Chambered round or not

[SouthWolfGA]

This thread is being created to allow the thread (https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=48704&page=5) in which the conversation began to get back on the OP's point.

I did some research and found that I was wrong. I'm big enough to admit that. I am mixing up range safety with carry safety. Here is the link to the Marine Corp's M9 training manual.

http://www.pointshooting.com/freemar.pdf

As far as the holsters that "rack" the pistol for you, they require that you unholster the weapon by forcing it down and out of the holster rather than pulling up. It also forces the direction the weapon points away from your body as you perform this action. I have seen them in use, but have not personally used them so I can speak on the reliability of this system. I do believe in theory, it would be safer.

To the poster that has three weapons in his living room with rounds in the chamber, I am assuming you don't have kids. It is, in my opinion certainly irresponsable to leave them in theis condition otherwise, unless they have trigger locks. I certainly can understand condition one if the weapon is in your control but not while being stored or laying around.

[theblackknight]

?????

Im not going to read thru that gay manual bc pistols in the MC are more status symbols then tools but it was cool seeing a IWB in bravos. Do you clean your AR at home like you cleaned your M16 at the recruit depo? I Dont!

[WillBrink]

unless they have trigger locks. I certainly can understand condition one if the weapon is in your control but not while being stored or laying around.

Thought the members here were well above the "chambered round or not" debates/posts. You store/carry your guns how you want based on your knowledge/experience levels, and leave others to do the same. :rolleyes:

[Shawn.L]

Thought the members here were well above the "chambered round or not" debates/posts. You store/carry your guns how you want based on your knowledge/experience levels, and leave others to do the same. :rolleyes:

yeah, I was a bit confused and upset to see this here as well.

[geminidglocker]

Thanks for asking about my kids, I only have one, but I only have him every other week end, and school vacations. He's 9 now, so I've had the time to teach him the fundamentals of Firearms Safety. I've also tought him that he is not allowed to handle any firearms without my supervision. That said, When we go outside to shoot, I do first unload which ever firearm we are going to be shooting until we are "On the Range". My Glock is always on my hip, and goes literally everywhere I go. Yes, I bring the Glock with me when I shower, but it rests on the sink, not IN the shower.:)

[SouthWolfGA]

?????

Im not going to read thru that gay manual bc pistols in the MC are more status symbols then tools but it was cool seeing a IWB in bravos. Do you clean your AR at home like you cleaned your M16 at the recruit depo? I Dont!

No I don't, I realize that at Paris Island a mojority of the procedures were hazing but with purpose. They over oiled, over scrubeed and over did everything.

I skip to the important part:

"When there is no immediate threat, the Marine assumes the holster transport. The pistol should be
in Condition 1. This is the lowest level of awareness for the Marine in a combat environment, but
the Marine must stay alert and aware of any nearby activity."

I am trying to agree with what you all have been pounding in all afternoon. You are right, pistols in the Corps are just status symbols essentially. On another note, concerning the Corps, I've been out for 5 years now, so I am a bit rusty on some of my training. I am not so hardheaded that I do not realize this.

[Jay Cunningham]

Keep this constructive/instructive.

No personal attacks. If you don't have constructive input keep it to yourself or use PM.

[theblackknight]

No I don't, I realize that at Paris Island a mojority of the procedures were hazing but with purpose. They over oiled, over scrubeed and over did everything.

I skip to the important part:

"When there is no immediate threat, the Marine assumes the holster transport. The pistol should be
in Condition 1. This is the lowest level of awareness for the Marine in a combat environment, but
the Marine must stay alert and aware of any nearby activity."

I am trying to agree with what you all have been pounding in all afternoon. You are right, pistols in the Corps are just status symbols essentially. On another note, concerning the Corps, I've been out for 5 years now, so I am a bit rusty on some of my training. I am not so hardheaded that I do not realize this.


Well i wasnt going to get into this but. . .

Do you carry?

If soo, did you carry condi3 up until the moment you just checked "the reference"?

[SouthWolfGA]

Thanks for asking about my kids, I only have one, but I only have him every other week end, and school vacations. He's 9 now, so I've had the time to teach him the fundamentals of Firearms Safety. I've also tought him that he is not allowed to handle any firearms without my supervision. That said, When we go outside to shoot, I do first unload which ever firearm we are going to be shooting until we are "On the Range". My Glock is always on my hip, and goes literally everywhere I go. Yes, I bring the Glock with me when I shower, but it rests on the sink, not IN the shower.:)

That's good that he is old enough to be disciplined well enough to adhere to gun safety. Mine are 2 and 5, they are actually my neice and nephew not my kids but hang around enough it is not feasable for me to keep my in cond 1. I do keep the ones in my safe chambered however. As far as the pistol in the shower goes, I mean in theory you could shower with it since it is a glock. :D lol

[SouthWolfGA]

Well i wasnt going to get into this but. . .

Do you carry?

If soo, did you carry condi3 up until the moment you just checked "the reference"?

I carry in my vehicle. I do not usually carry my pistol on my person unless I am at the range. But it stays in cond 3 in my truck.

[Artos]

I skip to the important part:

"When there is no immediate threat, the Marine assumes the holster transport. The pistol should be
in Condition 1. This is the lowest level of awareness for the Marine in a combat environment, but
the Marine must stay alert and aware of any nearby activity."

You simply cannot compare the avg Marine to the civi...if my main weapon was over my shoulder with several mags to keep me going, I would have much less issues with cond. 1, not to mention the back up of my fellow warriors.

...as a lone civi with an uncertain situation to pounce on me at any time, this comparison you share holds no water.

Let's keep the kids and guns around the house out of this...no one here needs preaching and we can start another thread. This comes down to situational awareness and being able to react with what you have at your disposal when the moment of truth arises.

IF you have a certain objection to a "ready" combat handgun for immediate defensive situation, let's hear it. A chambered auto and loaded modern wheel gun are both ready at a moments notice. NONE of my handguns will ever have a lock...they are ready to go or in the safe.

[SouthWolfGA]

IF you have a certain objection to a "ready" combat handgun for immediate defensive situation, let's hear it. A chambered auto and loaded modern wheel gun are both ready at a moments notice. NONE of my handguns will ever have a lock...they are ready to go or in the safe.

I agree that trigger locks are pointless, except maybe if the weapon is in storage and not intended to be used "at a moments notice".

Condition 1. Magazine inserted, round in chamber, slide forward, and safety on.

So the excerpt is saying that the lowest condition that a pistol should be in while holstered is with a round in the chamber and the safety on. I am aggreeing with you and I admitted I was wrong in my statement that it is recomended to keep the pistol in condition three which is magezine inserted, chamber empty and weapon on safe.

[SnackCracker]

NONE of my handguns will ever have a lock...they are ready to go or in the safe.

+1 'Nuff Said!

[mr_smiles]

I bring the Glock with me when I shower, but it rests on the sink, not IN the shower.:)
Weak! I have mine on my hip neoprene belt with kydex holster, waters no match for me :p

[Artos]

I agree that trigger locks are pointless, except maybe if the weapon is in storage and not intended to be used "at a moments notice".

Condition 1. Magazine inserted, round in chamber, slide forward, and safety on.

So the excerpt is saying that the lowest condition that a pistol should be in while holstered is with a round in the chamber and the safety on. I am aggreeing with you and I admitted I was wrong in my statement that it is recomended to keep the pistol in condition three which is magezine inserted, chamber empty and weapon on safe.



oops, I was on the defense from your previous posts.

Welcome back from the dark side amigo:cool:...actually, it is refreshing to see this. I'm used to seeing too many die on the wrong mountain.

[SouthWolfGA]

oops, I was on the defense from your previous posts.

Welcome back from the dark side amigo:cool:...actually, it is refreshing to see this. I'm used to seeing too many die on the wrong mountain.

Well you will have to forgive me, I have been away from the tactical life too long and am just recently taken an interest to my guns outside of hunting. I truly am not as dumb as I may first appear. LMAO

[Left Sig]

A former active duty Marine relative of mine always thumbs down the hammer on pistols when handling them.

I asked him why he does that instead of using the decocker, because thumbing a hammer can lead to a slip and discharge.

He said that's what he was taught in the Marines, on the M9! He joined around 20 years ago and the 1911's were already gone by then.

So I asked why he didn't just activate the safety on the M9 which decocks the hammer as well. He said they were never taught that, and didn't even realize there WAS a decocker. I showed him a S&W 4506 or 5906 which has a decocker safety just like the M9 (I don't have a Beretta) and he repeated that he never knew that's the right way to do it.

So what gives here? Were the DI's back then so used to the old 1911's (they had only been retired a few years earlier) that they taught the same methods on the M9? Or did they spend so little time on pistol training that it was an afterthought?

[SouthWolfGA]

A former active duty Marine relative of mine always thumbs down the hammer on pistols when handling them.

I asked him why he does that instead of using the decocker, because thumbing a hammer can lead to a slip and discharge.

He said that's what he was taught in the Marines, on the M9! He joined around 20 years ago and the 1911's were already gone by then.

So I asked why he didn't just activate the safety on the M9 which decocks the hammer as well. He said they were never taught that, and didn't even realize there WAS a decocker. I showed him a S&W 4506 or 5906 which has a decocker safety just like the M9 (I don't have a Beretta) and he repeated that he never knew that's the right way to do it.

So what gives here? Were the DI's back then so used to the old 1911's (they had only been retired a few years earlier) that they taught the same methods on the M9? Or did they spend so little time on pistol training that it was an afterthought?

I was in much more recently than that and the method you describe is what we were taught. I can only assume that your assumption about being use to the 1911s is probably correct.

[skyugo]

whoa did i just stumble into glocktalk? :D

[theblackknight]

A former active duty Marine relative of mine always thumbs down the hammer on pistols when handling them.

I asked him why he does that instead of using the decocker, because thumbing a hammer can lead to a slip and discharge.

He said that's what he was taught in the Marines, on the M9! He joined around 20 years ago and the 1911's were already gone by then.

So I asked why he didn't just activate the safety on the M9 which decocks the hammer as well. He said they were never taught that, and didn't even realize there WAS a decocker. I showed him a S&W 4506 or 5906 which has a decocker safety just like the M9 (I don't have a Beretta) and he repeated that he never knew that's the right way to do it.

So what gives here? Were the DI's back then so used to the old 1911's (they had only been retired a few years earlier) that they taught the same methods on the M9? Or did they spend so little time on pistol training that it was an afterthought?




1st off, a recruit wont touch a pistol during his 13 weeks in boot. He wont even get to slap his m16 on burst.


After this, if his MOS requires it, he will pistol qual in MOS school. If NOT, untill he reaches SSTG, he might never go to the pistol range. Not saying he WONT, but the chances are slim. Of course, special jobs and cases come up, but really in most places, things like M9s and M4s are luxury for SNCOs and Sirs.

[SouthWolfGA]

1st off, a recruit wont touch a pistol during his 13 weeks in boot. He wont even get to slap his m16 on burst.


After this, if his MOS requires it, he will pistol qual in MOS school. If NOT, untill he reaches SSTG, he might never go to the pistol range. Not saying he WONT, but the chances are slim. Of course, special jobs and cases come up, but really in most places, things like M9s and M4s are luxury for SNCOs and Sirs.

This was also the case while I was in. But I am not sure if that was so 20 years ago.

[Alpha Sierra]

Thank GOD was a Navy REMF so I did not pick up all those massively stupid bad weapon handling habits in the military.

My handguns are ready to go at the pull of a trigger from the moment I holster them to the moment I store them in the safe.

There is always at least one handgun ready to go in the house, even if I am not carrying it, plus a shotgun in cruiser-ready to back it up.

[danpass]

Has someone already replied with "I keep 6 in the chamber!"













aka: a revolver

[tracker722]

******

[dookie1481]

Yes, I bring the Glock with me when I shower, but it rests on the sink, not IN the shower.:)

I thought I was the only weirdo who did that.

Jay

[Smuckatelli]

He's 9 now, so I've had the time to teach him the fundamentals of Firearms Safety.

Watch for complacency, my 16 yr old screwed up with her weapon condition last night after she finished grass drills.