View Full Version : "Gucci Gun"
At what point do you consider an AR to fall under this category? I've heard the term a few times. Basically means "best" of everything I guess? It seems Noveske, DD, BCM, etc are all considered "standard" around here, so what does it take for you to consider a gun at the "next" level.
Interested in peoples responses as everyone has different opinions on what gun/parts might fill this category...
I have walked into Gucci/Versache/Bergdorff and looked at suits, tried them on, handled them. They are still just a suit in the long run though, and threads tear, shit shrinks, and life goes on.
Comparing a machine to something that is designed purely for aesthetics is not a comparison at all.
The Gucci comments died off long ago, but I don't think it ever referred to particular brands. I think it had more to do with accessories. For example, civilian guns with the latest night/thermal vision and IR gear. Anyways, that's my guess.
I remember 'Gucci' being used as a condescending description for things that were form over function. They were trendy or styled more than functional.
Edited for clarity:
The term Gucci {anything} has been replaced with the adjective 'Tacticool'. Same concept of of form over function.
I'm saying this on a personal basis, and my view does not represent M4Carbine insofar as an "official" response:
Quite honestly it's ****ing retarded to judge someone else's selection of gear. Some guys say an Aimpoint T-1 is not needed, and others draw the line at a PEQ and NODS. Some guys think A2 sights are not needed and the A1's are good enough, etc.
Quit judging other people's gear, and use what works for you.
Tacticool, Gucci, etc are crutches for the weak. Discuss it like a ****ing grown man and articulate why something won't work for you. Or better yet, stay in your lane and talk strictly about your gear and why it DOES work for you.
That's my rant for this AM. :D
jklaughrey
07-28-10, 09:01
Well personally I am more of a Louis Vuitton kind of guy. My wife has an extensive luggage/handbag collection. And to be fair some of their smaller luggage bags do nicely to conceal long guns broken down. I mean who would ever consider a high end bag in the arms of a woman who is carrying an AR?
Aside from this have to agree with Shivan, if you shit works for you to stay on target go for it. When it doesn't it is time to T/E.
Well personally I am more of a Louis Vuitton kind of guy. My wife has an extensive luggage/handbag collection. And to be fair some of their smaller luggage bags do nicely to conceal long guns broken down. I mean who would ever consider a high end bag in the arms of a woman who is carrying an AR?
Aside from this have to agree with Shivan, if you shit works for you to stay on target go for it. When it doesn't it is time to T/E.
They will now :D
At what point do you consider an AR to fall under this category? I've heard the term a few times. Basically means "best" of everything I guess? It seems Noveske, DD, BCM, etc are all considered "standard" around here, so what does it take for you to consider a gun at the "next" level.
Interested in peoples responses as everyone has different opinions on what gun/parts might fill this category...
There is no such thing as long as the gun fits the shooters role/reqs.
For instance, look at this pic:
http://www.gandrtactical.com/images/archive/Training_Pics/BW_CQB/Day1n.jpg
This is a 416 upper, with DBAL IR laser, EOTech, SOPMOD, SF adaptor, SF M300, etc, etc.
Would this be classified as Gucci?? No. It would be classified as a "work gun."
C4
jklaughrey
07-28-10, 09:13
They might, but which one, I have 2 daughters as well. Safety in numbers.;)
I'm saying this on a personal basis, and my view does not represent M4Carbine insofar as an "official" response:
Quite honestly it's ****ing retarded to judge someone else's selection of gear. Some guys say an Aimpoint T-1 is not needed, and others draw the line at a PEQ and NODS. Some guys think A2 sights are not needed and the A1's are good enough, etc.
Quit judging other people's gear, and use what works for you.
Tacticool, Gucci, etc are crutches for the weak. Discuss it like a ****ing grown man and articulate why something won't work for you. Or better yet, stay in your lane and talk strictly about your gear and why it DOES work for you.
That's my rant for this AM. :D
Makes me feel better about my jonesing for a green laser... don't need one anymore than I need a Ford GT500....... but I want one of those too :D
I agree with Shivan to a point. "Tacticool" in particular is starting to grate on me even more then "milspec" but not quite to the point of "flawless".
If you really must define "Gucci Gear" I think it's more about application than the product itself. An HK416 with an Aimpoint, magnifier, and laser is Gucci Gear to the majority of civilian owners because it sits in the safe and doesn't do much else. The same gun is far from Gucci Gear in the hands of some Delta guy crawling around a mountain somewhere and using it to peg smelly guys in man dresses.
Fitting your gun, and your gear, to your application means the term will never apply.
Fitting your gun, and your gear, to your application means the term will never apply.
Of course it will never apply to your own stuff, because people are narcissistic and believe their choices are perfect.
People attempt to apply these terms to other people's stuff, and honestly, they are in no position to judge what you or I, or anyone else, including a recreational AR shooter, has on their gun.
When asked the purpose of a white light on my AR, "I have it there because it makes me smile." What can anyone say to that?
That's stupid? That's tacticool? That's so Gucci? They can FOAD.
I don't care about his IR laser or the EoTech. I think the thing that makes his gun "Gucci Gear" is that camo paint job and the KAC BUIS.
Why can't he just use a black gun and YHM like the rest of us?
Except that's not really how these things typically go. More typical is the guy posts a vanity pic on the internut and either directly asks for opinions, states that this is now the uber-gun, or at the very least invites opinions simply by posting the pic. Then when queried it comes to light that he's never shot it, or has a few hundred rounds through it, has no idea how to use it, and only bought it because he saw it on COD4.
Or someone asks "why do you have a xyz123 on there" and the OP goes bananas saying "FOAD" when the question was asked in an attempt to learn something. I see people doing weird shit with their guns all the time and always ask why. More often than not they have no idea why and their head explodes, but sometimes they have a damn good reason and I learn something. I couldn't care less if someone gets upset because they have no idea why they did something, and I'll keep asking those questions because of the rare case when something valuable comes out of it.
There is a big difference IMHO between someone marching up to a shooter at a pubic range and saying "your AR is stupid" and posters offering opinions on a gun voluntarily posted on a discussion forum. The latter should understand that by posting the picture they've opened themselves up for commentary, and with that comes people making judgment calls. Once someone has asked for opinions, even passively, all best are off IMHO.
I have walked into Gucci/Versache/Bergdorff and looked at suits, tried them on, handled them. They are still just a suit in the long run though, and threads tear, shit shrinks, and life goes on.
Comparing a machine to something that is designed purely for aesthetics is not a comparison at all.
Getting off the subject, but these brands are not always " purely for aesthetics". Sure, they look nice, but many of these brands are also functional and well made. That's how they gained their present loyalty and brand recognition. You can use a LV bag and wear a good (Gucci) suit for many many years. Try that with a knock-off. There is a reason why it's expensive.
It's a difference between well made (and qa'ed) BCG and off brand one. Sure...BCG is a BCG. It'll work the same for a while, but is the BCG going to shoot loose after 3k rounds, because it's not properly staked ?
2 things being exactly the same and YOU not knowing the difference is a completely different issue.
Except that's not really how these things typically go. More typical is the guy posts a vanity pic on the internut and either directly asks for opinions, states that this is now the uber-gun, or at the very least invites opinions simply by posting the pic. Then when queried it comes to light that he's never shot it, or has a few hundred rounds through it, has no idea how to use it, and only bought it because he saw it on COD4.
Or someone asks "why do you have a xyz123 on there" and the OP goes bananas saying "FOAD" when the question was asked in an attempt to learn something. I see people doing weird shit with their guns all the time and always ask why. More often than not they have no idea why and their head explodes, but sometimes they have a damn good reason and I learn something. I couldn't care less if someone gets upset because they have no idea why they did something, and I'll keep asking those questions because of the rare case when something valuable comes out of it.
There is a big difference IMHO between someone marching up to a shooter at a pubic range and saying "your AR is stupid" and posters offering opinions on a gun voluntarily posted on a discussion forum. The latter should understand that by posting the picture they've opened themselves up for commentary, and with that comes people making judgment calls. Once someone has asked for opinions, even passively, all best are off IMHO.
So what? Talk about your gear and what works for you in an articulate and positive manner. People should stop using the vocabulary crutch buzzword of the month to look all cool and shit on the internet.
If XYZ accessory doesn't belong, and the guy's gun has it, and he wants an opinion: Tell him why the excess weight, or it's usage is probably not in line with the intended purpose of that accessory.
I dig the guys who shoot their A1 ironed like shit but want to call me and my Aimpoint, tacticool or Gucci. Yeah, got it.
There is a big difference IMHO between someone marching up to a shooter at a pubic range and saying "your AR is stupid."
I think this is important for folks to read. I recently posted a pic of something and someone basically said it looked bad. I have to wonder if I was standing in front of them (with item in hand) if they would have opened their pie hole??? Most likely not.
Before people make a comment on someones gear, appearance or whatever, they should REALLY consider if they would stand eye ball to eye ball and say it. If they wouldn't, then they should learn to keep their fingers off the keyboard.
C4
So what? Talk about your gear and what works for you in an articulate and positive manner. People should stop using the vocabulary crutch buzzword of the month to look all cool and shit on the internet.
I don't disagree. Simply pointing out that, whether the term is "crutch" or "buzz", the person it's applied to pretty generally earns it regardless, and complaining about it being applied when someone opens up the door themselves to begin with doesn't make any sense.
BTW, taking an "I'm so much better than the internet" is kind of the latest buzzword of the month. :p
If you show up to a party in a pink tutu and ask the group "what do you think?" you can't exactly complain when they all call you a fag. :haha:
(BTW, I think you're taking this all way more seriously than I am. I'm just having fun with a stupid topic. No reason to get bent out of shape about it either way, it's all in good fun on my end.)
Les Baer or Wilson maybe.
With the others mentioned you actually get what you pay for.:dance3:
I think this is important for folks to read. I recently posted a pic of something and someone basically said it looked bad. I have to wonder if I was standing in front of them (with item in hand) if they would have opened their pie hole??? Most likely not.
Before people make a comment on someones gear, appearance or whatever, they should REALLY consider if they would stand eye ball to eye ball and say it. If they wouldn't, then they should learn to keep their fingers off the keyboard.
C4
Yes but, the flipside was actually my argument which is that by posting on the internet you have to expect to open yourself up to that. I am reminded of that constantly when I encounter an issue here and am told that I made myself an internet personality and therefore deserve what I get.
If people don't want comment, criticism, complaint, derision, or ridicule then the way to avoid that is to avoid posting, and especially avoid posting pictures.
Yes but, the flipside was actually my argument which is that by posting on the internet you have to expect to open yourself up to that. I am reminded of that constantly when I encounter an issue here and am told that I made myself an internet personality and therefore deserve what I get.
If people don't want comment, criticism, complaint, derision, or ridicule then the way to avoid that is to avoid posting, and especially avoid posting pictures.
I think you are right, but want people to actually take a second and think if they would say what they are going to say to that person's face. Nine times out of 10, the answer would be no.
C4
There is no such thing as long as the gun fits the shooters role/reqs.
For instance, look at this pic:
http://www.gandrtactical.com/images/archive/Training_Pics/BW_CQB/Day1n.jpg
This is a 416 upper, with DBAL IR laser, EOTech, SOPMOD, SF adaptor, SF M300, etc, etc.
Would this be classified as Gucci?? No. It would be classified as a "work gun."
C4
The only thing "Gucci" in that pic is his "Baller Ass" hat.;)
I'm saying this on a personal basis, and my view does not represent M4Carbine insofar as an "official" response:
Quite honestly it's ****ing retarded to judge someone else's selection of gear. Some guys say an Aimpoint T-1 is not needed, and others draw the line at a PEQ and NODS. Some guys think A2 sights are not needed and the A1's are good enough, etc.
Quit judging other people's gear, and use what works for you.
Tacticool, Gucci, etc are crutches for the weak. Discuss it like a ****ing grown man and articulate why something won't work for you. Or better yet, stay in your lane and talk strictly about your gear and why it DOES work for you.
That's my rant for this AM. :D
I ****in love this post! :thank_you2:
Run what works for you and stop looking at other peoples kit... Sometimes sadly it takes trial and error to find what works for YOU!
The only thing "Gucci" in that pic is his "Baller Ass" hat.;)
It is, but for the mission at hand, the LAV class, the hat was a mission requirement that served a few purposes. Wearing that particular hat would be like running a decked out gun vs plain Jane gun.
I think the notion of "gucci gun" hasn't made it anywhere here for good reason and has gone by the wayside elsewhere also for good reason.
jklaughrey
07-28-10, 11:18
I think you are right, but want people to actually take a second and think if they would say what they are going to say to that person's face. Nine times out of 10, the answer would be no.
C4
I always say what I mean or think to my wife...probably explains the slap to the face or "headache" excuse at night.
Cheers!
This setup is pretty cool....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bI0AzYwIILQ
If you really must define "Gucci Gear" I think it's more about application than the product itself.
This is what I was trying to convey.
If people don't want comment, criticism, complaint, derision, or ridicule then the way to avoid that is to avoid posting, and especially avoid posting pictures.
Or have a website that demands posters of the site be articulate in their critiques, rather than juvenile.
You know, one where we strive to be something other than the mainstream gun sites that foster such phrases as tacticool and gucci....
Nah, by all means, if someone asks for opinions of their civilian gun and it's wearing a PVS-14 we should call it Gucci.
Dos Cylindros
07-28-10, 12:41
When I get home, I am going to take my daughters bedazzler and deck out mine. Who cares........run what you want.
When I get home, I am going to take my daughters bedazzler and deck out mine. Who cares........run what you want.
Gay. :jester:
...Nah, by all means, if someone asks for opinions of their civilian gun and it's wearing a PVS-14 we should call it Gucci.
Now you remind me of the gun grabbers, Pelosi... Your comment assumes that no civilian would have a legitimate need for a PVS-14. If I were a rancher or homeowner along our southern border I may want one. I am certain there are many cases where civilians may have legitimate needs for one and besides that this is America and if I can afford it I should not have to legitimize my need. I am also certain you did not mean it that way, but that is just how it struck me when I read it.
To me Gucci meant a gun and or equipment that looked better than it performed. Equipment that looked great, as long as you did not take it to the range, because it would fall apart or fail to function as intended. Something that tries to fill a void that doesn't exist, but looks good doing it.
Dos Cylindros
07-28-10, 12:43
Gay. :jester:
Perhaps, but it will be the heat at all the parties.
I have no problem with someone having a Prada or LV bag or Gucci suit. If they have the money and can afford it, more power to them. And those bags and suits probably last a lot longer than the cheapo ones.
The problem is those who buy the knock-off LV or Prada bags that are imposters. They do so to look cool, but don't have the real deal and they know it but hope no one else knows it.
While I may quietly, to myself, wonder about some gear I see on a gun. I am in no position to say anything. I am a mere peon learning as I go. There may be lots of valid reasons for what he has on his gun.
The biggest "Gucci" guns are those with knock-off gear on them meant to look good. IF the guy says, I have the primaryarms red dot because that is all I can afford, though I know it is not the best item, I can respect that. The guy who has the primaryarms red dot and says it is as good as the T-1 is the guy I have to wonder about.
I am also certain you did not mean it that way, but that is just how it struck me when I read it.
You should have stuck with your gut. My contention is that it's WAY outside my lane to be judging anyone's gear, requested or not. I further illustrated it with some sarcasm...
SHIVAN-
:dance3:
...All these new smileys and no 'applause' guy?
I'm sick of shit like....
"You run your ______ like that?!...That's like a good __" off where dogma states it should be...You ass clown wannabe. :haha: "
:rolleyes:
IF the guy says, I have the primaryarms red dot because that is all I can afford, though I know it is not the best item, I can respect that. The guy who has the primaryarms red dot and says it is as good as the T-1 is the guy I have to wonder about.
This is exactly correct.
RogerinTPA
07-28-10, 13:30
I'm saying this on a personal basis, and my view does not represent M4Carbine insofar as an "official" response:
Quite honestly it's ****ing retarded to judge someone else's selection of gear. Some guys say an Aimpoint T-1 is not needed, and others draw the line at a PEQ and NODS. Some guys think A2 sights are not needed and the A1's are good enough, etc.
Quit judging other people's gear, and use what works for you.
Tacticool, Gucci, etc are crutches for the weak. Discuss it like a ****ing grown man and articulate why something won't work for you. Or better yet, stay in your lane and talk strictly about your gear and why it DOES work for you.
That's my rant for this AM. :D
Well said.
RogerinTPA
07-28-10, 13:35
Of course it will never apply to your own stuff, because people are narcissistic and believe their choices are perfect.
People attempt to apply these terms to other people's stuff, and honestly, they are in no position to judge what you or I, or anyone else, including a recreational AR shooter, has on their gun.
When asked the purpose of a white light on my AR, "I have it there because it makes me smile." What can anyone say to that?
That's stupid? That's tacticool? That's so Gucci? They can FOAD.
I don't care about his IR laser or the EoTech. I think the thing that makes his gun "Gucci Gear" is that camo paint job and the KAC BUIS.
Why can't he just use a black gun and YHM like the rest of us?
snob!:p
All ARs need Krylon..... "cammo" is the new "black".;)
"I have it there because it makes me smile." :haha:
I'm stealing this one!
That's my rant for this AM. :D
Good rant. :)
A Gucci Gun stops being a Gucci Gun when the guy behind it makes faster hits at longer range than the guy next to him with a cheap POS gun having its version of hacking up a hairball.
Don't get me wrong, there's still some of the syndrome of buying top end stuff and running out of budget (like buying a Gucci purse and having nothing to put in it) where hardware is emphasized to the exclusion of the software component of the equation. I'm guilty of this, but I'll own up to the fact that I'll get handily outshoot by a great shot and a plain old A2.
Gucci gear=a gun that has one more accessory than yours. Just kidding, really.
George Carlin had an observation about driving that applies to many other things.
Anyone who drives slower than you is an idiot.
Anyone who drives faster is a maniac.
How about if the gear or gun enables the shooter to engage targets faster/more accurately/more effectively without having a negative effect on the reliability with which they can do so is not gucci gear?
Moose-Knuckle
07-28-10, 17:43
I remember 'Gucci' being used as a condescending description for things that were form over function. They were trendy or styled more than functional.
Edited for clarity:
The term Gucci {anything} has been replaced with the adjective 'Tacticool'. Same concept of of form over function.
This, it's always been a condescending remark of gear used by guy's who have more money than time down range. Not to be confused with Mall Ninjas and Tacticool. Basically a scoff at posers and wannabe's.
.
At one time there was a “weirdo” that jury-rigged a collapsible stock, another one that came up with a sling instead of a “carry strap”, and some guy had the first folding rear sight. I’m sure someone called them the equivalent of “Gucci” or “gimmicky” or whatever at the time they showed up with those ideas but look where that technology brought us.
A current example of this short-sightedness is a recent post on this site Titled - “Battery indication device… (https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=57618)” From some of the responses to that device, you can see the judgmental all-knowing “chest beaters” claiming the device is silly, useless, no need, waste of money, etc. it is easy to see the mentality we're talking about.
So, if years ago, we had left the decision making up to “these” guys, we would all be shooting 1-12 twist 20” barrels with 20-round mags with carry straps (instead of slings), fixed stocks, etc.
But back to the OP’s question. Like a couple of other posters, I think something is “Gucci” when the gun or accessory is there to give an “impression”. Meaning either the gun or the accessory is a piece of kaakaa or the owner does not know how to use it.
If Caggalikki made a purse that was twice as good as a Gucci, cost the same and was sold at the same store but it had no identifying characteristics (label or tag), Caggalikki would be out of business in a short-short because it doesn’t give an “impression”.
That's how some of these kaakaa AR makers and junk accessory makers stay in business, they give the impression of being the real deal and some people just want to buy something that gives an "impression" or image.
Oh well....
.
PhillyAR15
07-28-10, 19:22
The only thing "Gucci" in that pic is his "Baller Ass" hat.;)
Nice glove.
What brand is it ?
How much ?
Where can I get one ?
Nice glove.
What brand is it ?
How much ?
Where can I get one ?
Is this a real question or are you just adding comedy to the discussion?
PhillyAR15
07-28-10, 22:23
Is this a real question or are you just adding comedy to the discussion?
It's a real question. I am looking to get a new gloves.
motorwerks
07-29-10, 00:36
this whole thread is funny to me..... we kind of use "Gucci" around here not to mean anything derogatory but to just encompass higher end stuff. Example....
That guy over there has a (Fill in your favorite HIGH END AR builder here) Rifle.
or...
That guys rifle is Gucci.
Hell I heard it at the fun store the other day the owner was talking about a customers gun (customer was standing right there). He said "You buy all Gucci shit for your guns" didn't mean anything bad, just a slang, really.
It's a real question. I am looking to get a new gloves.
At a glance they look to be simple Oakley gloves... Vickers gloves would be similar or simple mechnix (sp) gloves are more than adequate for recreational shooting etc....
Unless you are running your rifle really fast and hot I have never "had" to have them... Shooting AK's you might need them a little sooner...
I think the Gucci label as a derogative got started with some owners of Harley Davidsons. a lot of suburban professionals (posers) got into the Harley kick and proceeded to deck out their bikes with the most outrageous gaudy crap which no real rider would be caught dead with, simply because in their lack of experience, they thought this was what a "biker" would have.
I think the operative word here is that they were bought and never used except to "profile" with or to ride to and from some tavern where they stood in the parking lot talking about how awesome their bikes were and what great things they planned to do with them...
once the stock market and real estate prices declined, the market was flooded with tons of pristine, ridiculous looking bikes sporting every accessory in the HD catalog with really, really low miles on them. :rolleyes:
savvy riders then snapped these $30K bikes for pennies on the dollar and proceeded to strip the crap off them to make them real. (honestly, who really needs a "Bike Buoy" drink holder on the handlebar of his bike?...)
in the same way, I'd love to be the beneficiary of some cash strapped poser who had to part with his Gucci gun for pennies on the dollar... :D
arizonaranchman
07-29-10, 12:04
I've always subscribed to the KISS philosphy with guns. My AR's all still wear carry handles and A2 iron sights, tho one of them may run with a T1 in the near future once I get the $$$ scraped together.
A SureFire lite and a sling is the only thing I've added to my BCM. No rails, no veritcle grips, etc. Only what's absolutely necessary because I like it simple and lightweight and not encumbered with alot of gadgets.
Whatever is essential for the user and his needs/mission is the key here. Just adding a bunch of BS on it to make it look cool is where Gucci starts to apply to me.
dirt_diver
07-29-10, 13:36
I know this site is home to a lot of honest to goodness, high speed low drag operators whose lives depend on their weapon and their proficiency with said weapon. But there are also a fair number of us regular joes who aren't in that ballpark, but still like to shoot and like to dress up our blasters with the "real" equipment. It's a hobby and we do it for fun, and I don't see anything wrong with that.
If that makes me a poser, then so be it.
I know this site is home to a lot of honest to goodness, high speed low drag operators whose lives depend on their weapon and their proficiency with said weapon. But there are also a fair number of us regular joes who aren't in that ballpark, but still like to shoot and like to dress up our blasters with the "real" equipment. It's a hobby and we do it for fun, and I don't see anything wrong with that.
If that makes me a poser, then so be it.
:) That is a refreshing reply after reading tons of replys every day taking this stuff wayyyyy to serious and those that are being way to critical and serious are usually the cats who do the posing.
Enough of this silly thread. This sort of thing belongs on some other site. Not a gun site, maybe an airsoft site, or something.
Use whatever you like, know why you have it even if that reason is " because I want it", and march on.
Using gucci, tacticool, and other derogatory terms to describe other people's gear is for the weak minded and vocabulary deficient.
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