View Full Version : Ford, the next-generation Police Interceptor
whitecoyote
03-10-10, 23:26
I'm looking forward to seeing this!
Want to be a Ford Police Interceptor "Insider"?
Mark Fields, President of the America's and Scott Tobin, Vehicle Line Director will expose the unique purpose-built characteristics of the Next-Generation Police Interceptor.
To see the live reveal webcast, please join us on Friday, March 12, 8:30am (PT)/11:30am (ET) www.fordpoliceinterceptorreveal.com
The webcast will also be available to view on demand within a few hours after the show.
http://i44.tinypic.com/2vucxzl.gif
Unless it has rear wheel drive and a six liter engine, I'm not interested.
http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/gallery/data/525/medium/capricefr34.jpg
Looks like a cross between a Malibu and a charger, but it is nice after almost 20 years of the same design to be changed.:rolleyes:
Look again. That is the new Caprice, not the upcoming Ford Interceptor (rumored to be FWD and based on the Taurus since Ford lacks a new RWD platform).
NinjaMedic
03-11-10, 01:02
Look again. That is the new Caprice, not the upcoming Ford Interceptor (rumored to be FWD and based on the Taurus since Ford lacks a new RWD platform).
I believe the poster recognizes that and was posting the Caprice as pert of his statement of what the Ford would have to compete with . . .
anybody read much about these?
http://www.carbonmotors.com/machine/specifications
mnagant762
03-11-10, 04:47
All the departments around here are getting Chargers and boy do they look good all blacked out.
All the departments around here are getting Chargers and boy do they look good all blacked out.
You will quickly learn to hate them. They win the contest in the looking cool category, but they also win the contest for the most blind spots, most crammed in with equipment and if you get the 6 cylinder version... the most time in the repair shop. I'm 5'8" on a good day and I barely fit in it. The Impala's have more room but not much and the Explorer's are just as bad as the Chargers. I just got assigned a brand new Crown Vic and it's great but the seat hits the back of the cage and you gotta sit straight up. Our Durango is nice and roomy but it's a bit big to go sneaking around in the alleys. I guess what I'm trying to say during my very negative rant is that NOTHING has ever taken the place of the Caprice Classic. Room, speed, handling it was the best. The best way to build a good police car capable of working in for 8 to 12 (and sometimes 16, like today) hours is to have cops aid in the design.
Cascades236
03-11-10, 05:01
The new caprice is based on the Holden commodore right? Want!
The new caprice is based on the Holden commodore right? Want!
It's got a Camaro chassis and is built on the former Pontiac G8 assembly line. I'm not sold on a car being built from a design that was originally for only 2 doors. We will see soon enough. On another note, Ford will be unavailing their 2012 CVPI replacement on April 1st.
woodandsteel
03-11-10, 05:10
Unless it has rear wheel drive and a six liter engine, I'm not interested.
http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/gallery/data/525/medium/capricefr34.jpg
I hated the look of that when it first came out. Until I did some research on it. Now I think that is one good looking ride. I wouldn't mind if my department tested that out.
Man, I really miss my old 94 Caprice. That was some car. We went to the crown Vic after Chevy discontinued the Caprice in 96. Was never really happy with it. Although it is more comfortable than the current alternatives.
Cory, you need to go back and look at where the "new" Camaro came from. Yes, the new Caprice IS a Holden Commodore. The G8 was a rebadged Commodore. The Camaro was a coupe built on a Commodore sedan driveline, not the other way around.
I miss Florida in the late 80's, early 90's and their Mustang 5.0's!
If it were me designing a new police vehicle I would increase the front seat area by at least 40%, convert the back seat area to the equipment compartment and throw the suspects in the trunk (renamed the aft detention container)...
madisonsfinest
03-11-10, 09:59
The Chargers at our department have way more room for the driver then the Crown Vics did. The doors are smaller in the back for putting people in them. With all of the crap in squads now I don't find the blind spots much worse than the crown vics. I also thought the handeling was way better in the snow.
"The Chargers at our department have way more room for the driver then the Crown Vics did."
Sorry, but that isn't any way close to being physically possible.
The CV is larger overall. The windows are both taller and longer, the C pillar is smaller, the rear window is more upright, affording much better visibility. Fitment of the cage in the Charger invilves limiting the full rearward movement of the driver's seat, shrinking the driver's work area. The Charger's seat is lower to the ground, making ingree/egress more difficult when wearing leather gear and a vest.
The Charger's smaller side windows and rear window, with the larger C pillar make visibility in traffic much more difficult. They may look cool but they suck as work vehicles.
I'm looking forward to seeing this!
Want to be a Ford Police Interceptor "Insider"?
Mark Fields, President of the America's and Scott Tobin, Vehicle Line Director will expose the unique purpose-built characteristics of the Next-Generation Police Interceptor.
To see the live reveal webcast, please join us on Friday, March 12, 8:30am (PT)/11:30am (ET) www.fordpoliceinterceptorreveal.com
The webcast will also be available to view on demand within a few hours after the show.
http://i44.tinypic.com/2vucxzl.gif
I know.
It's Ford 500/Taurus with AWD, twin turbo. ;)
It helps to have worked there and still have literally hundreds of close friends still there.
madisonsfinest
03-11-10, 11:31
There is more leg room in the charger. There is a reason all of the 6'03" + people like to drive them.
The seat in the Chargers we have can lift you almost to the ceiling so I see no problem getting in and out as long as you have the seat adjusted to you.
The windows are smaller, but I haven't had a problem seeing out of them. I'm not saying this one is better than that one, but there are parts of the charger I like better.
woodandsteel
03-11-10, 12:38
I know.
It's Ford 500/Taurus with AWD, twin turbo. ;)
It helps to have worked there and still have literally hundreds of close friends still there.
The 500/Tarurs aspect doesn't really excite me. But the AWD and twin turbo has me somewhat interested.
I know.
It's Ford 500/Taurus with AWD, twin turbo. ;)
It helps to have worked there and still have literally hundreds of close friends still there.
There's a police force that can afford that?
leatherneck0331
03-11-10, 15:45
That vehicle being called the new caprice is the pontiac g6.
ThirdWatcher
03-11-10, 20:26
I'm really going to miss the CVPI. It may not be the fastest patrol car on the road (my '88 Mustang was a little quicker ;)) but the CVPI's handling is so predictable (and forgiving, at times) that you get a lot of warning to 'back off the skinny pedal'. The way to get a little more room in front is to tilt the top part of the shield back (usually requiring longer bolts or brackets).
No offense to those enthusiastic about the Carbon Motors car, but it kinda reminds me of the Tucker: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Tucker_Sedan
I can't stand the thought of driving any FWD car, especially on police patrol so if this is what the new Ford Police Interceptor's gonna be, make mine a 2011 Chevrolet Caprice... if it's half as good as the '94 was, it will be good to go. :)
Cascades236
03-11-10, 20:33
I can't for the life of me figure out why Ford reversed the door lock and moved the window controls on the most recent cvpi...it also feels looser thru high speed turns.
DARK-KNIGHT
03-11-10, 21:46
I'de just be happy to have a CV that is a year or two old...I can't stand my Impala, although the new offering from Chevy looks nice
JBecker 72
03-11-10, 22:02
it would be cool to see the new PI use the 5.0 V8
a SHO based PI is pretty cool too tho I guess.
I miss Florida in the late 80's, early 90's and their Mustang 5.0's!
You mean every other state's 5.0 Mustangs. They had them in Mass and I got pulled over by one in Indiana. They had some here in Utah as well.
I know.
It's Ford 500/Taurus with AWD, twin turbo. ;)
It helps to have worked there and still have literally hundreds of close friends still there.
Maybe your joking, but it just doesnt make sense that Ford would replace a simple rear wheel drive/V8 bread & butter car like the Crown Vic, for a maintenance intensive vehicle like an AWD/Twin Turbo. I doubt any of the larger departments across the country would invest in a completely new platform that complex in-terms of maintenance.
I know.
It's Ford 500/Taurus with AWD, twin turbo. ;)
It helps to have worked there and still have literally hundreds of close friends still there.
Thats gonna make the WRX, EVO croud jelous. :p
Bobert0989
03-12-10, 03:55
I'm a Falcon Fan :)
Man, I wish I could get one of these in America... Australia rocks for having these on the streets. They should replace the Taurus SHO with these... IMO. (minus the police stickers, of course)
Alpha Sierra
03-12-10, 05:43
Maybe your joking, but it just doesnt make sense that Ford would replace a simple rear wheel drive/V8 bread & butter car like the Crown Vic, for a maintenance intensive vehicle like an AWD/Twin Turbo. I doubt any of the larger departments across the country would invest in a completely new platform that complex in-terms of maintenance.
You are adding four CV joints of mechanical complexity. That is it.
Turbochargers are maintenance free. So are CV joints. So long as both are lubricated they will run virtually forever IF manufactured and designed correctly. And design and manufacturing are issues the end user cannot control or affect.
Alpha Sierra
03-12-10, 05:47
I can't stand the thought of driving any FWD car, especially on police patrol
With a properly set up suspension (the correct front to rear roll stiffness ratio) a FWD car handles incredibly well. About the only thing it can't easily do is oversteer on command for obvious reasons.
I'm a Falcon Fan :)
Man, I wish I could get one of these in America... Australia rocks for having these on the streets. They should replace the Taurus SHO with these... IMO. (minus the police stickers, of course)
Me, too.
I did the Powertrain Refinement (NVH) development pretty much single handedly back in 1999/2000. The GHIA is a very nice car and I'd love to have one. At the time it had a straight 6 (which I love). We/I stiffened the engine mount brackets as there natural resonance was within the firing order of the engine operating range, stiffened the drive shaft, trans extension housing, intake manifold and strategically added sound deadening. The only trouble area was the transmission mount as the floorpan did not have enough structure/isolation so we had to make it softer than I ideally would have liked it to be. We even had a twin turbo version inline 6 and a V8 version later. Cool cars. They all need better brakes, though (at least for me).
You are adding four CV joints of mechanical complexity. That is it.
Turbochargers are maintenance free. So are CV joints. So long as both are lubricated they will run virtually forever IF manufactured and designed correctly. And design and manufacturing are issues the end user cannot control or affect.
If only it were so simple... It's not. Theres far more maintenance required than a simple FWD or RWD, normally aspirated design. COOL for a specialty car but probably not the best longterm solution for essentially a fleet vehicle. Operating costs will spiral over time.
Maybe your joking, but it just doesnt make sense that Ford would replace a simple rear wheel drive/V8 bread & butter car like the Crown Vic, for a maintenance intensive vehicle like an AWD/Twin Turbo. I doubt any of the larger departments across the country would invest in a completely new platform that complex in-terms of maintenance.
I never said that FORD MANAGEMENT decisions were great decisions. That's partly why I wished to get out of there. :(
It will probably be a good car; "great" to many but I use that term sparingly when it comes to cars. But it's HEAVY so brakes & tires will take a pounding. Fuel economy will be "non-existent", too. I've no idea what the Taurus SHO will cost but it will be in BMW 3 Series territory which makes no sense to me. I'd take a 3 Series Sports Package every single time... Brilliant! :rolleyes:
With a properly set up suspension (the correct front to rear roll stiffness ratio) a FWD car handles incredibly well. About the only thing it can't easily do is oversteer on command for obvious reasons.
I've been doing very bad things on public roads recently. My 2000 Acura Integra Type R is bone stock short of braided stainless steel brake lines and it handles superbly. Just slightly close the throttle prior to the apex of a corner and she tightens her line as if on command (well, it is). Jump off the throttle and you may as well be in a 911. There is no understeer. Of course, if you stand on the throttle while turning in it will resist turning but who would do that?
I've been in Ford Crown Vics at Ford's Vehicle Dynamics Track and even participated in an autocross where one was present (with Mustangs and even a Windstar) and through all but the tightest hairpins the little FWD Honda was much more nimble. Well, it's a helluva lot smaller, too. Over a 30 second course I was close to 2 seconds clear of the Crown Vic. The Mustang had the decent enough handling and more torque to be consistently 1/2 second quicker than the ITR. The ground was made on the launch and every time we/I had to brake hard and make a 90 degree turn. The Miata was only 1/4 second behind me. I enjoyed the Miata more than all of them though. An S2000 might be about perfect.
JBecker 72
03-12-10, 08:21
My 2000 Acura Integra Type R
well that is probably the best handling FWD car ever produced ;)
Turbochargers are maintenance free. So are CV joints.
Until you put a cop behind the wheel. City curbs wreak havoc on cv joints. And if there is one thing street cops do well, it is running into curbs.;)
woodandsteel
03-12-10, 12:34
I can'y argue about the engineering of this car. All I can say is that it looks pretty nice. I want one.
Having pulled 4 or 5 RWD police cruisers out of the snow and ice over the last year with my Jeep, I can't imagine the northern states not opting for an AWD solution.
woodandsteel
03-12-10, 14:46
Having pulled 4 or 5 RWD police cruisers out of the snow and ice over the last year with my Jeep, I can't imagine the northern states not opting for an AWD solution.
During heavy snow storms, RWD can be a complete PITA. But, once the roads are clear, and especially during fair weather, I prefer the RWD. My personal car is FWD. I just think that RWD allows for better handling, especially when you are responding in emergency mode.
The one thing I like about the AWD option is that my wife used to have a Mitsubishi Eclipse with AWD and a turbo in it. That car handled like a dream (the few times she let me drive it). Not sure if Ford can get it right or not.
Alpha Sierra
03-12-10, 16:40
If only it were so simple... It's not. Theres far more maintenance required than a simple FWD or RWD, normally aspirated design. COOL for a specialty car but probably not the best longterm solution for essentially a fleet vehicle. Operating costs will spiral over time.
What kind of preventive maintenance do you need to do to a turbocharged engine that you do not need to do to a normally aspirated engine?
Not talking repairs. Just maintenance. What user serviceable parts need more frequent replacement?
If you are talking breakdowns, that's just piss poor engineering and/or assembly.
Alpha Sierra
03-12-10, 16:43
European cops have successfully patrolled large cities, suburbs, countryside, and (real) high speed freeways in FWD and AWD for a couple of decades now.
American cops can figure it out and get used to it......It ain't that hard.
What kind of preventive maintenance do you need to do to a turbocharged engine that you do not need to do to a normally aspirated engine?
Not talking repairs. Just maintenance. What user serviceable parts need more frequent replacement?
If you are talking breakdowns, that's just piss poor engineering and/or assembly.
Premium oil, filter and fuel; strictly adhering to oil change scheduling; strictly adhering to coolant changes and levels, too. Everything is more critical with the higher stressed (both thermally and mechanically) powerplant. Those stresses will be carried through the driveline as well. Transmission gears and syncros, halfshafts and CV joints also have to deal with the increased loads. It's all doable, but look at the maintenance intervals for, say, the Mitsubishi Lancer Evo VII, IX and X... It aint pretty.
well that is probably the best handling FWD car ever produced ;)
Yes, it's probably the best up until this year. EVO magazine announced that the Renault Megane 250 is slightly better. I'd LOVE to drive one...
Count Chocula
03-12-10, 18:44
I have the 09 Tahoe and love it. Faster than my old Crown Vic and a lot more room. My department is going away from the Tahoe due to maintenance cost (more expensive maintenance, not more maintenance). Interested to see what 2011 will bring.
Alpha Sierra
03-12-10, 18:49
Premium oil, filter and fuel; strictly adhering to oil change scheduling; strictly adhering to coolant changes and levels, too. Everything is more critical with the higher stressed (both thermally and mechanically) powerplant. Those stresses will be carried through the driveline as well. Transmission gears and syncros, halfshafts and CV joints also have to deal with the increased loads. It's all doable, but look at the maintenance intervals for, say, the Mitsubishi Lancer Evo VII, IX and X... It aint pretty.
I'll grant you the frequency of engine fluid replacement.
But if the driveline needs more maintenance, or suffer more repairs, because it is attached to a turbocharged engine; then we are talking about piss poor engineering.
If you hook up a driveline to a turbo engine, design and engineer the drivetrain to deal with the worst possible stresses that it could endure.
Making excuses is par for the course for Detroit........
I think a lot of people are missing the point: it's a ****ing Taurus. Sorry, but Taurus has always been synonomous with POS.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/27/automobiles/27ulrich-best.html?_r=2&pagewanted=2&sq=Ford%20Taurus%20disappointing&st=cse&scp=1
A Holiday From Wishful Thinking
Beyond the Top 10
Here are some of my biggest letdowns this year:
1. Ford Taurus
Looks are deceiving for the Taurus, whose modestly handsome styling disguises the most disappointing car I tested this year. The Taurus could get the award for World’s Biggest Small Car: it seems enormous on the outside, claustrophobic on the inside, with poor exterior sightlines and an paucity of rear legroom for taller adults. The final backhand came from my wife, taken aback by the Taurus’ old-fashioned, floaty road manners. “I thought America stopped making cars like this,” she said.
So - Ford is pushing a FWD V6 on us . . . . again. Luckily, the interior will be too small and visibility will be reduced to make up for the lack of durability and handling problems inherent with the drivetrain (technical garbage aside, the last time Ford pushed the FWD taurus, they said all th same things - it was a piece of shit then too). Awesome.
Go suck a dick, Ford. With all due respect.
I'll grant you the frequency of engine fluid replacement.
But if the driveline needs more maintenance, or suffer more repairs, because it is attached to a turbocharged engine; then we are talking about piss poor engineering.
If you hook up a driveline to a turbo engine, design and engineer the drivetrain to deal with the worst possible stresses that it could endure.
Making excuses is par for the course for Detroit........
Then you don't understand. No one will reengineer an engine block, add a forged steel, shotpeened crank, same with conrods and forged Al pistons, upsize or improve the alloys and material properties of the entire driveline for such a small production run. You simply could not afford it. If it cost within $5k of a BMW 335i which would YOU purchase? Yeah, me, too...
Part of what makes the Euro cars so damned pricey is because of the engineering that has gone into them. Line up a Lincoln LS, BMW 5 Series and a Lexus GS300 and then have engineers do a thorough cost analysis and assume equal production numbers and the BMW will have about 6 grand more engineering than the Lexus which will have a similar position over the LS. We did that study and it was a bit larger than what I've outlayed.
Check out the maintenance requirements for a Subaru
SRi, Mitsubishi EVO, Nissan Skyline GT-R and any other high performance car. It's insane.
Alpha Sierra
03-12-10, 22:51
Then you don't understand. No one will reengineer an engine block, add a forged steel, shotpeened crank, same with conrods and forged Al pistons, upsize or improve the alloys and material properties of the entire driveline for such a small production run. You simply could not afford it. If it cost within $5k of a BMW 335i which would YOU purchase? Yeah, me, too...
Part of what makes the Euro cars so damned pricey is because of the engineering that has gone into them. Line up a Lincoln LS, BMW 5 Series and a Lexus GS300 and then have engineers do a thorough cost analysis and assume equal production numbers and the BMW will have about 6 grand more engineering than the Lexus which will have a similar position over the LS. We did that study and it was a bit larger than what I've outlayed.
Check out the maintenance requirements for a Subaru
SRi, Mitsubishi EVO, Nissan Skyline GT-R and any other high performance car. It's insane.
I understand alright. All the way to the bank.
As someone working in the Japanese auto industry, it pleases me to see that Detroit is still Detroit.
I'm witholding judgment until I drive one. Watched the press conference from Friday over at: http://www.fordvehicles.com/fordpoliceinterceptor/
Direct link to video (about a 20 min long presentation):
http://www.fordvehicles.com/asp/modules/fordpoliceinterceptor/video.asp
It's nice to see Ford addressing specific LE needs for those who drive the car on a daily basis. For example, maintaining the 9" space between driver and pass seat/center console allow you to retain your radio/light box and/or long gun racks that mount between both front seats. The red and white interior (assuming "dome" style) lights will be handy for map reading/report writing/etc.
The USB port will probably come in handy during report writing (copying/pasting, pre-filling documents like search warrants, etc). The pre-existing wire looms for electrical wiring and grommets will help prevent garages/fleet techs from butchering up installations (hopefully LOL).
Basically, Ford is incorporating all the stuff that a PD would want in a police package (in theory). Sounds like a good package so far.
The 365 HP / 350 TQ power specs of the twin turbo Ecoboost engine is quite appealing for those working traffic on the highway IMHO. :D
Also came across an article that details the "tech" side of Ford's TT Ecoboost engine:
http://autospeed.com/cms/A_111422/article.html
The engine doesn't seem too "maintenance heavy" either - water cooled turbos rated to 150K miles during testing, etc, etc.
YMMV
Cascades236
03-13-10, 02:47
well that is probably the best handling FWD car ever produced ;)
Ford knows something about fed handling, the euro focus rs with revoknuckle is proof.
Ford knows something about fed handling, the euro focus rs with revoknuckle is proof.
It is nice but harsh from reviews in evo magazine and from Vehicle Dynamics engineers, though. I would still like to have access to one though.
I understand alright. All the way to the bank.
As someone working in the Japanese auto industry, it pleases me to see that Detroit is still Detroit.
Then u understand the intensive maintenance schedule and costs
associated for the Subaru STI, Mitsubishi EVO and Nissan Skyline GT-R perfectly well then. The same is true for ALL of the higher end performance cars, too. It's also the reason that I don't lust for the Porsche 997 Turbo, Skyline, EVO or STi
nor even Ferrari's latest incarnations. I would be content with another Honda Integra Type R, S2000 or Lotus Elise. There is a small herd of cars like this in Europe
that are rudely mechanical yet don't fail to excite. Driver's Cars for those who don't get it.
Alpha Sierra
03-13-10, 09:12
Then u understand the intensive maintenance schedule and costs associated for the Subaru STI, Mitsubishi EVO and Nissan Skyline GT-R perfectly well then. The same is true for ALL of the higher end performance cars, too.
A mildly turbocharged Taurus is not even close to being in the same performance league as those cars.
Nathan_Bell
03-13-10, 11:51
Premium oil, filter and fuel; strictly adhering to oil change scheduling; strictly adhering to coolant changes and levels, too. Everything is more critical with the higher stressed (both thermally and mechanically) powerplant. Those stresses will be carried through the driveline as well. Transmission gears and syncros, halfshafts and CV joints also have to deal with the increased loads. It's all doable, but look at the maintenance intervals for, say, the Mitsubishi Lancer Evo VII, IX and X... It aint pretty.
Don't forget to let the turbo get cooler oil run through it, even modern designs with good oil will coke up if you go from loaded WOT to off. Considering the fact that police sometimes must shut the car off in those situations it would mean a oil circ system of some sort designed into it.
Kentucky Cop
03-13-10, 12:16
I am so disappointed thus far. Its all up in the air at this point. What were they thinking. I guess we will have to wait and see some of the bigger departments get their hands on them and test them out a bit. Right now, give me the Hemi Charger or the Caprice road rocket with the six liter RWD. My department has already said that it comes down to 2 things. How long ford's warranty will be for and price. Bottom line.
Ky Cop
Alpha Sierra
03-13-10, 16:43
Don't forget to let the turbo get cooler oil run through it, even modern designs with good oil will coke up if you go from loaded WOT to off. Considering the fact that police sometimes must shut the car off in those situations it would mean a oil circ system of some sort designed into it.
Evidently you did not read the link to the 3.5 liter EcoBoost torture testing, which included nearly 1500 cycles of WOT for 10 minutes followed by immediate shutdown.
The test ran EcoBoost at maximum boost flat out for a 10-minute period. Then the engine and all cooling were abruptly shut down and the turbo was left to “bake” after this high-speed operation. This process was then repeated 1,500 times without an oil change. After the 1,500 cycles, the turbos were cut open for detailed technical examination and proved to be fine.
Cascades236
03-13-10, 16:51
Then u understand the intensive maintenance schedule and costs
associated for the Subaru STI, Mitsubishi EVO and Nissan Skyline GT-R perfectly well then. The same is true for ALL of the higher end performance cars, too. It's also the reason that I don't lust for the Porsche 997 Turbo, Skyline, EVO or STi
nor even Ferrari's latest incarnations. I would be content with another Honda Integra Type R, S2000 or Lotus Elise. There is a small herd of cars like this in Europe
that are rudely mechanical yet don't fail to excite. Driver's Cars for those who don't get it. the sti needs an oil change every 3750 miles..what exactly is intensive about its maintenance?
The Taurus sho doesn't even require premium fool. It runs two small snails boosting 12psi, not exactly a gt35
the sti needs an oil change every 3750 miles..what exactly is intensive about its maintenance?
The Taurus sho doesn't even require premium fool. It runs two small snails boosting 12psi, not exactly a gt35
Ever other vehicle has twice the life for oil. Check on the durability of the Sunaru's clutch and other driveline components. Same with the EVO. While you're at look
closely at the mighty GT-R.
Dude, you may as well fence with a windmill. I looked extremely closely at the turbo AWD cars and we benchmarked the drivelines of both. I am still driving my Type R for reasons other than the "H" badges and crazy theft rates...
Perhaps it will be a big seller but I have no interest: too large and too heavy. I have very close friend who is addressing some minor (to me & him, anyways) Vehicle Dynamics issues. I doubt it will have trackable brakes, either. But then what does
that is remotely affordable?
Cascades236
03-13-10, 20:42
Ever other vehicle has twice the life for oil. Check on the durability of the Sunaru's clutch and other driveline components. Same with the EVO. While you're at look
closely at the mighty GT-R.
Dude, you may as well fence with a windmill. I looked extremely closely at the turbo AWD cars and we benchmarked the drivelines of both. I am still driving my Type R for reasons other than the "H" badges and crazy theft rates...
Our cvpis go 3000 between oil changes and the sho isn't a manual so why mention a clutch? We aren't getting decade old type rs for patrol cars so you can stop hanging on to that approach.
Alpha Sierra
03-13-10, 20:48
Ever other vehicle has twice the life for oil. Check on the durability of the Sunaru's clutch and other driveline components. Same with the EVO. While you're at look
closely at the mighty GT-R.
Dude, you may as well fence with a windmill. I looked extremely closely at the turbo AWD cars and we benchmarked the drivelines of both. I am still driving my Type R for reasons other than the "H" badges and crazy theft rates...
Give it up dude. You make no sense.
Give it up dude. You make no sense.
U're obviously very ignorant about auto engineering especially as it relates
to high performance cars. I have encountered many like yourself who profess to know but really don't. I cannot fathom how someone could conclude that a more complex, higher stressed component or vehicle would not require higher maintenance...
Are you sure you aren't a fast tracked manager at one of the Big 3?
Next you will inform us that Toyota's new supercar will be as reliable as their Corolla...
Alpha Sierra
03-13-10, 21:46
U're obviously very ignorant about auto engineering especially as it relates
to high performance cars. I have encountered many like yourself who profess to know but really don't. I cannot fathom how someone could conclude that a more complex, higher stressed component or vehicle would not require higher maintenance....
Let me spell it out for you sport. There is a league of difference between a mildly turboed sedan and some 550+ hp sports car.
Why don't YOU list the difference in maintenance requirements between a 2010 Taurus 3.5 Duratec and a 2010 Taurus 3.5 EcoBoost?
Quit talking generalities and making nonsense comparison to highly strung, limited edition supercars. Start putting facts to your claims.
I'm not going to get into a dick measuring contest with you about my credentials. Suffice it to say that Honda trusts my judgment when it comes to production engineering on their transmission assembly lines.
Bobert0989
03-13-10, 23:21
Next you will inform us that Toyota's new supercar will be as reliable as their Corolla...
Does this impose that they are "unstoppable"? Lol... pun intended.
Unless it has rear wheel drive and a six liter engine, I'm not interested.
http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/gallery/data/525/medium/capricefr34.jpg
The floor shifter is a deal killer for me. No police car should have a floor shifter.
European cops have successfully patrolled large cities, suburbs, countryside, and (real) high speed freeways in FWD and AWD for a couple of decades now.
American cops can figure it out and get used to it......It ain't that hard.
None of them drive a purpose built vehicle. I have yet to see a european manufacturer that produces a purpose built police package car.
whitecoyote
03-14-10, 04:24
The new Ford Police Interceptor looks great!
http://i42.tinypic.com/25h3f9w.jpg
Alpha Sierra
03-14-10, 06:49
None of them drive a purpose built vehicle. I have yet to see a european manufacturer that produces a purpose built police package car.
Maybe so. Yet they seem to get along just fine.
http://policecaruk.com/PoliceAtWork/PoliceAtWork.html
Let me spell it out for you sport. There is a league of difference between a mildly turboed sedan and some 550+ hp sports car.
Why don't YOU list the difference in maintenance requirements between a 2010 Taurus 3.5 Duratec and a 2010 Taurus 3.5 EcoBoost?
Suffice it to say that Honda trusts my judgment when it comes to production engineering on their transmission assembly lines.
I don't believe the 3.5 EcoBoost will be what Ford thinks it will be either. There's still more intense maintenance with the vehicle. If you're into sports cars then you won't mind it at all. You may relish it. But actually USE the power/torque and you'll find the weak link(s) - something EVERY car/manufacturer has. Adding complexity challenges reliability. Period. And some complexity adds mechanical and thermal loads which requires upgrading components and structure. If you work for Honda as an engineer you know this.
I *DO* know powertrains and high revving and/or force inducted petrol engines do NOT last as long as naturally aspirated petrol engines, in general, and when they do have similar longevity there is a more intensive maintenance schedule. Period.
I'm not "defending" Ford as I despise much of what their management has consistently done. Buy one at your own risk - even though from what I'm being told the quality has improved significantly. Well, that may be true but that should have been done a decade and a half ago. And while you're at work you may wish to inquire about Honda's 2nd gear synchros in the Honda/Acura RS-X and Civic Si vehicles...
Alpha Sierra
03-14-10, 11:58
I don't believe the 3.5 EcoBoost will be what Ford thinks it will be either.
On what do you base this assumption?
There's still more intense maintenance with the vehicle
I already asked once for you to list the differences in maintenance intervals between NA and forced induction 3.5 liter Duratecs. I assume that since you haven't laid that out you don't know.
Adding complexity challenges reliability. Period. Your absolute statement is false
And some complexity adds mechanical and thermal loads which requires upgrading components and structure.
How do you know that Ford didn't do just that?
And while you're at work you may wish to inquire about Honda's 2nd gear synchros in the Honda/Acura RS-X and Civic Si vehicles...
A) I work in automatic transmission manufacturing
B) Every manufacturer has some less than perfect products.
C) What does that synchro have to do with the car at hand (Ford Taurus)?
OK - if this ecoboost engine is so awesome, why not just drop it in the current crown vic so we can have the same frame, use the same equipment, etc and have the fuel savings and added power?
"The floor shifter is a deal killer for me. No police car should have a floor shifter."
It will move to the column, just like Chrysler did with the Charger. Can't have a floor shifter and a radio console.
Kentucky Cop
03-14-10, 12:46
I kind of like the high visibility yellow and orange paint schemes on the UK police cars and trucks. I think here in the states there is a push for fire trucks to be compliant with the same scheme just on the back of the truck. I overhead some FF's talking about it possibly being mandated in the next few years. I could see it eventually coming over to the LE side.
http://www.excellance.com/2199large.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/columind99/3664369904/
http://www.lexingtonky.gov/Modules/ShowImage.aspx?imageid=6562
As for this Taurus, I have no clue about turbos other than they sound cool. Does anyone know when Ford will let some interested parties drive the police interceptor and be able to write about it? None affiliated of course......real thoughts. (ex- car/driver, motortrend, LA Sheriff, MI state police) etc. :confused:
Go CATS!
KY Cop
Alpha Sierra
03-14-10, 13:18
"The floor shifter is a deal killer for me. No police car should have a floor shifter."
It will move to the column, just like Chrysler did with the Charger. Can't have a floor shifter and a radio console.
European police car upfitters place the radio in the dash. Presumably they fabricate some brackets to hold it in there. I imagine in some cases the car's music radio is replaced with the 2-way unit.
Column shifters are unheard of in Europe, as virtually no European maker offers them. So upfitters there work around it.
Not saying it is the best way. Just another way of dealing with the issue.
Here in this country the SC Highway Patrol used a few BMW 5 series cars for patrol use. I believe they were donated or discounted by BMW. No column shifters on them. BMW 5 series are very popular for highway patrol use in Europe particularly in Germany and the UK. I'm sure there's a way to get the radio in there.
And of course, there were the many agencies that ran mid to late 80s Mustangs with the same issue.
Alpha Sierra
03-14-10, 13:29
I kind of like the high visibility yellow and orange paint schemes on the UK police cars and trucks
I think US police cars, particularly traffic units, could stand to benefit from much bolder decal/paint schemes. I think this is an issue of officer safety when working around heavy traffic.
Some of the paint schemes around here in Ohio are almost camouflage. The highway patrol cars are all white, with a pair of reflective side stripes along the sides as well as the OSHP "flying wheel" emblem (also reflective). The back side of the car (the most vulnerable during a stop) has nothing but the words STATE TROOPER in reflective tape (silver) on the deck lid
http://www.wcpo.com/media/lib/94/7/a/4/7a45d536-8dcb-47ed-8633-c003708d5419/Story.jpg
All Ohio Sheriff Departments share the same exact markings and color scheme. The car is all black (what a great color for night conspicuity....) with yellow reflective stripes and sheriff star along the sides. The back of the cruiser is all black with the exception of the word SHERIFF in yellow reflective letters on the trunk lid. Again, terrible from the point of view of visibility.
http://www.pixelperfectdigital.com/free_stock_photos/data/581/medium/accident_008.jpg
My town's PD's color scheme is probably the worse from a visibility standpoint. Cars are all metallic gray, with red POLICE on the doors and rear of trunk lid. Very dull on an overcast or misty day.
http://www.troyohio.gov/police/Crusier.jpg
Yes, overhead lights make the car stand out. But more of a good thing can't hurt.
Kentucky Cop
03-14-10, 13:47
Alpha,
I use to be in our canine unit and we would travel to the Ohio multiple times for canine qualifications and such. Every time we would pull into the hotel or parking lot of the competition I would gasp. "How many canine units does this department have" as I would see nothing but the black sheriff cars with the gold stripes. It took us awhile to figure out that everyone had the same paint scheme but from several departments. OSHP cars never really impressed me and they are always the victim of a rear end crash video on TV. Maybe UK is on to something that we should try. Our Kentucky Vehicle Enforcement is strictly "slick tops". Kentucky State Police is half and half with most wanting the slick tops for all the right reasons.
Sorry about the derail. When will the Taurus be available to be tested and write ups done. I am ready for them to belly up to the bar and put this vehicle up against the Charger and new Caprice which I believe will be a frickin road rocket. As far as the column shifter, departments will work around that. Are tech guys are the shit at installs.
Ky Cop
Radios and light control boxes in the dash aren't going to happen here. There is no way all of the modules in my last marked unit would all fit in the dash, light controls, radio controls, etc. DIN spaces for factory "good time" radios are too small and would not afford the rapid access for replacement.
Alpha Sierra
03-14-10, 14:48
Found a shot of the Chevy Caprice interior, console mounted shifter and all.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_IAg3qB6xNwU/SsoC86FZYKI/AAAAAAAAAbo/7JlkEPztSIY/s400/2011-chevrolet-caprice-police-patrol-vehicle-interior.jpg
Interior of a Ford Mondeo (aka Contour in the US) of a UK ambulance service. Has pretty much all the gear you would find in a police car with the exception of an MDT. Note the controls for something mounted on the right side of the steering wheel rim between the rim and the airbag. Smart use of space.
http://www.ukemergency.co.uk/ambulance/dsc02564.jpg
Maybe they can go to paddle shifters :D
Kentucky Cop
03-14-10, 16:03
From that shot of the interior of the Chevy Caprice, it looks like it will work. Just picture the MDC on a swivel mount on the passenger side floor board. It would hang over the passengers legs but how many times do you have a front passenger. I could see it riding just over the gear shifter just a bit but with the mounts you can adjust height for how you want it. GTG!
Ky cop
Kentucky Cop
03-14-10, 17:32
http://www.policeone.com/police-products/vehicles/Patrol/articles/2018850-Competition-heating-up-for-new-police-cruisers/
Scroll down and read all the comments from officers that are instructors in the EVOC field. Very interesting reading on the big 3. I thought it was fitting for all to read.
Ky Cop
Cascades236
03-14-10, 18:32
This is all just coming at the wrong time. Departments don't have money but now they need to choose a new vehicle to refleet? That's likely to include new cages, lightbars, electronics mounts etc. Nevermind retooling the shop.
Maybe they can go to paddle shifters :D
Yeah, they are REALLY durable. :p
Does this impose that they are "unstoppable"? Lol... pun intended.
And maintainence-free, too, some would have you believe. Just like all European cars. :D
P.S.
I still love German cars, though... ;)
Yeah, they are REALLY durable. :p
SMOE :D
MSP "Sarge"
03-14-10, 22:54
Anybody even care to address the problem of FWD patrol vehicle being involved in frontend collision ? Lots of stuff up in the front of a FWD vehicle. Cops like to put the front of their patrol vehicle in places it doesn't belong sometimes ie... curbs, rearend of other cars, medians ect.. Just a thought here.
Anybody even care to address the problem of FWD patrol vehicle being involved in frontend collision ? Lots of stuff up in the front of a FWD vehicle. Cops like to put the front of their patrol vehicle in places it doesn't belong sometimes ie... curbs, rearend of other cars, medians ect.. Just a thought here.
One must be cognizant of the strengths and weaknesses of one's vehicle. Putting the nose of one's car "where it doesn't belong" will most likely stop said vehicle.
With the engine transverse in the vehicle and the axles where they are if you're hit squarely in the wheel it's done. But that's also true with RWD...
FWD is easier for MOST to drive quickly in from a Vehicle Dynamics perspective and it certainly is easier to drive well when things are slippery. AWD can be a great aid here. Operative word is "CAN". It will depend on how the electronics have been integrated into the AWD system. Nissan, Subaru, Mitsubishi and Honda have very complex AWD systems. I recall at the time of our benchmarking effort Mitsu and Nissan had the most advanced but Honda's matches Mitsubishi's but they don't have the system in a vehicle that young, testosterone-driven males are prone to wrap around inanimate and animate objects so it doesn't receive much "press". A very rudimentary AWD system (without electrickery and/or LSDs) can be good for straight line acceleration but little else.
Pretty complicated once you start unpeeling it; especially the "torque vectoring" and inside rear corner braking to assist initial turn-in. Just keep in mind: MAXIMIZE traction no matter the cost and that would pretty much define a good high performance AWD system. But that's way off topic, aint it? Sorry. ;)
Bobert0989
03-15-10, 01:27
Anybody even care to address the problem of FWD patrol vehicle being involved in frontend collision ? Lots of stuff up in the front of a FWD vehicle. Cops like to put the front of their patrol vehicle in places it doesn't belong sometimes ie... curbs, rearend of other cars, medians ect.. Just a thought here.
Start using their rear-ends? ;)
I'm still in love with the Falcons. Can't RPD just buy one already? It may make me WANT to get intop trouble just to ride in it! That's kinda how I felt when I saw the newest Murcialago traffic patrol vehicle online last week... I wanna run past one of those at around 140 just to see it catch up to me (while it's still in like 2nd gear...lol).
And yes, FTR, I drive a Honda (actually, an Acura) daily... lol
ThirdWatcher
03-15-10, 05:37
I used to be a Ford man, but they've become pretty irrelevant to me. I traded my older Ford diesel for a new Dodge Cummins last year because I didn't want a new Powerjoke and it's attendant problems and now this. GM perfected the 9C1 in '94 and promptly discontinued it in early '95 and they haven't been a player since. Ford is going to have to learn the same lesson, while GM takes their market share away from them (I hope).
Screw FWD, if my department opts for FWD Fords over RWD Chevys or Dodges, I'm pulling the pin after the last CVPI wears out.
Alpha Sierra
03-15-10, 05:40
Anybody even care to address the problem of FWD patrol vehicle being involved in frontend collision ? Lots of stuff up in the front of a FWD vehicle. Cops like to put the front of their patrol vehicle in places it doesn't belong sometimes ie... curbs, rearend of other cars, medians ect.. Just a thought here.
Any front end collision severe enough to disable a FWD vehicle will almost always do the same to a RWD vehicle.
What exactly is "a lot of stuff up in the front of a FWD vehicle" that is not in the same (or near the same) place in a RWD vehicle? Besides the driveshafts, anyway....
There is always motors! At least in cities with decent weather. Free yourself from the cage! Speaking of motors, LAPD finally saw the light and has ended their miserable five year experiment with Harley Davidson and is now ordering BMW's to replace those maintenance intensive nightmares. At IACP Kawasaki debuted a Police Package for the 1400 but it may be too late for them now that all of the KZ'z are long retired from every department that had them.
There is always motors! At least in cities with decent weather. Free yourself from the cage! Speaking of motors, LAPD finally saw the light and has ended their miserable five year experiment with Harley Davidson and is now ordering BMW's to replace those maintenance intensive nightmares. At IACP Kawasaki debuted a Police Package for the 1400 but it may be too late for them now that all of the KZ'z are long retired from every department that had them.
That's interesting. I wonder how much they cost relative to each other.
Alpha Sierra,
Its evident from your comments that you aren't a cop, which is why you don't understand a lot of what is being said. Its not a matter of technical aspects, its a matter of actual use.
How many times a day do you bottom out your car?
How many times a day do you push a vehicle with your car?
How many times a day do you turn your car at full lock a day?
The list goes on and on, but the point is that a cruiser fills a role in police work like food fills a role for fat people.
The list goes on and on, but the point is that a cruiser fills a role in police work like food fills a role for fat people.
You do have a way with words:D
Alpha Sierra
03-15-10, 17:08
Alpha Sierra,
Its evident from your comments that you aren't a cop, which is why you don't understand a lot of what is being said. Its not a matter of technical aspects, its a matter of actual use.
How many times a day do you bottom out your car?
How many times a day do you push a vehicle with your car?
How many times a day do you turn your car at full lock a day?
The list goes on and on, but the point is that a cruiser fills a role in police work like food fills a role for fat people.
You're right. I am not a police officer.
I do know that LE work is tough on vehicles.
I just have to ask the obvious questions, though.
Cars like the Taurus (V6/FWD/AWD) have been used for patrol duties in other places with success for a long time. Europe seems to be the most logical comparison since their continent is pretty big, they have a mix of urban, suburban, and rural (though not to the scale seen here), and plenty of roads (including very high speed roads) to patrol.
I find it difficult to believe that the European policing environment is so much different from ours. I am sure they have their share of car chases, potholes, PIT maneuvers, curb hopping, crashes, ramming, and all those other issues you deal with.
Should the process of due diligence, when investigating the suitability of a new type of vehicle for patrol use, not include detailed inquiries to other police departments that do have experience with that vehicle type? When presented with focused questions, such an inquiry must yield good information to add to the mix.
Don't get me wrong. I am not trying to be an ass about this or imply that American cops don't know anything. Far from it. But I can see there is some degree of thinking that says "we do things our way (in the US) and they do things some other way (elsewhere)". While that is true in some aspects, I bet there is a lot of commonality in many other areas of policing.
http://www.bing.com/videos/watch/video/polish-police-car-chase/1eed2147291987487fc11eed2147291987487fc1-1642884170207 Polish police in Ford Focus chasing someone in an Audi A4.
MSP "Sarge"
03-15-10, 22:06
I do not think FWD patrol vehicle are a good thing unless you patrol in a small city. I want a full size police vehicle when on patrol. Bigger and heavier all the way around. The 96 Impala I had would kick butt. I have a small Impala now and after a full day of jumping in and out serving warrants I can't wait to park that thing and get in my truck.
If you haven't had to do it you wouldn't understand. A full size patrol car is the only way to go.
Regarding the 2011 Caprice; it should be noted that word is being passed around that the shifter is being moved from the console to the steering column as a result of all the comments and concerns raised following it's unveiling. The first year following its release will determine it's fait, but I see the Caprice regaining dominance within the LE Community and I for one, will be more than welcoming to that.
"That's interesting. I wonder how much they cost relative to each other."
It didn't matter, I was told that the Harleys were universally loathed. Kawi riders were "missing" transition training to avoid transitioning to them, motor officers were rotating back to cages. The complaints were they were slow, they were loud (no sneaking up like LASO on their bimmers), they were hot (red hot, not liking to idle), starters burning out left and right.
"That's interesting. I wonder how much they cost relative to each other."
It didn't matter, I was told that the Harleys were universally loathed. Kawi riders were "missing" transition training to avoid transitioning to them, motor officers were rotating back to cages. The complaints were they were slow, they were loud (no sneaking up like LASO on their bimmers), they were hot (red hot, not liking to idle), starters burning out left and right.
I was just curious. I know Harley's aren't inexpensive and are at least as expensive as BMWs. I also know they aren't the most reliable bikes, unfortunately. That's too bad... :(
http://www.bmwmc.net/uploads/tm7/LAPD%20Fleet%20Report.pdf
"The Los Angeles Police Department has experienced an abnormal number of repairs due to design deficiencies and poor workmanship in the initial assembly of Harley Davidson motorcycles ."
Nathan_Bell
03-16-10, 09:32
I was just curious. I know Harley's aren't inexpensive and are at least as expensive as BMWs. I also know they aren't the most reliable bikes, unfortunately. That's too bad... :(
Sad state of affairs, if you want a bike that can really run some miles, you are looking at a BMW or a Wing. Nothing else will get you to 100k without real service issues. BMW's smaller girth making it the better choice of those two for a motor.
HD being the absolute worse choice in the mix, do you know of any other motorcycle that has independent repairmen that are booked solid from Sept-March every year?
Sad state of affairs, if you want a bike that can really run some miles, you are looking at a BMW or a Wing. Nothing else will get you to 100k without real service issues. BMW's smaller girth making it the better choice of those two for a motor.
HD being the absolute worse choice in the mix, do you know of any other motorcycle that has independent repairmen that are booked solid from Sept-March every year?
Wow. I have mixed feelings about HD. They don't make the type of bike I'd be interested in but it's iconic. I interviewed with them and had "an issue" with one of the NVH Managers so part of me kinda smiles a crocodile smile but that's just pure ego.
Sad thing is, our industry has been demasculated. Honda and Toyota represent the pinnacle of reliable automobiles and Honda, et als, represent the pinnacle of motorcyle reliability.
Kentucky Cop
03-16-10, 11:26
Regarding the 2011 Caprice; it should be noted that word is being passed around that the shifter is being moved from the console to the steering column as a result of all the comments and concerns raised following it's unveiling. The first year following its release will determine it's fait, but I see the Caprice regaining dominance within the LE Community and I for one, will be more than welcoming to that.
ZG, do you have any related articles or links that would back up the change. Just looking for some solid information on it to pass along here in my city. Couple of my LT's stated that the shifter would get negative points at my department for it being on the floor and not on the wheel. I would love to email them a link claiming the change. I too think that could be a huge plus when departments such as mine look at them. Our MDC's ride on a mount that is mounted to the passenger side "tranny hump" for lack of better words. :D The MDC swivels over the center console and it works out nice.
There is no way my department will trade in the Panasonic Tough books for the ones with the separate screens that mount on the dash. Not happening.
Ky Cop
ThirdWatcher
03-16-10, 14:43
IMO, moving the shifter to the steering column would make the 2011 Caprice just about perfect for police work.
Kentucky Cop
03-16-10, 15:49
IMO, moving the shifter to the steering column would make the 2011 Caprice just about perfect for police work.
I concur my friend! It just raised them up a bit when departments look at them in September. Our guys are going to the Michigan State Police track to test the big 3 out then from what I hear. Our fleet mechanics say that our Chargers are junk. Several of them said that the transmissions and brakes are constant issues. Funny thing is that we only have about 20 V6 models and the detectives use them. They aren't abused like the patrol cars. As I said before, the head fleet guy seems very interested in the Taurus but was going to hold his comments about it before he gets to drive one. I hope the Caprice wins some of them over. They say it will flat run with the 6.0 liter V8 in it. I would like to see personally.......;)
Ky cop
Kentucky Cop
03-25-10, 14:45
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ML3e-KMNMfo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7Sb6qaxmA0
Good home video of the new cruisers. Ford's Taurus is MIA.
Ky Cop
I do not think FWD patrol vehicle are a good thing unless you patrol in a small city. I want a full size police vehicle when on patrol.
Why can't a FWD be a large vehicle? And FWD handles better, might give up a bit in acceleration. I will agree FWD isn't as sexy as HP and RWD :D
Kentucky Cop
06-23-10, 15:00
Anyone heard of any scuttle about which cruiser their department is "leaning" towards. Spoke to some of our head mechanics and they state that they are going to encourage the elite to look at the new Taurus's.
I asked why and they stated that most of the equipment, parts, tools, and even thousands of dollars of Ford diagnostic computers will be compatible with the new interceptor. They also frowned on the twin turbo and think that the V6 will pull just fine.
They said hell, it has around 15 more HP than the Crown Vic. I told them to throw in all the cages, lightbars, and a trunk full of equipment and then tell me how good it drives. Also, while they were looking at me funny I asked them how it would do in the EVOC course being front wheel drive and heavy as hell in the front?
I just cant see a front wheel drive cruiser being fit for duty. Haven't we been thru this before with the Impala and old Taurus?
Ky Cop
ThirdWatcher
06-23-10, 15:21
I just cant see a front wheel drive cruiser being fit for duty. Haven't we been thru this before with the Impala and old Taurus?
Ky Cop
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." I'll be just about ready to pull the pin when my agency's last CVPI retires. Good riddance.
Mr_smiles, who told you FWD handles better than RWD? Whomever told you this is woefully misinformed. About the only advantage a FWD car has in "threshhold driving" would be (marginally) slalom and long sweeping near constant radius curves. Everywhere else RWD dominates.
In rain RWD is "easier to drive" but under near threshhold driving conditions one must recall that you cannot separate steering and braking/acceleration happening simultaneously at the front end which will spell "understeer".
That said, brother, I keep a hard on for small FWD econobox-derived coupes and hatchbacks because they are based upon inexpensive (relatively) platforms and if done properly they can be quite spritely and still return great fuel economy. They can be true "hot hatches" like my very own "Aelf" (Acura Integra Type R) but I do recognize that a well setup Miata handles every bit as well and manages to rotate in slow corners where I must trailbrake and perhaps claw the throttle to induce rotation. That's not a good habit.
You also have the maintenance issues of halfshafts & CV joints w/ FWD...
ThirdWatcher
06-23-10, 23:18
...and still return great fuel economy.
I have never heard a good explanation of why the current version of the CVPI gets such poor fuel economy.
I turned in a '97 CVPI that I once got 27mph (not on patrol, just driving to HQ and back, obeying the traffic laws). I was then issued a new '02 CVPI that got 14 mpg at best. (Neither car had roof lights.) I think we can all admit that, among the other requirements that LE services have to be provided within a budget and the cost of maintaining a fleet of patrol vehicles is probably second only to labor costs. It sure would be nice to have another '97 CVPI. :D
I have never heard a good explanation of why the current version of the CVPI gets such poor fuel economy.
I turned in a '97 CVPI that I once got 27mph (not on patrol, just driving to HQ and back, obeying the traffic laws). I was then issued a new '02 CVPI that got 14 mpg at best. (Neither car had roof lights.) I think we can all admit that, among the other requirements that LE services have to be provided within a budget and the cost of maintaining a fleet of patrol vehicles is probably second only to labor costs. It sure would be nice to have another '97 CVPI. :D
I would bet most of that has to do with emissions. They keep choking them to reduce emissions, causing them to burn more fuel to get the same amount of work done, which equals more emissions. :confused: I think gasoline engine technology is finally starting to catch up in terms of efficiency.
I think it's for this reason and re-sale value that my local PD and some of the Texas DPS have gone to Tahoes, i.e., similar mileage and more money on the trade-in.
I'm thinking more mass due to safety regulations and powertrain matching (engine torque: gear ratio choice).
Kentucky Cop
08-26-10, 20:55
And here we go. Looks as if Chrysler has just released its new Dodge Charger "Pursuit" vehicle.
I am all ears and hopefully my agency will be come late 2011. The article states that they are HUSH HUSH on the specifics and even wont give a clear picture of what this beast will look like. :agree:
http://www.insideline.com/dodge/charger/2011/2011-dodge-charger-pursuit-unveiled-previews-redesigned-charger.html
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.roadandtrack.com/var/ezflow_site/storage_RT_NEW/storage/images/future-cars/spy_photos/spied-2011-dodge-charger-cop-car/gallery/2011_dodge_charger_cop_car_photo_3/2073938-1-eng-US/spy-dodge-charger-pursuit-003_gallery_image_large.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.roadandtrack.com/future-cars/spy-photos/spied-2011-dodge-charger-cop-car/gallery&usg=__1CJzkNdbrhEcymjTHlu_L2MXijY=&h=366&w=600&sz=54&hl=en&start=0&zoom=1&tbnid=-fQK7TAEb6StuM:&tbnh=100&tbnw=164&prev=/images%3Fq%3Ddodge%2Bcharger%2Bpursuit%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dsafari%26sa%3DN%26rls%3Den%26biw%3D1253%26bih%3D631%26tbs%3Disch:10%2C15&um=1&itbs=1&iact=hc&vpx=458&vpy=170&dur=4338&hovh=175&hovw=288&tx=170&ty=109&ei=ZBt3TJX_D8L48AaBiKCFBg&oei=ZBt3TJX_D8L48AaBiKCFBg&esq=1&page=1&ndsp=18&ved=1t:429,r:2,s:0&biw=1253&bih=631
http://www.allpar.com/squads/police-cars/challenger.html Just For Fun!
KC
woodandsteel
08-27-10, 04:39
I was at the Ford dealership today, and was looking at tne Taurus. I hate to say it, but I am not at all impressed. I am really going to miss my Crown Vic. Almost as much as I missed my 94 and 96 Caprices.
My department just ordered it's last group of Crown Vics. :cray:
Kentucky Cop
09-01-10, 21:39
Ford just released its Interceptor Utility Vehicle. It is only available in a V6. I like the looks of it but I really think they missed the boat AGAIN not putting a V8 in it. Watch the video and read the comments....
In the video you can hear the V6 screaming as it attempts to haul that SUV past the camera in a highway overtaking situation.
KC
http://www.policeone.com/police-products/vehicles/articles/2601162-Video-Ford-adds-police-version-of-Explorer-SUV/
ThirdWatcher
09-02-10, 02:35
It continues to amaze me how much the engineers love to play with the lights and siren (I guess its supposed to take our minds off the crap they're trying to sell us). :confused:
Nathan_Bell
09-02-10, 08:45
Saw a few of the Dodge Charger OHP cars. I haven't had a chance to talk to anyone that is driving them, but looking at the specs it should be a good platform.
Kentucky Cop
09-13-10, 15:28
2011 Charger Pursuit revealed in St Louis...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0lqfjGufJjA
Enjoy,
Kentucky Cop
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