View Full Version : Is it just me? (ACR price)
Is it just me, or does it seem a lot of people seem to be jumping on the ACR is over priced band wagon?
Not so well informed?
Unrealistic expectations?
spamsammich
03-18-10, 23:25
Is this a joke?
Belmont31R
03-18-10, 23:29
I think it has a lot to do with Magpul coming out even in the weeks prior to the launch touting the 1500 price range. Then we get hit with the price, and MSRP is close to 3k. Add to that the features being somewhat lacking....
I personally see no reason to jump on the ACR when its not doing anything the AR already is not, and the AR has a huge aftermarket. The ACR has zero, and you are stuck with that BM puts out.
I personally made a 80% decision against the gun as soon as it was announced BM would be producing it. They've been making AR's for a very long time, and still are sub par to many other brands. I have zero faith they would suddenly put the build quality into it that several brands of AR's have. For instance for 2k I can get another SR15, and have top of the line equipment. Solid metal (not plastic) sights, quality hammer forged 1x7 barrel, one of the best rails on the market, good furniture, and parts commonality with most parts. Or I could get a fully equipped 6920 (or other mid range AR), and have money left over for what a base ACR costs with nothing.
With the ACR you are stuck with the factory grip, and its not possible to change it out. Apparently the barrels are proprietary parts. Operating system is proprietary. Furniture is proprietary. BM has exhibited no interest in selling their rifle, and explaining why its a good rifle to buy for the money. Magpul has been near silent, and has no interest in defending their prior statements, and the current ACR. Part of my buying experience is seeing the company stand behind their products, and explain within reason why its a good purchase. I want to know the company will stand behind the products they want me to buy. BM basically said **** it, and retracted back from selling the gun to the market.
Is it just me, or does it seem a lot of people seem to be jumping on the ACR is over priced band wagon?
Not so well informed?
Unrealistic expectations?
What, in your opinion, makes the ACR worth the $3k asking price?
Whats an ACR?
Another Crappy Rifle :)
or is it
Another Cool Rifle ?
Another Crappy Rifle :)
or is it
Another Cool Rifle ?
Another Costly Rifle
rifleman2000
03-19-10, 07:43
I personally see no reason to jump on the ACR when its not doing anything the AR already is not, and the AR has a huge aftermarket. The ACR has zero, and you are stuck with that BM puts out.
These reasons alone are plenty for me.
I can get two 6920s for the price of 1 ACR, and I am willing to bet the 6920s are much higher quality in parts, assembly, and a proven system.
ForTehNguyen
03-19-10, 08:01
i don't recall when they said it was going to be $1500 near launch. In 2008 when Drake had a demo on it, they said they are trying to target it at that price range but that was before they joined with Remmy/Bushy. That was the last I heard about any price. I honestly never expected it to be $1500, that was totally unrealistic considering what ARs go for nowadays. Before the announcement I was expecting low to mid 2000s, considering its primary competitor, FN SCAR. If I had designed this weapon, no way I would sell it just for $1500, but I wouldn't sell it for $3000
some websites already posted their selling price of ACRs. Buds Gun Shop has Basic for around $2050 Enhanced $2330. Georgia Gun Store $2162/$2650, On Point $2283/$2600
rifleman2000
03-19-10, 08:10
i don't recall when they said it was going to be $1500 near launch. In 2008 when Drake had a demo on it, they said they are trying to target it at that price range but that was before they joined with Remmy/Bushy. That was the last I heard about any price. I honestly never expected it to be $1500, that was totally unrealistic considering what ARs go for nowadays. Before the announcement I was expecting low to mid 2000s, considering its primary competitor, FN SCAR. If I had designed this weapon, no way I would sell it just for $1500, but I wouldn't sell it for $3000
some websites already posted their selling price of ACRs. Buds Gun Shop has Basic for around $2050 Enhanced $2330. Georgia Gun Store $2162/$2650, On Point $2283/$2600
I think what people have to consider is; what does it do different or better than a rifle like the LE6920? For practical purposes, nothing, in my opinion.
I would argue that a quality AR15 is superior to the ACR, admittedly I have never handled an ACR. But an AR has about 50 years of development, debugging, and improvements put into the design. The ACR is an untested platform. The AR15 has far, far more accessories and variants available.
Bushmaster does not have a reputation for quality these days, so even if the design is sound, the execution may not be.
Lastly, the AR15 is cheaper!
Proven AR15 (LE6920) $1300
Unproven, Bushmaster ACR ~$2300
ForTehNguyen
03-19-10, 08:33
I'm still mildly interested in one, as I'm ARed out a bit. I sort of want something next gen to be a flagship to my collection, but haven't seen one anywhere to touch and feel to help make a decision or any magazine reviews. $2500+ is a lot of money obviously to drop, and being a first adopter is risky as well. So I just have to wait and see. The SCAR didnt go far enough (mainly the reciprocating CH, and non ambi mag release controls) so I'm not as interested in that.
Heavy Metal
03-19-10, 09:23
Is it just me, or does it seem a lot of people seem to be jumping on the ACR is over priced band wagon?
Not so well informed?
Unrealistic expectations?
Because $3K for what is essentially an AR-18A3 is absurd.
Considering the upper is an extrusion and the lower is polymer, the rifle likely costs much less than an AR-15 to manufacture. An XCR has more intense machining that the ACR and yet is costs half as much. The ACR was obviously designed to be cheap to manufacture.
Sure, they gotta recoup their tooling and R&D but you can also do that over a larger number of untis sold.
At $1,500 they could have captured market share and perhaps constitute a long-term serious competitor to the AR.
At $3,000, they have a low-volume niche piece that will never capture a sliver of the market.
Belmont31R
03-19-10, 09:56
i don't recall when they said it was going to be $1500 near launch. In 2008 when Drake had a demo on it, they said they are trying to target it at that price range but that was before they joined with Remmy/Bushy. That was the last I heard about any price. I honestly never expected it to be $1500, that was totally unrealistic considering what ARs go for nowadays. Before the announcement I was expecting low to mid 2000s, considering its primary competitor, FN SCAR. If I had designed this weapon, no way I would sell it just for $1500, but I wouldn't sell it for $3000
some websites already posted their selling price of ACRs. Buds Gun Shop has Basic for around $2050 Enhanced $2330. Georgia Gun Store $2162/$2650, On Point $2283/$2600
Magpul was touting the 1500 price even weeks before the launch.
I could see someone saying 1500, and then it ends up 1800, maybe 2k for the "enhanced" model. A full 100% increase?
The only plausible explanation, especially given the materials used in the ACR, is BM wanted to capitalize as much as they could given the Magpul name and following they have, and Remington is still pushing for a military contract. That means they need to pump the price up so they make more off military sales, and that is where the money is. Same reason the SCAR is so costly, and why a KAC SR25 costs at least 5k. If they sold those guns with a standard profit margin they couldn't sell them to the gov for 6-8k a pop. AR's are not finely tuned by hand, and with custom fit parts. You can train almost anyone to put one together. The shops that do not sell guns to the gov can do it for half.
considering how reasonably priced the rest of magpul's gear is, the 3k price point is dissapointing... if they tossed a pac nor barrel in and and dropped the price by 1000 bucks it would make it interesting again...
Go here, watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BB0Pu-rvFjs
Makes me laugh every time.
"Shrubmaster"
"**** them. **** them sideways!"
FromMyColdDeadHand
03-19-10, 11:19
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3288/2961175776_b341ca0fc5.jpg
Is it just me, or does it seem a lot of people seem to be jumping on the ACR is over priced band wagon?
Not so well informed?
Unrealistic expectations?
Two reasons I believe ...
!. They weren't going to buy an ACR to begin with.
2. Once the initial MSRP prices came out (or whatever BM was thinking) a lot of people stopped reading all future posts about the ACR and thus don't realize the price is actually much lower.
militarymoron
03-19-10, 13:05
The SCAR didnt go far enough (mainly the reciprocating CH, and non ambi mag release controls) so I'm not as interested in that.
?? the SCAR has ambi mag release controls.
I thought the SCAR did have an ambi mag release, but I do belive the bolt catch/bolt release is not ambi, like the ACR is.
Another Costly Rifle
ahhh should have thought of that one :) two points for ya
I held a SCAR for the first time the other day. Very left-handed-friendly and surprisingly well balanced. It was priced around $2500 which is good for a SCAR (no price gouging on this one), but still too much for me to spend.
Haven't seen an ACR, but personally I'd rather own an FN product than a Bushmaster product.
I am not really sure it is fair to call the ACR a "Bushmaster." I don't have a low down on the whole process but the ACR is being built in a totally different location from the Bushmaster AR lines (AFAIK) and the Remington ACR are built on the same line as the Bushmaster ACR. No one here would be complaining about buying a Remington ACR (ignoring pricing issues).
Budsgunshop.com has ACRs for less then 2500. Yes the price could fluctuate when the rifle comes in stock, but I don't believe it would be too much of a difference. Better price, better controls (in my opinion.)
I remember when piston AR15s first came out years ago there were just over 2000. 2000 and change for the basic model, 300 extra for the enhanced doesn't seem to bad to me.
It was what, the HK 416, Patriot Ordinance, and ...... LWRC? The first 3 piston ARs. I remember the forums were a buzz with people pissed HK "didn't have any plans at the time to make the 416 available to the US Civilian Market.
sabashimon
03-19-10, 23:06
Is it just me, or does it seem a lot of people seem to be jumping on the ACR is over priced band wagon?
After seeing this, I'd say that is an understatement:
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=161198693
I do believe that is a "special edition" not the regular ACR.
The difference between the Remington and Bushmaster is just the mil-spec specifications right? Metal coating and stuff like. The idea was Bushmaster could make the rifle (or finish it as it would seem) to be more cost effective to us. Not waisting money on certain details we don't want/need but the military wants.
DISCLAIMER
(I could be wrong, please not too much trash talking if I am)
ForTehNguyen
03-19-10, 23:20
After seeing this, I'd say that is an understatement:
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=161198693
the first serialized ACR for civilians will command a collectability premium. However its irrelevant to the rest of us in the same way as the the how much the first serialized first AR15 is worth
sabashimon
03-19-10, 23:24
I do believe that is a "special edition" not the regular ACR.
I understand that.......but for 15 large (and that still hasn't met the reserve!) that baby better be able to go 1/10 MOA, shine my shoes, and give sexual favors :rolleyes:
baffle Stack
03-19-10, 23:26
Is it just me, or does it seem a lot of people seem to be jumping on the ACR is over priced band wagon?
¿Que?
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=1&t=1014567
We need a :facepalm: smiley.
I understand that.......but for 15 large (and that still hasn't met the reserve!) that baby better be able to go 1/10 MOA, shine my shoes, and give sexual favors :rolleyes:
oh it does. :D
The difference between the Remington and Bushmaster is just the mil-spec specifications right? Metal coating and stuff like. The idea was Bushmaster could make the rifle (or finish it as it would seem) to be more cost effective to us. Not waisting money on certain details we don't want/need but the military wants.
DISCLAIMER
(I could be wrong, please not too much trash talking if I am)
I don't even think it is that much difference
AFAIK, they are the same except the fire control pieces on the Remington mil version and the barrel (until the rumored 1/7 Bushmaster shows up) and maybe the forearms. And the name on the side.
After seeing this, I'd say that is an understatement:
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=161198693
Wow!!! 15k....that elcan better come with it. Heck for that price three or four of them should come with it.
PdxMotoxer
03-20-10, 05:49
It's NEW it's expensive.
I'm old enough to remember when microwaves were $1,000
The fancy Bata-max came out at more than triple the price of a VCR
and if i remember correctly they were still pretty hard to get.
you couldn't touch a laptop pc for under 3g's and those had HUGE 10gig hard drives.
If you want the new technology and you can afford it than cool.
Meanwhile there will always be those who can't believe someone at sometime
paid that price for something.
How much are these pro poker players throwing down on the tables in
just a bluff and then walking away with nothing to even show for it.
Hahaha, thank you wise one. :)
ForTehNguyen
03-20-10, 14:39
¿Que?
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=1&t=1014567
We need a :facepalm: smiley.
TOS will whine about anything and everything. Just look how fast that thread went downhill.
Why does everyone blame shrubmaster for this fiasco? Seems to me magpul has screwed this up from the get go, they only had bushy/remy build the metal parts of this gun, assemble and distribute it. The metal receiver may say BM or REMY on it, but magpul is making the plastic parts. Every pic of the ACR has magpul logos stamped in the buttstock, lower, plastic handguards, sights and the mag. If Bushmaster and Remington has final say so on this rifle then why are they putting someone elses logo on there gun, I wouldn't do it!
Its priced to hi because
1. They have to buy those expensive plastic magpul parts.
2. They have to pay royaltys to magpul for every gun sold.
3. They have to price it around the socom proven SCAR rifle.
4. But what the hell do i know!!!!!!!!
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.