View Full Version : Thinking about M4 - need advise
I've been thinking about getting a carabine for some time now. I almost settled on getting a Bushmaster M4A3 from aimsurplus when SIG came out with 556.
I had a chance today to handle 556 and M4 side by side (at the gunshop) and in my uneducated opinion 556 has only one major benefit over M4 - the trigger. At the same time it is heavier, longer and bulkier then M4 although the build quality is good.
After this encounter I'm back to the idea of getting an M4 in the next couple of months.
I'm planning on installing flip front/rear sights and getting optics later. Would regular M4A3 be a good choice or would I have troubles removing front sight (I saw some references about cutting it off)?
That would be the first carabine/rifle for me but I was shooting handguns for the last five years. I would appreciate any input regarding the Bushmaster quality and correct start configuration for my planned setup.
Thanks,
Igor
If you look at getting a standard M4, then making the changes that you want, you may find that it would have been cheaper, and quicker to have a custom weapon built.
There are several dealers here who are more than capable of building you a solid weapon in the configuration that you want.
Have a look at CMMG's web page. I think the drop down menus with all the configuration options are an excellent way to price a custom carbine. I have done business with CMMG and have nothing but praise for their quality and customer service.
www.cmmginc.com
I'm not familiar with CMMG - are they building complete guns from scratch or modify some other vendor?
All lower receivers, regardless of company come from a handful of vendors. All lower receivers. Colt's, Bushmasters, Noveske, CMMG...everyones come from three primary lower receiver makers.
As for the rest, CMMG assembles complete weapons. They are MP tested, they have, IMO, better QC than most AR makers....by far. In addition, you can order a standard configured weapon, such as an M4 type carbine, or you can modify nearly every aspect of the rifle with a huge selection of optional/upgradable parts right there on their web page.
I own 2 CMMG rifles and they are extremely well made weapons. I highly recommend them as a company.
The short version is that they make excellent weapons. Either in several standard configurations, or highly customized.
Nothing but praise for CMMG. Met those folks at SHOT and have bought 2 rifles through them since. Nothing but praise.
So, assuming Bushmaster is not a good option what are the choices besides CMMG? Just trying to see different possibilities :)
Jay Cunningham
05-25-07, 05:54
I've been thinking about getting a carabine for some time now. I almost settled on getting a Bushmaster M4A3 from aimsurplus when SIG came out with 556.
I had a chance today to handle 556 and M4 side by side (at the gunshop) and in my uneducated opinion 556 has only one major benefit over M4 - the trigger. At the same time it is heavier, longer and bulkier then M4 although the build quality is good.
After this encounter I'm back to the idea of getting an M4 in the next couple of months.
I'm planning on installing flip front/rear sights and getting optics later. Would regular M4A3 be a good choice or would I have troubles removing front sight (I saw some references about cutting it off)?
That would be the first carabine/rifle for me but I was shooting handguns for the last five years. I would appreciate any input regarding the Bushmaster quality and correct start configuration for my planned setup.
Thanks,
Igor
isakhnov,
From what you described, a Smith & Wesson M&P15T (http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=11101&storeId=10001&productId=44934&langId=-1&parent_category_rn=33803&isFirearm=Y) may fit the bill.
smith and wesson is a great gun manufactorer but honestly has anyone had any good experiences with their m&p rifle?
If you do go with an M4, do ALOT of reading on this site, specifically when people are talking about carbine classes. There is alot of interesting info on different makes of ARs. Dont buy a gun just because it is available at the local shop. I learned that the hard way.
EDIT: Let me say, I am not being elitist or pretending I have much experience with different ARs. My scenario is I bought a very well known brand and had an issue. As soon as I started reasearching this issue, I found out on here that it is a well known problem with this brand and they have been putting this half arsed stuff out for years. I would have skipped buying this brand in the first place if I would have researched on here.
Best options for a mil-spec (as close as you can get) M4 are:
Colt
LMT
BCM
Sabre Defence
BM would be at the bottom of my list and would pass on the SIG 556.
C4
+1 to Grant.
Based on the use and abuse of my agency's Colt M4A1 carbines, which are seldom cared for properly but keep on shooting, I bought Colt (with FA bolt carrier). I've not regretted spending the extra dough.
Rock-N-Ruin
05-25-07, 12:25
Bushmaster would be at the very bottom of my list also, ya might try this guy.. I hear he's somewhat reliable lol... :D
http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=279 :D
isakhnov,
From what you described, a Smith & Wesson M&P15T (http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=11101&storeId=10001&productId=44934&langId=-1&parent_category_rn=33803&isFirearm=Y) may fit the bill.
I have SW revolver and it always worked as expected. Are their rifles any good?
If you do go with an M4, do ALOT of reading on this site, specifically when people are talking about carbine classes. There is alot of interesting info on different makes of ARs. Dont buy a gun just because it is available at the local shop. I learned that the hard way.
EDIT: Let me say, I am not being elitist or pretending I have much experience with different ARs. My scenario is I bought a very well known brand and had an issue. As soon as I started reasearching this issue, I found out on here that it is a well known problem with this brand and they have been putting this half arsed stuff out for years. I would have skipped buying this brand in the first place if I would have researched on here.
Yes, that is what I try to do now :)
Best options for a mil-spec (as close as you can get) M4 are:
Colt
LMT
BCM
Sabre Defence
BM would be at the bottom of my list and would pass on the SIG 556.
C4
I've seen LMT mentioned a lot on the site but as far as I can tell LMT does not sell complete guns (at least for civilian use). Is that the case?
I've got a friend at work who just bought a S&W M/PT for $1,300. The model that has the rails & flip ups. He hasn't put a lot of rounds down range yet, but he really likes it so far. It goes bang.
If you have a limited budget then assemble your own or buy the parts & have someone do it for you. You can prolly go that route & have a good AR for $600-$700 or maybe less. The majority of AR's from various "manufacturers" will go bang when you pull the trigger for general range use & outlast you without too much fuss. If you're going to war then you may want to buy a Colt. However, that's always up for debate reference other companies rifles being just as good as a Colt to use when WWIII is upon us. Depending on what you will be using your AR for will ultimately determine what company you want to buy from. I've used a lot of different makes of AR's in various situations over the years & I must agree with 5.56's posts. I'll say that CMMG is one of the best IMO. I've SBR'd most of my AR's now & use them for work & my last purchase was from CMMG.
I will not buy another AR or AR assemblies from another company after getting my hands on their 10.3M2 upper. I cannot give enough praise for these folks. But that's me. Like the op's have said, do a lot of research & ask a lot of questions before you decide if you're new to BRD. After all is said & done though, most AR's start off from a few leading distributors of the mahor parts. Various companies turn around & buy the parts & then assemble them into finished rifles, assemblies or just sell various parts separately. There are about a billion differing opinions as to quality, function, appearance, etc, etc. Good luck & make sure to post some pics of what you buy or make:cool: .
I've got a friend at work who just bought a S&W M/PT for $1,300. The model that has the rails & flip ups. He hasn't put a lot of rounds down range yet, but he really likes it so far. It goes bang.
If you have a limited budget then assemble your own or buy the parts & have someone do it for you. You can prolly go that route & have a good AR for $600-$700 or maybe less. The majority of AR's from various "manufacturers" will go bang when you pull the trigger for general range use & outlast you without too much fuss. If you're going to war then you may want to buy a Colt. However, that's always up for debate reference other companies rifles being just as good as a Colt to use when WWIII is upon us. Depending on what you will be using your AR for will ultimately determine what company you want to buy from. I've used a lot of different makes of AR's in various situations over the years & I must agree with 5.56's posts. I'll say that CMMG is one of the best IMO. I've SBR'd most of my AR's now & use them for work & my last purchase was from CMMG.
I will not buy another AR or AR assemblies from another company after getting my hands on their 10.3M2 upper. I cannot give enough praise for these folks. But that's me. Like the op's have said, do a lot of research & ask a lot of questions before you decide if you're new to BRD. After all is said & done though, most AR's start off from a few leading distributors of the mahor parts. Various companies turn around & buy the parts & then assemble them into finished rifles, assemblies or just sell various parts separately. There are about a billion differing opinions as to quality, function, appearance, etc, etc. Good luck & make sure to post some pics of what you buy or make:cool: .
I can see SW for around $1300 online in couple of places and I do not mind paying this amount as long as it is a good quality firearm that will go bang every time and give decent accuracy. I think CMMG would be in the same price range with the flip sights (I had tried Bushmaster in the local store with EOTech mounted and I didn't like the regular front sight a bit).
At the same time my budget does not go beyond $1500.
Probaly a stupid question but what does BRD stand for?
Sorry...BRD=Black Rifle Disease
I haven't been to the CMMG site in a while, but I believe you can get a good AR for under $1,500. You may have to vary your options, but I don't think flip ups will put you over your target price.
The SW is a good choice at that price range.
The flipups are what you want and the rail is something you will probably want soon after anyway- that's just how it goes. A lot of people like to get back to the basics with standard sights and handguards to keep things simple and love the classic looks of them.
But, you'll have to experience BRD for yourself... ;)
BM would be at the bottom of my list and would pass on the SIG 556.
C4
+1
I have seen many BM rifles go back for issues (straight out of the "box") when I was working at a funstore. I also agree on the 556. Fired one that a friend HAD and was not in the least bit impressed (too heavy, accuracy was worse than a 10.5" AR :eek: ). Just my humble opinion.
I've seen LMT mentioned a lot on the site but as far as I can tell LMT does not sell complete guns (at least for civilian use). Is that the case?
Yes.
They only sell complete uppers. Just pick a lower of your choice and pop the pins in and your ready to go.
I've seen LMT mentioned a lot on the site but as far as I can tell LMT does not sell complete guns (at least for civilian use). Is that the case?
They do not sell complete weapons and honest, you don't want to buy a complete weapon (if you can help it).
C4
I have SW revolver and it always worked as expected. Are their rifles any good?
They rifles are pretty good (now that they have moved them back into house). The model 15A represents a pretty good value IMHO.
C4
I've got a friend at work who just bought a S&W M/PT for $1,300. The model that has the rails & flip ups. He hasn't put a lot of rounds down range yet, but he really likes it so far. It goes bang.
If you have a limited budget then assemble your own or buy the parts & have someone do it for you. You can prolly go that route & have a good AR for $600-$700 or maybe less. The majority of AR's from various "manufacturers" will go bang when you pull the trigger for general range use & outlast you without too much fuss. If you're going to war then you may want to buy a Colt. However, that's always up for debate reference other companies rifles being just as good as a Colt to use when WWIII is upon us. Depending on what you will be using your AR for will ultimately determine what company you want to buy from. I've used a lot of different makes of AR's in various situations over the years & I must agree with 5.56's posts. I'll say that CMMG is one of the best IMO. I've SBR'd most of my AR's now & use them for work & my last purchase was from CMMG.
I will not buy another AR or AR assemblies from another company after getting my hands on their 10.3M2 upper. I cannot give enough praise for these folks. But that's me. Like the op's have said, do a lot of research & ask a lot of questions before you decide if you're new to BRD. After all is said & done though, most AR's start off from a few leading distributors of the mahor parts. Various companies turn around & buy the parts & then assemble them into finished rifles, assemblies or just sell various parts separately. There are about a billion differing opinions as to quality, function, appearance, etc, etc. Good luck & make sure to post some pics of what you buy or make:cool: .
$1,300!!! :eek: You should have sent him this link: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=4782
C4
$1,300!!! :eek: You should have sent him this link: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=4782
C4
The price is good! The best I've seen online was just short of $1300. Do you usually have items listed there in stock or it takes time to order?
They do not sell complete weapons and honest, you don't want to buy a complete weapon (if you can help it).
C4
Although I'm hesitant of building one myself I still need to ask - how hard is it to assemble one from separate parts? Does it require a lot of fitting (I dropped the idea of building 1911 myself some time ago :) )?
The price is good! The best I've seen online was just short of $1300. Do you usually have items listed there in stock or it takes time to order?
I try to have them in stock as often as I can.
C4
Although I'm hesitant of building one myself I still need to ask - how hard is it to assemble one from separate parts? Does it require a lot of fitting (I dropped the idea of building 1911 myself some time ago :) )?
You buy a complete upper and a complete lower and simply push the pins in (that's it).
C4
Darn...he bought it in March:( He thought it was a good deal since it already comes with two systems he would have added anyway to a cheaper rifle...seemingly making up for the price for the rails & flip ups.
my first time shooting an AR was a bushy 16" and i came off from the experience thinking, "Whats the big deal".. then i shot my friends Rock River Arms Entry Tactical and absolutely loved it, so i went out and bought a RRA tactical CAR-A4 with the entry stock and eo-tech..... this rifle can be had for under $975 before eo-tech.. i actually think mine was $899 +$35 for NJ Legal + $35 transfer charge and $15 NICS fee..... i got the Heavy chrome lined barrel.... i couldnt be happier with the rifle... with that being said my father recently bought a Colt 20" A3 Match HBAR and i really like it but the trigger stinks..... ill let you know when i finally shoot a bushy i like...... if interested PM me and ill give you the site i got my rifle from... with that being said i have 2 friends with Bushy's that really like them , they are just not my cup of tea.... good luck with your choice... i dont know where you are located but if you near NJ i have no problem taking someone out to shoot my rifle
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