View Full Version : Minotaur MTAC vs. Raven Concealment Phantom
Looking for an IWB holster for my M&P Compact 9mm and these are the two I have narrowed it to. I have read very good things for both. The MTAC is leather backed and the Raven is not so I am curious how the Raven would feel against the skin, does it rub/annoy? Price is really not a concern, nor is the wait. Just looking for some input, especially from folks who might have had a chance to use both. Obviously if you have something better in mind I'd love to hear about it. Thank you.
The Raven, IWB, will feel like any other kydex IWB, with the exception of how it mounts (your options selected) and your light option. The MTAC obviously will be nicer against the skin, but you may or may not want it.
For IWB, and not wanting the option to ever go OWB, the MTAC will probably be a slightly better choice, but remember it does not have the options the Raven does. For a good holster that will do both, Raven is the way to go. I am actually going to be setting mine up to mimic a CTAC very soon.
Rubbing and annoying will vary, but none of them have ever bothered me.
G34Shooter
06-14-10, 11:30
I prefer quality leather holsters now :D
I carry in an MTAC and really like the leather backing. If you wanted to make the Raven holster more comfortable, though, you could always get some moleskin or leather to apply to the back with glue.
The more I consider it, you could have someone make you an MTAC style back that the Raven would attach to as well. Or the moleskin idea as well. There is another thread on it around here.
JSantoro ran a Vickers class this past weekend with a Minotaur. From what I remember, he really liked it. Hopefully he will chime in with more insight.
Powder_Burn
06-14-10, 14:12
I own both and the MTAC is a superior IWB option since the leather backing on the MTAC allows it to contour to your hip. The curve on the Raven can be adjusted some with a heat gun but mine never fit as well as the MTAC.
theblackknight
06-14-10, 15:54
I love my MTAC. Its just awesome.
For IWB only the comfort is about even with the edge going to the MTAC, ease of donning/doffing goes to the Phantom since the whole thing is rigid and not as grippy as the leather backing (I wear an undershirt), price and availability goes to the MTAC no questions asked, versatility goes to the Phantom. If I were to do it all over again I'd go MTAC based on the wait alone... wait be damned the Phantom.
i have both for my glock and 1911. and can honestly say the phantom is not a good IWB no flex and to many sharp edges. im an average size guy 215 6 foot 3 and it was to much. the mtac is my daily carry holster and i love it. you cant go wrong and you could have it this month instead of this winter.
Im 5'11" 165 and the Raven holster just doesnt fit well IWB for me. The MTAC bends and hugs much better.
For IWB I say COMP-TAC minotaur. I will be ordering a Raven for OWB that will accommodate a light mounted on my pistol
MTAC or Crossbreed Supertuck. I have the Supertuck with horsehide and it does great in the Florida heat.
The MTAC is a dedicated IWB holster, comparing it to the Raven is apples to oranges. IMO, the Raven is an OWB that can be used as an IWB, but was ment to be run OWB.
For IWB, the MTAC is the gnats ass.
willowofwisp
06-14-10, 22:52
I have been running the MTAC iwb for about a year now and just recently began running the raven..this far they are about the same to me...but i think if i was a slimmer guy i would prefer the raven
Thank you for all the great replies. I will be ordering an MTAC today. :D
This thread has me "resurecting" my MTAC for my Glock 26. Set it up again this morning with the C-Clips and DAMN-forgot how comfy this rig is! While I have been using my VM-2's for many years now for my 26, and they are certainly comfortable, the MTAC really wrapps around your body to conform. The draw for me is ever so slightly slower, but this is probably due to the fact that I have the MTAC set with a little lower ride than my VM2 while still allowing adequate clearance for a full grip on the draw.
The Raven is a well made holster, but the fact that it will not bend with my body/belt makes it a little less desirable for my build. I am only 5'-7" at 170 lbs and a 30" waist. NOT a big fella by any standards and the Raven feels like a little trenching shovel blade in my pants....
OWB its much better for me...
Stay safe!
JSantoro ran a Vickers class this past weekend with a Minotaur. From what I remember, he really liked it. Hopefully he will chime in with more insight.
This is correct, and I've used a Phantom IWB for the same type of pistol.
My experience with the Phantom was that when I snugged up my belt enough to keep the holster and gun from shifting, the thinner Kydes would compress when the gun was drawn, making reholstering. I've heard some word that they may be using thicker Kydex, now, and I know for a fact that it can be requested, but have no idea as to whether or not that would mitigate that, in my case. Regardless, I ended up using it as OWB-only bdcause of the above. Retention is either case was excellent. In addition, using the Phantom IWB, the thing pressed on a nerve and made my outer right thigh and ass-cheek go numb. Not a design flaw, just a result of how that design interacted with my own physiology; I couldn't sdjust it to not do that, so OWB it went.
With the Phantom used IWB, my undershirts would untuck and wad up even under normal, walking-around activities, much less while practicing or taking classes. I imagine that the Kydex is just too slick, on it's own.
Both the Infidel and Minotaur are very rigid; neither flex so that the opening narrows and forces me to take more time than I already do reholstering, which is already very deliberate.
The Infidel allowed my shirts to come untucked and require frequent adjustment to keep the opening unobstructed. The Minotaur does not.
I'd get another Phantom for OWB, but so far I'm really liking what the Monotaur brings to the table.
my sentiments exactly.the minotaur has been my daily carry since it came out and lets just say its help remarkable well.
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj41/leeindy/Mobile%20Uploads/0615001133a.jpg
http://i269.photobucket.com/albums/jj41/leeindy/Mobile%20Uploads/0615001133.jpg
its well broken in.
I have no experience with either, but from what I've gathered while reading about holsters:
IWB - MTAC > Phantom
OWB - Phantom > all (and can also be used for IWB if required)
The Raven holster is supposed to be a damn good, OWB holster that can also be used IWB. Most people agree that it's not the best IWB holster out there when used that way though, but it works.
For IWB, I have a Stronghold Phoenix by Occidental. I was going to get the MTAC, but decided to spring for the Phoenix. Although I'm sure the MTAC would have been great, the Phoenix is awesome and is very much like a Versa Max 2. I do plan to eventually order a Raven holster for OWB carry and for use with a light.
My MTAC should be arriving any day now. I'll be happy to give a full review, though it seems like many here are well-versed already. That's a good thing.
SWATcop556
06-17-10, 19:45
Based solely on comfort I personally feel the MTAC has a slight advantage but the versatility of the RCS offsets this. I still use my MTAC often but my go-to holsters are my RCS, especially at work.
i find the phantom pretty comfy for IWB personally. i would like to try something leather... on the down side leather absorbs moisture and could get kinda gross if you're active/sweaty :mad:
Dirty McCurdy
06-17-10, 21:38
MTAC is better for me, conceals better. The raven rides to high for me. Im only 5'8'' 170lbs with a 33'' waist, and I have a hard time not printing bad. I think the MTAC is more comfortable and is easier for me to conceal my M&P9c.
The raven do fit guns with lights and that is a big plus to them though.
i find the phantom pretty comfy for IWB personally. i would like to try something leather... on the down side leather absorbs moisture and could get kinda gross if you're active/sweaty :mad:
I've never ran a marathon with a leather holster on, but I have never had a problem with leather holsters getting "gross" in the 6 years I've been carrying with them.
While moving into my new house last September I was carrying my M&P in my MTAC and the sweat soaked through to the gun pretty badly. I just ended up stripping the gun down and cleaned/oiled it that night and it was good to go. I also allowed the holster to air out really good. That was the first time I had that problem though.
I've never ran a marathon with a leather holster on, but I have never had a problem with leather holsters getting "gross" in the 6 years I've been carrying with them.
fair enough... still the kydex is impervious to all forms of moisture. could be a benefit to some users.
cougar_guy04
06-19-10, 10:02
I've got both (MTAC and Phantom LC w/ Offset Tuckable Loops) and for carrying a gun w/o a light, I like the MTAC. I think (personally) it's easier to tuck my shirt in with the MTAC vs. the Phatnom. However, the Phantom is very handy for when the aircraft landing light is strapped onto my G19. :D
One thing I ran into with the MTAC was that the standard clips would slip off the belt and the holster would start riding up. I haven't had a chance to experiment with what was causing that (my belts, the clips, location, etc.) since I've started carrying the Raven almost exclusively now.
Are there any drawbacks to using the C clips VS the standard ones?
FYI - Just ordered an MTAC and mag holder. They currently have a 15% off sale on anything in the magazine holder section of their website. Use code MAGS-0610.
I ordered mine with the standard clips.
Good choice. :)
Good choice. :)
Thanks for your help ;)
motorsporting
06-21-10, 13:57
I don't have an M-Tac, but I have several Comp-Tacs. I also have a RCS. If you are going to carry with a light attached, definitely get the RCS. Otherwise, I would stick with the Com-Tac. RCS is a great holster, but it is a little thinner than Comp-Tacs, IMHO. I have had some RCS parts/holster break (which were quickly replaced free of charge), so that is why if you're not carrying a light I suggest the Comp-Tac. Either way, they are great Kydex holsters!
I received mine in the mail today. Right now, I am in the "I'm not used to it mode." This is my first hybrid and the appearance, quality, and workmanship appear to be top-notch. However, after carrying a Sidearmor for ten years, I really have to get my expectations management in check. While both are IWB holsters, it appears there are subtle differences in intended use and utility.
Initial impressions are positive, but I just have to work through some things in order to give it a fair shake.
Are there any drawbacks to using the C clips VS the standard ones?
I find I need to thread the belt onto my C-clips for my M-TAC. My new Wilderness belt is so stiff that I can't flex it to put the belt in the clips after it is on. Makes it a little hard to quickly put the holster on and take it off again.
boondocksaint
06-21-10, 20:42
Initial impressions are positive, but I just have to work through some things in order to give it a fair shake.
Took me about a week to really feel comfortable wearing my Comp-Tac with my Springfield. Now that the leather has formed a bit to my body, I can't say enough good about them!
I love the quality of the leather and the fact that I can buy different clips, bodies, etc if I want to change for a diff gun.
Enjoy :D
Took me about a week to really feel comfortable wearing my Comp-Tac with my Springfield. Now that the leather has formed a bit to my body, I can't say enough good about them!
I love the quality of the leather and the fact that I can buy different clips, bodies, etc if I want to change for a diff gun.
Enjoy :D
Thanks. Those qualities are important to me too. However, one thing I noticed about the leather was how it grabbed the slide when I holstered both of my G17 and G26. I believe the retention is set properly, but I got a good 1/4" of rearward slide movement. Not alarmed yet, but like I said, I need to work through a few things. :o
Ahhh, see what the "search" lead me to! Now I'm SOLD on the Comp-Tac MTAC since I was contemplating on this one and the Raven Concealment Phantom. But I think giving both a try would be worth it. :cool:
Kry, I've found that putting the gun-hand thumb on the back of the slide while holstering to prevent that. That's regardless of holster type.
Granted, it's a holdover from M9-use days when it can tell one if the hammer is creeping back due to the trigger being hung up on something, but I haven't found a reason to stop doing it with M&Ps or Glocks.
I can't conjure a reason to NOT do that, but I'd like to hear from somebody who has a safety-related reason to do otherwise.
SW-Shooter
12-20-10, 13:53
For me the MTAC is a one trick pony. It's great for daytime carry, but when the sun goes down it's useless to me. I also think about low light indoors, inclement weather, etc; where the need for a weapon mounted light may present itself.
The one reason I went to Raven is I can have it all in one package. No need for multiple holsters. Efficiency is bar none with the RCS.
Try mounting that TLR-1, Surefire X300, WX150 to an MTAC.
As technology improves I for one wouldn't be caught anywhere without my WML, and the MTAC is a no go on that station.
For me the MTAC is a one trick pony. It's great for daytime carry, but when the sun goes down it's useless to me. I also think about low light indoors, inclement weather, etc; where the need for a weapon mounted light may present itself.
The one reason I went to Raven is I can have it all in one package. No need for multiple holsters. Efficiency is bar none with the RCS.
Try mounting that TLR-1, Surefire X300, WX150 to an MTAC.
As technology improves I for one wouldn't be caught anywhere without my WML, and the MTAC is a no go on that station.
Change the "M" in MTAC to a "C" and you can.
That said, I have and use both the MTAC (I've got three of them I think) and the Phantom (LC, for 19 + TLR-1). The MTAC may be a "one trick pony" but it's pretty damn good at that one trick that it does. For me, the MTAC is the primary carry and the Phantom is for specialized situations...but certainly everyone's mileage may vary. I don't mind having multiple holsters to exploit each for the best of it's abilities.
On a side note, I agree with Jim on the thumb on the back of the slide to keep the gun in battery while holstering.
I've had great success with the MTAC thus far. It conceals well and is very comfortable. I also like the fact that it's easy on, easy off although there are some downsides to that as well. There have been several people who've commented about it's retention in concerns to drawing the pistol and I think it's valid but I haven't had an issue yet. I also haven't ran the holster in a class or high stress environment and that could be it's saving grace as well.
I did just place my order for a Phantom so I'll be giving that a try in about 3 months.
I have two MTACs and love them. I ordered a Phantom so I could mount a X300 and will report back once I receive it from Raven
gtmtnbiker98
12-21-10, 13:38
For me the MTAC is a one trick pony. It's great for daytime carry, but when the sun goes down it's useless to me. I also think about low light indoors, inclement weather, etc; where the need for a weapon mounted light may present itself.
The one reason I went to Raven is I can have it all in one package. No need for multiple holsters. Efficiency is bar none with the RCS.
Try mounting that TLR-1, Surefire X300, WX150 to an MTAC.
As technology improves I for one wouldn't be caught anywhere without my WML, and the MTAC is a no go on that station.
They are now offering some models that allow for the WML.
They are now offering some models that allow for the WML.
On C-T's website, it appears the WML holster(s) are custom made to order. That's fine, I wonder if it's doable with the MTAC?
On C-T's website, it appears the WML holster(s) are custom made to order. That's fine, I wonder if it's doable with the MTAC?
When I asked Comp-tac about WML holsters a few months ago, they told me it is just the CTAC and I believe one of the OWB holsters. The WML option on those holsters is under the gun make/model...and it's primarily Glocks if I'm not mistaken.
Badger1911
12-22-10, 09:12
I've been trying to decide on an IWB holster. MTAC is looking pretty good after this thread. Great info...thanks guys!
RogerinTPA
12-22-10, 09:25
The MTAC has been my daily carry for the past 3 years. It's very comfortable and great for year around carry here in FL from T-Shirts, wearing suits, outer wear jackets to formal wear.
I am a very big fan of Comp-Tac. I want to preface that before I discuss my recent purchase of their OWB Belt Holster that allowed for the Weapon Mounted Light to be carried. As usual, Comp-Tac's customer service is superb, ordering is easy and shipping is VERY fast compared to many other manufacturers.
The holster arrived in a USPS box, with no issues and the roll of smartees was in there as always! The quality of the holster was top notch as it always has been from Comp-Tac.
The first thing I noticed was that the belt loops seemed to be placed in weird positions. The front loop was at the very front of the holster but the rear loop was in the middle of the gun, not at the rear of the holster. When I put the holster on, the rear stuck out from my waist by several inches. No matter what position I wore it in, ir high tight I pulled my belt, the holster stuck out like a sore thumb. There is no way I could conceal that holster, even with a heavy jacket. Now, being a GLOCK 19 with a TLR-1s, I had no intentions of deep concealment but there was going to be no concealment with this holster.
I contact Comp-Tac the next day and discussed the issue with them. Excellent customer service as always. They stated that the belt holster was not meant to be a concealment holster and that I could try their IWB version that they started making using the C-Tac holster. I told them I didn't want to put a weapon mounted light IWB and they promptly refunded my money.
For a weapon mounted light holster, I have been looking elsewhere. I use the Comp-Tac Gladiator for OWB of my GLOCK 19 now but they aren't making them into Light holsters. :sad:
Have a MTAC and I now won't go back to an all-Kydex IWB. I'd rather have a second OWB rather than a jack-of-all trades, master of none. So, I ordered a Kaluban Cloak for OWB, which is comparable to the Raven and is getting great reviews.
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