View Full Version : Magpul MOE makeover goes horribly wronge! *VIDEO ADDED!*
Being that I must be a complete idiot, I have to ask a question....
Is it possable that Magpul placed a non .mil stock into a box marked for a .mil stock?
I ordered a Magpul MOE set in Foilage Green to dress up my rifle rather than try to paint things.
The MOE stock I got was in a box maked Military style as was the invoice.... and since the .mil style is the largest of the two, I knew that it would fit too loose if my Charles Daly Defense was a civi buffer tube, or fit just right if it was a .mil spec buffer tube. I also know that my Stag is a .mil buffer tube, so if it fits loose, I just dress out the Stag first and then order the MOE parts for the CDD in non .mil next week!
So I removed the OEM CDD stock and went to put the .mil Magpul on.... and she was snug as hell to get to start! I got it started about a half inch and decided that I am not getting anywhere fighting it by hand in the kitchen here so I went down to the shop (concrete floors) and I knelt down, I then pulled the pin all the down on the MOE stock release lever and took the rifle and grenaded that son of a bitch into the concrete stock first... thinking it would go on and get past this odd tight spot. Nope. It went on another inch or so.
O.O
Now I'm starting to get:
1) Pissed off
2) Myself in trouble
So I thought I would pull it off by hand. Nope, this SOB is on there good. (Come inside my head for a second!)...... Maybe it needs to be forced all the way on and then it will loosen up and work normal, yea, that must be it.... it is a .mil stock, it said it on the box and invoice... it has to be a .mil stock! Hit it harder, get it on! So I grenaded that son of a gun 3 or 4 more times and got it all the way on... and boy, she is tight!
So after realizing that this thing is likely not going to come off without a dremel to cut it off..... I got semi serious. I grabbed a strap and tied one end to the ball on my truck and the other end I tied to the MOE stock. I jerked and yanked on this think like I was fighting for my life.... not a fraction of an inch of movement. Nothing.
This next paragraph is my minds next logical move before employing power tools to remove/destroy the MOE stock.....
So I think tonight I will use the 4,000 LB Warn winch on my Yamaha Rhino and attach the winch to the MOE and somehow secure the riffle to the truck and commence to pull with the winch. I'm going to go ahead and assume that by the time this is over, I will have at a minimum destroyed the Magpul MOE stock, maybe some part of the rifle along with it. Nothing I can do at this point but get it off some way and recover in whatever way is necesary.
Then I guess I buy another .mil MOE stock and see what I get! Next time I'll measure first, grenade things later!
Just to verify:
This is unusual right? I have never removed and replaced a stock...
I take it that I could have gotten a civilian spec stock in a .mil spec box and forced the civi stock onto a mil spec buffer tube. Would that be tighter than all get out? Because this is tighter than hell!
Should I video using the winch to somehow pull the stock off of the buffer tube? I may as well have fun with this now, I have completely hosed up at this point.
Picture of the great looking MOE set up... with the permanently attached MOE stock...LOL!
http://i409.photobucket.com/albums/pp174/larry0071/AR-15%20Rifles/IMAG0471.jpg
tiger seven
03-16-10, 08:57
.... and since the .mil style is the largest of the two...
I'm a little confused, so excuse me if I'm misreading your post. The mil-spec receiver extension is actually the smaller of the two. It sounds to me like you may have forced a mil-spec stock onto a commercial-spec receiver extension.
See here: http://www.laruetactical.com/pics/BufferTube/CTR_Stock_Specs.jpg
:confused:
Derek
lethal dose
03-16-10, 09:02
Video!!! Haha.
Oh... shit.
I ASSumed that the .mil was the larger/stronger tube.
Damn it, I should have read the paperwork that came with the stock. I hate reading instructions, but dang... it does not make sense that the mil version is the smaller! So, that is the deal, the CDD must not be a mil spec buffer tube and my rationalization of the size with no reading the facts led me to act a fool.
Well, now I need to get the thing off.
It does look pretty good though, huh? I like the MOE stuff, looks nice and the feel of the heat gaurd over the OEM black round heat gaurd is much better.
Which CDD model do you have? I think it was something like(I might have the model designations wrong though) the CDDM4 had a commercial RE while the CDDM4LE had a milspec RE.
You are correct that I have the CD-DM4, not the CD-DM4LE.
5thprofession47
03-16-10, 10:51
I added a Magpul MOE stock to my rifle last year. I confirmed the size before ordering and slipped it on the buffer tube with just my fingers. It was very easy to do. Sorry you had such a difficult time.
Sorry you had such a difficult time.
LOL!!! :)
No sorry, I was in a hurry, excited, and well.... there may have been some beer involved leading up to the decision making process that got me to this point. I'm more amused at this point now that I know that it was packaged correctly and installed by a baffoon! Yes, the primate in question would be me!
Now I get to turn the bad string of choices into something interesting as I try to remove it as colorfully as I can.... with a winch!
I say sell it on TOS as a fixed stock to someone in a ban state. I expect that it is now "fixed" and you will not be able to remove it...
Buckaroo
http://fubap.org/kingston/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/rtfm4.jpg
At least it won't rattle....
Something to try...put your lower w/stock in the freezer and let it cold soak overnight.
MAYBE the metal will shrink enough compared to the plastic to let you pull it off without too much drama.
If you do get it off though, don't toss it quite yet. There isn't that much difference between a mil and civ tube...something like .010" off the inner diameter all around. Not a 10 minute job, but doable with a right-sized dowel and appropriate sandpaper and you get to customize the fit to your liking. (I'm about as lazy as they come, but I've done it...and know others that have, too)
...and try to keep your sense of humor. If that's the biggest mistake you make with a firearm, you won't be too bad off.
MikeN
Well, I tried again tonight to jerk at it and it is not budging at all. Maybe tomorow I'll have more time and hook the winch up to it. As for the freezing... I suspect both the plastic and the steel (or alluminum?) buffer tube will get smaler and not do much to help. Besides, the idea of using excessive force (4,000 lb Warn Winch!) kind of turns me on! I like sledge hammers and torches.... dramatic results! So I promise to video the chaos and put on my You Tube account for you all to shake your heads at me and think... WTF was he thinking!?
use spray lube. might help
Hey, on another note... is the MP 15-22 using the civilian size tube for the stock? If not, I can put this on the MP 15-22 and order a new one for the CDD DM4. I also need to get the lower rail add on and a AFG in the same color.
My plan is to the CDD in Foilage Green, the Stag 1L in Olive Drab, one of the new builds in Dark Earth and then one MP 15-22 in Foilage and the other I'm going to atempt to Duracoat multi-cam. That will be the end of my dressing up, then I'll worry about finishing the other lower I built into a 10.5" pistol, or maybe I'll get that Spikes Tactical 7.5" Concusion upper for the pistol.
I'm going to try and do one every 2 weeks (pay day) until they are all dressed up.
use spray lube. might help
This may not be a bad idea, I can spray some penetrating oil into it and leave it soak for a day and then go winch it.
before you destroy a perfectly good stock- have you assessed your needs? for me, if you glued my stock fully collapsed, i'd probably never find out.
before you destroy a perfectly good stock- have you assessed your needs? for me, if you glued my stock fully collapsed, i'd probably never find out.
I am only 5'8" but I tend to like the second click out, in the current "all the way in" config, it seems very short to me. Maybe I could teach myself to use this position.... but I am really used to the position one out from here.
That's what I was wondering, can you run it as is? Sorry about your misfortune.
I am only 5'8" but I tend to like the second click out, in the current "all the way in" config, it seems very short to me. Maybe I could teach myself to use this position.... but I am really used to the position one out from here.
maybe winch it out to the second click, and call 'er done. can you think of any reason you'd NEED to collapse it all the way? you have one of the only MOE stocks that's completely rock solid tight- that's a good thing.
i'd use the ****er, meself.
maybe winch it out to the second click, and call 'er done. can you think of any reason you'd NEED to collapse it all the way? you have one of the only MOE stocks that's completely rock solid tight- that's a good thing.
i'd use the ****er, meself.
That may be an idea. I'll see if I can winch it out gently, if there is such a thing.... and get it to the 2nd pin drop.
That may be an idea. I'll see if I can winch it out gently, if there is such a thing.... and get it to the 2nd pin drop.
Larry, you have to put this on youtube. Chapter II of the Wile E Coyote School of gunsmithing.;)
Thomas M-4
03-16-10, 20:34
Buck fever ?
Don't feel to bad I was helping a guy put long tube headers on a stang spent 4 hours trying to fit them almost had the motor out then I looked in the box and read the instructions [cut flange to separate headers to fit around steering shaft :eek:]
15 min later we were done :rolleyes:;) Talk about wanting to bang your head on something.
If you hammered it on, maybe you could hammer it off. . . .
Maybe put a good amount of some oil wherever you can get it on there, get the lower well secured (if possible in a way that orients it down so you can get more force on it), then get a block of wood and put it through the stock and hammer it as close to the stock as possible and see if that will get it moving. I would be somewhat concerned, I guess, about damaging the lower, but surely it wouldn't take so much force to remove it that it would damage the lower. It might help to get a hair dryer (or a more powerful heat gun) and try to heat up the stock to expand it before you try to remove it.
A couple of things come to mind... If you're going to go the winch route I would suggest using 2 pieces of identical strap looped around the sliding shaft part and pulling evenly. If you decide to only use one you'll get absolutely no where due to the obviously tight clearance and creating a side load. You may inadvertently end up damaging a whole lot more than you planned on fixing...
You might also try using dry ice to shrink the metal, not regular cocktail ice, while heating the Magpul stock with a heat gun/hair dryer and the winch method or try tapping, hard, with a hammer.
For future reference on metal parts being stuck together there is nothing better in the world than Kroil, it comes in an orange can. Miss your avatar :) and best of luck!
I would take the buffer tube off the lower, take the butt plate off the stock, shim the adjust pin out so it does not drag, support the front end of the stock on the correct size of PVC pipe and drive the tube out of the stock with a large wood dowel.
If that did not work I would say Screw it, eat the cost of the stock, cut it off and call it a day. Will be the cheapest thing in the long run before you screw up anything else.
I would take the buffer tube off the lower, take the butt plate off the stock, shim the adjust pin out so it does not drag, support the front end of the stock on the correct size of PVC pipe and drive the tube out of the stock with a large wood dowel.
If that did not work I would say Screw it, eat the cost of the stock, cut it off and call it a day. Will be the cheapest thing in the long run before you screw up anything else.
Here a man's talking about going at his AR with a winch, and you come along with the voice of prudence. You're supposed to say things like that after we see the video.
Here a man's talking about going at his AR with a winch, and you come along with the voice of prudence. You're supposed to say things like that after we see the video.
Damn It, Sorry About that!!!:D
The video would be cool.
If you get the stock off, a cheap brake hone ($10+/-) would open the ID up cheaply.
Be sure to get the video though. :D
lethal dose
03-17-10, 00:06
Be careful. You don't wanna torque your cdd lower outta spec. Unlikely, but possible. They are out of production, ya know. ;)
Can't wait to see how this pans out...:(
Here a man's talking about going at his AR with a winch, and you come along with the voice of prudence. You're supposed to say things like that after we see the video.
See that right there.... I like this guy. You all should encourage things like this, it does usually make for decent entertainment!
Aray (lurker member on here) called me last night to offer me encouragement and he suggested that I begin NOT with the winch, but the rifle tied to something non moveable on one end, and the truck attached to the stock and see if I can get the F-350 Crew-Cab Long Bed Powerstroke to spin the 33"x12.5" tires before the stock comes loose. He feels that this would make one hell of a Magpul quality proof video.... My MOE is stronger than my 1-Ton Diesel truck... something like that. He also feels that the video of such stupidness would become epic in ways that have never been seen before.
So, we shall see. I'll think about that suggestion.
tiger seven
03-17-10, 10:09
I would definitely use some sort of penetrating lubricant - like PB Blaster or Kroil - and let it sit for at least a day before I tried anything. Take the buttpad off so you can spray some in there from both ends, and get as much between the stock and receiver extension as you can. Can't possibly hurt at this point. :D
Good luck!
Derek
MWA-HA-HA-HA! I got the SOB off! It took some serious force, but she came off with a bang! Video to come soon, uploading to you-tube as I type!
lethal dose
03-17-10, 19:11
Hurry.
Be careful. You don't wanna torque your cdd lower outta spec. Unlikely, but possible. They are out of production, ya know. ;)
I was not too worried about this because I have the hard shipping case that one of my ARs came in, stocked full of CDD stripped lowers. Browns Armory in Rochester PA purchased about 40 of them this past winter and I accidentally dropped my credit card on the counter and then Tim Brown accidentally dropped a handfull of lowers in my car. I told my wife.... it was a total accident that I spent that money.
lethal dose
03-17-10, 19:52
...Vid?
I friggin uploaded it, but YouTube says that is not encoaded yet. I keep checking it.
This is the error:
This video is not yet processed.
Here is the link, but as of just now it is still not PROCESSED! Come on youtube, get'er did!
REMOVED LINK, VIDEO GOT SCREWED UP BY YOUTUBE.
The name on my YouTube account is HiPerformanceDiesel and the video is titled as "Magpul MOE .MIL stock stuck on civilian AR-15 rifle"
Youtube broke something, photobucket came through!
http://i409.photobucket.com/albums/pp174/larry0071/AR-15%20Rifles/th_100_2585_mpeg2video.jpg (http://s409.photobucket.com/albums/pp174/larry0071/AR-15%20Rifles/?action=view¤t=100_2585_mpeg2video.flv)
Larry
says the video is "private"
pilotguyo540
03-17-10, 21:01
If you freeze it the aluminum will shrink at a different rate than the plastic, if that does not work try piping hot, (not boiling) water
says the video is "private"
Its so private that even I can not see it. I just used ANY VIDEO CONVERTOR to rip it to a MPEG-2 and re-uploaded it.
New link: (Still needs a few moments to process)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9mh78JHbBs
And since I'm pissed at youtube, I'm also uploading to Photobucket as I type.
EDIT: I can not get the private to go away, and it will not allow me to watch it. I choose "share with the world" and click the save, but then if I go out and back in the PRIVATE thing is activated. The second video is not private, but its taking too dang long to process!
Almost done with the Photobucket upload, it is at 60% now.
lethal dose
03-17-10, 21:16
If you freeze it the aluminum will shrink at a different rate than the plastic, if that does not work try piping hot, (not boiling) water
Ugh...
Oh trust me, with a 4,000 lb winch.... it is off! It came off quite fast once we had the winch wound tight and the 1100 LB Rhino skidding along the blacktop. She came loose with a bang and jumped out of my hands. I tied the lower to the frame of the Honda Civic and tied the winch cable around the MOE stock and had my wife keep hitting the winch until the Rhino was skidding the back tires as it came towards the rifle. I had to have her stand on the brakes to lock the front tires and keep hitting the winch until it came off in a violent way.
OK, I got the fricken Photobucket video up!
http://i409.photobucket.com/albums/pp174/larry0071/AR-15%20Rifles/th_100_2585_mpeg2video.jpg (http://s409.photobucket.com/albums/pp174/larry0071/AR-15%20Rifles/?action=view¤t=100_2585_mpeg2video.flv)
You could have just added a bit of foam rubber to the butt of it to adjust it to "one click out length", and left it there... LOL
But then, what fun is that?
Jeff
since it hasn't been mentioned yet.. the term is "mortared," rather than "grenaded." :)
since it hasn't been mentioned yet.. the term is "mortared," rather than "grenaded." :)
So did you find amusement with that video? I mean, how many times have you seen someone use a winch and skid a rhino across a blacktop drive using an AR-15 as the tie-bar? I think I deserve a reward and also.... I think it is worth saying that the Magpul (or should it be Mag-PULL?) stock is made of some serious bad to the bone shit! I really kind of thought it was going to break. There was some serious force on that Magpul stock, listen to the winch start to change pitch..... that winch has pulled full size trucks up hills off-road in the snow.... she can apply some massive pull!
Rate that video 1 to 10, 10 being fantastic and entertaining.... 1 being lame and stupid.....
Yes, this part of PA is close to WV. Great video Larry. I still wanted to see the Cummins smoking tires connected to a DDM4.::cool:
I can belive you didnt rip your buffer tube extension off the lower...:eek:
Jay Cunningham
03-17-10, 22:08
You are an amazing individual, Larry.
Just dont try to stuff an AR10 mag in that rifle now...:D
lethal dose
03-17-10, 22:13
You are an amazing individual, Larry.
I was thinking "special" better describes Larry.
Congratulations on not screwing anything else up. I rate the video an 8.
That was fun to watch.
i'm a member of the 3-minutes-or-less generation, so i had to fast forward to the action a couple times, but good vid, and congrats on getting it off without es'ploding the gun.
just please don't say "grenaded" anymore :p
pilotguyo540
03-17-10, 23:44
Ugh...
We would all like to see stuff ripped apart, but I was trying to save the guy a little hassle. I didn't see that he had it off already because I was following along on the crackberry while I was running around town. Still the advise is sound, so don't ugh... me buddy! Anyways, this has been the most entertaining thread in a while!
Wow, after seeing the video that was not the safest way to do that
Tell me that your twin sons are not named Pontiac and AMC. :p:D
Nice vid. Next time take the optic off first ;)
Wow, after seeing the video that was not the safest way to do that
It was safer than many of the things I do in the garage. Trust me, that was not bad.
Tell me that your twin sons are not named Pontiac and AMC. :p:D
No, Larry, Chevelle, and Troy.
You are an amazing individual, Larry.
You have no idea!
Congratulations on not screwing anything else up. I rate the video an 8.
That was fun to watch.
That was the point of videoing it! Glad someone got a chuckle!
We would all like to see stuff ripped apart, but I was trying to save the guy a little hassle.
I was looking forward to the mayham! I don't think I could have been stopped once I decided to do it!
i'm a member of the 3-minutes-or-less generation, so i had to fast forward to the action a couple times, but good vid, and congrats on getting it off without es'ploding the gun.
just please don't say "grenaded" anymore :p
GRENADE x 1000!
Legend, Good ad for Magpul kit though.
Not sure what the hold up was with YouTube, but this morning it allowed me turn both videos to PUBLIC, so now they are both (identicle videos) able to be seen on You Tube.
This is as it came from the camera, I did not convert or compres it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6W1ut5JbGw
Second thought, I'm deleting the second video from YouTube. LINK REMOVED
This is the first time YouTube ever went wierd on me, I don't know what the heck happened.
lethal dose
03-19-10, 12:30
"GO 'HEAD!"
Ummm... Larry, hammers are generally used for installing things you don't want coming apart easily, like nails, hammer unions and such, not adjustable stocks. ;) hehehe.
Funny stuff man, but next time measure twice bud.
Ok, after giving it much thought, have you tried RDX or PETN? I'm pretty sure that would work! Good training.
Ok, after giving it much thought, have you tried RDX or PETN? I'm pretty sure that would work! Good training.
I had no idea what the heck you were saying to me with those initials.... RDX and PETN... so I naturally assumed that you were suggesting that I take some meds :(... called RDX and PETN. Then I googled the initials and discovered that you are suggesting I get some boom-juice to use as a tool around the garage :).
Now.... let me say this, if you knew me.... you would never invite me to have something capable of blowing shit up! :eek:
Because.... you could bet your last dollar that I would not stop blowing shit up until I ran out of that very fun sounding stuff you mentioned! Yea, I'm better off backing away from the explosives :D
(I also tried to make effective use of the emotion icons in this post, pretty effective huh!?)
john232629
04-03-10, 11:30
Why did you leave the upper on the rifle?
Why did you leave the upper on the rifle?
Same reason he stuffed the stock on. :D Im glad he got the stock off! Funny stuff....
john232629
04-03-10, 12:05
maybe this is the new "fixed" stocks for states that dont allow such ergonomically useful features on their weapons
LMarshall73
04-03-10, 13:01
That was great! And a valuable lesson learned.
I give it a 10, but if you took off the optic.... an 8.
I give it an 11, thats a 10 turned up one more higher!
Larry you are simply AWESOME and make me proud !
I will be sitting with a bunch of lawyers tomorrow and when things really suck (which they will:mad:), I'm gonna think of that video and smile!
I dream of having a wife that I can ask to come run the wench on the Rhino to remove the stuck stock on my M4 out in the drive way while my daughter films it and my dog supervises!:p Simply Priceless and truly American!
PdxMotoxer
04-20-10, 17:31
Mag-PULL .... lol sooo many classics in sooo little time.
Larry you are "Da-Man" and i thank you for sharing this with us.
Now if we could only get those A&E people to get some camera's
to follow you around because i''m pretty sure it would be more entertaining
than half those scripted "reality" shows they have going now. lol
Watching the video it appears you have a commercial buffer tube. Rear slants. Mil spec MOE would stick like it was epoxyed . Good to see things went well .
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