China to USA: You will lose trade war

[variablebinary]

For some reason, China thinks they have us by the balls. This is understandable considering the sheer amount of our debt they own.

How's that globalization working out for you, America?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/currency/8002719/Chinese-think-tank-warns-US-it-will-emerge-as-loser-in-trade-war.html


Chinese think tank warns US it will emerge as loser in trade war

A State Council think-tank in China has warned Washington that the US will come off worst in a trade war if it imposes sanctions against Beijing over the two nations' currency spat...

[Moose-Knuckle]

I don't think it is so much that the US will lose as much as it is the US has given it away.

[ralph]

I tend to agree with the article..It'll hurt them worse..They are dependent on us buying their goods,goods, which we could make here. They (The Chinese) don't manfacture a single thing which we can't make on our own, nothing. A trade war between us and them would suck, But maybe, it would cause our govt to pull it head out of it's ass and start figuring out how to make this country an attractive place to do business..instead of trying to tax it into leaving,or bankrupcy

[Gutshot John]

No war, trade or otherwise, is fought without cost and casualties.

We may win, but it will hurt...a lot.

[m4fun]

Think about the trade embargo the Colonists imposed on the Great Britian..."Boycott English Goods" - it worked...temporarily.

What will all the people of Wallmart do?

[variablebinary]

In case you were wondering, this all is the result of China undervaluing their currency to strengthen their ability to export.

Here is what Americans don't get, the Chinese don't give a shit about free markets, they are playing to win, and they don't take prisoners.

While we are dicking around with cap and trade, the Chinese only care about taking the gold by any means necessary.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704652104575493791456903512.html?KEYWORDS=china


U.S. Bill on China Gains Momentum

BY KATHY CHEN AND KRIS MAHER

With U.S.-China tensions rising on Capitol Hill, industry and labor groups are scrambling to shape the one bill aimed at China's currency policy that has a chance of success this election year.

[ralph]

No war, trade or otherwise, is fought without cost and casualties.

We may win, but it will hurt...a lot.

I could'nt agree with you more, it would hurt alot. But, in the long run, we would, without a doubt be better off without the Chinese..Manfacturing in this country could be rebuilt,restarted, and we could find a market for our goods.We can compete. I don't think the Chinese have this ability, They don't seem to have looked any farther than the U.S. for a market to dump their shit off on..

[Gutshot John]

we would, without a doubt be better off without the Chinese..

I wish there were but there aren't any easy answers. Win or lose the Chinese aren't going anywhere.

Manufacturing is alive and well in the US, we haven't stopped manufacturing, we manufacture more goods than we ever have...we've just lost manufacturing jobs as it's become more capital intensive. China has less capital but a lot cheaper labor. As their capital grows, the disparity will continue to shrink.

The Chinese are rapidly expanding into markets all over the world and signing FTAs at a much higher rate than we are. They will be the ones providing refrigerators to the third world, not us.

With the exception of high-end goods, their market share is growing while ours is shrinking. We just sell more to those willing to pay a premium for better quality goods.

For instance Caterpillar may sell 75% of the 200 drag-line pavers sold around the world every year at $20 million a pop for a total of $3billion. The Chinese will sell 50% of 40 million refrigerators at $400/pop and make more money. Now add computers, stereos, ipods and all sorts of other consumer electronics and the numbers start to get really scary. These numbers are for illustration purposes only don't quote me on them.

[ForTehNguyen]

a trade war will hurt the consumer far more than the producer

yup guess which side we are on

[armakraut]

Figure out what it costs to make something here, deduct the cost of an overseas purchase/shipping, and the importer can write a check payable to the federal government for the difference. Level the playing field. If the chinese can make a better light bulb or the germans can make a better pistol at a similar price, god bless 'em, we suck and they'll get our money because they are indeed more industrious.

If a country wants to adopt the US Constitution and Bill of Rights, we'll trade with them for free.

[Heavy Metal]

a trade war will hurt the consumer far more than the producer

yup guess which side we are on


Because if we got our IPOD's from Tiawan or Vietnam it would be the end of the world but if China lost it's largets market, it could simply shrug it off.

China needs our money and the employment it brings far more than we need their crap, the majority of which we can get elsewhere or do without in the short run.

[ForTehNguyen]

Because if we got our IPOD's from Tiawan or Vietnam it would be the end of the world but if China lost it's largets market, it could simply shrug it off.

China needs our money and the employment it brings far more than we need their crap, the majority of which we can get elsewhere or do without in the short run.

if they were smart they would decouple their currency and watch their purchasing power rocket. They dont need the US to consume, they have 1 billion people

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

I've been there, going there again soon. Really an interesting place. I'd say that the population in general is so worried about trying to get 'theirs' that a war- trade or otherwise- is a totally foreign concept. I talked to plant managers that were at 50% capacity and but they are worried because they are going at 40% a year....

I think the tilting point comes when their own population reaches an economic critical mass where it can 'support' its own industries. Actually then, I think they will be less apt to use cheap currency, and will want more to take advantage of someone elses cheap labor. make India or Africa their bitch.

They can use a command and control economy when you are growing like they are and the basic needs of the economy are fairly easy to discerne. Build the roads, highways, steel mills, power plants, airports, ports and other infrastructure. The issue comes when the middle class starts to want to spend money on 'silly' stuff that central planners can't figure out.

One thing that has bugged me and it took looking at the Japanese situation to understand. Everyone thought back in the 80s that we would be speaking Japanese by now, there was no way to stop them. The Japanese where new and rising and America's time was over. Now we hear similar things about China. It's their 'turn' since they are the new kids. The issue is that while America is 'new' Japan and China are not anywhere near new.

We put Japan into the stone age (maybe bronze really) in WWII and China is coming off a multicentury slide after being arguably the most advanced civilization at one time. America is trully the first multicultural, or at least the first trully new nation or civilization that has come along in millenium. Japan and China, for all their newness and shiny cities, are old civilizations and not any where as dynamic as the US. Now China is more pluralistic than Japan. But to simply draw a line thru Premier powers and leave the US as a dot on that line does a gross misservice to how unique and special this experiment we are conducting is.

China is going to grow but it beats having container ships rather than battleships coming over the horizon.

[variablebinary]

China is going to grow but it beats having container ships rather than battleships coming over the horizon.

For now. China is a gimp world power because they can't project force like the USA can...for now, but as they grow in status and wealth, they will modernize their air and sea power, and that is when the real fun starts because at that moment we will be in a new Cold War, only this time we are broke and beholden to our adversary.

[Heavy Metal]

if they were smart they would decouple their currency and watch their purchasing power rocket. They dont need the US to consume, they have 1 billion people

If thye totally un-peg their currency and let it float, the cost of the crap they make will go up so much that other markets will start to undercut their ability to export. Their bag is chaep crap. Take away the cheap and all you have is crap.

[HES]

In case you were wondering, this all is the result of China undervaluing their currency to strengthen their ability to export.

Here is what Americans don't get, the Chinese don't give a shit about free markets, they are playing to win, and they don't take prisoners.

While we are dicking around with cap and trade, the Chinese only care about taking the gold by any means necessary.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704652104575493791456903512.html?KEYWORDS=china


No war, trade or otherwise, is fought without cost and casualties.

We may win, but it will hurt...a lot.

Two important quotes, but remember what the US is up against. It is probably unavoidable as long as China is on the so called war path.

[Moose-Knuckle]

I guess will see what happens when the Chinese invade the United States in the remake of Red Dawn (http://www.reddawn2010.com/.html) comming to a big screen near you. :D

[variablebinary]

Two important quotes, but remember what the US is up against. It is probably unavoidable as long as China is on the so called war path.

There are plenty of buffoon economists in the USA that are quick to cite free trade with China, but fail to realize China doesn't actually engage in free trade.

China is thinking long term, their sole goal is to cut our American throats, and their interest in pseudo free trade feeds entirely into that purpose.

[ralph]

There are plenty of buffoon economists in the USA that are quick to cite free trade with China, but fail to realize China doesn't actually engage in free trade.

China is thinking long term, their sole goal is to cut our American throats, and their interest in pseudo free trade feeds entirely into that purpose.

Well said Sir! well said!!
Every member of our Govt that still thinks that China is our "friend" or is simply "free trading" should have your last post tatooed into their forehead...along with the words "I voted for that"

[Rider79]

I guess will see what happens when the Chinese invade the United States in the remake of Red Dawn (http://www.reddawn2010.com/.html) coming to a big screen near you. :D

I can't believe it took 17 posts for someone to mention Red Dawn, which won an award... for Best Movie Ever.

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

I can't believe it took 17 posts for someone to mention Red Dawn, which won an award... for Best Movie Ever.

"Go to the sporting goods store and get the forms marked 4-4-7-3..."