View Full Version : First class, many misc. gear questions
Hello m4c!
I've lurked here for a couple of years since I got into ARs, and this site has some of the best info I've ever seen online for any subject.
I'm a 21 year old CPL holder in Michigan, and I'm signed up for the Magpul Dynamics Handgun 1 on May 22-23. This is my first training class. I'm all set on my rig (M&P9c in CCC AIWB Looper/Shaggy, CCC mag carriers and Surefire all on Wilderness belt), but I've got some other general gear questions.
I might have to buy some things, so keep in mind that I have to be able to get it before May 20th, and on a broke college student budget.
1)Range bag
I've only ever used indoor ranges a half an hour from my house for an hour at a time, so I've never really set up a range bag. I've only ever really brought my ammo and targets. What are the things that I'll need in my bag for a two-day course on an outdoor range? List it even if it seems obvious to you.
2)Ammo
What's the best way for me to (cheaply) bring the requisite 1500 rounds of 9mm? It's all currently in the (really heavy) cardboard box it came in, which is obviously not sufficient.
3)Spare parts
I already plan on swapping in a gen5 striker on my M&P and keeping the old one as a spare, 'cause I know that the striker is a possible failure point. I also want to get some of the compact mag baseplates for the finger extension mag and a couple of fullsize mags. Question is, what other spare parts for the M&P should I get, and where might I find all of these parts that can get them to me soon? (Yes, I know I'm leaving some of this stuff late, I'm a Master Procrastinator.)
4)Jacket
I have a TAD Gear Ranger Hoodie v.5 that I've been wearing over the winter, and it's excellent at all things except temperatures much above 65. :p I want something constructed like a cheap hoodie (lightweight, breathable), that's in something like Foliage green, and has maybe a couple extra pockets on it. So far I've been coming up empty. Does such a thing exist?
Bit long-winded, but thanks in advance to anybody who takes the time to answer!
calicojack
05-01-10, 19:11
......
If you look around at different training centers websites, SI and Tactical Response spring to mind, they usually have write ups and After Action Reports and have a list of what to bring besides Gun. mags and ammo.
Ammo cans and clothes for a change in the weather are good things. Nothing worse than spending $300 to $500 bucks and shaking because you packed shorts and it dipped into cooler weather. Rain gear I would think a light weight jacket or something similar.
As for a range bag...... this could get like the Bug Out Bags or Get Back Home Bags for what all you might need. 1st Aid kit is needed and I would think some moleskin for sore hands, feet (if your using shoes that aren't all the way broke in). Cleaning kit is a good thing. Tools to replace spare parts, spare eyes and ears, batteries, and on and on.
Stuff that I keep in my range bag (maxpedition) are...
Extra ear pro
Extra batteries
Lube (Slip2k Small Bottle)
Solvent (Slip2k Small Bottle)
Cleaning kit (OTIS)
KleanKanteen
First Aid Kit (Zip lock baggy of band-aids, neosporin, alcohol wipes, and aspirin)
Extra mags
As for carrying your ammo I like to carry it loose in an ammo can, you can get a plastic plano ammo can from Bass Pro if you can't find a surplus store around you.
Thanks for the responses so far.
I should probably specify:
I have ears eyes, mags and ammo covered (Purchased the ammo in January, usually run with plugs under muffs with the microphones turned up). I just wasn't sure the best way to carry the ammo around. I've got some ammo cans full of AR mags I can dump out for this I guess.
For the bag, I'm mostly thinking of those little things you wished you had, but didn't think of until you found you needed it. I don't already have any spare parts for the M&P, so I'm just looking for the bare minimum most likely to break parts to keep me on the line.
Spring in Michigan is unpredictable. It could be 35 and raining or 90 with the sun beating down, and neither would surprise me. So I'm gonna bring clothing for different weather types. I wear hoodies almost year round (lightweight in spring/fall, Ranger in the winter, and anytime in summer when its below 75 and cloudy). Part of blending in at school. It's more of a general question, 'cause my current spring hoodie is bright red. :p
The mag loader is something I'd forgotten about. I don't mind loading mags, but I imaging I'll get tired of it after 700 rounds or so.
Definitely pack some candy or like a power bar or something. And definitely a first aid kit of some sort. After getting a cut on my hand from a rail, I wish I had bandages. I was bleeding all over the place it was embarrassing haha. Get some bug spray or sunblock, and a nice hat if your gonna be outdoors.
calicojack
05-01-10, 21:56
......
cliff bars for sure. if you don't have an ifak either on your person or in your bag already your doing it wrong.
'Nuff said :cool:
M&P stuff, probably find the parts you're after with one of the listed vendors.
https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=3553
This isn't a hoodie, but I and a few others have found this to be a very usable, light, water resistant and wind resistant uninsulated soft shell that's not "cheap," but won't kill your wallet, either.
http://www.rei.com/product/795026
Check the clearance racks at your local Bass Pro, Cabelas, or whatever. It's spring, so you might find a deal on a hoodie version of the same sort of thing. Might wanna invest in a light boonie-hat variant if you can't.
For carting loose ammo, I used to double up a couple of medium nylon stuff sacks (I've collected a bunch over the years), but I was recently given one of these, and I LOVE it. Dump the boxes of rounds in, cinch it up, go. Repeat as needed.
http://prostores2.carrierzone.com/servlet/emdomusa/Detail?no=55
Also...
Light staple gun
Aspirin - or whichever
Pens - including a Sharpie or three
Notebook of some sort - network with your fellow students and instructors, or just jot stuff down so you don't forget it
Tools - you literally never know when a flat or Phillips screwdriver may be handy. A Leatherman/Gerber multitool, at the least.
Don't for get to bring plenty of water, drink as much as possible between breaks. Some kind of powerbar/snack as well.
Most people in the classes I've been to just used ammo cans (30 cal ones) for carrying ammo.
Failure2Stop
05-02-10, 00:04
I prefer to reload out of the normal boxes that pistol ammo ships in. I just slide the internal round holder out of the cardboard box enough to have three lines of ammo exposed and invert said box over my awaiting hand- a perfectly counted 15 rounds to insert directly into the mag. Otherwise I find myself trying to shove 16 rounds into a 15 round mag, which eats time and produces only anger and blisters. It's also a good way to track round count. 10 empty boxes? Must have shot 500 rounds.
Optimally, have as many mags as you possibly can fully jammed before class starts. The more the merrier. It will free up time to suck water or discuss things with other shooters or the instructor(s). Sometimes the little side-conversations are worth the entry price; something that the unprepared will never know.
Bring lots of staples.
Write your name on your stapler. Otherwise you may have to set the building on fire.
Bring a note-pad and a pen. All sorts of little things that you think you will never forget will be forgotten by the time you eat lunch.
Bring some kind of burn ointment. I like Aloe. Something with a topical numbing agent is a good idea. Shoot beside someone else enough and you will get a piece of brass somewhere that will hurt like hell. Dealing with it properly and quickly can make the difference between learning and perfecting a skill-set and rushing through drills worrying more about pain than getting your money's worth. If you forget that stuff, try to be the far left shooter.
Always have a towel.
Im the host for that class
all good info as usual
a easy up canopy is good to i will have at least 2 of mine there
the range has a good selection of food drinks as well if you need more
Ill have about 4-5 Mp handguns there as well if problems come up
good soild footwear is a biggee for me and a folding bag chair
I often go for the voice recorder now a days for class notes
I second, F2S's comment about staplers. A small easy to handle one works fine.
Lense Cleaner/ Defogger: I have one of those smooth cloth rags for cleaning eye pro/ optics and also some store bought anti-fog stuf for eyepro. When it is hot, rainy etc this stuff comes in really handy.
Every class I have ever been to the back of your car is your mothership. Keep it clean and orderly so you can quicky find things. I keep a cardboard box or trash bag to throw trash into so that I dont have to worry about it. I also have all my gear split up and labeled so I can find it. IE I have one box labeled "ADMIN" that has stuff like sharpies, extra eye/ear pro, batteries, bulbs etc.
Like others have said jack as many mags before hand if possible. I have learned just as much on mag jack breaks as I do in the class.
Eat lunch with the instructor or students. Do not be a loner. Talk to them. They know stuff you dont and are more than happy to share. If not it helps to build relationships.
Water. Hydrate. I usually stow a few gallon jugs of water for a class. My daily intake depends on temp/ physical activity but drinking from gallon jugs allows me to keep track of my water intake.
Chapstick. Not only can this help protect your lips from the elements, it can also be used on your light to protect the lense from muzzle blast.
I keep pistol ammo in the original packages of 50 if possible. I do however put the 50rd boxes into ammo cans. This makes it easy to transport.
PJ
Thanks guys, I've got some buying to do.
As far as the striker assembly and mag base plates, I've found the striker at Midway and S&W's parts list, and the base plates at speed shooters. Are the strikers that Midway has gen5? They list the same part number that's on S&W's site:
STRIKER ASSY 279770000
MAGAZINE BUTT PLATE (FLAT) 392930000
Are these the right parts numbers? and if I call in an order from S&W, how likely are they to get me the parts in time?
Write your name on your stapler. Otherwise you may have to set the building on fire.
I b'lieve you have my stapler?
Always have a towel.
A good shooter always knows where his towel is.
Things that live in my range box:
Stapler, staples, sunblock, lube, punches, hammer, cleaning rod, Boresnake, screwdriver kit, brushes, foamies, Q Tips, paint pens, markers, index cards and I'm sure there's more I can't remember.
I like keeping my ammo loose in an ammo can. I grab a handful and jam mags until they won't take any more, then strip one off. I like that I don't have to fuss about with opening boxes and such. And I don't leave a ton of garbage at the range that I'll have to clean up later.
I also keep my gun stuff in the range box (for the most part), holsters and other stuff in a big car box (those folding cloth ones you can get at Wal Mart for 10 bucks) and admin type incidentals in a clear plastic bin. For a pistol class I'll usually bring a couple of extra holsters and mag carriers, both for me and for anyone else who made a bad gear choice and needs a stand-in.
I heartily second the notion of bringing a folding chair. Did I mention sunblock? You don't want to be a lobster by the end of the first day. It's unpleasant and will take away from the stuff you're trying to learn. Speaking of unpleasant, keep rain gear, boots and a spare pair of socks in the car.
VMI-MO has a great point about working out of the back of your car. If you can't do that, a small table that folds flat is a nice thing to have.
Always have a towel.
A hitchhikers must;), so says the guide
Every class I have ever been to the back of your car is your mothership. Keep it clean and orderly so you can quicky find things.
The trunk of my car typically looks like a nuclear bomb went off in it by TD2.
Anyways pretty good advice. Personally I found myself rarely using my stapler, the instructors I've been to have been on the ball bring their own supplies, and policing the targets. With one during a lecture or a demonstration, while the targets are switched out.
Well I've got a list, checking it off, ordered some things, bought some things locally.
I'm gonna order up a striker from Midway, 'cause they have it in stock. I'll let you guys know if it's a gen5 or not, and even if it's not two older strikers should be enough for a class.
Question for Steve: Are any of your M&Ps a 9 compact? I ask because I will be bringing compact mags and a Kydek holster that wont fit the fullsize.
Thanks for your posts so far, and if there's anything you can think of that hasn't been mentioned, feel free!
SeriousStudent
05-04-10, 19:06
........
Bring lots of staples.
Write your name on your stapler. Otherwise you may have to set the building on fire.
........
This!
http://www.thinkgeek.com/homeoffice/supplies/61b7/
:D
I actually went to the local hardware store and bought a fairly small metal stapler. Was already in the car when I realized that it was painted bright red. :D
SeriousStudent
05-04-10, 19:38
Then you are all set! :D
Good luck with your class, you will have a blast. Stick with the drills, and remember to practice what you learn when you get home.
Stay safe.
thopkins22
05-04-10, 21:08
ear pro. recommend surefire ep4s for plugs and at least peltor tac 6s for electronic muffs. not necessarily combined. if you don't have electronic ear plugs i would probably double up (muffs and plugs)
Just a note that may not matter since the OP hasn't mentioned more questions about earpro...but unless your ears are very large I'd strongly recommend the EP3's instead....
You guys bring a lot of stuff.
I was reading this and thinking what does one really need for a class: Bring some medical tape. Unless you are accustomed to 700-1000 round training sessions, your hands will be raw from manipulations/loading magazines. Medical tape will help you cover up those broken blisters/cuts.
Oh one suggestions I just remembered, mark you magazines, with a number, and a unique mark, like your initials.
Also it wouldn't be a bad idea to mark your ear pro, UpLula, and stapler.
I prefer to reload out of the normal boxes that pistol ammo ships in. I just slide the internal round holder out of the cardboard box enough to have three lines of ammo exposed and invert said box over my awaiting hand- a perfectly counted 15 rounds to insert directly into the mag. Otherwise I find myself trying to shove 16 rounds into a 15 round mag, which eats time and produces only anger and blisters. It's also a good way to track round count. 10 empty boxes? Must have shot 500 rounds.
How often do you get mad when you shoot a 7 or 8 shot gun and can't do this? I know I get irked at myself from time to time having to count.
I attended a T/S pistol class last month and it looks like just about everything has been covered.
Bug Juice
Baby Wipes
Ziplock Bags (I policed my brass for reloading)
have fun....................
In addition to what others have said...
For ammo, a class I just came back from called for 1,000 rounds and I brought 1500 just in case. I put 750 rounds in a 30 mm ammo can and the rest were in their factory boxes. At night you just count whatever's left and subtract what was in there. Everything fit inside a small suitcase so it was easy to drag it from the car to the loading/unloading area each morning.
I took a pen and notepad to take notes during class. After I got home it was easy to see everything we did to practice later on. You're paying big bucks to take the class, might as well retain all the info you can. I wish I had a voice recorder and small video recorder like a Flip Ultra.
Bring some medical tape and/or bandaids. I had a blister on my shooting hand middle finger (Glock) after the first day and I don't think I would have been able to shoot without something covering it up.
My drive was 5 hours so I brought a cooler along in the back seat. I didn't really bring much to the class.
I think you need to pick up a few extra rounds. From the MD class I've attended the req was 1500 and I ended up firing 1800 or so by the end of the class. You definatley don't want to end up being shy by a few hundred causing you to have to sit out of the class the law hour or two. That's usually when all of the drills are done! Enjoy the class. It will surely open your eyes to what you may or may not have thought to be true!
I've got 2000 rds that I bought in bulk. I plan on shooting some of it beforehand 'cause I've never used this particular ammo before. I planned on bringing the several hundred rounds of WWB that I've got laying around though.
Jay Cunningham
05-05-10, 22:36
Actually I prefer to dump ammo into ammo cans. I have been to classes where there was so much trash generated by guys opening fresh boxes of ammo that it was overflowing the cans.
FYI Midway sent me a gen5 striker, so it looks like they're out of old stock. They still have 'em in stock so grab 'em if you have an older M&P.
Pretty much all set thanks to you guys! I think I'll try my hand at an AAR after the class.
I dump my ammo into ammo cans. I hate fumbling with cardboard boxes, toting trash, etc. Load every mag you have before you arrive each day so you don't have to do it when you get there. Also, make sure you have one of these ...
http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=23962/Product/UPLULA_UNIVERSAL_SEMI_AUTO_PISTOL_MAGAZINE_LOADER
... it will save your thumbs and get you back on the line faster. The instructor will appreciate you for it. It will also give you a few extra minutes alone with the instructor to ask questions or get extra help while everyone else is loading their mags.
In a pistol class I think showing up with anything less than 10 mags is unprepared. Personally, I usually have 15+.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.