Are Mid Lengths Becoming the New Standard? [Archive]

ghostman1960

09-12-10, 17:23

Or are they just popular among us internet enthusiasts? I don't see myself ever buying another carbine length gas system as I find the mid length system to be superior.

The one thing is though is that I never see mid length rifles in the gun shops that I frequent. I asked one guy why he does not stock them and he said no one has ever heard of them and the military does not use them so the public wont buy them.

I bet that would change over night if Colt came out with a mid length.

Robb Jensen

09-12-10, 17:30

Dobie

09-12-10, 18:46

No they arent, question is should they be?
Until the military adopts them they will be the best kept secret.:secret:
I find your avitar disturbing what did the dog do :laugh:

Col_Crocs

09-12-10, 18:51

Ideally but not anytime soon, I think.

jbsmwd

09-12-10, 18:53

I find your avitar disturbing what did the dog do :laugh:

LOL I have been wondering about that too.

BufordTJustice

09-12-10, 18:56

Most gun shop owners & personnel don't know much technically about ARs.
Mid-lengths are used by those who take the time to educate themselves with what works best for 14.5"-16" ARs and want a better gun. IMHO CAR gas should only ever be used on 10.3"-12.5" ARs.

+1

Midlength AR's are "the new black".

In 6 years (if not sooner), most AR's sold will be midlength gas models....just my humble prediction.

VIP3R 237

09-12-10, 19:02

LOL I have been wondering about that too.

Yeah same here, it looks just like my Aussie...

SeaSoldier

09-12-10, 19:08

I wish I new all this before buying a Colt SOCOM 14.5" upper. I guess I'll just have to buy a new middy upper for the next one.

arizonaranchman

09-12-10, 19:21

For me personally yes they're all I go with now. I've got two BCM middies and one 16" BM dissipator with A2 carry handle. I have no plans to change much now except if BCM does come out with a dissipator version then I will swap uppers on the BM and go with the BCM middy gas rather than the carbine gas on the BM dissy.

Failure2Stop

09-12-10, 20:16

Are Mid Lengths Becoming the New Standard?

The world would be a better place if they were.

RogerinTPA

09-12-10, 20:30

I don't know about "new standard" but they are preferred over the carbine length, at least here, for a variety of positive reasons (softer recoil impulse, slower bolt/bcg velocity, less pressure and less overall wear & tear, etc...). I have no problems with either since I own two of each, but I prefer to shoot my middies first. Add a BattleComp 1.0, and the middies becomes a dream to shoot.

HeavyDuty

09-12-10, 20:31

I find your avitar disturbing what did the dog do :laugh:

I feel old. Doesn't anyone remember National Lampoon magazine?

mmike87

09-12-10, 20:39

All four of my AR's are middies. I just do not see a real reason to NOT own a middy. Originally, there were less accessory options for mid-lengths, however that is certainly not the case anymore.

RetreatHell

09-12-10, 20:41

The world would be a better place if they were.

Hell yes it would! Think how awesome it would be if there was a random press release one day from the Army and Marine Corps, announcing they're switching all of their M4 carbine uppers over to BCM 14.5" AND 16" mid-length uppers (depending on MOS and mission, the 16" may be better for some I'm assuming): more reliable, softer shooting, longer lifespan between repairs and new parts, longer rail-estate... Colt who??

JR TACTICAL

09-12-10, 21:08

I dont think that the midlength will become the new standard unless the military adopts a 16 inch gun, the carbine length gas system was designed for the 14.5 inch barrel and work great in that length and under, Midlengths are far superior than a carbine in a 16 inch but I dont see it happening our troops go with the 16 inch

Just my opinion

ST911

09-12-10, 21:19

Mid-lengths (9") have some advantages. Not so many that they'll be rendering 7" guns obsolete anytime soon, nor will they even be displacing them in any great number for some time. The value of what they offer can be real, but it's very subjective.

ralph

09-12-10, 21:19

I feel old. Doesn't anyone remember National Lampoon magazine?

Yes, I do..

Pi3

09-12-10, 21:40

Yes, I do..

i remember it vivdly, but i am also old. so...

Heavy Metal

09-12-10, 22:50

I feel old. Doesn't anyone remember National Lampoon magazine?

I'm happy to report the Dog died of natural causes.

PS, I got the complete National Lampoon on CD for like $15.50 on a Amazon Gold Box special Saturday.

P.J. O'Rorke kills me!:D

A-Bear680

09-13-10, 05:12

I think that the middies are well on thier way to becoming the new standard -- at least for civilian owners who have a clue about the advantages of the 9 inch system over the old 7 inch setup.
I have never owned a 7 inch. The early versions had a bad rep for poor reliabilty and the first Colt shortie that I ever fired launched the muzzle device downrange half way through the first magazine.

Seraph

09-13-10, 06:08

I'm happy to report the Dog died of natural causes.

PS, I got the complete National Lampoon on CD for like $15.50 on a Amazon Gold Box special Saturday.

P.J. O'Rorke kills me!:D

P.J. O'Rourke rocks! When I was 12, I used to relish disappointing the nerd at a local book store, by regularly showing up to get the latest issues of National Lampoon, Heavy Metal, MAD, and Cracked.

Back on topic - I did middy before middy was cool, but right now, my only two carbines are 14.5" "M4geries." Does that make me a Fudd?:fie:

ra2bach

09-13-10, 12:13

to people who actually shoot enough to understand the issues, yes, I think the mid length will take over. but how many people shoot enough to understand the issue?...

RetreatHell

09-13-10, 13:11

Even some guys who shoot a LOT have just never heard about the mid-length system either. I mean, now that I think about it, there's not very many manufacturers that even make a mid-length gas system.

Personally though, I now have 0 carbine length gas system uppers that are NOT SBRs. I have two 16" uppers (SR-15 and BCM) and one 14.5" upper (BCM), and all 3 have middy gas systems.

to people who actually shoot enough to understand the issues, yes, I think the mid length will take over. but how many people shoot enough to understand the issue?...

VIP3R 237

09-13-10, 14:11

So with a 14.5 inch barrel the 7 inch (carbine) gas length is preffered, and with a 16 inch the 9 inch (mid-length) is better. But what about a 14.5 inch barrel with a 9 inch gas system?

RetreatHell

09-13-10, 14:22

So with a 14.5 inch barrel the 7 inch (carbine) gas length is preffered, and with a 16 inch the 9 inch (mid-length) is better. But what about a 14.5 inch barrel with a 9 inch gas system?

Not sure about others, but I most certainly prefer the 9" middy system in a 14.5" bbl as well. It shoots VERY smooth and is nice and soft. I like it... a LOT.:cool:

VIP3R 237

09-13-10, 14:44

yeah my S&W TS model has a middy with a 14.5 barrel. I sure like it.

RetreatHell

09-13-10, 14:48

yeah my S&W TS model has a middy with a 14.5 barrel. I sure like it.

I didn't know S&W was doing ANY mid-lengths now... that's cool. The more the merrier!:)

Black Jeep

09-13-10, 16:11

I sure wish I would have joined this site before I actually put my M4 on layaway at the local shop. I had the option to pick up a midlength, but the only difference as the guy at the counter put it was the length of the handguard. I know see after poking around a bit more that it is ever so slightly a bit more than that. I'll see if he'll let me trade out the upper for the midlength as no official paperwork has been submitted yet. Oh well, live and learn.

So, for the purposes of this thread. At the moment, I can say that the uneducated buyer is not being schooled on the differences. I did what I thought was sufficient research, but when you don't know what you're looking for it is easy to get overwhelmed

VIP3R 237

09-13-10, 16:25

I didn't know S&W was doing ANY mid-lengths now... that's cool. The more the merrier!:)

yeah its just the TS model that they put the 14.5 with a mid, It's also a 1-7 twist and it has a smith vortex flash hider pinned on. I've really enjoyed it.

RetreatHell

09-13-10, 18:39

I see NO reason why you couldn't change it, man. I mean after all, YOU are the customer here! He damn well better change it for you. Worst case scenario I'm guessing would MAYBE be a small fee or something to change it over. But you haven't bought anything yet, and it would be straight up wrong of him to NOT change the order for you.

You could also get all of your money back and simply order a 14.5" BCM mid-length upper directly from the Bravo Company USA website. They're probably cheaper, and almost certainly better, than the one you have set aside at your local shop.

Just a thought, but no pressure at all, man.:)

I sure wish I would have joined this site before I actually put my M4 on layaway at the local shop. I had the option to pick up a midlength, but the only difference as the guy at the counter put it was the length of the handguard. I know see after poking around a bit more that it is ever so slightly a bit more than that. I'll see if he'll let me trade out the upper for the midlength as no official paperwork has been submitted yet. Oh well, live and learn.

So, for the purposes of this thread. At the moment, I can say that the uneducated buyer is not being schooled on the differences. I did what I thought was sufficient research, but when you don't know what you're looking for it is easy to get overwhelmed

ra2bach

09-14-10, 17:33

Even some guys who shoot a LOT have just never heard about the mid-length system either. I mean, now that I think about it, there's not very many manufacturers that even make a mid-length gas system.

Personally though, I now have 0 carbine length gas system uppers that are NOT SBRs. I have two 16" uppers (SR-15 and BCM) and one 14.5" upper (BCM), and all 3 have middy gas systems.

true. true... but even with all the accolades and discussion about the benefits, I was not really enlightened until I shot both side by side.

and I'm not talking about recoil, or pressure, or bolt speed, etc., I'm simply talking about where I want to put my support hand. if you keep the FSB, and I do prefer it, a carbine just doesn't have enough real estate for my tastes...

Doc Safari

10-22-10, 13:21

So, for the purposes of this thread. At the moment, I can say that the uneducated buyer is not being schooled on the differences. I did what I thought was sufficient research, but when you don't know what you're looking for it is easy to get overwhelmed

I agree. I chose the carbine length system for the lighter weight, plain and simple. I know the mid-length system has advantages, but it makes the rifle a little front-heavy, especially if you start putting a lot of stuff on rails and whatnot.

I have to put myself in the category of one who won't shoot more than a few hundred rounds per year, so maybe I don't need to be concerned. Being used to 30-caliber battle rifles and AK's the recoil out of any AR-15 is less than those.

I see the likelihood that parts will wear faster on a carbine than a mid-length, but are we talking thousands of rounds or tens of thousands of rounds?

What other issues are there?

Could somebody go into some detail about the "issues" of a carbine length system out of a 16-inch barrel?

Somebody please give detailed information on why a mid-length is so much better than a carbine-length gas system on a 16" barrel.

Thanks.

Robb Jensen

10-22-10, 13:51

I agree. I chose the carbine length system for the lighter weight, plain and simple. I know the mid-length system has advantages, but it makes the rifle a little front-heavy, especially if you start putting a lot of stuff on rails and whatnot.

I have to put myself in the category of one who won't shoot more than a few hundred rounds per year, so maybe I don't need to be concerned. Being used to 30-caliber battle rifles and AK's the recoil out of any AR-15 is less than those.

I see the likelihood that parts will wear faster on a carbine than a mid-length, but are we talking thousands of rounds or tens of thousands of rounds?

What other issues are there?

Could somebody go into some detail about the "issues" of a carbine length system out of a 16-inch barrel?

Somebody please give detailed information on why a mid-length is so much better than a carbine-length gas system on a 16" barrel.

Thanks.

FWIW a midlength gas tube weighs less than 1oz more than a CAR length gas tube.

If you're meaning a 9" rail is heavier than a 7" rail you're correct but then again were talking a few ounces.

Midlength = much lower pressure than CAR gas and closer to Rifle gas pressures. Rifle is how the platform was originally designed. CAR gas was designed first for 10" guns. It was carried over to the 14.5" and then in the civilian world guns to 16-18" barrels. Someone pretty smart came along and designed the system longer....midlength was designed by KAC and ArmaLite (two different length midlengths).

JDW67

10-22-10, 13:54

Lots of great info here.

Thanks :cool:

Doc Safari

10-22-10, 14:24

Midlength = much lower pressure than CAR gas and closer to Rifle gas pressures. Rifle is how the platform was originally designed. CAR gas was designed first for 10" guns. It was carried over to the 14.5" and then in the civilian world guns to 16-18" barrels. Someone pretty smart came along and designed the system longer....midlength was designed by KAC and ArmaLite (two different length midlengths).

Lots of good info there, but I guess what I'm getting at is how long will my bolt last in a carbine length vs. a mid or rifle length? I've read the NAVSEA documents on bolts cracking around the cam pin area on guns that have been fired full auto a lot, but will a civilian with a semi auto rifle have to be concerned about this?

I understand the higher pressures might lead to extraction issues, but what are they specifically? Are we talking the need for more spare parts, or just that the rifle may choke on a round more often?

Sorry to be a pain. I'm just trying to be better informed. :)

EDITED TO ADD: I'm looking to see if it's justified in ordering mid-length uppers for my BCM and DD carbines or for my amount of shooting if I'd be wasting my money. Thanks.

markm

10-22-10, 19:23

I understand the higher pressures might lead to extraction issues, but what are they specifically? Are we talking the need for more spare parts, or just that the rifle may choke on a round more often?

Sorry to be a pain. I'm just trying to be better informed. :)

EDITED TO ADD: I'm looking to see if it's justified in ordering mid-length uppers for my BCM and DD carbines or for my amount of shooting if I'd be wasting my money. Thanks.

They're easier on parts, easier on your brass if you reload, and run more reliably because the cycle is smoother. The bolt isn't trying to pull out a pressurized empty from the chamber. The gas port pressure is 2-3 thousand psi lower on a mid length, depending on ammo.

A smoother cycle is more forgiving. It allows the mag to keep ahead of the cycle of the weapon.

All that said... I still run an 11.5" colt commando for home defense. The carbine gas system isn't gone.

LowSpeed_HighDrag

10-22-10, 21:40

Lots of good info there, but I guess what I'm getting at is how long will my bolt last in a carbine length vs. a mid or rifle length? I've read the NAVSEA documents on bolts cracking around the cam pin area on guns that have been fired full auto a lot, but will a civilian with a semi auto rifle have to be concerned about this?

I understand the higher pressures might lead to extraction issues, but what are they specifically? Are we talking the need for more spare parts, or just that the rifle may choke on a round more often?

Sorry to be a pain. I'm just trying to be better informed. :)

EDITED TO ADD: I'm looking to see if it's justified in ordering mid-length uppers for my BCM and DD carbines or for my amount of shooting if I'd be wasting my money. Thanks.

For guys like us who may not shoot more than 1k rds a year, a carbin length gas system is sufficient. That doesnt mean we cant buy the best we can afford though. My issued M4 sees quite a bit of abuse but hasnt cracked....

BUT, I am buying a midlength just for peace of mind. You never know when the AWB may come back and you only have one AR15 for 10 years. Speaking of that, time to go buy some more mags.

fdxpilot

10-22-10, 22:04

Doc Safari

10-22-10, 22:56

After reading this thread, I'm certainly considering adding a midi to my AR's sometime in the near future.

I agree that we all need to get the best we can get. Never again will there be a Bushmaster in my safe. After joining this forum, I decided to stick to rifles like DD, BCM, LMT, and Colt.

But I still love ol' Shorty. I switched back to AR's after being reminded how light and handy the carbines are. I don't think I could give them all up in favor of mid-length rifles no-how. I just didn't want somebody to post that they crap out after 5,000 rounds.:laugh:

Jake Bauer

10-23-10, 03:08

I understand the advantages of midlengths.. but I'm glad I have my DDXV. One because I got a fantastic deal, and two, as well as I maintain it and the fact that it's a DD, I have no doubts it will last me many many years of good, reliable function. If I was to get another AR, yeah it'd be a midlength.. but I'm not about to sell my XV off to get a middy.

Robb Jensen

10-23-10, 07:46

Lots of good info there, but I guess what I'm getting at is how long will my bolt last in a carbine length vs. a mid or rifle length? I've read the NAVSEA documents on bolts cracking around the cam pin area on guns that have been fired full auto a lot, but will a civilian with a semi auto rifle have to be concerned about this?

I understand the higher pressures might lead to extraction issues, but what are they specifically? Are we talking the need for more spare parts, or just that the rifle may choke on a round more often?

Sorry to be a pain. I'm just trying to be better informed. :)

EDITED TO ADD: I'm looking to see if it's justified in ordering mid-length uppers for my BCM and DD carbines or for my amount of shooting if I'd be wasting my money. Thanks.

CAR gas systems are the whole reasons for stronger extractor spring, Crane 0-rings on extractors etc. The gas system pressure on a CAR gas gun is almost double that of a rifle gas which is why it has these problems. If you already own your ARs and they have CAR gas just keep them. What I would recommend is either H or H2 buffer and to beef up your extractor using the BCM bolt upgrade kit.
Since I've been shooting ARs (started in 1975) I've broken 8 bolts, 7 were with CAR gas guns. I had one crack but stayed together on a rifle gas gun. The only way I discovered the crack is that the firing pin would drag on the extractor pin. This was a DPMS bolt on a Franken gun (my first 3gun rifle) after about 12K rounds.

ForTehNguyen

10-23-10, 08:48

Somebody please give detailed information on why a mid-length is so much better than a carbine-length gas system on a 16" barrel.

Thanks.

when a bullet is fired, the bullet is basically a plug to pressurize the gas system until the bullet leaves the barrel of course. Take note of the distance of the gas port of a 16" carbine vs a 16" midlength to the end of the barrels. The gas system is pressurized longer in a carbine, longer than what is necessary. Now look at the same distance on a 20" rifle, which is what the entire system is optimized around. Its closer to the midlength distance. A 14.5" carbine would work a little better than a 16" carbine. The distance of the gas port to the end of the barrel has a great impact on how the gun extracts and the timing of extraction. Things arent as simple when you just cut down the gas system. You start to imbalance a once balanced system.

Also a lot of people with longer arms like the midlength handguard because of the extra 2" of handguard length. My ergonomics are better on a midlength handguard vs a carbine handguard. For me to use a carbine handguard I have to extend the stock 2 clicks, putting the gun further out thus pushing the center of mass of the rifle out.

On govt profile the midlength probably weighs less overall than a carbine. The barrel is milled down under the handguards thinner than whats forward of the front sight tower. A carbine has more metal forward of the front sight tower that is not milled down. I can easily see that there is more metal on a carbine barrel, thus more weight. Even the metal under the handguard looks thicker on the carbine vs the midlength.

according to here, 16" standard middy upper weighs 3lbs flat, they dont have a carbine upper tho. I own a lightweight middy and a lightweight carbine upper and the carbine upper actually weighs 1oz more than the middy.

http://www.03designgroup.com/technotes/ar15-upper-receiver-weight-comparisons

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/v/vspfiles/photos/BCM-URG-MID-16-2.jpg

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/v/vspfiles/photos/BCM-URG-M4-16-2.jpg

Doc Safari

10-24-10, 14:41

Since I've been shooting ARs (started in 1975) I've broken 8 bolts, 7 were with CAR gas guns. I had one crack but stayed together on a rifle gas gun. The only way I discovered the crack is that the firing pin would drag on the extractor pin. This was a DPMS bolt on a Franken gun (my first 3gun rifle) after about 12K rounds.

About how many rounds does a bolt last in a CAR gas gun?

How difficult is it to headspace a new bolt to the existing upper? Are we talking "be prepared to return several before you get one that headspaces properly", or are we talking "nine times out of ten a bolt will headspace properly."

TwitchALot

10-24-10, 15:21

I agree. I chose the carbine length system for the lighter weight, plain and simple. I know the mid-length system has advantages, but it makes the rifle a little front-heavy, especially if you start putting a lot of stuff on rails and whatnot.

The carbine system shouldn't be (and AFAIK, isn't) lighter. Yes, you have less gas tube length on the carbine, which is weight. But you also have much more of of the heavier barrel profile in front of the FSB on a carbine. The extra metal shaved off under the midlength handguards cuts its weight far more than the extra bit of gas tube length you get, so not only does a midlength shoot softer, have a longer sight radius, is easier on your parts, and allows you (in basic configurations) to get a grip farther forward on the gun, it is ALSO lighter because it has the lightweight barrel profile for a longer length than on a carbine gas system. I'm not sure what would happen when you put various rail systems on (especially since some rail systems are lighter than others), but in general, it should be a negligible difference. Whatever the midlength gains in weight for the extra gas tube length and rail weight it makes up for in the increased length of the lightweight barrel profile (and therefore lighter barrel). On top of that, being able to hold the gun farther forward will help you control the gun much better and help you counteract recoil and whatever additional weight a ML may have, IF any.

What other issues are there?

Could somebody go into some detail about the "issues" of a carbine length system out of a 16-inch barrel?

Somebody please give detailed information on why a mid-length is so much better than a carbine-length gas system on a 16" barrel.

Thanks.

I'll just highlight a few quick points that others can elaborate on due to time constraints - the higher pressures on a carbine coupled with the increased dwell time on the 16' speed up unlocking timing of the bolt and speed of the BCG rearward. You may not notice this if you're just plinking, but this can reduce not only parts life, but also reliable extraction, which is why we have aftermarket parts for heavier buffers and o-rings to increase extractor tension.

Eric D.

10-24-10, 21:07

In a carbine gas system, due to the higher pressure, the BCG is given more kinetic energy than is needed to move it completely rearward before the spring returns it into battery. In a midlength system, the shorter distance from gas port to muzzle mean less gas going into the gas tube. The longer gas tube means more volume for gasses to expand. Because of those two factors, less force is directed on the BCG, thus it has less acceleration (f=ma)
In an ideal gas system, the BCG would have 0 kinetic energy (completely stopped) when it reached the rear of the buffer tube.
In layman's terms a carbine is gassed more than necessary to cycle; a midlength is gassed just enough to cycle. As far as extraction, the faster BCG speed in a carbine system causes a centripetal moment on the extractor, that is the reason for stiffer springs, so the the extractor holds onto the casing.

Coming down to the functionality of the two systems, you have to ask yourself what you want the rifle to do. A weekend shooter may not notice the reduced recoil of the midlength (the AR isn't renowned for its excruciating recoil anyway), nor would they shoot enough rounds in their lifetime to see a broken bolt. I have only owned carbines, the military uses them that's good enough for me. Plus I'm more inclined to trust a system that operates with more force than necessary to make damn sure it cycles. A spare bolt is ~$70? not a big deal. I plan on building a midlength in the near future for my own comparison and to add variety to my collection.

peabody

10-25-10, 11:38

peabody

10-25-10, 11:43

carbine gas' interesting subject :sarcastic:

in my IDF clone' i used a tubbs flat spring' and H2 buffer' with an AUTO BCG' [ BCM by the way :laugh:]

cutt the barrel back to 13.5 pin'ed on a levang'

sure did soften it up' and shoots very smooth now' ejection is at 3:30

turned out pretty nice.

peabody

Entropy

10-25-10, 11:50

As long as Colt and other manufacturers are churning out barrels of less than 16" for the military, they will continue to use the carbine gas system and it will stay the norm for civilian sales. The cost of making a middy versus just slapping a 16" barrel on a M4 is too great in the eyes of behemoth companies like Colt to justify the deviation from the primary production line.

Same reason Remington did not fix the trigger mechanism on their 700 series after 70 years of knowledge of the dangerous condition........cost.

If I want a Colt, I'll buy the 20" rifle. Otherwise, I'm happy with my BCM middies.

jaygee

10-25-10, 12:48

IF I'm not playing around with a 20", it's gotta be Middie ! If Colt
were to release an LE Middie, it would turn the world on it's ear,
but alas...this is not likely beyond a few prototypes for quite a while.

Pi3

11-12-10, 20:32

what is the most reliable barrel length for a carbine gas tube?

Spiffums

11-12-10, 20:52

The world would be a better place if they were.

Sings "I'd like to buy the world a Middy and keep it company......."

:sarcastic:

DHart

11-13-10, 03:08

In considering my first AR, I looked long and hard at the Colt, but I was convinced by all of the arguments for the middy (longer handguard, longer sighting radius, less stress on the bolt and action, slightly less recoil - all good stuff in my view) and went the BCM Middy route. Very glad I did. Not that the Colt or a carbine gas would have been a poor choice at all, but the middy just makes a lot more sense to me. I'm not likely to ever own a carbine length gas AR, myself... not with 14.5" or 16"+ barrels anyway. I'm surprised at how soft shooting the 14.5" middy with BC1.5 is... amazing. I really like it. I'm beginning to plan a 6.8 SPC build and it too will be a middy.

120mm

11-13-10, 04:50

About how many rounds does a bolt last in a CAR gas gun?

How difficult is it to headspace a new bolt to the existing upper? Are we talking "be prepared to return several before you get one that headspaces properly", or are we talking "nine times out of ten a bolt will headspace properly."

I think we're talking about "it's theoretically possible for a new bolt to not headspace properly, though unlikely".

I've never heard of it happening, but I suppose someone on this board has had a new bolt not headspace to an existing upper.

DHart

11-13-10, 05:37

I think we're talking about "it's theoretically possible for a new bolt to not headspace properly, though unlikely".

I've never heard of it happening, but I suppose someone on this board has had a new bolt not headspace to an existing upper.

My understanding is that it's not wise to move a somewhat used bolt from one upper/barrel pairing to another but that installing a new bolt in an upper should be no problem, given adequate quality/spec of the parts. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable on this than I can confirm or refute.

LRB45

11-13-10, 06:06

Not everyone is gungho to get educated on the AR as others who frequent here, thus when they go to buy an AR at the gunstore they end up buying what brand they sell. Which usually is a carbine length from RRA or Bushmaster.

I'm not the smartest guy when it comes to the AR or any gun for that matter but have learned alot on the various forums on the internet. However I bought my first AR and from what I gleaned off the internet, I went with a 14.5" with a carbine length gas system. At the time that seemed to be the best option.

Of course from reading more and more, if I could do it over again I would definitely go with a mid length. It does seem to offer advantages to the shooter.