View Full Version : Disney World and CCW
Ga Shooter
05-05-10, 21:17
I will be going to Disney World later this month and was wondering if anybody had CCW and/or know what Disney's policy is. I have a GA concealed weapons permit and I know that Florida recongises the permit but what about Disney?
Thanks
Alpha Sierra
05-05-10, 21:21
Disney security will escort you out and you will be banned from admission for life if you get caught. No criminal penalties though.
There are cameras EVERYWHERE. If you must carry, be extremely discreet.
I've never had anyone search me or raise an eyebrow at my attire (typically untucked "casual" shirt and shorts). There's no magnetometers, and the only thing that gets "searched" is bags of any kind (so no belly bags or Maxpedition murses for mouse-land...)
Have carried both Glocks (G23 on my hip, G27 in my pocket) with no issues; though the PM9/S&W 340 combo was admittedly a LOT more comfortable in June.
Regards,
Kevin
You can do it. Just be very discrete. Hell my wife has gone through with her purse and they never even clued into the compartment in her purse. I know guys who have gone in with the likes of a Maxpedition and security only gave the bags a cursory once over.
does disney world employ any sort of armed personnel? :confused:
Disney security will escort you out and you will be banned from admission for life if you get caught.
Sounds ok to me.
does disney world employ any sort of armed personnel? :confused:
Not visible at least. I have spoke to one of my best friends who is management and all I can get from him is a "no comment" when I have asked that question.
elkknuckle
05-05-10, 23:16
i think disney has its own pd, unless its lake buena vista or orlando pd, i know that when i went last march there were armed police officer type guys there, ill ask my uncle he lives close by
Why do people insist on over analyzing whether or not they can carry into a place where they will never get caught?
There are 1000s of people there.
Put your gun in your pocket or in a IWB holster and wear a baggy shirt over it and you have nothing to worry about.
Being banned from disney for life isn't that big of a deal.
And fanny packs make you look like a douche.
If I'm not going through a metal detector, well then....
Texpatriate
05-05-10, 23:31
We used to live in Orlando and I've got kids so we've been to Disney literally dozens of times. That probably sounds like a nightmare, but its not so bad when you've got free annual passes for the whole fam from your company and you've figured out how to get free parking. We used to just go for a couple of hours, ride a ride or two, watch the fireworks and head home. Cheap entertainment when you do it like that.
Disney security will escort you out and you will be banned from admission for life if you get caught. No criminal penalties though.
I've never had anyone search me or raise an eyebrow at my attire (typically untucked "casual" shirt and shorts). There's no magnetometers, and the only thing that gets "searched" is bags of any kind (so no belly bags or Maxpedition murses for mouse-land...)
Both of the above are accurate. Disney's policy is no firearms and they will throw your butt to the curb if they catch you, but they do not post it at any entrance that I have ever seen as required by FL law. All bags are supposed to be searched, and they halfheartedly do so as you enter all of their parks. So just don't put your ccw in a bag. They will not search your person, so just put it in a good holster or pocket carry and you're good to go. I think the whole policy and the security measures are just corporate CYA crap.
Its really as simple as this: If there is a sign posted at the entrance that says "NO FIREARMS ALLOWED" then dont carry. If theres nothing posted then go for it. I went to Six Flags over arlington and they had these no firearms signs posted at the entrance. I declared my off duty weapon at the gate, showed my badge, my Id, followed by my warrant of apointment and all I got from the security officer was a confused look followed by "sir, can you just check it in at our lock boxes please" so I had to leave my gun at their lock boxes before entering the park. I am sure I could have legally carried in the park being LEO and all, but decided not to get into a pissing contest with the security guy and just did what he told me. I highly doubt Disney has less strict firearms policies than Six Flags, so pay attention to these signs, and obey them. If it is posted and you do carry, you will be criminally penalized.
Texpatriate
05-05-10, 23:58
I agree with your post that if there is no sign you can carry, however, if the sign you saw at Six Flags didn't look pretty much exactly like this:
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c196/rburkheimer/TarrantAdminBuilding3005.jpg
it was not a legally binding sign in the state of Texas and you can carry there *legally*. Aside from that, if you are active LEO you could have carried anyway.
Does anyone else find it ironic that a place called "Six Flags Over Texas" would be posted no CCW?
um... it has been a while since I have checked for this specifically but I do not think FL has a law about businesses posting signs banning firearms on thier property as other states do. Therefore there would be no criminal prosecution as long as you were legally carrying. The most they could do is kick you out of the park as mentioned above. To be sure though you would have to check FL Statute 790.
Not visible at least. I have spoke to one of my best friends who is management and all I can get from him is a "no comment" when I have asked that question.
it seems like the sort of place that might have some kind of contingency.... walt doesn't strike me as a man who'd leave anything to chance :D
citizensoldier16
05-06-10, 00:49
it seems like the sort of place that might have some kind of contingency.... walt doesn't strike me as a man who'd leave anything to chance :D
From what I've heard from local cops, word is that Disney has a crack SWAT team but they keep it very hush-hush.
From what I've heard from local cops, word is that Disney has a crack SWAT team but they keep it very hush-hush.
good for them. :cool:
does disney world employ any sort of armed personnel? :confused:
Yes, they do.
Following 9/11 in Disneyland anyone with a keen eye might have noticed that the troops on Tom Sawyer's Island (where fireworks for the fantasmic show are stored) were carrying something other than fake 6 shooters in their oldschool cavalry holsters.
ohiorifleman
05-06-10, 07:04
From what I've heard from local cops, word is that Disney has a crack SWAT team but they keep it very hush-hush.
I am just picturing their insignia when they go to SWAT competitions- Mickey with an M-4 or something like that.:p
QuietShootr
05-06-10, 07:14
I've never had anyone search me or raise an eyebrow at my attire (typically untucked "casual" shirt and shorts). There's no magnetometers, and the only thing that gets "searched" is bags of any kind (so no belly bags or Maxpedition murses for mouse-land...)
Have carried both Glocks (G23 on my hip, G27 in my pocket) with no issues; though the PM9/S&W 340 combo was admittedly a LOT more comfortable in June.
Regards,
Kevin
I have been twice in the last four years and carried a 1911, 2 spares, and a 340PD both times with no problems. They cursorily check bags, but as was said no magnetometers.
Getting banned for life wouldn't bother me a bit...my wife is a frigging Disney nut and that would get me out of ever having to go there again.
you've figured out how to get free parking. We used to just go for a couple of hours, ride a ride or two, watch the fireworks and head home. Cheap entertainment when you do it like that.
Free parking? What do you do? Park at the hotels?
Both of the above are accurate. Disney's policy is no firearms and they will throw your butt to the curb if they catch you, but they do not post it at any entrance that I have ever seen as required by FL law. All bags are supposed to be searched, and they halfheartedly do so as you enter all of their parks. So just don't put your ccw in a bag. They will not search your person, so just put it in a good holster or pocket carry and you're good to go. I think the whole policy and the security measures are just corporate CYA crap.
That's how I pretty much did Universal Studios. My only concern was using an IWB with out a retention strap on the roller coasters. But then I realized that the retaining harness also snugly kept the pistol in place.
um... it has been a while since I have checked for this specifically but I do not think FL has a law about businesses posting signs banning firearms on their property as other states do.
True. Unlike Alabama and (apparently) Texas and other states, a "no weapons sign" in Florida does not carry the force of law. Like traffic lights in Italy, they are merely a request.
From what I've heard from local cops, word is that Disney has a crack SWAT team but they keep it very hush-hush.
God bless them because if I was on an ERT at Disney I think I might snap and shoot Mickey after the 47th verse of "Its a small world"
Guys,
Don't get me wrong, I only wish I was able to carry, and I would in most instances. But do you really need to carry in Disney World?
I understand crime can happan anywhere, and it is your right to protect yourself, but it just seems to me that its going to be more of a pain the a$$ then its worth. Going on rides that use any kind of restraint system it not going to be comfortable.
I dunno, maybe Im a naive yankee but it just seems like you can go without having a firearm on your person at Disney.
I know if by some miricle NJ residents will be allowed to carry, I will leave my firearm in the car when I go to Six Flags. The last thing I need it my gun going flying when I am on a roller coaster.
What if you go to a water park? lol
Flame away!
If you do carry, I would assume that as long as no-one notces, you will be fine. Personaly, I do not wear loose fitting clothing, so I would stick out like a sore thumb with a gun on my hip, but if you wear a loose fitting t-shirt or polo and some cargo shorts, I doubt anyone would be the wiser.
I agree with your post that if there is no sign you can carry, however, if the sign you saw at Six Flags didn't look pretty much exactly like this:
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c196/rburkheimer/TarrantAdminBuilding3005.jpg
it was not a legally binding sign in the state of Texas and you can carry there *legally*. Aside from that, if you are active LEO you could have carried anyway.
Does anyone else find it ironic that a place called "Six Flags Over Texas" would be posted no CCW?
Sorry, the sign does not conform to the law. Try PC 30.06, not PC 30.05 (trespassing).
CENTCOM_Survivor
05-06-10, 11:41
But do you really need to carry in Disney World?
That is exactly why I carry when I go. If everyone else is thinking the same thing then the wolf has the advantage. I carry to protect my family and I'm not getting whacked at the friendliest place on earth!
Guys,
Don't get me wrong, I only wish I was able to carry, and I would in most instances. But do you really need to carry in Disney World?
I understand crime can happan anywhere, and it is your right to protect yourself, but it just seems to me that its going to be more of a pain the a$$ then its worth. Going on rides that use any kind of restraint system it not going to be comfortable.
I dunno, maybe Im a naive yankee but it just seems like you can go without having a firearm on your person at Disney.
I know if by some miricle NJ residents will be allowed to carry, I will leave my firearm in the car when I go to Six Flags. The last thing I need it my gun going flying when I am on a roller coaster.
What if you go to a water park? lol
Flame away!
If you do carry, I would assume that as long as no-one notces, you will be fine. Personaly, I do not wear loose fitting clothing, so I would stick out like a sore thumb with a gun on my hip, but if you wear a loose fitting t-shirt or polo and some cargo shorts, I doubt anyone would be the wiser.
I've been to Disney more times than I can count (living in Orlando you gain acquaintances who were for the Mouse), and yes I have carried there. Tourist areas in Orlando have seen increases in violent crime over the past several years, predictably if you ask me. You've got a lot of people in one place who generally aren't familiar with the area, many who aren't even from this country; carrying cash on them, etc. While I haven't ever been walking through the Magic Kingdom thinking "man, I wish I had my gun", a lot of people generally aren't comfortable leaving their weapon in the car which leaves carrying it on your person.
So where are people being targeted at Disney? I guess in my mind, there are tons of people everywhere there. If you did need to draw your weapon, are you going to have 30 kids running around behind the bad guy? Sounds like that would violate one of the rules of firearm safety, but to each his own. Then again, you never know what is going to pop up out of the water on the "It's a small world" ride.
That is exactly why I carry when I go. If everyone else is thinking the same thing then the wolf has the advantage. I carry to protect my family and I'm not getting whacked at the friendliest place on earth!
I've been to Disney more times than I can count (living in Orlando you gain acquaintances who were for the Mouse), and yes I have carried there. Tourist areas in Orlando have seen increases in violent crime over the past several years, predictably if you ask me. You've got a lot of people in one place who generally aren't familiar with the area, many who aren't even from this country; carrying cash on them, etc. While I haven't ever been walking through the Magic Kingdom thinking "man, I wish I had my gun", a lot of people generally aren't comfortable leaving their weapon in the car which leaves carrying it on your person.
fair enough...
I just can see it taking away from enjoying the rides as the gun digs into your hip when the favery bar comes down on Splash Mountain...
So where are people being targeted at Disney? I guess in my mind, there are tons of people everywhere there. If you did need to draw your weapon, are you going to have 30 kids running around behind the bad guy? Sounds like that would violate one of the rules of firearm safety, but to each his own. Then again, you never know what is going to pop up out of the water on the "It's a small world" ride.
I guess getting mugged in the parking lot will never happen, going to the park or leaving it.
QuietShootr
05-06-10, 13:49
Guys,
Don't get me wrong, I only wish I was able to carry, and I would in most instances. But do you really need to carry in Disney World?
I understand crime can happan anywhere, and it is your right to protect yourself, but it just seems to me that its going to be more of a pain the a$$ then its worth. Going on rides that use any kind of restraint system it not going to be comfortable.
I dunno, maybe Im a naive yankee but it just seems like you can go without having a firearm on your person at Disney.
I know if by some miricle NJ residents will be allowed to carry, I will leave my firearm in the car when I go to Six Flags. The last thing I need it my gun going flying when I am on a roller coaster.
What if you go to a water park? lol
Flame away!
If you do carry, I would assume that as long as no-one notces, you will be fine. Personaly, I do not wear loose fitting clothing, so I would stick out like a sore thumb with a gun on my hip, but if you wear a loose fitting t-shirt or polo and some cargo shorts, I doubt anyone would be the wiser.
Yup, naive Yankee.
I can't imagine there's any criminal activity at Disney, and I'm real sure haji respects the magic of Disney, too.
:rolleyes:
Come on out of your cage, it's not so bad out here in the free world.
Going on rides that use any kind of restraint system it not going to be comfortable.
I found it very comfortable.
I guess getting mugged in the parking lot will never happen, going to the park or leaving it.
Might happen going to the park. Shouldn't happen leaving. Nobody has money at the end of a day at Disney. :D
So where are people being targeted at Disney? I guess in my mind, there are tons of people everywhere there. If you did need to draw your weapon, are you going to have 30 kids running around behind the bad guy? Sounds like that would violate one of the rules of firearm safety, but to each his own. Then again, you never know what is going to pop up out of the water on the "It's a small world" ride.
I am with you on this one. You dont hear of many people being "individually" targeted at disney. If someone did target you, and you drew your gun and opened fire, it would just be a blood bath. The kind of people that ccw at disney are probably the same kinds of people that walk around their urban house with a pistol opened carried on their hips. Sure, its legal, but do you want to be known as the nut job of the block? The biggest security concern for a place like disney its probably more of an act of terrorism, than a robbery of an individual. Besides, what are you going to do with your gun before getting into a ride? take it out and put it in a lock box with your wifes purse? Sounds like a pain to me.. To each his own though
QuietShootr
05-06-10, 15:17
I am with you on this one. You dont hear of many people being "individually" targeted at disney. If someone did target you, and you drew your gun and opened fire, it would just be a blood bath. The kind of people that ccw at disney are probably the same kinds of people that walk around their urban house with a pistol opened carried on their hips. Sure, its legal, but do you want to be known as the nut job of the block? The biggest security concern for a place like disney its probably more of an act of terrorism, than a robbery of an individual. Besides, what are you going to do with your gun before getting into a ride? take it out and put it in a lock box with your wifes purse? Sounds like a pain to me.. To each his own though
You and I are gonna be BFFs, I can tell already.
CarlosDJackal
05-06-10, 15:18
When I visited DW about 6 years ago I called their office to inquire about this. Basically, they told me that I can leave my handgun in my vehicle but under no circumstances can I have it on my person when I enter the main premises. And I was an LEO when I asked and when I visited (not anymore). FWIW.
CarlosDJackal
05-06-10, 15:23
...But do you really need to carry in Disney World?...
Is Disney World so "magical" that they have somehow figured out a way to prevent ANY crime from happening within their property?
Didn't they have a murder out in their parking lot a couple of years ago? Have you seen how large their parking lot is? Just saying. :rolleyes:
I am with you on this one. You dont hear of many people being "individually" targeted at disney. If someone did target you, and you drew your gun and opened fire, it would just be a blood bath. The kind of people that ccw at disney are probably the same kinds of people that walk around their urban house with a pistol opened carried on their hips. Sure, its legal, but do you want to be known as the nut job of the block? The biggest security concern for a place like disney its probably more of an act of terrorism, than a robbery of an individual. Besides, what are you going to do with your gun before getting into a ride? take it out and put it in a lock box with your wifes purse? Sounds like a pain to me.. To each his own though
Go back and read my post on page 1 of this thread.
Also, for the record, there's not a ride (water rides notwithstanding) at WDW where a small to medium sized semi-auto pistol carried IWB in a decent holster with a decent belt and a decent shirt over it would present any kind of problems, much less requiring discreet disarming prior to going on the ride.
For thoes of you who are terrified of the long lonely walk from the parking garage to the entrance, is there not a lock box at the entrance to disney were you can leave your weapon? When you are done in the park, just get it out and make the long walk back to your car armed. I mean, if your gona get robbed at disney, its probably gona happen in the parking lot, not in the park with thousands of people, hundreds of hidden cameras, and dozens of undercover security personel.
QuietShootr
05-07-10, 06:55
For thoes of you who are terrified of the long lonely walk from the parking garage to the entrance, is there not a lock box at the entrance to disney were you can leave your weapon? When you are done in the park, just get it out and make the long walk back to your car armed. I mean, if your gona get robbed at disney, its probably gona happen in the parking lot, not in the park with thousands of people, hundreds of hidden cameras, and dozens of undercover security personel.
Terrified...lol.
I think you got lost on the way to http://www.bradycampaign.org/ or http://www.fuddhuntersagainstblackguns.org/ or http://www.gunsaretoysnotweapons.org/.
God, I can't wait till school starts again.
For thoes of you who are terrified of the long lonely walk from the parking garage to the entrance, is there not a lock box at the entrance to disney were you can leave your weapon? When you are done in the park, just get it out and make the long walk back to your car armed. I mean, if your gona get robbed at disney, its probably gona happen in the parking lot, not in the park with thousands of people, hundreds of hidden cameras, and dozens of undercover security personel.
I don't recall there being lockboxes outside the gates to the individual parks. There are inside. Only problem with that is you'd almost have to have it in a bag to avoid overtly unholstering with those thousands of people all around you, oh and bags are all checked. So I guess you'd have to have it on your body going through the gates, go into a stall in the bathroom and move it to the bag prior to putting it in a locker. If someone wants to do that, more power to them; I really don't care either way (and I'm not sure why some people here seem to care so much what other people do).
You can save all the "terrified" nonsense. I highly doubt anyone here is "terrified" to walk in an amusement park without a gun. Some of us just happen to acknowledge that often times there is a false sense of security about certain places in this country (after all, why would anyone need a gun in school? That's just lunacy...). Shootings happen in gun-free zones. Carrying a gun doesn't have to be some kind of huge imposition; it's not like we are carrying Desert Eagles in drop-leg holsters down here in Florida. A gun like a Glock 19 or 26 or M&P9c can be concealed easily and wearing it is not a big deal.
Littlelebowski
05-07-10, 07:44
For thoes of you who are terrified of the long lonely walk from the parking garage to the entrance, is there not a lock box at the entrance to disney were you can leave your weapon? When you are done in the park, just get it out and make the long walk back to your car armed. I mean, if your gona get robbed at disney, its probably gona happen in the parking lot, not in the park with thousands of people, hundreds of hidden cameras, and dozens of undercover security personel.
That's a well worded and properly spelled point. Why should any of us be armed? After all, there's LEOs and security guards at most public places. It just makes sense.
30 cal slut
05-07-10, 07:49
OP,
Your question has probably already been answered, but the answer is yes if you are discreet.
At each of the parks (Magic Kingdom, Animal Kingdom, Epcot, etc) I visited last November, security only checked bags and nobody was being wanded. There are just too many dang people waiting in line. Wanding would slow things down.
Concealed means concealed, on your body.
I did just that at both the Magic Kingdom and Epcot center just 3 weeks ago.
As as been said, no one will search your person, only your bags if you present them for screening. I went through with strollers and lots of kid/baby bags. In every instance, I simply give the screener one of the bags and left purses, diaper bags, coolers, etc hanging off the stroller. Never was I stopped and asked to have the other bags checked, although that could be a possibility. If you go through the screening at peek times (~9am), they seemed to spend the least amount of time checking people.
When I went, I pocket carried a small pistol. Florida heat and close quarters (standing in line, etc) might make it difficult to carry something larger on the belt.
On a side note: I would rather patronize the Bush Gardens/Sea World parks, since their parent corporation is actually PRO gun, unlike the Disney Corp. Although it's tough to explain that to a 3 year old ;)
Bottom line, no one will check your person for weapons and the worst case scenario if discovered would be them asking you to leave the park, possibly without a refund. You would not however be breaking any laws, unless of course you refused to leave.
I did just that at both the Magic Kingdom and Epcot center just 3 weeks ago.
As as been said, no one will search your person, only your bags if you present them for screening. I went through with strollers and lots of kid/baby bags. In every instance, I simply give the screener one of the bags and left purses, diaper bags, coolers, etc hanging off the stroller. Never was I stopped and asked to have the other bags checked, although that could be a possibility. If you go through the screening at peek times (~9am), they seemed to spend the least amount of time checking people.
When I went, I pocket carried a small pistol. Florida heat and close quarters (standing in line, etc) might make it difficult to carry something larger on the belt.
On a side note: I would rather patronize the Bush Gardens/Sea World parks, since their parent corporation is actually PRO gun, unlike the Disney Corp. Although it's tough to explain that to a 3 year old ;)
Bottom line, no one will check your person for weapons and the worst case scenario if discovered would be them asking you to leave the park, possibly without a refund. You would not however be breaking any laws, unless of course you refused to leave.
Security theater...that's all it is.
Agreed on the Anheuser Busch parks...although to be fair the weapons policies at the parks for guests are identical. But you're right, at least Sea World didn't assert the same exception to FS 790.251 (http://www.flsenate.gov/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=Ch0790/SEC251.HTM&Title=-%3E2008-%3ECh0790-%3ESection%20251) that Disney pulled.
Hmmm. Private property. The owners of that private property do not allow concealed or open carry.
If you must go, don't carry. If you must carry, don't go. Pretty simple.
:rolleyes:
Hmmm. Private property. The owners of that private property do not allow concealed or open carry.
If the eyes of Florida law, policies like this have about as much weight as one that said "No tube socks allowed".
I agree with your post that if there is no sign you can carry, however, if the sign you saw at Six Flags didn't look pretty much exactly like this:
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c196/rburkheimer/TarrantAdminBuilding3005.jpg
it was not a legally binding sign in the state of Texas and you can carry there *legally*. Aside from that, if you are active LEO you could have carried anyway.
Does anyone else find it ironic that a place called "Six Flags Over Texas" would be posted no CCW?
Yup indeed.. In Texas it have to be the 30.06 sign for it to be a legal sign. I wonder what the other states sign are like?
That's a well worded and properly spelled point. Why should any of us be armed? After all, there's LEOs and security guards at most public places. It just makes sense.
Hey I am not trying to make the argument of whether anyone should be armed or not. We are simply discussing the practicality/legality of bringing a gun to Disney. Heck if you could go into the park, unholster your gun without people freaking out, put it in a dedicated gun lock box before entering a ride, all without jumping through loop holes, then heck yeah I would carry in there! I am not against this at all, as a matter of fact on one of my posts I think in page one I talked about how I tried to carry inside 6 flags, but the very knowledgeable security officer who wasn’t even a license peace officer wouldn’t allow it :rolleyes:.
rifleman2000
05-07-10, 13:55
I love all the people that can't understand why it is people feel the need to carry everywhere, or why we get upset when we are told not to.
1st, Better to have and not need than need and not have.
2nd, there is no reasonable, sound, or logical reason that a law-abiding citizen should not be able to carry wherever they go.
But here is the long version for you sheeple that will put your gun in a lock box. (sheeple- persons who voluntarily acquiesce to a perceived authority, or suggestion without sufficient research to understand fully the scope of the ramifications involved in that decision, and thus undermine their own human individuality or in other cases give up certain rights)
and finally...
By Lt. Col Dave Grossman
Most of the people in our society are sheep. They are kind, gentle, productive creatures who can only hurt one another by accident.” This is true. Remember, the murder rate is six per 100,000 per year, and the aggravated assault rate is four per 1,000 per year. What this means is that the vast majority of Americans are not inclined to hurt one another.
We may well be in the most violent times in history, but violence is still remarkably rare. This is because most citizens are kind, decent people who are not capable of hurting each other, except by accident or under extreme provocation. They are sheep.
Then there are the wolves and the wolves feed on the sheep without mercy. Do you believe there are wolves out there who will feed on the flock without mercy? You better believe it. There are evil men in this world and they are capable of evil deeds. The moment you forget that or pretend it is not so, you become a sheep. There is no safety in denial.
Then there are sheepdogs and I’m a sheepdog. I live to protect the flock and confront the wolf. Or, as a sign in one California law enforcement agency put it, “We intimidate those who intimidate others.”
If you have no capacity for violence then you are a healthy productive citizen: a sheep. If you have a capacity for violence and no empathy for your fellow citizens, then you have defined an aggressive sociopath–a wolf. But what if you have a capacity for violence, and a deep love for your fellow citizens? Then you are a sheepdog, a warrior, someone who is walking the hero’s path. Someone who can walk into the heart of darkness, into the universal human phobia, and walk out unscathed.
We know that the sheep live in denial, that is what makes them sheep. They do not want to believe that there is evil in the world. They can accept the fact that fires can happen, which is why they want fire extinguishers, fire sprinklers, fire alarms and fire exits throughout their kids' schools. But many of them are outraged at the idea of putting an armed police officer in their kid's school. Our children are thousands of times more likely to be killed or seriously injured by school violence than fire, but the sheep's only response to the possibility of violence is denial. The idea of someone coming to kill or harm their child is just too hard, and so they chose the path of denial.
The sheep generally do not like the sheepdog. He looks a lot like the wolf. He has fangs and the capacity for violence. The
difference, though, is that the sheepdog must not, cannot and will not ever harm the sheep. Any sheep dog who intentionally harms the lowliest little lamb will be punished and removed. The world cannot work any other way, at least not in a representative democracy or a republic such as ours.
Still, the sheepdog disturbs the sheep. He is a constant reminder that there are wolves in the land. They would prefer that he didn't tell them where to go, or give them traffic tickets, or stand at the ready in our airports, in camouflage fatigues, holding an M-16. The sheep would much rather have the sheepdog cash in his fangs, spray paint himself white, and go, "Baa." Until the wolf shows up. Then the entire flock tries desperately to hide behind one lonely sheepdog.
The students, the victims, at Columbine High School were big, tough high school students, and under ordinary circumstances they would not have had the time of day for a police officer. They were not bad kids; they just had nothing to say to a cop. When the school was under attack, however, and SWAT teams were clearing the rooms and hallways, the officers had to physically peel those clinging, sobbing kids off of them. This is how the little lambs feel about their sheepdog when the wolf is at the door.
Look at what happened after September 11, 2001 when the wolf pounded hard on the door. Remember how America, more than ever before, felt differently about their law enforcement officers and military personnel? Remember how many times you heard the word hero?
Understand that there is nothing morally superior about being a sheepdog; it is just what you choose to be. Also understand that a sheepdog is a funny critter: He is always sniffing around out on the perimeter, checking the breeze, barking at things that go bump in the night, and yearning for a righteous battle. That is, the young sheepdogs yearn for a righteous battle. The old sheepdogs are a little older and wiser, but they move to the sound of the guns when needed, right along with the young ones.
Here is how the sheep and the sheepdog think differently. The sheep pretend the wolf will never come, but the sheepdog lives for that day. After the attacks on September 11, 2001, most of the sheep, that is, most citizens in America said, "Thank God I wasn't on one of those planes." The sheepdogs, the warriors, said, "Dear God, I wish I could have been on one of those planes. Maybe I could have made a difference." When you are truly transformed into a warrior and have truly invested yourself into warriorhood, you want to be there. You want to be able to make a difference.
There is nothing morally superior about the sheepdog, the warrior, but he does have one real advantage. Only one. And that is that he is able to survive and thrive in an environment that destroys 98 percent of the population.
There was research conducted a few years ago with individuals convicted of violent crimes. These cons were in prison for serious,
predatory crimes of violence: assaults, murders and killing law enforcement officers. The vast majority said that they specifically
targeted victims by body language: Slumped walk, passive behavior and lack of awareness. They chose their victims like big cats do in Africa, when they select one out of the herd that is least able to protect itself.
Some people may be destined to be sheep and others might be genetically primed to be wolves or sheepdogs. But I believe that
most people can choose which one they want to be, and I'm proud to say that more and more Americans are choosing to become sheepdogs.
Seven months after the attack on September 11, 2001, Todd Beamer was honored in his hometown of Cranbury, New Jersey. Todd, as you recall, was the man on Flight 93 over Pennsylvania who called on his cell phone to alert an operator from United Airlines about the hijacking. When he learned of the other three passenger planes that had been used as weapons, Todd dropped his phone and uttered the words, "Let's roll," which authorities believe was a signal to the other passengers to confront the terrorist hijackers. In one hour, a transformation occurred among the passengers – athletes, business people and parents. — from sheep to sheepdogs and together they fought the wolves, ultimately saving an unknown number of lives on the ground.
There is no safety for honest men except by believing all possible evil of evil men. – Edmund Burke
Here is the point I like to emphasize, especially to the thousands of police officers and soldiers I speak to each year. In nature the
sheep, real sheep, are born as sheep. Sheepdogs are born that way, and so are wolves. They didn't have a choice. But you are not a critter. As a human being, you can be whatever you want to be. It is a conscious, moral decision.
If you want to be a sheep, then you can be a sheep and that is okay, but you must understand the price you pay. When the wolf comes, you and your loved ones are going to die if there is not a sheepdog there to protect you. If you want to be a wolf, you can be one, but the sheepdogs are going to hunt you down and you will never have rest, safety, trust or love. But if you want to be a sheepdog and walk the warrior's path, then you must make a conscious and moral decision every day to dedicate, equip and prepare yourself to thrive in that toxic, corrosive moment when the wolf comes knocking at the door.
This business of being a sheep or a sheep dog is not a yes-no dichotomy. It is not an all-or-nothing, either-or choice. It is a
matter of degrees, a continuum. On one end is an abject, head-in-the-sand-sheep and on the other end is the ultimate warrior. Few people exist completely on one end or the other. Most of us live somewhere in between.
Since 9-11 almost everyone in America took a step up that continuum, away from denial. The sheep took a few steps toward accepting and appreciating their warriors, and the warriors started taking their job more seriously. It's okay to be a sheep, but do not kick the sheepdog. Indeed, the sheep dog may just run a little harder, strive to protect a little beter and be fully prepared to pay an ultimate price in battle and spirit with the sheep moving from "baa" to "thanks". The degree to which you move up that continuum, away from sheephood and denial, is the degree to which you and your loved ones will survive, physically and psychologically at your moment of truth.
Very nice post rifleman. Hey the sheep and the wolfs are what keeps me in business...:D
I am a strong supporter of an individual’s right to keep and bear arms for their defense; however, what I fail to understand is why some people think that in the exercising of their rights, that it is acceptable to violate the rights of others…
Private property is just that, private… If the owner of the property has placed certain conditions upon all persons that they are allowing to visit their privately owned property, why do you feel it is acceptable to defy their wishes… There is no Constitutional amendment requiring that you go to any property that Disney owns, so If you do not like their rules, that’s ok, do not go there… Do enjoy the rights and privileges granted to you under our constitution, but also respect the rights of others when they exercise theirs as well…
B
I am a strong supporter of an individual’s right to keep and bear arms for their defense; however, what I fail to understand is why some people think that in the exercising of their rights, that it is acceptable to violate the rights of others…
Private property is just that, private… If the owner of the property has placed certain conditions upon all persons that they are allowing to visit their privately owned property, why do you feel it is acceptable to defy their wishes… There is no Constitutional amendment requiring that you go to any property that Disney owns, so If you do not like their rules, that’s ok, do not go there… Do enjoy the rights and privileges granted to you under our constitution, but also respect the rights of others when they exercise theirs as well…
B
Kind of like putting a "No Colors Allowed" sign up? Since it's private property and all, the land owner should be able to refuse service to anyone they want right? If they don't like it, they can go someplace else?
Kind of like putting a "No Colors Allowed" sign up? Since it's private property and all, the land owner should be able to refuse service to anyone they want right? If they don't like it, they can go someplace else?
Actually NO... It is nothing like that...
Kind of like putting a "No Colors Allowed" sign up? Since it's private property and all, the land owner should be able to refuse service to anyone they want right? If they don't like it, they can go someplace else?
Throwing segragation into this mix is kind of comparing apples to oranges.
Actually NO... It is nothing like that...
Same thing, people have a right to not be persecuted for their skin color just like they have a right to self preservation and self defense.
My right to defend my life, trumps the land owners irrational fears that I have the means to do so.
Same thing, people have a right to not be persecuted for their skin color just like they have a right to self preservation and self defense.
My right to defend my life, trumps the land owners irrational fears that I have the means to do so.
So, I can walk into your house as a guest armed, and you cant touch me! that seems to be your logic.
So, I can walk into your house as a guest armed, and you cant touch me! that seems to be your logic.
A Home and private property being operated as a business, open to the public. Yeah that's the same thing :rolleyes:
A Home and private property being operated as a business, open to the public. Yeah that's the same thing :rolleyes:
Its obviously not the same, but its still private property not owned by the govt. Same rights apply.
Its obviously not the same, but its still private property not owned by the govt. Same rights apply.
There are actually no legal entities, either federal or municipal that would agree with that statement.
There are thousands of laws, that apply to businesses that don't apply to a persons home and vise-versa. Is this really a concept that complicated to grasp?
Perhaps we should just agree to disagree.
Ga Shooter
05-07-10, 15:33
Thanks for all the replies. I wanted to know what Fla law was and Disney's policy. I will take all the info into consideration. Just for the record I will be with my parents, my wife and my children. While my girls are young and small 3 and 5 me and my father are very large muscular men. We are not afraid of walking through a parking lot lights or not, but like was mentioned others in this world have no respect for human life and in some cases try to take as many human lives as possible at one time. Like rifleman posted most people are sheep and Disney has thousands of sheep all in one place (perfect for a wolf IMHO).
Thanks again for the info.
cougar_guy04
05-07-10, 16:37
From what I've heard from local cops, word is that Disney has a crack SWAT team but they keep it very hush-hush.
Heck, could you imagine the load-out that Eeyore or Baloo could carry under that giddup. :D
does disney world employ any sort of armed personnel? :confused:
Not visible at least. I have spoke to one of my best friends who is management and all I can get from him is a "no comment" when I have asked that question.
From what I've heard from local cops, word is that Disney has a crack SWAT team but they keep it very hush-hush.
Kind of like with the US Secret Service... The things you can see aren't half as impressive as the things you can't.
Disney is an American icon and a big target. Anticipate that they've prepared accordingly.
Why do people insist on over analyzing whether or not they can carry into a place where they will never get caught?
There are 1000s of people there.
Put your gun in your pocket or in a IWB holster and wear a baggy shirt over it and you have nothing to worry about.
Being banned from disney for life isn't that big of a deal.
And fanny packs make you look like a douche.
If I'm not going through a metal detector, well then....
What Scott said.
Its really as simple as this: If there is a sign posted at the entrance that says "NO FIREARMS ALLOWED" then dont carry. If theres nothing posted then go for it. I went to Six Flags over arlington and they had these no firearms signs posted at the entrance. I declared my off duty weapon at the gate, showed my badge, my Id, followed by my warrant of apointment and all I got from the security officer was a confused look followed by "sir, can you just check it in at our lock boxes please" so I had to leave my gun at their lock boxes before entering the park. I am sure I could have legally carried in the park being LEO and all, but decided not to get into a pissing contest with the security guy and just did what he told me. I highly doubt Disney has less strict firearms policies than Six Flags, so pay attention to these signs, and obey them. If it is posted and you do carry, you will be criminally penalized.
:rolleyes:
Kind of like putting a "No Colors Allowed" sign up? Since it's private property and all, the land owner should be able to refuse service to anyone they want right? If they don't like it, they can go someplace else?
Throwing segragation into this mix is kind of comparing apples to oranges.
Does he mean "No Colors Allowed" or "No Coloreds Allowed." Two very different things, with very different law applicable to each. When I hear "no colors allowed", I think of gang, OMG, etc colors.
I am a strong supporter of an individual’s right to keep and bear arms for their defense; however, what I fail to understand is why some people think that in the exercising of their rights, that it is acceptable to violate the rights of others…
Private property is just that, private… If the owner of the property has placed certain conditions upon all persons that they are allowing to visit their privately owned property, why do you feel it is acceptable to defy their wishes… There is no Constitutional amendment requiring that you go to any property that Disney owns, so If you do not like their rules, that’s ok, do not go there… Do enjoy the rights and privileges granted to you under our constitution, but also respect the rights of others when they exercise theirs as well…
I do agree with Buck. Private property owners should retain their rights to establish conditions of use and occupancy. The key is in denying them the ability to identify the non-compliant use or condition. Concealed means concealed.
I highly doubt Disney has less strict firearms policies than Six Flags, so pay attention to these signs, and obey them.
Disney is definitely less strict and is easy to carry in.
John_Wayne777
05-07-10, 18:03
Alright, gents....
I'm a bit weary of seeing every thread turn into a slap fight. I have no idea why everybody is on edge lately, but I suggest dialing down the acrimony.
We're all adults here.
Since the original poster had his question answered and since this thread seems to want to spiral into nonsense, it's over.
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