse/restructuring that is going to happen sooner or later.
Answers:
A) medical. The higher the better. a good goal is RN/BSN. Nurse anesthetist is better. Radiology technician. Research this carefully - some things are going to go away (i.e. respiratory therapy).
B) Chemistry. You can get a good job with a BS in Chemistry. This is not true of biology or other science degrees, in which a MS/MA is usually the starting point to be able to get some kind of a job, even if it's teaching.
Your job is to make yourself MORE valuable than the next schmuckatelli on the street. If you can learn to do a job in six months or less, it's likely something that can be easily outsourced or eliminated. You want to be the brain that they can't do without, not the hand that they can always get more of.
Criminal Justice and Business degrees are worthless and kind of pathetic.
However, I am making really good money doing Sociology/Anthropology/International Relations work, and having the time of my life doing it.
QuietShootr
05-22-10, 14:01
This is a crap mindset to fall into, that any given degree is "worthless." That's simply bullshit. Better than half of any class of graduating seniors ends up in a field that's outside of their field of study. Ergo, a degree isn't worthless in and of itself, it may be merely non-applicable. Calling a degree worthless is both snobbery and a cop-out. Having the diploma, of any type, is enough unless a given position's requirements are pretty specific.
Degrees aren't worthless. People are worthless. Get the degree, and don't be a worthless person who blames their out-of-field degree for their lack of employment status. What's often referred to as a "douchebag," or a "Democrat."
At the job fair aboard Quantico in March, whole metric assloads of people with "worthless," "soft" degrees got hired to boss around the pencil-necks with the "hard" degrees. Don't fall for the "Bachelor of Science degrees are the only ones that matter!" hype. Huuuuuuge myth, that those jobs can't be outsourced; they already are, and people from the Eastern cultures who are better, smarter, and willing to start for less pay than an American are very competitive in those fields. It's not an automatic ticket to employment.
Study something you're interested in, which makes you far more likely to complete the program. If you have to push an Idiot Stick (a stick with a shovel on one end and an idiot on the other) to eke out an existence until the GI Bill and the stipend that comes with it comes through, it's worth it.
Sir, no disrespect intended, but you might save that advice for someone who needs it. I have a bachelor and a master's degree (paid for with GI Bill), I'm not working in either of the fields my degrees are in, and I'm kicking ass and taking names. AND I'm working on a second bachelor's in a hard science.
I just left a Fortune 500 company for a Fortune 50 company. I was recruited for this job, and my old company would take me back in half a second. I have done this through hard work and determination. I could have done it faster and easier if I'd gotten an appropriate degree to begin with. Stop telling the kid that an English degree is just as good as a science or nursing degree, because it isn't. A job that can be done by Susie Sorority girl with an English degree will soon be taken over by a HS diploma/GED holder, and Susie Sorority English major will be managing a McDonald's somewhere. If she's lucky.
Degrees are not equal, any more than people are.
Sir.
QuietShootr
05-22-10, 14:01
Seriously? Why not?
Listen; I spent 1999 - 2003 with a head injury, basically unemployable, and a family to feed. I delivered pizzas and cleaned toilets. And did odd jobs, and collected junk from the curb and repaired it and resold it. And did whatever I could.
I came off Active Duty twice, and here is the no shit problem I see with 99% of former military folks:
First, there is not personnel reassignment department for the real world. Get off your ass and get thee a job, no matter what it is. Employers can smell your unemployed-ness on you.
Second, very few former Active Duty military types really understand how to work. There is no 3 hours for PT in the morning and 1 1/2 hours for lunch and time off during the day for ****ing appointments any more. And just sitting in the squad bay, pretending to clean weapons doesn't earn a living. You may think humping is work, but it's not. Staying awake 20 hours a day doesn't count any more, either. You are now paid to earn the boss money. Until you realize this, you are ****ed.
Frankly, you may THINK you're looking hard, but trust me; from reading your posts I can tell you're fooling yourself. You are not.
It's a freaking numbers game. Get off your ass, and start knocking on doors. If you don't talk to 5 potential hirers (not their secretary or somesuch) a day, you are slacking. To do that, you need to actually get out, and knock on doors, and talk to potential employers face to face. More than once. And drop that shitty "I'm too good for THAT job ****ing attitude."
You know, you and others on this board think I might be being hard on you, but if you look into your heart, you'll realize you are shitting yourself if whateverthehell you've done so far has been good enough.
Now get the **** up and get moving!!!!
(And don't for one God-damned minute think I haven't been where you are right now.)
And what this guy said, too.
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