View Full Version : Laser sights on duty pistols?
Was talking to a group of LEO the other day on the value of laser sights. One of the more interesting responses I got from an LEO who had been using one on duty for some time, was he found the laser "took the fight out of people." His experience was (paraphrasing); With a laser, where you are going to get shot is not left up to your imagination, and according to his experience, found it it had the effect of preventing use of force. He said it even had that effect on people running away, he painted the wall in front of them, or some object they could see in front of them, and some would stop dead in their tracks.
I'm conflicted on the value of the laser for CCW, but I thought that was one of the more interesting angles of the benefit of the laser from an LEO who had had some time to use one on duty.
Anyone confirm/deny that experience? Any studies/reports on the psychological impact of laser sights on people worth reading?
In my dept., only the shield guys have lasers.
However, we've seen "compliance by illumination" with Tasers. Some of the hardened mopes know that they're not about to be shot, but they know that the Taser has a lower threshold for use. They'll challenge officers with guns out, but when the red dot comes on, they know that they're a few seconds from taking the hit.
That might be a factor in what you're hearing about where you are.
Just a thought.
In my dept., only the shield guys have lasers.
However, we've seen "compliance by illumination" with Tasers. Some of the hardened mopes know that they're not about to be shot, but they know that the Taser has a lower threshold for use.
There's a threshold for use?! :D
They'll challenge officers with guns out, but when the red dot comes on, they know that they're a few seconds from taking the hit.
That might be a factor in what you're hearing about where you are.
Just a thought.
Makes sense, thanx.
I see both sides of the story I think its good as long as its not used for a crutch and used by someone that had good skills before the laser was put on. To many think its a death ray
John_Wayne777
10-01-10, 11:27
Anyone confirm/deny that experience?
There are a number of anecdotes centering on that little dot's ability to make a bad guy ponder his own mortality...enough so that I would say it's a legitimate phenomenon. It's certainly not something I would rely on by any means, but I don't doubt for a second that there are some bad guys who see the laser hovering over their most vital areas and decide that what is about to transpire really isn't going to end well for them and thusly decide to let it go.
Any studies/reports on the psychological impact of laser sights on people worth reading?
I don't know of any that have been done, but maybe someone else does.
sandsunsurf
10-01-10, 12:52
In my dept., only the shield guys have lasers.
However, we've seen "compliance by illumination" with Tasers. Some of the hardened mopes know that they're not about to be shot, but they know that the Taser has a lower threshold for use. They'll challenge officers with guns out, but when the red dot comes on, they know that they're a few seconds from taking the hit.
That might be a factor in what you're hearing about where you are.
Just a thought.
I've seen this phenomenon several times.
I think I'm convinced that a laser is a useful tool for ccw. Echoing what awm14hp said, as long as it's not a crutch, it can be useful. The idea of being able to make aimed shots without being directly behind the pistol, for instance. Would it be rare? Of course, but adding an option that is this simple is good. It can also help as a training tool, being able to watch where the muzzle is pointed while pressing the trigger, etc...
One of the guys from an outlying agency painted a guy we were taking down. The guy started to yell and scream when he saw the dot, "Don't tase me man, that shit hurts, you can shoot me before you tase me.."
I have found most of these guys think its the taser.
I had a similar incident where we tracked a guy down to his house after he ran from a traffic stop (not only did the officer have his license plate, but he had his id... that is drunk logic for you). We finally got him out of the house and he had my partner on one side and another officer on the other (one was 6'1" and the other was about 6'4"). The guy started to fight as they were putting on cuffs and I pulled my taser and painted his chest. As soon as he saw it he went to his knees and put his hands behind his back and exclaimed, "I won't fight, just don't use that ****ing evil thing on me." Apparently he had been hit by a taser a couple of years back and it wasn't pleasant.
Lasers are allowed but I know of no one in our department using them. The only benefit I could see is if you were somehow disabled and not able to raise you pistol to see the sights or in another similar akward position. They have to be turned off when qualifying.
Kentucky Cop
10-01-10, 15:10
I have heard from other agencies that we come in contact with that a felony stop with 5 or 6 officers equipped with lasers on their weapons turns into a light show. As they paint the suspect, its difficult to figure out which on is yours as everyone "jockeys" for position.
KC
lethal dose
10-01-10, 15:57
As john Wayne stated, I wouldn't rely on the dot to frighten the perp into submission, you gotta have the millimeters to back it up. I think a laser is a very viable option and extremely beneficial on a defensive or service weapon.
I think lights are allowed across the board on duty weapons, but lasers are only allowed on the ERT members weapons.
I think it's a viable tool but it needs to be a tool and not a crutch as others stated.
A viable tool to be sure, but as long as you're using it as a tool for target acquisition when sight alignment, etc. can't be attained.
Relying on it to give opponents a moment of pause is akin to racking a shotgun to intimidate a home invader.
lethal dose
10-01-10, 17:35
A viable tool to be sure, but as long as you're using it as a tool for target acquisition when sight alignment, etc. can't be attained.
Relying on it to give opponents a moment of pause is akin to racking a shotgun to intimidate a home invader.
Spot on, bro.
My .02...compliance by laser dot is because the BG thinks it's a Taser. I've seen it. I have also seen them comply when an officer yells "Taser! Taser! Taser!" even when he isn't carrying one. :D
My department hasn't really had to address the issue because nobody wants one on their duty gun. I have one on my backup, and during my last qual a month ago I had it on and it actually caused me to throw a shot because I transitioned from my iron sights to the red dot. I won't be putting one on my duty weapon, but I do like it for my "oh shit" gun.
And it's been a rare occasion where I felt the need to put the little red dot from the taser on a guy and not zap him.
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