View Full Version : Immigration laws that need reform
Based on this article, assuming it is as is given (which I do not doubt), we need some real reform in immigration laws.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/02/19/nyregion/19judge.html
I am all for strict enforcement of the laws for those that come here illegally.
But this sort of thing makes me mad.
Belmont31R
02-20-10, 01:04
Why? He broke the law, and as an immigrant he is supposed to go back home.
I dont want immigrants coming here to commit crimes, and because of some sob story he gets to stay? Relaxing enforcement just means more immigrant criminals we cannot send back home, and not all of them are going to have some bleeding hearts supporting them.
Shouldn't have even been allowed in the first place....
Why? He broke the law, and as an immigrant he is supposed to go back home.
He came here legally, at the age of 5. He was not a criminal when he came. As a teenager he committed some minor crimes for which he did his time in reform school. I am not of the opinion that the laws were made to send people like this home. They were meant to send the real criminals, not juvenile deliquents, out of the country.
I dont want immigrants coming here to commit crimes,
He did not come here to commit crimes. He was 5 when he came with his family, none of whom committed crimes and all became productive citizens. He was a teenager -- a juvenile -- when he did some dumb things. Not a hardened criminal.
and because of some sob story he gets to stay?
Does the concept of justice mean anything to you? Does not sound like it.
Relaxing enforcement just means more immigrant criminals we cannot send back home, and not all of them are going to have some bleeding hearts supporting them.
It does not mean that. I did not say we should relax enforcement. We should change the laws to what sort of crimes, by what sort of people (adults, juveniles, etc) should count. We should also take into account extenuating circumstances. Has nothing to do with sob stories. It has to do with justice.
Shouldn't have even been allowed in the first place....
Ignorance is bliss.
Hope you are having a blissful weekend.
The teenager, a gifted student, was pleading guilty to a string of muggings committed at 15 with an eclectic crew in Manhattan’s Chinatown.
Shoplifting is dumb, a mugging is a violent crime and a string of them makes him a real criminal.
I agree, he paid his dept, got his shit straight and became a productive member of society, which is more than you can say for more than a couple shitbags in this country that just take their citizenship for granted.
Shoplifting is dumb, a mugging is a violent crime and a string of them makes him a real criminal.
Did you read what the muggings actually were?
"In December 1995, he and two other teenagers, one of them pretending to have a gun, took a jacket from a young boy. In two episodes in April 1996, he and others robbed elderly men of money, knocking one down and punching another; he took part in a fourth mugging that June, records show."
I agree not some sweet innocent kid, but rather dumb juvenile actions -- minor actions. Not a career muggist. Someone who banded together with friends for protection (as noted in the article) and got on the wrong path with those friends. As a juvenile. Went to reform school and got turned around.
Justice was served. There is no justice in deporting him. Deport the illegals and the dangerous criminal immigrants, whether legal or not.
"In December 1995, he and two other teenagers, one of them pretending to have a gun, took a jacket from a young boy. In two episodes in April 1996, he and others robbed elderly men of money, knocking one down and punching another; he took part in a fourth mugging that June, records show."
Committing a crime where the victim would be justified in shooting you is not just a juvineil action. I am sure if that happened to your kid or you grandfather you would not be so happy to have him here.
I agree not some sweet innocent kid, but rather dumb juvenile actions -- minor actions. Not a career muggist. Someone who banded together with friends for protection (as noted in the article) and got on the wrong path with those friends.
He didnt not become a career mugger because he got locked up. You can say it however you want but he was a gang member involved in criminal activity.
Belmont31R
02-20-10, 02:08
Did you read what the muggings actually were?
"In December 1995, he and two other teenagers, one of them pretending to have a gun, took a jacket from a young boy. In two episodes in April 1996, he and others robbed elderly men of money, knocking one down and punching another; he took part in a fourth mugging that June, records show."
I agree not some sweet innocent kid, but rather dumb juvenile actions -- minor actions. Not a career muggist. Someone who banded together with friends for protection (as noted in the article) and got on the wrong path with those friends. As a juvenile. Went to reform school and got turned around.
Justice was served. There is no justice in deporting him. Deport the illegals and the dangerous criminal immigrants, whether legal or not.
He should have been deported after he turned violent. The fact that some time has passed between his proposed deportation and his criminal acts does not change anything to me. If anything it shows the system is too slow in returning these people back where they came from who come here, and turn into violent criminals.
Age is irrelevant. Lots of "kids" do "adult" crimes but it doesnt change the crime that occurred.
The way I see it immigration has some conditions attached to it. He broke those conditions by turning to violent criminal acts against our citizens, and he should have that privilege of being here revoked.
Committing a crime where the victim would be justified in shooting you is not just a juvineil action. I am sure if that happened to your kid or you grandfather you would not be so happy to have him here.
I would have exactly the same thoughts that I already do. I would not have been asking for him to avoid punishment, but once he did his time and showed he was rehabilitated he should not be deported. That serves no purpose and does not satisfy justice.
He didnt not become a career mugger because he got locked up.
That may or may not be true. But I am not saying he should not have gotten "locked up" (he seems to have gone to reform school, not juvenile detention). I am saying that once out, for what were minor crimes committed as a juvenile, he should not be deported 15 years later.
You can say it however you want but he was a gang member involved in criminal activity.
Not "gang member" in the modern sense. He and a few friends had too much time on their hand. They were not (based on the article) in any organized gang.
He should have been deported after he turned violent. The fact that some time has passed between his proposed deportation and his criminal acts does not change anything to me. If anything it shows the system is too slow in returning these people back where they came from who come here, and turn into violent criminals.
Age is irrelevant. Lots of "kids" do "adult" crimes but it doesnt change the crime that occurred.
The way I see it immigration has some conditions attached to it. He broke those conditions by turning to violent criminal acts against our citizens, and he should have that privilege of being here revoked.
This post is an example of what is wrong in this world. Sorry. If you cannot see the difference between some bored and (growing up on the streets of NY) scared kid doing some stupid things, getting caught, and straightening out and the career criminals in organized gangs that come to this country, or come as kids and turn to a life of crime, then I am sorry for you.
In this case, justice (the concept) was served. Injustice does not need to be foisted on this guy by an overbearing government with mixed up and screwed up laws.
This kind of story only empowers the "amnesty" crowd who wants all the illegals to be allowed to stay and to open the doors to all sorts of people who should not be here. If we cannot have a sane immigration policy where good people can come here legally to make a better life for themselves and to make this country better, because we cannot differentiate between these people and the scumbags, we are doomed as a country.
Belmont31R
02-20-10, 02:16
I would have exactly the same thoughts that I already do. I would not have been asking for him to avoid punishment, but once he did his time and showed he was rehabilitated he should not be deported. That serves no purpose and does not satisfy justice.
That may or may not be true. But I am not saying he should not have gotten "locked up" (he seems to have gone to reform school, not juvenile detention). I am saying that once out, for what were minor crimes committed as a juvenile, he should not be deported 15 years later.
Not "gang member" in the modern sense. He and a few friends had too much time on their hand. They were not (based on the article) in any organized gang.
Unfortunately thats the speed INS works at. I agree its shitty do be set in your life, and then face deportation but part of the punishment for being an immigrant and committing violent acts is you lose the privilege of staying here. He has managed to skip out on that part of his punishment which to me is still due. Lots of people manage to skip out on justice, and live "comfortable" lives until what they did in the past catches up with them.....doesn't change the fact they still have to owe up to what they did.
It is hard for me to say he should be deported NOW, but clearly the system failed at the time. Im sure for every story like this there are 100 where they did become a career criminal, because "reform school" does as much reforming as a federal prison. The only reform I see that is needed is more deportation of people that come here and commit crime.
Belmont31R
02-20-10, 02:35
This post is an example of what is wrong in this world. Sorry. If you cannot see the difference between some bored and (growing up on the streets of NY) scared kid doing some stupid things, getting caught, and straightening out and the career criminals in organized gangs that come to this country, or come as kids and turn to a life of crime, then I am sorry for you.
In this case, justice (the concept) was served. Injustice does not need to be foisted on this guy by an overbearing government with mixed up and screwed up laws.
This kind of story only empowers the "amnesty" crowd who wants all the illegals to be allowed to stay and to open the doors to all sorts of people who should not be here. If we cannot have a sane immigration policy where good people can come here legally to make a better life for themselves and to make this country better, because we cannot differentiate between these people and the scumbags, we are doomed as a country.
The dude did a series of violent criminal acts, and per the law he should have been deported. Its a bit of an injustice to take so long getting him out of the country but its still the punishment for his crimes. Maybe he should have been a better member of society if he didn't want to face his punishment.
I don't care about his sob story of why he committed those crimes. Bored kid? When I was bored I didn't go rob people on the street repeatedly. Thats a sorry excuse for becoming a violent criminal, and doesn't change what he did. Everyone has a reason or excuse for their criminal behavior but they still need to be punished, and according to the law in this case he is to be deported.
Shouldn't have even been allowed in the first place....
? Are you saying people shouldn't be allowed to immigrate to this country?
And as far as facing deportation, it's BS. He was sentenced and paid his debt to society. It's not a matter if you agree on the punishment or not because that judgment isn't yours to make.
So no he shouldn't be deported.
Belmont31R
02-20-10, 03:45
? Are you saying people shouldn't be allowed to immigrate to this country?
And as far as facing deportation, it's BS. He was sentenced and paid his debt to society. It's not a matter if you agree on the punishment or not because that judgment isn't yours to make.
So no he shouldn't be deported.
Part of the legal punishment for what he did is deportation so no he did not pay his debt to society. He managed to shirk the rule of law until it caught up with him.
Now, since its been a long time, there is some sob story about how he should further be able to avoid the law and remain in this country. So every alien that commits a crime, and then gets away from the deportation for so many years gets a free pass while others who face their full punishment get sent packing?
And you're right. I don't get to set what his punishment is. The law already does that, and the law says he should be deported. Now people want the law to be neglected because it hadnt been enforced yet.
I don't agree with immigration from 3rd world countries especially communist ones.
I don't agree with immigration from 3rd world countries especially communist ones.
So you're family that immigrated to this country came from a wealthy country? Last time I checked this country has made by people from poor countries. Kind of the reasons they came to America, because the countries they left offered nothing for their future.
okay.
I read the article.
I suspect he'll get to stay, it will take two years of wrangling and hearings, his savings will be wiped out, everyone will have a bad taste in their mouth, but he'll get to stay.
The greatest injustice here, his mom still cant speak english, she never took time. send her ass back home :p
The greatest injustice here, his mom still cant speak english, she never took time. send her ass back home :p
If you had to work long hours (more than likely 12 plus hours per day, 6 days a week) to make only a few dollars and had to take care of your family, do you think you have time to go to school to learn?
I don't agree with immigration from 3rd world countries especially communist ones.
Communist is a government and not a way of life for some chinese people which is why some have immigrated here. By the way, McCarthyism is long gone and over with. The U.S. have some of the best and brightest chinese that immigrated here. You would want productive immigrants, regardless of what country, who can help and benefit this country rather than closing the borders.
Belmont31R
02-20-10, 11:48
So you're family that immigrated to this country came from a wealthy country? Last time I checked this country has made by people from poor countries. Kind of the reasons they came to America, because the countries they left offered nothing for their future.
That worked when we still had tons of room for expansion, and economic growth. Now? Not so much, and we can/should be selective in who we let immigrate here.
And we have been selective in the past. During WW2 there was even a ship full of Jewish refugees escaping the Nazi's, and we turned them away.
Its great some Chinese came here, and have done well. At some point we cannot keep soaking people in just because where they come from is shitty. Thats the same argument amnesty people make for illegals...."they're just looking for a better life."
I think Europe is a good example of what happens when you allow unfettered immigration from the 3rd world.
If you had to work long hours (more than likely 12 plus hours per day, 6 days a week) to make only a few dollars and had to take care of your family, do you think you have time to go to school to learn?
yes. if she WANTED to bad enough, she would have.
with the latin community, its most often the children learn in school, come home and teach the parents.
MY SIL in Bolivia has learned pretty good english doing this. Her kids learn english at school, they come home and do the lessons with mom. takes less than an hour a day.
Belmont31R
02-20-10, 11:50
If you had to work long hours (more than likely 12 plus hours per day, 6 days a week) to make only a few dollars and had to take care of your family, do you think you have time to go to school to learn?
Somehow every single one of my family members that immigrated in 1948 managed to learn English.
Belmont31R
02-20-10, 11:55
Communist is a government and not a way of life for some chinese people which is why some have immigrated here. By the way, McCarthyism is long gone and over with. The U.S. have some of the best and brightest chinese that immigrated here. You would want productive immigrants, regardless of what country, who can help and benefit this country rather than closing the borders.
Yes, and these immigrants have the largest spy network in the US.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,330320,00.html
Under current law, because he committed a crime with a sentence over 1 year in length, he is ineligible for discretionary cancellation of removal.
I think as it stands now, the Immigration Laws are too inflexible. People in the country illegally for over 1 year are barred from applying for asylum, even if they have a valid reason for asylum (Female Genital Mutilation, Gov't sanctioned persecution, etc.)
After the 1996 Illegal Immigrant Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act (IIRAIRA) Congress significantly clamped down on a lot of more flexible statutes. If I recall correctly, the predecessor to the cancellation of removal statute allowed judges discretion in cancelling removal. However as it stands now, INA s. 240 is far more restrictive and rigid than needs be.
I'm curious if there'll be any successful imm. reform in the next 4 years.
Yes, and these immigrants have the largest spy network in the US.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,330320,00.html
LOL. You're right. That's why there are a lot of counterfeit merchandise made in China and sold here ;).
yes. if she WANTED to bad enough, she would have.
with the latin community, its most often the children learn in school, come home and teach the parents.
MY SIL in Bolivia has learned pretty good english doing this. Her kids learn english at school, they come home and do the lessons with mom. takes less than an hour a day.
I have to disagree with you and to point out LEOs and court room in a lot of locations need translators and not just spanish language. I see most, if not all, instruction manuals, advertisement, driver license manual, etc. are in spanish. This country has been accomodating every immigrant that comes here.
I have to disagree with you and to point out LEOs and court room in a lot of locations need translators and not just spanish language. I see most, if not all, instruction manuals, advertisement, driver license manual, etc. are in spanish. This country has been accomodating every immigrant that comes here.
as is your privilege :p
I stand by my statement:
If she WANTED to bad enough, she would have.
ForTehNguyen
02-21-10, 09:00
the problem is right now coming in illegally is easier than coming in through legally (red tape fest and huge wait times). So you might as well try to go through illegally. Plus the consequences of coming in illegally are weak, just deport you and you can try again and again. Eventually you will get in without getting caught. Make the legal means easier and make the illegal consequences much harsher.
Also checking verification for citizenship status on federal/state benefits. Open borders with super entitlements does not work, just look at Cali.
INS and immigration laws, are just screwed up in so many ways it would be impossible to have a sane discourse on them.
LockenLoad
02-21-10, 19:51
the problem is right now coming in illegally is easier than coming in through legally (red tape fest and huge wait times). So you might as well try to go through illegally. Plus the consequences of coming in illegally are weak, just deport you and you can try again and again. Eventually you will get in without getting caught. Make the legal means easier and make the illegal consequences much harsher.
Also checking verification for citizenship status on federal/state benefits. Open borders with super entitlements does not work, just look at Cali.
What would be your harsher penalty than deportation? Sure as hell hope you don't want to add to an already burdened prison system. I wonder how much government aide this Chinese family got. That regular natural born citizens are not eligible for, I am so sick of seeing a bunch of Spanish speaking illegal bums in my country with four kids they can't afford getting food stamps and WIC cards, people we can't afford that anymore than free health care. I always love how it's we could not make a living in our own country, but they come here and breed like rats even though they can't afford it, because we reward laying on your back and having babies u can not afford. People we are being invaded, just think of all the anchor babies voting in the next 30 years.
"INS and immigration laws, are just screwed up in so many ways it would be impossible to have a sane discourse on them."
True enough. BTW, there hasn't been an INS since 2003 and 90% of the problem with the INA (Immigration and Nationality Act, Titles 8 of the U.S. Criminal Code and CFR's) is the tinkering that Congress has done to it over the past 40 years. There is now more in the INA about what the CBP, ICE, and CIS cannot do than what they can. Every time the words "immigration reform" come up it is anything but true reform; just another tinkering with the INA, real change means rewriting the entire INA, simplifying and clarifying the codes, making the INA enforceable.
"INS and immigration laws, are just screwed up in so many ways it would be impossible to have a sane discourse on them."
True enough. BTW, there hasn't been an INS since 2003 and 90% of the problem with the INA (Immigration and Nationality Act, Titles 8 of the U.S. Criminal Code and CFR's) is the tinkering that Congress has done to it over the past 40 years. There is now more in the INA about what the CBP, ICE, and CIS cannot do than what they can. Every time the words "immigration reform" come up it is anything but true reform; just another tinkering with the INA, real change means rewriting the entire INA, simplifying and clarifying the codes, making the INA enforceable.
Man, I am all for that. Have you read some of the statutes? Makes me want to pull my hair out. I have no idea why legislators can't write laws in plain english?
Belmont31R
02-21-10, 21:59
Man, I am all for that. Have you read some of the statutes? Makes me want to pull my hair out. I have no idea why legislators can't write laws in plain english?
Its done intentionally so it takes a team of 10 high dollar lawyers to decipher what the hell the law means, and thus is easier to trip people up on stupid crap no one really cares about.
One of the bad things about having a government as old as ours is its filled with so many laws no one really knows what they all mean anymore. Im sure we are breaking laws just doing things we take for granted everyday we have no idea, and should have no reasonable idea its against the law.
Look - your not a citizen, your on probation. deported. Circumstances? GMAFB!
You FU, your out. Why would we spend the money to figure this out? People are loosing jobs everday, illegals are taxing our public funds, services for "citizen" real kids are getting cut all the time.
Sorry man - life happens and beting a welfare state has to end.
LockenLoad
02-21-10, 22:16
Man, I am all for that. Have you read some of the statutes? Makes me want to pull my hair out. I have no idea why legislators can't write laws in plain english?
they rarely write the bills they sponsor our read them, you would be surprised that most bills are wrote by lobbyist and special interest groups, and none of the morons in office even read them, I don't know anyone who has read 60,000.00 pages of health care legislation. We would all be better off if they did nothing, for a decade our 2.
Man, I am all for that. Have you read some of the statutes? Makes me want to pull my hair out. I have no idea why legislators can't write laws in plain english?
Read them? Oh yes. Thank God I don't deal with the INA anymore.
Sorry I skipped out the last 2 days on this. Business and family did not allow me more than 10 min for M4C each day until now.
Immigration needs to be greatly reformed. That is true. This example I posted as the root post is an example where reform is necessary.
I am 100% against illegal immigration and think everyone here illegally should be deported and become ineligible for legal immigration due to having flouted the immigration laws. If you are here illegally and can sneak back to your home country, then apply there for legal entry.
I am also for reform of "who is an American." The law needs to be changed so only those here legally who give birth give their offspring US citizenship.
And I am 100% against providing benefits to illegals. I am also mostly against providing benefits to legal immigrants -- at least until a certain time after they become citizens (except for extreme cases where people come due to political reasons and have been helpful to the US -- think some of the Hmong from Vietnam who were our staunch allies, or some Iraqis who put their lives on the lines to help the US). Heck, I am against providing "welfare" type benefits to most people, illegals, legals, and citizens. That is not the function of government.
I am for legal immigration. By people who can pull their own weight and make positive contributions to society, and their immediate families and perhaps elderly parents. Not those looking for a handout. We must as a country welcome with open arms these productive new immigrants. We must be selective and say no to those who want a handout and cannot pull their own weight and make a positive contribution to society.
But the story shown in my original post, if substantially true, is also a travesty and not what America is about. Someone who came here as a kid with his family, legally, and as a teenager screwed up some, was sent to reform school, was reformed and got on the straight and narrow, and has over more than a decade proven that by his behavior, positive contributions to society (it does not seem that he is on welfare, or getting handouts, etc -- he was some director of internet services or something for some sort of financial institution if I remember the article correctly -- he is earning his way, paying taxes, and supporting his mom to a degree, financially [instead of telling the govt to support her]). To now deport him back to a country he has no connection to (being 5 when he came here) based on 15 year old teenage crimes he committed, is ridiculous. It shows what sorts of reforms need to be part of any immigration reform.
If you commit violent crimes as an adult, throw your ass back to your country. If you commit seriously egregious crimes as a juvenile, probably throw your ass out. (From the descriptions in the article, in this case, they did not seem to be particularly egregious and not obviously from a hardened criminal.) If you commit crimes as a juvenile, or stupid mundane ones as an adult, there should be able to be discretion made, with safeguards and backups against abuse [either direction], before throwing your ass out. If you are not a hardened criminal type, and the crimes were not super serious, maybe you should be allowed to stay as long as you keep your nose clean and make positive contributions to society.
I am done in this topic. Thanks for listening.
"I am also for reform of "who is an American." The law needs to be changed so only those here legally who give birth give their offspring US citizenship."
That law is called the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. Good luck with that.
"I am also for reform of "who is an American." The law needs to be changed so only those here legally who give birth give their offspring US citizenship."
That law is called the 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution. Good luck with that.
It is not as clear cut as that might imply. The Supreme Court has never ruled on the legality of birth children of illegal immigrants automatically becoming citizens and some legal minds think that Congress could legitimately regulate this. The one case from the late 1800s that talked about immigrant children was before the concept of "illegal immigrant" basically existed.
But it needs to be addressed, whether hard or not.
That ruling, U.S. v Wong Kim Ark, layed it out pretty clearly; if you're born here, you're a citizen.
That ruling, U.S. v Wong Kim Ark, layed it out pretty clearly; if you're born here, you're a citizen.
Many sharp legal minds think that there is an opening since the idea of there being "illegal" immigrants did not exist at that time. This idea has not been tested.
There are already exceptions to the law, for example, children of diplomats, I believe.
Yes, there are a few narrow exceptions. Diplomats and foreign military engaged in war are two. The key to these two is that they "are not subject to" the laws of the United States. Wong Kim Ark has been the standard interpretation of the 14th Amendment for over one hundred years. SCOTUS isn't going back there to change it, especially since it was not a narrow ruling, it was a 6-2 decision. The key to any change would have to come from a change to the 14th Amendment. That just isn't happening.
Sorry I skipped out the last 2 days on this. Business and family did not allow me more than 10 min for M4C each day until now.
Immigration needs to be greatly reformed. That is true. This example I posted as the root post is an example where reform is necessary.
I am 100% against illegal immigration and think everyone here illegally should be deported and become ineligible for legal immigration due to having flouted the immigration laws. If you are here illegally and can sneak back to your home country, then apply there for legal entry.
I am also for reform of "who is an American." The law needs to be changed so only those here legally who give birth give their offspring US citizenship.
And I am 100% against providing benefits to illegals. I am also mostly against providing benefits to legal immigrants -- at least until a certain time after they become citizens (except for extreme cases where people come due to political reasons and have been helpful to the US -- think some of the Hmong from Vietnam who were our staunch allies, or some Iraqis who put their lives on the lines to help the US). Heck, I am against providing "welfare" type benefits to most people, illegals, legals, and citizens. That is not the function of government.
I am for legal immigration. By people who can pull their own weight and make positive contributions to society, and their immediate families and perhaps elderly parents. Not those looking for a handout. We must as a country welcome with open arms these productive new immigrants. We must be selective and say no to those who want a handout and cannot pull their own weight and make a positive contribution to society.
But the story shown in my original post, if substantially true, is also a travesty and not what America is about. Someone who came here as a kid with his family, legally, and as a teenager screwed up some, was sent to reform school, was reformed and got on the straight and narrow, and has over more than a decade proven that by his behavior, positive contributions to society (it does not seem that he is on welfare, or getting handouts, etc -- he was some director of internet services or something for some sort of financial institution if I remember the article correctly -- he is earning his way, paying taxes, and supporting his mom to a degree, financially [instead of telling the govt to support her]). To now deport him back to a country he has no connection to (being 5 when he came here) based on 15 year old teenage crimes he committed, is ridiculous. It shows what sorts of reforms need to be part of any immigration reform.
If you commit violent crimes as an adult, throw your ass back to your country. If you commit seriously egregious crimes as a juvenile, probably throw your ass out. (From the descriptions in the article, in this case, they did not seem to be particularly egregious and not obviously from a hardened criminal.) If you commit crimes as a juvenile, or stupid mundane ones as an adult, there should be able to be discretion made, with safeguards and backups against abuse [either direction], before throwing your ass out. If you are not a hardened criminal type, and the crimes were not super serious, maybe you should be allowed to stay as long as you keep your nose clean and make positive contributions to society.
I am done in this topic. Thanks for listening.
+1 good thoughts
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