LMT/MRP PISTON ARTICLE [Archive] - M4Carbine.net Forums

nickdrak

05-30-07, 19:16

Here is a scan of the recent article from "THE BOOK OF THE AR-15" for those interested....

http://i13.tinypic.com/4q3zvia.jpg

http://i19.tinypic.com/5222fiq.jpg

http://i8.tinypic.com/4l8aef9.jpg

http://i14.tinypic.com/6gxp4s2.jpg

http://i10.tinypic.com/6f4rrev.jpg

It looks like a nice simple design. The bolt carrier looks identical to the Ares bolt carrier. Dont know if this is a good thing or not??? I have tons of rounds thru my MRP without any weapon related failures/malfunctions at all, but I am still going to try this out when it hits the market.

RHR

05-30-07, 20:01

Thanks for the scan. I emailed LMT about a release date. They didn't have a firm date they just said maybe by the end of summer.

CarlosDJackal

05-30-07, 20:32

Thanks for the scan. I emailed LMT about a release date. They didn't have a firm date they just said maybe by the end of summer.

Did they indicate the estimated cost for both complete rifle or an upper?

RAM Engineer

05-30-07, 20:50

Is this a NEW upper or a retrofit for current MRPs?

nickdrak

05-30-07, 20:58

Is this a NEW upper or a retrofit for current MRPs?

It is supposedly a direct "Drop-in" replacement for all current MRP's.

RHR

05-31-07, 06:47

Did they indicate the estimated cost for both complete rifle or an upper?

I didn't ask.

ETA: I contacted them today and they don't have a MSRP yet.

KevinB

05-31-07, 07:11

Hmm I just picked up a 10.5 MRP over here -- maybe I need a piston :D

shark31

05-31-07, 08:28

Hmm I just picked up a 10.5 MRP over here -- maybe I need a piston :D

I hope they come up with a 10.5" barrel, but that gas block appears to not be compatible with that barrel length.

RHR

05-31-07, 11:45

LMT said there will be 12" and 16" barrels available.

S-1

05-31-07, 19:59

LMT said there will be 12" and 16" barrels available.

Well, I guess I won't be buying one then. I was hoping for a 10.5" barrel.

Seth Harness

06-02-07, 20:49

Cue the piston bashers...

Lumpy196

06-02-07, 21:40

Cue the piston bashers...

That was constructive.

Seth Harness

06-03-07, 12:26

That was constructive.

WHAT ?! I thought that was funny :D
Anyway, I picked up that mag from the store yesterday. The whole damb thing is full of cool stuff.
Anybody know how extensively they've tested this piston upper?

Dave L.

06-03-07, 13:11

LMT was showing this gun off to the Army Times a few weeks ago down at Blackwater.
They were letting anyone shoot it. I, unfortunately didn't get to shoot it but a close friend of mine did. He shot the HK416 (HK was there too) and the LMT back to back and liked the LMT better.

It was just a dog and pony show, but the guns that were there looked sweet...like that new modular FN "thing" coming out.

tikkafan

06-03-07, 15:18

I really love the design with the monolithic rail and quick change barrel.

I just wonder how much it'll cost. A DI MRP with barrel is just under 1300.

the1911fan

06-03-07, 15:34

Will the Piston systems delay things like bolt replacement/ bolt failures?

Seth Harness

06-03-07, 16:23

I really love the design with the monolithic rail and quick change barrel.

I just wonder how much it'll cost. A DI MRP with barrel is just under 1300.

+1, That things bad-ass.
My guess is that it'll be comparable to the LWRC SRT in price. If thats the case I'll purchase a LMT instead.

twodollarbill

06-03-07, 16:33

I just received my LMT MRP the other day, I and

my fellow shooters were amazed at the quality

of this unit. They were all dumb-struck why I

ordered it with a 16" barrel, as my other three

LMT M4's are 14.5" sbr's.

I had guessed LMT was going to be coming out

with the piston set-up and it would be a direct

slide in. It would have to be, this way they can sell

one to current MRP owners with no hassle.

I will have a compliant 16" to sell when I upgrade.

I'll be putting my order in.........FOR SURE!!!!!

LMT stuff is top-notch.

RAM Engineer

06-03-07, 16:41

"people" on TOS are already bitching about how you are "locked in" to just using LMT barrels. :rolleyes:

So are the initial offerings going to be 12", 14.5" & 16"? or JUST 12" & 16"?

Jason

docsprague

06-03-07, 19:40

Well, I guess I won't be buying one then. I was hoping for a 10.5" barrel.

Pretty much, and I was really looking foward to a 10.5 MRP gas piston. Fingers still crossed.

Razorhunter

06-03-07, 20:22

SO,
Are any of you guys ABSOLUTELY certain that this LMT gas piston will be a DIRECT, DROP IN REPLACEMENT package of parts, thtat can be added later on, to a 16" LMT MRP rifle???
IOW, you guys are telling me I can buy an LMT MRP upper NOW, and then, later on down the road, I can buy the gas piston parts and drop them right in for a total conversion????
Is this correct? Is this confirmed???? Is this meaning NO GUNSMITHING required or what???
I need to know for sure, (if possible) before I go spending $1300....
Thanks for any help guys..

Also, one more question.
WHO can explain to me how the LMT gas piston system works, as compared to the other brands???? I mean, doesn't the LOOK of the LMT gas piston strike anyone else around here as a bit odd? (at least when compared to OTHER brands)????
I mean, that thing is shaped unlike ANY other gas piston I've EVER seen!
Kind of cool if you ask me, but I would like to know more about why it's shaped like this, and IF it functions considerably different than all the other systems ????? ??????

tikkafan

06-03-07, 22:03

SO,
Are any of you guys ABSOLUTELY certain that this LMT gas piston will be a DIRECT, DROP IN REPLACEMENT package of parts, thtat can be added later on, to a 16" LMT MRP rifle???

The only thing that has me wondering is the gas tube hole in the receiver.

I wouldn't bet money on it being a drop in replacement just yet.

nickdrak

06-03-07, 22:38

The only thing that has me wondering is the gas tube hole in the receiver.

I wouldn't bet money on it being a drop in replacement just yet.

Guys,

From what I can gather on this, It will be a complete gas piston operated barrel assembly that will "drop-in" to any MRP upper that has been produced to date.

A "Drop-in" parts kit to convert your DI barrels to the new gas piston system will not likely be available at all. LMT has never really been open to selling seperate parts from their proprietary MRP system.

nickdrak

06-03-07, 22:42

SO,

Also, one more question.
WHO can explain to me how the LMT gas piston system works, as compared to the other brands???? I mean, doesn't the LOOK of the LMT gas piston strike anyone else around here as a bit odd? (at least when compared to OTHER brands)????
I mean, that thing is shaped unlike ANY other gas piston I've EVER seen!
Kind of cool if you ask me, but I would like to know more about why it's shaped like this, and IF it functions considerably different than all the other systems ????? ??????

Paul,

To me it looks much simpler than any of the other AR piston systems out there on the market. It reminds me of an AK-47 style piston that has been disconnected from the bolt carrier.

conspiro agnew

06-03-07, 23:24

Any idea where it releases the excess gas?

Razorhunter

06-04-07, 00:47

Thanks so much for the info guys.
I guess for now, it sounds like I should NOT buy a 16" DI MRP, in hopes of having it converted in the future huh?
Damn... HOPEFULLY they will be out soon!!!!

RHR

06-04-07, 08:30

"people" on TOS are already bitching about how you are "locked in" to just using LMT barrels. :rolleyes:

So are the initial offerings going to be 12", 14.5" & 16"? or JUST 12" & 16"?

Jason

12" & 16" according to Gene from LMT.

C4IGrant

06-04-07, 12:55

Any idea where it releases the excess gas?

Usually it is at the front of the gas block.

C4

C4IGrant

06-04-07, 12:57

Thanks so much for the info guys.
I guess for now, it sounds like I should NOT buy a 16" DI MRP, in hopes of having it converted in the future huh?
Damn... HOPEFULLY they will be out soon!!!!

My honest opinion is that if you want to run a 16" barrel on semi-auto fire, you really don't need a gas piston system (especially with a middy gas system).

Where gas pistons are REALLy needed is 14.5" and below.

C4

KevinB

06-04-07, 13:16

LMT has been working on the drop in piston for the MRP for a while.
My guess is that the 12" barrel was the optimun they found for release at this point, with the 16" as a sop to the non-NFA crowd

Seth Harness

06-04-07, 13:58

SO,

WHO can explain to me how the LMT gas piston system works, as compared to the other brands???? I mean, doesn't the LOOK of the LMT gas piston strike anyone else around here as a bit odd? (at least when compared to OTHER brands)????
I mean, that thing is shaped unlike ANY other gas piston I've EVER seen!
Kind of cool if you ask me, but I would like to know more about why it's shaped like this, and IF it functions considerably different than all the other systems ????? ??????

+1 Which brings up my earlier question, does anybody know how extensively this thing has been tested? Ya know, for durability in the long run sake.

nickdrak

06-04-07, 19:35

+1 Which brings up my earlier question, does anybody know how extensively this thing has been tested? Ya know, for durability in the long run sake.

LMT tests their new products extensively before they release them into the market. Many will probably cry about their testing being "too extensive" :rolleyes: as it usually delays the release dates for new products.

Voodoochild

06-04-07, 20:42

LMT tests their new products extensively before they release them into the market. Many will probably cry about their testing being "too extensive" :rolleyes: as it usually delays the release dates for new products.

I would rather them to test it extensively and get it right than have them realease it with all sorts of problems.

CarlosDJackal

06-04-07, 21:03

I would rather them to test it extensively and get it right than have them realease it with all sorts of problems.

Amen!! :)

Derek_Connor

06-05-07, 05:35

This will be a really interesting addition to the piston market. I'd much rather give my $$$ and justify an MRP setup with piston to LMT to any other manufact...

Razorhunter

06-06-07, 19:56

Guys,
I recently emailed LMT regarding the piston system, and this is the response I got from LMT today. Very nice of them to reply in such a manner.
Enjoy guys.

"Dear Mr. Cataldo,

Thanks much for the note.

We are indeed working on the piston system, and we're in the final phases. At this time, we should start taking orders in mid July and deliver in November/December.

The first run of units (all units, complete top ends, complete guns and "upgrade kits") will be done in 16" chrome lined barrels. The second run which will happen first quarter of 08 will be 12.5" chrome lined barrels. We will not develop additional barrel lenghts until the first two lengths have been tested by our customers and we see the demand of different barrel lengths. It won't be brain surgery to do additional barrel lengths, but it will be time consuming. Chopping off or adding an inch or two changes enough internal operations that we would test between 5 and 10,000 rounds on multiple barrels before turning it to a production run.

Basic specs:
-- Our piston driven system is based off of our CQB MRP (that is the carbine length monolithic rail platform).
-- Piston upgrade kit will consist of a barrel assembly and bolt carrier group to go from gas operated existing CQB MRP to the piston driven.
-- Pricing yet to be released, but will be released by mid July.
-- Initial barrel length is 16" chrome lined, second barrel length offered will be 12.5" chrome lined

Let me know if you have additional questions.
--
Monica S. Sipp
Director of Sales & Marketing
Lewis Machine & Tool Company
1305 West 11th Street
Milan IL 61264
Phone: 309.787.7151
Fax: 309.787.7193
Email: sippm@lewismachine.net"

Seth Harness

06-07-07, 19:25

Damb! I wish money was'nt one of my short comings. :rolleyes:

CarlosDJackal

06-09-07, 10:13

I guess I'll have to wait a while for the 12.5" version. At least I won't have to be the giunea pig for this. :p

panzerr

06-10-07, 04:04

A gas piston LMT? This is the news I've been waiting for! Now I just have to wait a few years for the bugs to get worked out before I buy one.

nickdrak

06-10-07, 09:50

A gas piston LMT? This is the news I've been waiting for! Now I just have to wait a few years for the bugs to get worked out before I buy one.

LMT has been testing the new MRP piston system for a long time now. Im sure any bugs will be worked out before it is released.

koniz

06-10-07, 15:21

I can assure everyone that every bug will be fixed before they start selling these weapons, I beleve they were to do a stress test next week if I am not mistaken, I will find out more at work.

jar3ds

06-13-07, 21:06

bring on the MUD TESTS LMT :-D... I wanna see an AR dipped into mud then sand with the bolt cover opened and then fired on a full auto with a pmag :D lol

I think that may throw me over into MRP world instead of my current future investment of a VIS midlength :D

C4IGrant

06-14-07, 09:25

Talked to LMT yesterday. They are taking orders in July (am on the first to called for orders) with shipping in November. This most likely means that they will not ship till the Shot Show.

C4

shark31

06-14-07, 09:36

Talked to LMT yesterday. They are taking orders in July (am on the first to called for orders) with shipping in November. This most likely means that they will not ship till the Shot Show.

C4

I'm wondering how much barrel is in front of the gas block on the 12.5" barrels. Wondering if a Surefire can will fit.

C4IGrant

06-17-07, 13:27

All, we are now accepting pre-orders for the LMT Gas Piston systems here: https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?p=58456#post58456

C4

Razorhunter

06-17-07, 14:02

with shipping in November. This most likely means that they will not ship till the Shot Show.

C4

So WHEN is the SHOT Show??? Isn't there TWO SHOT Shows each year??? (or am I wrong about that???)

Just trying to determine exactly WHICH month/year you are saying they will probably ship Grant????? (Sorry, I'm not up to par on Shot Show dates/times/etc)...
Thanks SO MUCH for the help Grant!!!! You rock!!!

C4IGrant

06-17-07, 14:14

So WHEN is the SHOT Show??? Isn't there TWO SHOT Shows each year??? (or am I wrong about that???)

Just trying to determine exactly WHICH month/year you are saying they will probably ship Grant????? (Sorry, I'm not up to par on Shot Show dates/times/etc)...
Thanks SO MUCH for the help Grant!!!! You rock!!!

The Shot Show is in Feb. For more info: http://www.shotshow.com

There is only one SS a year.

They are taking pre-orders next month (July 07) and will start to ship November 07.

C4

Razorhunter

06-17-07, 14:20

Thanks Grant,
Damn I sure hope they actually start shipping to us in November, instead of making us wait until Feb 08!
Thanks~

Razorhunter

06-18-07, 11:56

Guys,
One other issue has got me thinking a great deal here lately.
I am TOTALLY interested in finding out the approximate cost of the LMT Gas Piston "Conversion Kit" that they are going to offer, to convert existing DI MRP guns to Gas Piston MRP's.
SO, if ANYONE here happens to work for LMT, or know someone who does, and can tell us just HOW MUCH the Gas Piston "Conversion Kit" might cost (approximate Ballpark figures MORE than welcome!), I would be SUPER DUPER GREATFUL!

Cold Zero

06-18-07, 12:12

Anyone care to comment on which gas piston design will be better, the Colt L.E. 1020 or the L.M.T..:confused:

AR15barrels

06-18-07, 12:21

Anyone care to comment on which gas piston design will be better, the Colt L.E. 1020 or the L.M.T..:confused:

Colt guys will tell you that the Colt one will be better.
LMT guys will tell you that the LMT one will be better.
Both groups of guys would be wrong without actual units being fielded and tested.
Don't be an early adopter if you can not accept possible glitches.
Let all the kinks get worked out before you accept a new design.

CarlosDJackal

06-18-07, 15:35

Anyone care to comment on which gas piston design will be better, the Colt L.E. 1020 or the L.M.T..:confused:

Yes!! :D

C4IGrant

06-18-07, 16:41

Anyone care to comment on which gas piston design will be better, the Colt L.E. 1020 or the L.M.T..:confused:

Well, we would ACTUALLY have to spend some time with each to able to make any kind of informed decision. I have seen the 1020 up close for two years now, but still have had a chance to fire it.

C4

Razorhunter

06-18-07, 18:04

I say for now, the LMT is better, because at least LMT has announced that they are actually going to produce (AND SELL) their GP Rifle to us.
Not to mention the MRP system is totally KICK ASS, and the DI guns can be quickly converted over to Gas Piston with the conversion parts... Quick change bbls, the whole nine yards...
(I'm actually a Kool Aid Drinker normally, but the LMT rifles have got me STOKED!)...

LIL-COMMANDO

05-17-08, 18:40

Well, we would ACTUALLY have to spend some time with each to able to make any kind of informed decision. I have seen the 1020 up close for two years now, but still have had a chance to fire it.

C4

What I would like to know between the 1020 and LMT is how different are they in design. I have seen the articel on the 1020 and it showed the Carrier with"SKIS" so it would not bounce out of line. On the LMT carrier I have not seen any info relating on how they will solve this problem if there is a problem. LMT carriers are made from one solid piece but what about Colts 1020 Carrier? I can see from LMT's Gas block that it appears excess gas will be released from a whole on each side as does the 1020. I like this much better then a release of gas inside handguards or rails such as the LWRC system.

Cohibra45

08-30-08, 08:00

:DLMT is shipping their 'Piston' rifles!!!:D

Been a very long wait...hopefully mine will be in very soon. I ordered mine in early Feb. Man, that is a long time, but I'm just praying that LMT has worked all the bugs out!!

Kelly

BTW, has anyone here received theirs yet??? Pictures???

Thanks

RHR

08-30-08, 09:57

There is one for sale on TOS. The pics aren't that great though.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=7&f=21&t=574360

LibertyCola

09-02-08, 02:48

any updates on pricing, of if 14.5 PA will be available?

.357sigger

09-02-08, 04:12

I would like to hear some reports as well...

H2O MAN

10-13-08, 11:20

Is there any updated information available yet?

sgtmajor

10-13-08, 11:30

Is there any updated information available yet?

im pretty sure there available at a few places

Gunrider

10-13-08, 11:41

I love my LMT Gas Piston. Fire at my range (Angeles Forest Range) these last two days and too windy with Santa Anas to do legit accuracy test but Iron sights hits on LaRue reactive targets at 380 meters --

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p54/Fasanoland/LMTGP.jpg

H2O MAN

10-13-08, 12:03

I love my LMT Gas Piston. Fire at my range (Angeles Forest Range) these last two days and too windy with Santa Anas to do legit accuracy test but Iron sights hits on LaRue reactive targets at 380 meters --

That's what I'm talking about!

More pictures and details please.

I'm looking at this upper for my one & only AR.

Thanks :)

Gunrider

10-13-08, 12:13

I fired my LMT GP MRP against the same barrel length DI MRP. The Gas piston kicked 10-15% less than the DI gun using Federal match 77 grain ammo. I ran 250 rounds without a hitch out of each gun before I had to take one of my kids home because they were sick. A friend of mine who is a world class AR-15 competitor shot both guns and told me to immediately shitcan the DI gun -- the piston gun was as accurate and ran cooler and smoother.

LMT really did it's homework on this piston system, 16 years they have been planning and refining it. I know some people aren't fans of gas pistons (they love their "old school" ARs) but pistons are here to stay. Small companies like ADDAX out here in L.A. have refined the conversion and full upper, and I have had them covert my existing DI ARs, but for an out of the box complete gun, so far the milspec version that LMT is making is the best complete gun I've found.