View Full Version : first quality AR help me decide
I am planning on getting my first high quality AR. My Bushy/stag mutt runs 100% but i know it would not stand up to hard abuse and i bought it before being enlightened by this site. I have learned a TON since i've been lurking here. So i've narrowed my choices down to 3 atm. the new Larue OBR 5.56, a Noveske N4 Recon and a Knights armament SR-15 3E. I'm really torn between these three. How do you experienced and knowledgable guys think these three rifles stack up? i would like this to be a good all-purpose gun. Home defense, Range, Carbine classes if i can find a good one in the area, SHTF, ECT...
thanks ahead of time!
Disclaimer: I have nither rifle on your list
People are saying the LaRue rifle is a bit heavy, but I am sure it is a tac driver as are the other two. The only thing that would make me think twice about the KAC is the E3 bolt. I am sure you can get a spare as I think its not a bad idea to have one, but if one fails and you don't have access to them, I don't believe a standard bolt will work. Say in a worst case scenario of a world gone to hell and zombies on the rampage, finding a regular bolt would be either no?
If it was my choice, I would go with the Noveske with little more to back it up than the overwelmingly positive feedback I see for their products on this site.
organdonor
07-19-10, 12:31
I believe when you enter into this class of rifle your decision is largely based on personal preference. I'd probably choose the KA SR15.
Out of the three, I only have experience with Noveske. Noveske rifles are top notch.
My latest build has been a BCM 16" middy. Another quality rifle, and probably the best bang for the buck AR-15 right now.
Personally, I don't like to go too expensive with my equipment......unless I were a rich SOB. As long as you have the elements of reliablity, durability, and performance.....any savings can go towards ammo and training time. Plus, I'm less fearful of getting the rifle banged up.....so a little more peace of mind.
Noveske N4 w/VIS here. Fantastic rifle - I went that route because of accuracy + the super-tough M249-spec barrel. Not disappointed, but either of the other two are top-notch too.
Grease Monkey
07-19-10, 16:31
Out of those for your thought train on the rifle purpose, I would go with a Noveske. I like the parts commonality factor. In that senario if your weapon goes down it should be easier to find parts for the Noveske. Also, I'm a Noveske fan. Mine has run flawless. If I were starting out I would go with A BCM. Best rifles for your $ hands down in my opinion.
ForTehNguyen
07-19-10, 16:58
get a lower and then a BCM upper
I own and love my Noveske N4.
That said, I'm itching for a SR15.
Sometimes I wish I had known about the SR before I bought my Noveske because I would have gotten that.
The way I see it, you already have a back up gun if your knights goes down. Though it may be a hobby gun, it should serve its purpose while the SR is waiting on parts.
Grease Monkey
07-19-10, 17:30
The way I see it, you already have a back up gun if your knights goes down. Though it may be a hobby gun, it should serve its purpose while the SR is waiting on parts.
Or if you have the Noveske you could use said back-up to get your primary running immediately. I don't know how long the wait for the Knights to come back would be in a SHTF senario......might be a while.:D
Or if you have the Noveske you could use said back-up to get your primary running immediately. I don't know how long the wait for the Knights to come back would be in a SHTF senario......might be a while.:D
This is true. Maybe I'm in a different state of mind because I already own a Noveske. :D
I don't subscribe to the whole SHTF idea either though, so if it took Knights a week or so to get me parts via UPS, I'm ok with that. :rolleyes:
Grease Monkey
07-19-10, 17:56
This is true. Maybe I'm in a different state of mind because I already own a Noveske. :D
I don't subscribe to the whole SHTF idea either though, so if it took Knights a week or so to get me parts via UPS, I'm ok with that. :rolleyes:
Yeah Noveske's good stuff!!
He did say SHTF, ETC... Alot of folks base what they do on this concept. As for me I just like parts commonality. Not saying Knights shit isn't sweet though.
rlgdestroyu@hotmail.com
07-19-10, 20:12
I've owned my SR15 for a little over a year and although I cannot comment on Noveske or BCM rifles....I do absolutely love the SR15. It is my first AR and probably my last AR in 5.56 that is!!:D Everything on it, from the ambi features to the overall quality of the componentry, is exactly what I had envisioned in my head. Plus you can say you have one when you get one!!;) And you get excellent customer service, I have had first hand. I just think you can't go wrong.
Jake Bauer
07-19-10, 20:26
Noveske from your list. But I'd also look into Daniel Defense and BCM
RogerinTPA
07-19-10, 20:32
Noveske from your list. But I'd also look into Daniel Defense and BCM
Agreed...And save the coin for more ammo, training and spare parts.
I will live under a bridge before I sell my SR15e3.
Granted, if I came across the Noveske first I probably would have that and not the KAC..
I've owned several AR's but from your list, only the Noveske.
If I had it to do over again...I'd get another Noveske RECCE.
Something to consider. How much accuracy do you need? All 3 of your choices are probably very accurate (I know my Noveske is).
So I think the real question is why not consider a good BCM or Daniel Defense as well? Or one of the basic Noveske guns?
This will allow you to pocket extra cash for mags, ammo and possibly training.
all good advice so far. I'm not over the top paranoid about SHTF its just an afterthought that i want a reliable rifle that would last as long as possible without needing major maintenance/parts replacements. I would like as much accuracy as i can squeeze out of the platform without making a dmr type rifle that would be ineffective for a home defense scenario (inside the home short distances.) .. and as to iraqgunz's question, i have not put much thought into DD or BCM i will look into that. i just figured i bought an arguably shitty AR the first time so i might as well go big on my second one, maybe i'm way off base on that though.
Jake Bauer
07-19-10, 23:58
i dont think you bought a terrible AR, its just you can get better for the money. I'd save that AR you have for a good truck gun or something.
Or I guess you could keep your lower and get a kick a$$ upper.
Yes, definitely look into DD. You can get them VERY reasonable (got mine for the same price as your Stag/bushy probably) Saved me a lot of $ for accessories and ammo.
Something to consider. How much accuracy do you need? All 3 of your choices are probably very accurate (I know my Noveske is).
So I think the real question is why not consider a good BCM or Daniel Defense as well? Or one of the basic Noveske guns?
This will allow you to pocket extra cash for mags, ammo and possibly training.
===============================
I agree wholeheartedly with Iraqgunz's statement.
I sold off several guns to buy a Noveske. I had a wad of money, so I ordered the Recon on late Friday afternoon. (Over) thinking over the weekend, I realized it was not what I wanted; I wanted a light all around simple gun. Frantic until Monday morning, I called for 2-hours in case someone was at Noveske early. Finally got someone (15-minutes before they were supposed to open) and they willingly (and enthusiastically) changed my order to the Light Recce Basic.
I never had 1 millisecond of remorse. I have never enjoyed a gun more than I have enjoyed that gun-period. It is way more accurate than I am. (100 yd 10-shot 1-1/4" groups) - I love it.
But that's just me. There are a lot of good guns and at least you have narrowed it down to some quality choices and have some good recommendations to pick from.
BTW - Have you looked at Olympic Arms yet??? :sarcastic:
.
If you needed an AR for say a DMR rifle, I would say go for it. But, many people cannot shoot to the accuracy off their weapon. For what you want to use it for, I think that the ones I mentioned will serve you well. With ammo prices coming down and everything basically being in supply I say use your extra cash to get the other necessities.
all good advice so far. I'm not over the top paranoid about SHTF its just an afterthought that i want a reliable rifle that would last as long as possible without needing major maintenance/parts replacements. I would like as much accuracy as i can squeeze out of the platform without making a dmr type rifle that would be ineffective for a home defense scenario (inside the home short distances.) .. and as to iraqgunz's question, i have not put much thought into DD or BCM i will look into that. i just figured i bought an arguably shitty AR the first time so i might as well go big on my second one, maybe i'm way off base on that though.
Belmont31R
07-20-10, 00:23
It never makes sense to me why people ask what to get, and they list different guns all doing something very different from each other. Its like asking should I get a F350 dually or a Ferrari F430?
The LaRue OBR Lite is not at all close to the SR15 in what they are designed for.
I would pick the KAC SR15 E3. After building my own for several years now, I thought I had it all figured out....until I put my paws on a SR15 E3 recently. It is truly the best balanced 16" AR platform carbine I have ever handled. The quality is second to none. The ambi controls are fantastic. The price, for what you get, is a complete bargain. I would dump the two stage trigger for a standard single stage MilSpec trigger, but other than that it's perfect!
ford7379trucks
07-20-10, 01:16
I chose to build a Noveske 14.5 light basic but with some custom options. I cant save up $2000 to buy what I want all at once. I have that if you have money something will break disease. So I'll buy it piece by piece. The stock 14.5 basic is affordable tho. $1465
rlgdestroyu@hotmail.com
07-20-10, 08:46
I will live under a bridge before I sell my SR15e3.
Granted, if I came across the Noveske first I probably would have that and not the KAC..
:p Put very well.
===============================
I never had 1 millisecond of remorse. I have never enjoyed a gun more than I have enjoyed that gun-period. It is way more accurate than I am. (100 yd 10-shot 1-1/4" groups) - I love it.
.
When you guys speak of this type accuracy is it supposed to be understood that this is standing, from sand bag on a bench or what?
Sorry, but I don't have much rifle experience and I'm at the -choose an upper- phase right now also. .... and if you can get 1-1/4" with that one, what might be expected from say a basic BCM middy upper under similar conditions.
Tom
GermanSynergy
07-20-10, 09:23
Seanb,
You've already set the bar pretty high with your three carbine choices.
It's very hard to go wrong with the Larue OBR 5.56, Noveske N-4 Recon or the KAC SR15E3.
Given the choice of the three, I'd select the SR15E3. I love mine and it's approaching the 3500 rd mark with 100% reliability (end user errors such as failing to seat the mag during a reload don't count against it :cool: )
Like others have said, don't overlook the offerings from DD or BCM. They also make outstanding carbines.
When you guys speak of this type accuracy is it supposed to be understood that this is standing, from sand bag on a bench or what?
Sorry, but I don't have much rifle experience and I'm at the -choose an upper- phase right now also. .... and if you can get 1-1/4" with that one, what might be expected from say a basic BCM middy upper under similar conditions.
Tom
=============================
.
I'm sorry, I should have been more clear. That was resting on sand bags with a 2-7X Leupold. I was trying to find the ammo that shot the best, so I would know what to expect.
I put an Aimpoint T-1 on the rifle and have shot 3" 10-shot groups, again resting at a 100-yards. What is amazing with the T-1 and an ADM QD mount is I have shot 4 - 5 shot groups at 50 yards, removing the T-1 between each of the 4 - 5 shot strings and remounting it to have an OA 2-3/4" group. I'm sure there are other mounts that can do the same but I really like the ADM.
Did I say that I really like my Noveske...?
+1 on the BCM, for what you're talking about I wouldn't spend absolute top dollar when you can get something of high quality and completely functional for a bit less.
Everything you mentioned , and the advice given is all great, but if budget is a concern the 2 I would consider first are LMT's and BCM's. The GB auction site has some deals if you can't find something in the classifieds here, that's where I bought 2 of my ARs.
My LMT is 100% LMT, and I love it. The BCM (BFH) middy upper is on a 2 stage RRA lower.....that fits together better than the RRA upper did, and it'll drive tacks all day long.
Good luck with your search...and happy hunting. ;)
From your list I'd choose the Noveske.
I'd also consider LMT, BCM and DD.
I've got a LMT 14.5" carbine and it has worked flawlessly.
However if I knew then what I know now I probably would have seriously looked at getting either a LMT MRP, Noveske, or even the Knight. Why? By the time I got done adding a rail, BUIS, and having a flash suppressor pinned and welded by ADCO, the basic carbine turned into a higher dollar affair real quick. I definitely have it setup how I wanted it but cost wise it is now more than what a LMT MRP runs, about the same as a Noveske, and only slightly less $$$ than the Knight. Oh well, next time!
VirginiaTactical
07-21-10, 10:50
Looks like no one chimed in for the LaRue! I woulkd choose the LaRue. I have a stealth 5.56 and I love it. I replaced my M&PVTAC with my LaRue and have not looked back since. It is a nail driver. That being said I don't have experience with the other 2 =). I know I wanted a Noveske for a long time, but glad I chose LaRue instead. It is also built really tight.
first quality AR help me decide --
Noveske or LMT
rlgdestroyu@hotmail.com
07-21-10, 12:27
It really seems like you can't go wrong with many of these choices...I guess that says a lot regarding some AR manufacturers. At some point you reach the precipice of the platform, everything else is just ancillary.
first quality AR help me decide --
Noveske or LMT
+1
Colt
LMT
Noveske
Would be what I picked from.
After shooting Colt (M16), Bushies, and MP15, I decided to take the leap to a high quality AR last year. I went Noveske recce low profile.
As others mentioned, there are other high quality manufacturers so it's more just personal preference.
Moose-Knuckle
07-21-10, 16:03
Sometimes people buy to much gun...KAC is to the AR like Bugatti is to the automobile.
With that said the only AR I own is a Colt. With the money that I'm getting from selling one of my Sig 556s I am planning on buying a DD M4V3.
If I had the money and I was either a collector or an AR afficianado I would buy the three you mentioned with the KAC being at the top of the list.
You cannot lose with those choices. Pick the one that feels best and is best balanced for you, then you have a great rifle that fits you specifically. That being said; I agree with Jack Bauer; look into DD, they have great quality stuff at very competitive prices; pretty hard to beat the same quality in a rifle rifle as on your list, but extra cash to buy add ons and extra mags for the rifle with.
Another thing to keep in mind if you're not too rushed to get the new rifle (And since you already have a back up one) is to wait for some internet sales; you can get a rifle for a steal with a bit of patience and a shit ton of internet browsing. I know I did; if I was in a hurry I would have spent about 1.5 times what I did on my complete package if not more so.
Happy hunting!
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.