View Full Version : Noveske QD Endplate or Ikickhippies SLAP plate?
Lucky Strike
06-09-10, 14:20
I've got a VTAC and just aquired a MS2 clone (tac strap) and am wondering whether it'd be worth it to switch my endplate from a Noveske QD to a SLAP endplate. I've got both right now and the one I don't use will be saved for a future build.
My VTAC has a HK hook up front and the QD in the rear, the Tac Strap's got a snap shakle in the rear and an HK in the front.
Right now on the Tac Strap I'm just attaching the snap shackle onto a daniel defense QD swivel into my noveske. Seems kinda hokey (having an attachment into an attachment) but it works.
Going to a SLAP plate seems more streamlined (i'd have to switch out the QD with a HK hook or mash hook on the rear of my VTAC) but just looking for any opinions out there on the pros and cons of the noveske vs. the SLAP.
Some very knowledgeable people that have BTDT say that endplates should not be used for sling attachment because with hard use it could disable your rifle.
See: Lightfighter Forum -> Primary Individual Weapons Forum -> Noveske receiver plate sling mount
Complication
06-09-10, 14:45
Some very knowledgeable people that have BTDT say that endplates should not be used for sling attachment because with hard use it could disable your rifle.
Not to say that just because someone's a firearms instructor they know everything (or anything), but my impression is that a lot of people out there running classes are running end-plate sling mounts and even suggest mounting 2-point slings at the end-plate.
What is the gist of knowledgeable people's reasoning? I'm no expert in AR engineering, but I can't imagine there anything you could possible do to the end-plate simply by running a sling on it. After all, the forces generated by firing the weapon are immensely more powerful than the 8-10 lbs of rifle resting on the mount (half of that, if you're running a 2-point). And I'm guessing that any excessive force applied to the mount would break the mount or the sling before it broke the endplate or damaged the internals. (I guess maybe if you fell off a building and your sling caught you--but then damaging your rifle is the least of your worries.)
If a "knowledgeable person" says something but has no reason behind it, it's worth precisely diddly-squat.
i just skimmed through, but i didn't see a single issue that couldn't be 100% prevented by proper installation. if you torque and stake, there will be no issue.
ETA: to answer the OP- if you can simplify to a hook, a SLAP/ASAP type is the way to rock it. since the SLAP is cheaper and doesn't have the stupid ring to cut off, i'd give it a shot, if i were in the market for a rear hook mount.
Some very knowledgeable people that have BTDT say that endplates should not be used for sling attachment because with hard use it could disable your rifle.
See: Lightfighter Forum -> Primary Individual Weapons Forum -> Noveske receiver plate sling mount
Read the thread. The concern is that the receiver plate could come loose. The reason it "could come loose" is because the castle nut was not installed correctly. If you torque it on correctly and then stake it in TWO places, it is NOT coming loose.
The advantage of the Noveske or DD QD receiver plates are:
1. Allows the stock to fully collapse.
2. Optimal position for a two point sling (as it allows you to switch shoulders without changing hands).
3. Cost effective mount point ($44 dollars cheaper than the PR4).
4. Weight savings over the PR4. (2.4oz vs .5oz)
If you are worried about the receiver plate moving with "hard use" then you should be as concerned with the 4 screws holding the PR4 on the gun (as people can incorrectly install it as well).
Now if I couldn't modify my gun (Dept. issued weapon, etc) or I was not experienced enough to do it right, then the PR4 is the best choice out there IMHO.
I have been running the DD and Noveske QD receiver plates for YEARS. Never an issue. Then again, I know what I am doing.
C4
MagPul's ASAP, IKickHippies End Plate, DD and Noveske options are all great, and Grant spelled out that it really is a nonissue for a properly assembled weapon.
The ASAP (and I presume IKH) limit travel of the sling with the stock forward, but the rest of the time adds some flexibility. I'm waiting to see how the ASAP works with the ERGO retouched M93/F93's, but that is a known limitation.
For people with large hands, or with certain sling hardware configurations it's possible to have the sling catch on shooting thumb webbing, but the QD flexibility is a big selling point in that case. I notice this some, but appreciate the lower price of the ASAP.
The NP4 is what we're using for our issue M4's, and it's a great workaround, not really an ideal solution from scratch.
I don't find weight to be that big a concern, as it's located pretty far aft, and is the only sling mounting option that allows us to conveniently run 1pt slings over body armor, but it's not a perfect solution.
In practical terms, what I've been using is an ASAP for 1-pt, and when running 2pt I'll use QD swivels on the buttstock and handguard. I'm still a bit torn between moving to ASAP/RSA/MS2, or go with SKD Pig Sling and VCAS Padded as a two-sling setup, but both of these options have worked well for me (personal preference), and can work great regardless of which endplate is used.
Moose-Knuckle
06-09-10, 15:34
Both stock and endpate sling mounting methods are good to go...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6SbrDh6_Oo&feature=PlayList&p=4CA0B0EE5B869E8D&playnext_from=PL&playnext=1&index=11
I'm no super duper door kicker, but I've put a lot or range time, formal and informal, in with a Noveske well staked receiver nut and it's never come loose. I only switched when I went to a UBR, but I still effectively mount my sling in the same place. In fact the only downer to that is the off shoulder transition wraps the sling up a bit more than an end plate.
could you unstitch the ms2 sling and get rid of the quick release, thread in the normal QD swivel and sew it back up? Basically switching out the attachments.
PrivateCitizen
06-09-10, 20:22
I have a SLAP and I like it a lot.
You will sacrifice movement on a fully collapsed stock a bit.
My IMODS/EMODS pin the sling hardware on one side or another in that state. No really enough to prevent a transition an alternate side, but it does bind it up a bit. But it does close all the way
On a Magpul ACS it prevents being fully collapsed at all. Position 2 is best it can manage.
ETA: I have been thinking about getting a DD QD in an effort to just improve … no idea if it would make a lot of dif though.
3CTactical
06-10-10, 00:32
The DD endplate will allow my Vltor emod stocks to collapse fully without a QD in the endplate, but when it is inserted it will not collapse fully. The Noveske endplate will allow my Vltor emods to collapse fully even with a QD installed. The Noveske end plates are steel, the DD are aluminum. I prefer the Noveske end plates, but I have DD plates on all my rifles currently as I built them before the Noveske end plates were available. I'm not going to switch to the Noveske plates even though I like them better, because the DD plates work just fine.
...The Noveske endplate will allow my Vltor emods to collapse fully even with a QD installed. ...
Yes, but the stock is pushing in on the QD button. I didn't like that so I took the roloc to the emod, cutting a "half moon" shape out so that the stock would not hit the button when fully collapsed. Seemed to me that without the clearance, you could have an unintentional QD release.
polymorpheous
06-10-10, 10:22
Yes, but the stock is pushing in on the QD button. I didn't like that so I took the roloc to the emod, cutting a "half moon" shape out so that the stock would not hit the button when fully collapsed. Seemed to me that without the clearance, you could have an unintentional QD release.
I'm glad I ran into this thread.
This is exactly why I haven't bought a QD endplate.
I just wasn't sure at how it would function with the stock fully closed.
3CTactical
06-10-10, 10:28
Yes, but the stock is pushing in on the QD button. I didn't like that so I took the roloc to the emod, cutting a "half moon" shape out so that the stock would not hit the button when fully collapsed. Seemed to me that without the clearance, you could have an unintentional QD release.
I should have clarified - I'm using Blue Force Gear's QDs. They are smaller then the typical QD's everyone else offers. I also feel they are a better quality QD.
I'm glad I ran into this thread.
This is exactly why I haven't bought a QD endplate.
I just wasn't sure at how it would function with the stock fully closed.
Remember that this is stock specifice. There is not issues with say the LMT SOPMOD.
If the stock is pushing against the "button" on the QD swivel, it is also retaining it. So no, it is not going to come out.
C4
3CTactical
06-10-10, 10:32
Remember that this is stock specifice. There is not issues with say the LMT SOPMOD.
If the stock is pushing against the "button" on the QD swivel, it is also retaining it. So no, it is not going to come out.
C4
I agree on both points - that's why I specifically stated my experience with my Vltor emods. I also have used them with my MOE stocks, but I don't recall if they hit the QD or not when fully collapsed.
I agree on both points - that's why I specifically stated my experience with my Vltor emods. I also have used them with my MOE stocks, but I don't recall if they hit the QD or not when fully collapsed.
MOE and CTR stock's will both contact the QD swivel.
C4
polymorpheous
06-10-10, 12:01
how about the original modstock?
Lucky Strike
06-10-10, 14:55
I have a SLAP and I like it a lot.
You will sacrifice movement on a fully collapsed stock a bit.
My IMODS/EMODS pin the sling hardware on one side or another in that state. No really enough to prevent a transition an alternate side, but it does bind it up a bit. But it does close all the way
On a Magpul ACS it prevents being fully collapsed at all. Position 2 is best it can manage.
ETA: I have been thinking about getting a DD QD in an effort to just improve … no idea if it would make a lot of dif though.
You may have just convinced me to stick with the Noveske plate as I have an ACS and am not keen on not being able to fully close it. With the Noveske and VLTOR swivels i've not had any issues with a fully closed ACS.
I might take the suggestion of someone a couple posts up and cut the stitching on the TacStrap so I can remove the snap shakle and sew back in a QD swivel. Having the snap shakle attach to the QD swivel like it is now just seems redundant.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.