Fail Zero with extractor upgrade

[notofnow]

12345

[EW1066]

I think you might want to look at the "stove piping jam" thread before you "upgrade" to the o-ring. According to what is being said in that thread, the o-ring is a fix not an upgrade. In light of that I would try the fail zero as is and see if it functions as advertised. If so, there is nothing to fix. Leave the o-ring in the parts box until you need to fix a problem with the extractor.


Vince

[BufordTJustice]

I just bought a Spike's Fail Zero Coated FA BCG and also had a BCM extractor upgrade kit.

The BCM spring and black insert were substantially stronger than the spring, brown o-ring, and black insert that came with the BCG.

I installed the BCM spring and insert and omitted the o-ring.

The BCM spring, coupled with the o-ring, is too strong for my BCM 16" middy upper and would induce malfunctions. Even if you run a carbine setup, I would only run all three after extensive testing.

The thread that EW recommends is good reading.

[Boss Hogg]

If it runs (and all 3 of my Fail Zero bolts do), I'd leave well enough alone. When I used a Wolff extractor spring and o-ring on a BCM bolt, the case did not eject- there was too much tension. So the first round fires, then the spent case is parallel to the bolt face and ruins your next shot. You have to manually extract the spent case from the bolt face.

IIRC Crane developed the o-ring for 10.3" Navy guns. I'm not sure that upgrade is necessary on many ARs, particularly midlengths.

[Complication]

Skimming through the "Questions about FailZero" thread (http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=35550) in the FailZero forums under Manufacturers, it's fairly clear that Scrambler (the FZ rep) recommends FZ-coated parts to interact with FZ-coated parts but that, for the hammer at least, you can mix in non-coated parts as long as you make sure they're lubed-up sufficiently.

I doubt there would be any problem using an "upgrade" extractor but, as EW1066 said, if it's not causing malfunctions, I'd suggest leaving it alone. Scrambler's pretty good about answering questions people throw at him in the thread I linked to, so it can't hurt to head over there and ask for sure if you can do it and/or what the drawbacks might be.

Edit: I'm running a FZ-coated Noveske BCG with a FZ-coated Geissele SSA trigger--my extractor is coated.

[JSantoro]

Like EW said, try shooting what you normally shoot, first. If you don't exhibit any extraction problems, then there's no need to fret over an upgrade for a condition that doesn't exist.

[notofnow]

The upgrade kit i have doesn't replace the extractor itself, it's just the black insert, heavier spring and the o-ring. I'll take everyone's advice and run it the way it is first and swap out the spring if i have extraction problems.

Tks

[Complication]

The upgrade kit i have doesn't replace the extractor itself, it's just the black insert, heavier spring and the o-ring. I'll take everyone's advice and run it the way it is first and swap out the spring if i have extraction problems.

Tks

Oh, then you shouldn't have any trouble swapping it out if you feel the need to. Naturally, the insert and and o-rings don't get coated ;) and an un-coated spring (I don't think the spring in the kits is coated...) isn't going to muck anything up.

So leave it be unless you have extraction problems, but if you do and you want to toss the upgrade kit in, you should have no worries.

[mach1337]

Hey guys I didnt want to start another thread just yet but Im having trouble finding things out about them. but I am about to build my first AR and have been lookin at a fail zero extreme duty kit. I want my AR to be rock solid and these sound pretty good but I havent seen any reviews or anything for them. Are they worth it? i have a budget (altho its pretty big for a ar) just wanted to know what you all that have them think.

this is the one http://www.failzero.com/productaquisition.html?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage-ask.tpl&product_id=2&category_id=1

[Safetyhit]

I just bought a Spike's Fail Zero Coated FA BCG and also had a BCM extractor upgrade kit.

The BCM spring and black insert were substantially stronger than the spring, brown o-ring, and black insert that came with the BCG.

I installed the BCM spring and insert and omitted the o-ring.

The BCM spring, coupled with the o-ring, is too strong for my BCM 16" middy upper and would induce malfunctions. Even if you run a carbine setup, I would only run all three after extensive testing.


This post help me decide a course of action, thank-you.

[mach1337]

Sweet thanks. Im trying to find out if they truely do run without lube as well as they say they do. on there website it said that they put 50k rounds thru AR-15's lube free. if thats thru that is nothing short of amazing.

[BufordTJustice]

This post help me decide a course of action, thank-you.

Np. Glad I could help. I try to share what little knowledge I have. :)

[mach1337]

does anyone on here have a complete failzero upper? or does everyone tend to stick to the BCG?