Wolf ammo

[GADAWG]

What's the best type of Wolf to shoot through your AR? Thanks guys!

[hawxter996]

What's the best type of Wolf to shoot through your AR? Thanks guys!


I hear the polymer is what to go with

[bullitt5172]

Yup, the newer polymer coated Wolf is good to go. I have shot over 1000rds in the last couple of months without a single issue.

[nationwide]

I hear the polymer is what to go with


Polymer GOOD, laquer BAD.

But it's gotten so expensive, I've just gave in to buying brassed cased ammo. At least I'm building a pile of once fired brass to load.

[Army Chief]

I realize the whole question of finding affordable quality ammunition has become more relevant of late, but every time I hear the Wolf thing brought up (and it seems to come up often), I get this mental image of pumping regular unleaded fuel into a ZO6 Corvette or something.

I don't know if Wolf is actually that bad these days, but I personally would still be looking for an alternative loading. Has Wolf's quality really come up to the point where it is deserving of a second look?

Chief

[DRich]

In the past month, I've run 2200rds of Wolf through my Sabre Defence M4 with no failures. That's 1000rds of 5yr old lacquer coated 55gr at the range and 1200rds of new polymer coated 55gr at a 3-day class. Other than the awful stench, I have no complaints.

In the past, I've had guns that occasionally choked on Wolf (mainly FTE failures on a hot gun), but this rifle eats it up like candy. Hot or cold, it's golden. The Wolf is not loaded nearly as hot as most domestic loads, but it's reliable for me and accurate enough for range/class work. Plus, I like the fact that I can police my "brass" with a big ass magnet. :D

I have a good stockpile of XM193 and Q3131A stacked up in the basement along with a fair amount of other quality domestic loads, but I'll keep running Wolf for my plinking/training ammo. I'll save the good stuff for a rainy day.

[Resq47]

I've got a pile of Radway that runs fine for me, but where able I shoot Wolf 55/62gr without issue. It smells bad, but shoots well enough to be my go-to match/training ammo at a bit more than half the cost of more conventional options.

[nationwide]

I realize the whole question of finding affordable quality ammunition has become more relevant of late, but every time I hear the Wolf thing brought up (and it seems to come up often), I get this mental image of pumping regular unleaded fuel into a ZO6 Corvette or something.

I don't know if Wolf is actually that bad these days, but I personally would still be looking for an alternative loading. Has Wolf's quality really come up to the point where it is deserving of a second look?

Chief

The new polymer coating is incomperable to the former laquer coating.

I have friends with M16's, and it's all they'll put through their RR guns.

It functions 100% in my AR's, 20", 16" and 11.5" SBR no problem!

[GHILLIE]

I have shot about 1200 rounds of the polymer coated stuff with no issues whatsoever. I have about 2800 rounds of it left to shoot. I'll let you know how it goes. :)




GHILLIE

[mmike87]

I shot primarily Wolf during my carbine class a couple months ago. No problems other than it smells bad when fired. It was more than accurate enough for the ranges involed in the class and I had 100% reliability with it.

If the money I save with Wolf means I can shoot more or take an extra class this year, then I think it's well worth it.

[UVvis]

I've had the best luck with the 62 grain new stuff. Seemed to shoot more precisely in my guns than 55 grain and seemed to function better. Of course my sample size is one case of 55gr and about seven or eight of 62...

But that might just be me.

[RogerinTPA]

I have a Talon Arms/SDI 1/7 Mid-length upper on a colt lower. I have ran 3k+ of both types in both 55 and 62grain, without ANY malfunctions or lacquer build ups. I also have a stash of Q3131A in case another Katrina, but several thousand rounds of wolf for training and plinking. With the price of ammo these days, Wolf is the way to go. 6 months to a year ago, who'd a thunk it!:rolleyes:

[MH64]

How do you distinguish the lacquar coated v the polymer coated? Are the boxes marked?

[DRich]

How do you distinguish the lacquar coated v the polymer coated? Are the boxes marked?

Lacquer coated cases are dark green. The polymer coated cases are grey.

[Razoreye]

I realize the whole question of finding affordable quality ammunition has become more relevant of late, but every time I hear the Wolf thing brought up (and it seems to come up often), I get this mental image of pumping regular unleaded fuel into a ZO6 Corvette or something.

I don't know if Wolf is actually that bad these days, but I personally would still be looking for an alternative loading. Has Wolf's quality really come up to the point where it is deserving of a second look?

Chief
I think the question you need to ask is: has Wolf ever been that bad?

You might not use it for duty due to it being dirty, lower velocity, steel cased, whatever. But it is good for what it is: practice ammo.

There seems to be more problems with the old laquer cases but they were around a lot longer and the steel has more to do with the problem than the coating (if at all.)

Given that many machine gun users use it on expensive weapons to feed their weapons for cheap, I'll continue to use it.

There is no doubt that better options exist but Wolf has an unfair reputation. That's quite alright with me as that means more ammo for me. I didn't have an issue with the last 600 rounds I just blasted off. In that case, I did have a sideways primer installed but 1/1000 ain't bad. Now if it blew up do to overcharge/weak case/setback then I might have a problem.

[C4IGrant]

Have always heard that the polymer Wolf ammo can seperate if your chamber is hot enough. Anyone have this happen? Or worse yet, have the polymer melt in your chamber?

For those that shoot this stuff, do you run your guns hot for long periods of time like you would in a carbine class??


C4

[Razoreye]

Have always heard that the polymer Wolf ammo can seperate if your chamber is hot enough. Anyone have this happen? Or worse yet, have the polymer melt in your chamber?

For those that shoot this stuff, do you run your guns hot for long periods of time like you would in a carbine class??


C4
I've heard people have taken a propane torch to both the old and new wolf with no meltage. I'm curious to try this as well, anecdotal at best.

I'll defer to someone else other than to say I shot 600 rounds the other day, 6 of those mags were pretty much dumps. No problems. Others were using Beta mags. I'd say you have a better chance of melting your gas tube than you would of the polymer.

Again, I'll defer as I'm a noob. :p

PS - I have had exactly one round stick. I can't remember if it was Wolf followed by Wolf or Wolf followed by Brass. Regardless, it wasn't the coating. It was a few cases ago, I think it was the old laquer type too. I posted it quite a while ago.

[DRich]

Have always heard that the polymer Wolf ammo can seperate if your chamber is hot enough. Anyone have this happen? Or worse yet, have the polymer melt in your chamber?

For those that shoot this stuff, do you run your guns hot for long periods of time like you would in a carbine class??
C4

I ran through 1200rds of polymer coated Wolf through my SDI M4 during a 3-day class last month. I had rounds sit in a hot chamber for a long time with no hints of separation or melting. Since then, I finished off that case and have gone through another 300rds with no problems related to the coating. I've had two hard primers in this last batch, though.

[deadwood83]

From ym experience the polymer is G2G. My qualms with it involve the nasty red sealant, the terrible ammonia smell when you fire it, and when I pulled out some of the polymer coated and it had light rust spots on the cases. When I e-mailed Wolf (I know, I should have called) about it I received no reply. Oh well, nothing is perfect. I only had one broken case ruim in everything i've shot through it though which is a bonus

[m4fun]

This is one of those "I read about a guy who knew someone who said he knew a guy that had issues with it..."

There was always that concern about the laguer gumming up the chamber and causing failures to extract. I could do that like clock work with any ammo in my 11" after 3-5 mag dumps(I am pretty sure it was the chamber on that one)

I used it exlusively at the last carbing class I attended(I think 90% of the folks used it) and have been blasting away with it FA with lots of assorted toys. No problems other than the once in a blue moon primer popping out and getting into the action(which I've had happen with SA, Guatamalin, Olympic, etc.)

I other words, it works just like everything else. Different smell(like comparing Winchester to S&B) and different fouling(including red primer sealant debris instead of Guat's green) but thats it.

I try to use 62gr exclusively but some 55gr sneak in every now and then.

As with most Internet advice, YMMV.

[carshooter]

I worked in a high volume indoor shooting range for six years. The range had a policy prohibiting steel cased, core, or jacketed ammunition. In spite of that, wolf ammunition was common on the range. Almost weekly, someone had either a Mini 14 or AR with a round or case stuck in the chamber.

Initially, I felt it was lacquer gumming up the chamber. I came to realize that it was soot, carbon and a filthy chamber issue. I also came to realize that most of the shooters suffering issues from it didn't own or know what a chamber brush was. Of the malfunctions I cleared and observed, the debris in the chamber caused the lacquered steel case to stick.

FWIW, I never saw a malfunction with the polymer.

[UVvis]

My problems have been maybe one stuck empty case for every 2000 rounds, cleared with a cleaning rod. Which has been maybe 6-7 overall for me.

Other issues are that you really have to clean your chamber, and the primer sealant gunks up the firing pin channel in the bolt.

[Razoreye]

I worked in a high volume indoor shooting range for six years. The range had a policy prohibiting steel cased, core, or jacketed ammunition. In spite of that, wolf ammunition was common on the range. Almost weekly, someone had either a Mini 14 or AR with a round or case stuck in the chamber.

Initially, I felt it was lacquer gumming up the chamber. I came to realize that it was soot, carbon and a filthy chamber issue. I also came to realize that most of the shooters suffering issues from it didn't own or know what a chamber brush was. Of the malfunctions I cleared and observed, the debris in the chamber caused the lacquered steel case to stick.

FWIW, I never saw a malfunction with the polymer.I agree on carbon being the culprit there. Do you suppose the lacquer has a rougher surface to collect on? Maybe it just expanded more than the newer polymer coated cases? I suspect the coating or the case was changed to help prevent that but meltage wasn't an issue. YMMV.

[mmike87]

Have always heard that the polymer Wolf ammo can seperate if your chamber is hot enough. Anyone have this happen? Or worse yet, have the polymer melt in your chamber?

For those that shoot this stuff, do you run your guns hot for long periods of time like you would in a carbine class??


C4

I ran mostly wolf in the carbine class I took a couple months ago. Many times the rifle got what I would call "pretty damn hot" for lack of a better term. I experienced no problems whatsoever.

[Grin Reaper]

I've heard more than a few times that Wolf ammo isn't accurate. I don't think that statement is 100% true, but I will agree that Wolf isn't as consistant (velocity-wise) as other ammunition -- a friend confirmed this with his chrono.

That having been said, I did manage to wring out a 4" group at 200 yards with an unscoped Bushmaster today (2moa, prone, no support, iron sights -- not bad for a balding guy with glasses).

[carshooter]

I agree on carbon being the culprit there. Do you suppose the lacquer has a rougher surface to collect on? Maybe it just expanded more than the newer polymer coated cases? I suspect the coating or the case was changed to help prevent that but meltage wasn't an issue. YMMV.

Based on my observations, that is exactly what I think.

[dialM4murder]

but every time I hear the Wolf thing brought up (and it seems to come up often), I get this mental image of pumping regular unleaded fuel into a ZO6 Corvette or something.
Chief

Actually the knock sensors would take care of it if you did. You just wouldn't get maximum performance. Which yes, I know is the point of owning a z06 in the 1st place.

[RogerinTPA]

I just fired 12 rounds of wolf ammo into an 1&1/2" hole at 50yards this weekend using a SDI Mid-length barrel and a EOTech sight(Now hanging on my refrigerator:p )Not say that 50 yards is all that, but shooting accurately must be practiced and practiced often. If you do your part and have a decent rifle, you will get accuracy. 800 rounds of wolf so far and if I do my part, I'll get accurate hits. Wolf is "good to go" in my book.:cool:

[AR15barrels]

I just fired 12 rounds of wolf ammo into an 1&1/2" hole at 50yards this weekend

That's roughly 3 MOA accuracy.
Completely acceptable if you are shooting smelly bearded guys across the street.

[Grin Reaper]

Completely acceptable if you are shooting smelly bearded guys across the street.
Good one!

[benthughes]

I bought 500 rounds of Wolf Polymer coated 223 Rem at a gun show last weekend. Took it to the range to sight in my LWRC. First 60 rounds was PMC 55 Gr. which went without a hitch. The first round of Wolf expanded and lodged in the chamber holding the entire bolt/carrier in the forward position. Fixed that. Next day I went to the range, new box of Wolf and a clean/lube later. 1 round and the case was caught in the chamber. I'm currently selling the rest of my Wolf ammo.

[sjc3081]

I bought 500 rounds of Wolf Polymer coated 223 Rem at a gun show last weekend. Took it to the range to sight in my LWRC. First 60 rounds was PMC 55 Gr. which went without a hitch. The first round of Wolf expanded and lodged in the chamber holding the entire bolt/carrier in the forward position. Fixed that. Next day I went to the range, new box of Wolf and a clean/lube later. 1 round and the case was caught in the chamber. I'm currently selling the rest of my Wolf ammo.

.....

[Iraqgunz]

I believe he said it was an LWRC. Does that mean that they couldn't have made a mistake? No. I would contact LWRC first and see what they say before I got rid of the ammo.


I suspect you have a 223 chamber and not a 5.56 chamber. What brand upper are you using, Bushmaster? Get that chamber reamed and shoot cheap Wolf with no worries.
I was at the range last weak and another shooter was firing his brand new Bushy with Wolf poly. After 80 rounds cases stuck in chamber with rim ripped off by extractor. Bushy 223 chamber strikes again.

[benthughes]

Yeah.... shooting that stupid LWRC ;) . I'll give them a ring. I'd rather not send it back if I'm not having issues with any other ammo. I'll have to take a couple boxes out and shoot them through my DI guns. On both rounds the primer was protruding and the rim of the case ripped off. Bullets came from different boxes. It's great that it works well for everyone else, I'm not shooting any more after this batch is gone. Unfortunately ammo is next to unavailable up here.

[CarlosDJackal]

I just wanted to add this THREAD. (https://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=30097)

I am thinking that the bolt impulse on piston guns may be too quick and violent for the Wolf ammo. Either that or the chambers have little or no leeway. FWIW, I have shot 5.56 rounds through my LWRC upper without a single issue (although just a box's worth). Granted, it was not during a 1,200 -round class.

[Thomas M-4]

Does anybody know if the 62grain polymer produces more pressure than 55grain polymer or is it the other way around. My rifle shoots PMC bronze fine but it does seem to cycle slower I wouldn't want it to get it much slower than that.

[hotwheelsjr]

Not to go OT, but along the same lines -- how is Silver Bear zinc plated ammo? Seems Wolf and Brown/Silver Bear are the cheapest in town when it comes to bulk ammo. I haven't shot any Silver Bear, yet, but would like to buy some the next time I see it available. Anyone have any experience with it? I've been told the zinc kinda acts like a lubricant for the chamber, but I'd like to know from somebody with first hand experience.

Forgive me if the OP doesn't want this here -- I'll start a new thread if I have to.;)

[RogerinTPA]

Not to go OT, but along the same lines -- how is Silver Bear zinc plated ammo? Seems Wolf and Brown/Silver Bear are the cheapest in town when it comes to bulk ammo. I haven't shot any Silver Bear, yet, but would like to buy some the next time I see it available. Anyone have any experience with it? I've been told the zinc kinda acts like a lubricant for the chamber, but I'd like to know from somebody with first hand experience.

Forgive me if the OP doesn't want this here -- I'll start a new thread if I have to.;)

I've fired 2K of the 62 gr HP silver bear in the past. No issues for me. It appears to shoot tighter groups and a bit cleaner than Wolf, when doing a side by side comparison using two different carbines.

[sundance435]

It looks like I may have to put away my past disdain for wolf ammo and try some of the newer polymer stuff.

My experiences with Wolf's lacquered stuff was terrible, i.e. blow primers, FTF, FTE, etc. Not to mention it was filthy.

[CarlosDJackal]

Not to go OT, but along the same lines -- how is Silver Bear zinc plated ammo? Seems Wolf and Brown/Silver Bear are the cheapest in town when it comes to bulk ammo. I haven't shot any Silver Bear, yet, but would like to buy some the next time I see it available. Anyone have any experience with it? I've been told the zinc kinda acts like a lubricant for the chamber, but I'd like to know from somebody with first hand experience.

Forgive me if the OP doesn't want this here -- I'll start a new thread if I have to.;)

If I had a choice, I'd go with Silver Bear zinc over either of the Wolf. At least it does not leave any residue when left in a hot chamber.