Harv
07-15-07, 03:18
We'll... I finally rolled in the door and had a chance to relax and put my ARR together for my 3 Day Carbine Class with Pat Roger's down in fun filled fabulous Boone County IN with "Super" Sheriff Ken Campbell as Host. The Weather could not have been better for this class.
There are a enough AAR's that cover gear and all that other stuff.. so I will not get in to great detail other then what I used and why and what my observations were, what worked and what did not.
Suffice to say I have been taking a course with Pat for 4 years now... Some would ask.."Why take the same course from the same guy" you should take one from everybody ... We'll, at the end of this AAR,, there might be a clue in here why I don't...
GEAR:
On Day 1 I decided I wanted to come out of my comfort zone and play with my MAK90 AK. Nothing fancy.. stock Chinese AK with 3 Russian Steel mags.. the standard green cloth sling in a 2 pt position and I took a rat tail file and opened the notch on the rear sight. I ran about 300 rds and finished the day with just enough ammo ( I had 4 rds left)
I ran a 14.5" BCM Upper (1-7"Gov. Profile) Upper with a LMT Lower. I mounted my standards KAC RAS with a chopped downed KAC VFG. A SOPMOD Stock, Vickers 2 pt sling and an M2 Aimpoint with a LaRue Mount. The Gun had 1150 rds thru it prior to the class. Ammo was some 92 Radway Green M855 spec I bought last fall in the 720 rd Ammo cans with the nice bandoleers.(More on that) Mags were standard GI aluminum with Gen 2 Mag Pull followers.
I also ran my G-17 in a modded 6004 Holster (Hi rise with one strap) Thanks to Jeff Cahill from Tango-Down for hooking me up with one of the new Vickers Glock extended mag releases. It worked great and really was noticeable for me when I tac reloaded my pistol after a drill , especially with gloves on.. I would recommend these to any one who runs a G17.
I used my ICE Tactical Belt padded with two Eagle FB open top Kydex M4 pouches and two TT Kydex lined Pistol Pouches. A Maxpedition Dump pouch sits on my 8 O'clock position.
I also ran my SO Tech Callahan with Plates. This is my standard rig that holds 6 AR mags.. 4 pistol mags with an Admin pouch and a Utility pouch on the left side and a Hydration system on the back. The pouches allowed me to put AK mags (Bullets up) in them for day one. It's a good rig.. gives me Rifle protection and good mobility with comfort.
For Ear pro I ran my Sordins with the new GelSels for the first time.. all I can say is.....sweet....Very comfortable and excellent sound quality.
Day 1: (Reader Shooter521's AAR..) he describes it much better then me.
Lessons learned (AK)
-It's a decent platform.. but don't expect super accuracy.. Mag changes can be pretty fast if you use the incoming mag to activate the mag catch and sweep it out of the way.
-AK stock sights suck..period, use the who front sight at CQB distance (15Yds and in) and you can get good,fast COM hits.
-My trigger was pretty bad.. alot of trigger slap, but with some effort (and gloves) it can be over come.
-I would get an Aimpoint on this gun if it were going to be my primary, but since it's not, I will stick to Irons
-I modded my safety so I could activate it with my trigger finger, otherwise I would have had to adapt and overcome with a little more effort.
The day was spent going over all the basic stuff.. you know.. the kind of stuff we tend to overlook and forget after a period of time. Stuff that is very basic in concept and execution, if we practice it to a high degree....
DAY2: Ditched the AK and got back to an AR... thank God... Confirmed our Zero's at 50 yds Started working on single and multiple tgts and shooting from different positions. Started shooting on the move and working on malfunction clearance drills. Also worked on transition to pistol after a malfunction at 25Yds and closer to threat.
Lessons Learned:
-Staying focused on what you are doing is the key.. that and repetition, Oh sure.. it sounds easy enough, but most of what Pat teaches is pretty simple... all you have to do is execute it in a smooth and efficient manner every time and it works.
I had a Malfunction that caused me to transition to finish the drill, then take a knee to clear it... you think I would be able to do the Type 2 Clearance drill verbatim.... noop.. not a chance, Oh sure, I cleared it, but not by the book.
-Trigger manipulation... you here about it.. books are written on the topic ad Nauseam..but yet it really is very simple. Get a good sight picture.. press.. ease to reset and press again... but This year I really tried to focus on my trigger press and reset and I think It's slowly getting to a level that I am sorta happy with.
-Keeping you head in the fight.... one of the things I see every year.... Students shoot the drill and a split second after the bullet has left the barrel... they drop there barrel.. they drop there focus and they go back to there pre drill mindset. You have to follow thru and look for some one else to fight.. you need to assess and scan and then check your Gun.. You know that little trick about rolling the carbine over to visually inspect the ejection port and then once you know it's good (No malfunction in there) Close the ejection cover. Well, it sounds simple.. but yet it is so hard to get guys/gals to do.. and one student had a malfunction that he did not see... until the next drill...
DAY 3: We started off checking Zero's at 50 yds and then went into a series of warm up drills that start out simple and slowly progress.. adding a higher degree of difficulty as they go..Makes you pay attention and use the skills you were taught in the first 2 days.
Then he runs you thru a Qual course.. the purpose of the course is to allow the students to use and integrate every technique and apply it in a practical application. It's a great little qual course that is a pretty good yard stick to measure against , but like anything... you can be a hero on it one day and a zero the next... it's when you can shoot a decent score at the drop of a hat in any condition that it really comes into play.
Lessons Learned:
-It's always the simple stuff that bites you.. like for example, when I ran my first qual course.. After engaging the tgt's from 50 yds, you then run from 50 to 25 yds and then engage at 25 yds from standing and then kneeling.. as I ran to the 25 yd line, my trigger finger engaged my mag release and ... yup.. you guessed it.. Dropped my mag on the deck. So I scramble to get a new mag out and in the gun and complete the drill. (And I can watch this over and over again thanks to my Good pal BobR who got it on video tape for me...)
-Kneeling positions.. Pat teaches several, but you know which one always works the best...The one he refers to as the "Monica" you just drop down to your knees and roll back a little and take the shot... it's quick to get in.. quick to get out and I can get good solid hits from 50 yds.
-Staking the castle nut on the buffer tube.. A student's gun went down because the castle nut loosened allowing a single point sling plate to move, which caused the Charging handle to be blocked rendering the gun NMC. The TDP calls for them to be staked .. good enough for me.
-Reliability requires constant attention.. anybodies stuff can break or be out of spec..New M4 Aimpoints were having issues, moving on rails.. EOTechs with ARMS mounts will slide on several different rails (Colts), Older Aimpoints were having issues with weak battery springs and dirty electrical contacts.. You have to check you gear and maintain it....
It's never the cool 2 stage trigger, or what the best Flash hider is.. or what stock you have.. and that $300 custom barrel that shoots .5MOA it's always the simple shit that bites you.. Dropping a mag.. not keeping a gun topped off and running dry... not transitioning... Guys... don't get hung up on all the Minutia... it DOES NOT MATTER... You can have the coolest shit.. and you will still screw things up.
-The Radway ammo I ran worked fine on day 2, but on day three, it started to slow down my gun to the point I came of line and had to clean it out and relube. This ammo has a rep of being underpowered, and it finally caught up to me.. Plus the smoke that belches from it is quite noticeable and made my morning zero reconfirms fun as I had to wait for the smoke to clear from each shot. It works when you only shooting 100-200 rds, but once you start running more at a higher rate.. it causes problems.. something to be aware of...
-Dump pouches.. Like the rest of you.. I love um.. excellent piece of kit.. but what I learned from this class.. is I don't love my Rolly Polly anymore.. cause it's two shallow and every-time I would run and then go to prone or kneeling, A mag would come flying out... So per Pat's sage advice.. I'm gonna replace it with a CSM Dump pouch.. has a better opening and is longer and deeper and will keep the mag inside the pouch. And it's made by a Great American to boot.. win..win..
-Simple gear set ups work the best.. if you have to much shit on your vest.. it makes getting in prone harder.. I watched ALOT of students fight there gear.. That is something one needs to constantly work on and revise and adjust as you learn what works.. I have ZERO pouches on my right side.. keep it free for you pistol draw. Pat has you do a drill where you fire 2 rds from each magazine on your kit... from prone.... excellent way to see if you shit is wired tight or needs some revision.
Closing lesson:
like most things in life.. what Pat teaches is actually pretty simple.. and he always follows it with a statement that is simple but yet so poetic... just prior to a drill he will often be heard saying..."Don't F%$% up" and that in a nutshell is what we are all really trying hard not to do in just about every facet of our lives on the planet... Whether it's driving home from work.. or doing you job at work.changing the oil on your truck.. or what ever you trying to do... You want to execute it with the most smooth and efficient technique that you can...
We all need somebody to be standing behind us making sure we don't "F%$#up"
and then slapping us behind our heads (or making you do it your self) when we do... until we can achieve a level where we don't...
I can't speak for anyone else but me... but I have not reached that level where I don't .....So until I do..... I'm going to have to have someone behind me ready to make that slap... and I can't think of anyone better then Pat and Mike and Josh and Ken........And that is why I keep going back........ well, that, and maybe that Chinese Buffet...
There are a enough AAR's that cover gear and all that other stuff.. so I will not get in to great detail other then what I used and why and what my observations were, what worked and what did not.
Suffice to say I have been taking a course with Pat for 4 years now... Some would ask.."Why take the same course from the same guy" you should take one from everybody ... We'll, at the end of this AAR,, there might be a clue in here why I don't...
GEAR:
On Day 1 I decided I wanted to come out of my comfort zone and play with my MAK90 AK. Nothing fancy.. stock Chinese AK with 3 Russian Steel mags.. the standard green cloth sling in a 2 pt position and I took a rat tail file and opened the notch on the rear sight. I ran about 300 rds and finished the day with just enough ammo ( I had 4 rds left)
I ran a 14.5" BCM Upper (1-7"Gov. Profile) Upper with a LMT Lower. I mounted my standards KAC RAS with a chopped downed KAC VFG. A SOPMOD Stock, Vickers 2 pt sling and an M2 Aimpoint with a LaRue Mount. The Gun had 1150 rds thru it prior to the class. Ammo was some 92 Radway Green M855 spec I bought last fall in the 720 rd Ammo cans with the nice bandoleers.(More on that) Mags were standard GI aluminum with Gen 2 Mag Pull followers.
I also ran my G-17 in a modded 6004 Holster (Hi rise with one strap) Thanks to Jeff Cahill from Tango-Down for hooking me up with one of the new Vickers Glock extended mag releases. It worked great and really was noticeable for me when I tac reloaded my pistol after a drill , especially with gloves on.. I would recommend these to any one who runs a G17.
I used my ICE Tactical Belt padded with two Eagle FB open top Kydex M4 pouches and two TT Kydex lined Pistol Pouches. A Maxpedition Dump pouch sits on my 8 O'clock position.
I also ran my SO Tech Callahan with Plates. This is my standard rig that holds 6 AR mags.. 4 pistol mags with an Admin pouch and a Utility pouch on the left side and a Hydration system on the back. The pouches allowed me to put AK mags (Bullets up) in them for day one. It's a good rig.. gives me Rifle protection and good mobility with comfort.
For Ear pro I ran my Sordins with the new GelSels for the first time.. all I can say is.....sweet....Very comfortable and excellent sound quality.
Day 1: (Reader Shooter521's AAR..) he describes it much better then me.
Lessons learned (AK)
-It's a decent platform.. but don't expect super accuracy.. Mag changes can be pretty fast if you use the incoming mag to activate the mag catch and sweep it out of the way.
-AK stock sights suck..period, use the who front sight at CQB distance (15Yds and in) and you can get good,fast COM hits.
-My trigger was pretty bad.. alot of trigger slap, but with some effort (and gloves) it can be over come.
-I would get an Aimpoint on this gun if it were going to be my primary, but since it's not, I will stick to Irons
-I modded my safety so I could activate it with my trigger finger, otherwise I would have had to adapt and overcome with a little more effort.
The day was spent going over all the basic stuff.. you know.. the kind of stuff we tend to overlook and forget after a period of time. Stuff that is very basic in concept and execution, if we practice it to a high degree....
DAY2: Ditched the AK and got back to an AR... thank God... Confirmed our Zero's at 50 yds Started working on single and multiple tgts and shooting from different positions. Started shooting on the move and working on malfunction clearance drills. Also worked on transition to pistol after a malfunction at 25Yds and closer to threat.
Lessons Learned:
-Staying focused on what you are doing is the key.. that and repetition, Oh sure.. it sounds easy enough, but most of what Pat teaches is pretty simple... all you have to do is execute it in a smooth and efficient manner every time and it works.
I had a Malfunction that caused me to transition to finish the drill, then take a knee to clear it... you think I would be able to do the Type 2 Clearance drill verbatim.... noop.. not a chance, Oh sure, I cleared it, but not by the book.
-Trigger manipulation... you here about it.. books are written on the topic ad Nauseam..but yet it really is very simple. Get a good sight picture.. press.. ease to reset and press again... but This year I really tried to focus on my trigger press and reset and I think It's slowly getting to a level that I am sorta happy with.
-Keeping you head in the fight.... one of the things I see every year.... Students shoot the drill and a split second after the bullet has left the barrel... they drop there barrel.. they drop there focus and they go back to there pre drill mindset. You have to follow thru and look for some one else to fight.. you need to assess and scan and then check your Gun.. You know that little trick about rolling the carbine over to visually inspect the ejection port and then once you know it's good (No malfunction in there) Close the ejection cover. Well, it sounds simple.. but yet it is so hard to get guys/gals to do.. and one student had a malfunction that he did not see... until the next drill...
DAY 3: We started off checking Zero's at 50 yds and then went into a series of warm up drills that start out simple and slowly progress.. adding a higher degree of difficulty as they go..Makes you pay attention and use the skills you were taught in the first 2 days.
Then he runs you thru a Qual course.. the purpose of the course is to allow the students to use and integrate every technique and apply it in a practical application. It's a great little qual course that is a pretty good yard stick to measure against , but like anything... you can be a hero on it one day and a zero the next... it's when you can shoot a decent score at the drop of a hat in any condition that it really comes into play.
Lessons Learned:
-It's always the simple stuff that bites you.. like for example, when I ran my first qual course.. After engaging the tgt's from 50 yds, you then run from 50 to 25 yds and then engage at 25 yds from standing and then kneeling.. as I ran to the 25 yd line, my trigger finger engaged my mag release and ... yup.. you guessed it.. Dropped my mag on the deck. So I scramble to get a new mag out and in the gun and complete the drill. (And I can watch this over and over again thanks to my Good pal BobR who got it on video tape for me...)
-Kneeling positions.. Pat teaches several, but you know which one always works the best...The one he refers to as the "Monica" you just drop down to your knees and roll back a little and take the shot... it's quick to get in.. quick to get out and I can get good solid hits from 50 yds.
-Staking the castle nut on the buffer tube.. A student's gun went down because the castle nut loosened allowing a single point sling plate to move, which caused the Charging handle to be blocked rendering the gun NMC. The TDP calls for them to be staked .. good enough for me.
-Reliability requires constant attention.. anybodies stuff can break or be out of spec..New M4 Aimpoints were having issues, moving on rails.. EOTechs with ARMS mounts will slide on several different rails (Colts), Older Aimpoints were having issues with weak battery springs and dirty electrical contacts.. You have to check you gear and maintain it....
It's never the cool 2 stage trigger, or what the best Flash hider is.. or what stock you have.. and that $300 custom barrel that shoots .5MOA it's always the simple shit that bites you.. Dropping a mag.. not keeping a gun topped off and running dry... not transitioning... Guys... don't get hung up on all the Minutia... it DOES NOT MATTER... You can have the coolest shit.. and you will still screw things up.
-The Radway ammo I ran worked fine on day 2, but on day three, it started to slow down my gun to the point I came of line and had to clean it out and relube. This ammo has a rep of being underpowered, and it finally caught up to me.. Plus the smoke that belches from it is quite noticeable and made my morning zero reconfirms fun as I had to wait for the smoke to clear from each shot. It works when you only shooting 100-200 rds, but once you start running more at a higher rate.. it causes problems.. something to be aware of...
-Dump pouches.. Like the rest of you.. I love um.. excellent piece of kit.. but what I learned from this class.. is I don't love my Rolly Polly anymore.. cause it's two shallow and every-time I would run and then go to prone or kneeling, A mag would come flying out... So per Pat's sage advice.. I'm gonna replace it with a CSM Dump pouch.. has a better opening and is longer and deeper and will keep the mag inside the pouch. And it's made by a Great American to boot.. win..win..
-Simple gear set ups work the best.. if you have to much shit on your vest.. it makes getting in prone harder.. I watched ALOT of students fight there gear.. That is something one needs to constantly work on and revise and adjust as you learn what works.. I have ZERO pouches on my right side.. keep it free for you pistol draw. Pat has you do a drill where you fire 2 rds from each magazine on your kit... from prone.... excellent way to see if you shit is wired tight or needs some revision.
Closing lesson:
like most things in life.. what Pat teaches is actually pretty simple.. and he always follows it with a statement that is simple but yet so poetic... just prior to a drill he will often be heard saying..."Don't F%$% up" and that in a nutshell is what we are all really trying hard not to do in just about every facet of our lives on the planet... Whether it's driving home from work.. or doing you job at work.changing the oil on your truck.. or what ever you trying to do... You want to execute it with the most smooth and efficient technique that you can...
We all need somebody to be standing behind us making sure we don't "F%$#up"
and then slapping us behind our heads (or making you do it your self) when we do... until we can achieve a level where we don't...
I can't speak for anyone else but me... but I have not reached that level where I don't .....So until I do..... I'm going to have to have someone behind me ready to make that slap... and I can't think of anyone better then Pat and Mike and Josh and Ken........And that is why I keep going back........ well, that, and maybe that Chinese Buffet...