Water storage question....

[motorwerks]

So I have been reading a bunch about water storage and filtration, and I have a question...... why doesn't anyone ever talk about freezing water for storage? I mean its not for everyone but some. I have the bottom shelf of my stand up freezer full of gallon water jugs that are all frozen...... Frozen water doesn't breed bacteria, while the power is on it takes up a little space and which in turn makes the freezer run a little more efficient (think less space to cool), once the power goes out it could keep my meat frozen or at the very least a little cooler (like an ice chest) while I make my way home to get things figured out. Once thawed.... it might taste a little like freezer burn (I kid) but it will be fine.

Also.... watercoolers. We have one here at the house, and we go through about 1, 5 gallon a week but keep at least 1 spare on hand. I have been thinking about getting 2 more just to have in case SHTF because it would give us just that much more of a buffer since I have family (Mom and Grandma) right up the road that dont prepare like I try to. I mean 10 more gallons could mean the difference in keeping Granny Hydrated if something does go down.

One cool thing about them being 1 mile exactly up the road is that they just happen to be in a different water district. So chances of something happening to both sources is slim.


Ok so back on topic.... why doesn't anyone ever talk about freezing water for storage? Is it just that most people dont have the space? Am I doing something wrong?

[devildogljb]

It sounds like a good idea your reasoning is sound from what i can figure.

[kartoffel]

If it's clean water in a clean container, you don't need to worry about bacteria.

On the other hand, having a bunch of ice on hand could help with preserving perishable food when the power goes out. In the old days they used to cut ice out of ponds, store it, then use it all summer.

[Von Rheydt]

Tap water is not clean water. Some may argue the point but at the end of the day it isn't.

As Mr Kartoffel said it needs to be clean water in a clean container. Then you do not need to use up valuable freezer space that you could be using for food.

Clean your waterproof airtight storage container with a water & weak bleach mix. Check out the amount of bleach that you need to add to a gallon of water to make it drinkable - it is only drops not cups or bottles. You can also zap the container with UV light.

Making your water drinkable. You can filter it or use reverse osmosis this will remove most of the nastys. Then to make sure you have killed all the bugs you can either boil the water or add the recomended amount of bleach per gallon to make it drinkable.

When you put the water into your containers fill right up to the top so that there is absolutely no air gap. Then, making sure you have washed the lid close the lid to an airtight seal. Store in the shade and it should keep for three or four months.

If you ever do get around to using it for an emergency situation make sure to boil every drop before it passes anyones lips.

To understand why water must be clean before use read up on:

Cryptosporidium: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cryptosporidiosis

Giardiasis: https://health.google.com/health/ref/Giardiasis

Cholera: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cholera

[762xIan]

Making your water drinkable. You can filter it or use reverse osmosis this will remove most of the nastys.

Reverse Osmosis (RO's) will remove most of the crap in water......for a while. If the water is contaminated with "bugs" the RO membrane itself will become fouled and turn into a breeding ground.

Filtration does nothing for removal of bacteria and viruses. Filters that will remove them are in the <1 micron area, and to force water through a filter that size you are going to need a high pressure pump. Then again, the filter system just like an RO membrane will eventually become fouled.

Chemical treatment and UV (ultra-violet light) are the surest and cheapest bets for killing bugs.


Ok so back on topic.... why doesn't anyone ever talk about freezing water for storage? Is it just that most people dont have the space? Am I doing something wrong?

Lot's of prep info I have read have talked about freezing water for storage, I would rotate the jugs every 6 months or so just to keep it "fresh" and also to inspect the integrity of the plastic containers, especially if you are using milk jugs. They may develop cracks and leak.

My experience is mostly with industrial and some municipal large scale water treatment. But the basic knowledge and equipment applies across the board.

In my own home I have a well. My water has tested clean for microbiologicals though it is marginal for hardness. I have it tested once a year or so. But for the home I still have a 10 micron Carbon block filter (removes sediment and improves taste) then the water passes through a UV light for added security. My well and UV system can be run off my generator.

[chadbag]

I use a berkey light filter with the black filters and the pf-2 arsenic/flouride filters. Their testing shows it gets rid of the bugs as well as other things. It has embedded silver in it to kill the bugs. This is what they claim testing shows.

I use it for our day to day water (fill it with tap water daily) and it is also part of my emergency preparedness plans.

In addition any water I store will get sent through the filter before we drink it.

[Von Rheydt]

Reverse Osmosis (RO's) will remove most of the crap in water......for a while. If the water is contaminated with "bugs" the RO membrane itself will become fouled and turn into a breeding ground.

Thats why I additionaly recomended further treatment; either boiling or chemical.


Filtration does nothing for removal of bacteria and viruses. Filters that will remove them are in the <1 micron area, and to force water through a filter that size you are going to need a high pressure pump. Then again, the filter system just like an RO membrane will eventually become fouled.

GE Now produce the Merlin RO system. It is about as "plug and play' as you can get for the small commercial and home user. It meets NSF Standard 58 so it goes quite a way to meeting home needs and could easily be upped with the addition of a UV unit. The Merlin also does not need a pump if you have a 40 - 50 pound water pressure at home. As I recall the Merlin filter is capable of handling 720 gallons a day and does not need changing for 6 months. There are other ones out there but this one is about as plug and play as you can get, I have seen many in use commercially in the UK.

Here you go, from Amazon, but available for less elsewhere:

http://www.amazon.com/Merlin-Reverse-Osmosis-Water-System/dp/B000G7KSO0


Chemical treatment and UV (ultra-violet light) are the surest and cheapest bets for killing bugs.

And boiling.


Lot's of prep info I have read have talked about freezing water for storage, I would rotate the jugs every 6 months or so just to keep it "fresh" and also to inspect the integrity of the plastic containers, especially if you are using milk jugs. They may develop cracks and leak.

I treat all stored water as contaminated. It MUST ALWAYS be boiled before human consumption.


My experience is mostly with industrial and some municipal large scale water treatment. But the basic knowledge and equipment applies across the board.

I'm a UK Master Plumber for commercial and domestic water systems and licensed to connect direct into City Water Mains. You're right, does'nt matter if it is municipal, commercial or domestic the principles are identical..........just that the kit gets bigger.

I have also been asked by a UK manufacturer to sell their water purification kit here in the USA - but I am going to start as a commercial user first. The system relies on the production of ultra pure water with < 0 (zero) Parts Per Million (PPM) contamination. Measured using a Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) meter calibrated in PPM. Good enough for the medical equipment and electronics industry.


In my own home I have a well. My water has tested clean for microbiologicals though it is marginal for hardness. I have it tested once a year or so. But for the home I still have a 10 micron Carbon block filter (removes sediment and improves taste) then the water passes through a UV light for added security. My well and UV system can be run off my generator.

Professional interest: Whose carbon filter are you using and how many gallons is it good for?

Additional Info:

The ultra pure water I shall be producing for commercial use is so pure that it is not drinkable as such. The reason for this is that ultra pure water, simple chemical H2O, nothing else in it with not a contaminant in sight is inherantly unstable. Under a microscope it looks like Nitric acid bubbling away looking for something to disolve. If the water is warmed slightly and oxygen driven off it can vary between H2O & H3O which makes it very agressive to any potential contaminants. Think of your washing machine, it has a hot wash cycle which is better for removing contaminants (dirt) in your clothes.

Put simply ultra pure water is looking for and needs contaminants/dirt to stabilise itself. Look at any pond or pool of water, they are normally covered in a film of algae and other crud making it a grunge pool but inherently very stable as a compound. In use ultra pure water is used to clean newly produced medical equipment, printed circuit boards, factory produced sheet glass and many things needed in clean room environments.

If you drink ultra pure water it will take with it any mucous coating the insides of your alimentary canal, may cause severe illness and give you a dose of the squits like a bad curry in Delhi or a bad chilli burger from Tijuana. Therefore when cleaning and purifying water for human consumption you always leave a few mineral impurities behind.....tatstes better too.

[762xIan]

Von Rheydt, apologize for the long delay in response.

You are hot on boiling water (no pun intended) the only reason I shy away from it from a tactical or SHTF standpoint is fires and smoke draw attention. I so agree though....If possible and practical I would definitly filter and boil FIRST. This would save any stockpile of treatment chemicals and the life of your UV system for when you can't boil your water.


Professional interest: Whose carbon filter are you using and how many gallons is it good for?

I get pretty much the best prices fromhttp://www.waterfilters.net/ I have a Big Blue (whole house) filter housing which uses a 20"x 4.5" filter. I have two housings mounted in tandem. The primary filter is a cheapo sediment filter (cellulose filter 20 micron), the secondary is a 10 micron carbon, then the water goes through my UV system.

I am currently using Pentek brand carbon block filters. 30,000 gallons @4 gpm. I figured our home usage roughly and replace every 6 months. No problems and the water "tastes" fine.


I have also been asked by a UK manufacturer to sell their water purification kit here in the USA - but I am going to start as a commercial user first. The system relies on the production of ultra pure water with < 0 (zero) Parts Per Million (PPM) contamination. Measured using a Total Dissolved Solids (TDS) meter calibrated in PPM. Good enough for the medical equipment and electronics industry

We have a 9x5 RO then the water goes through an EDI (electro-de-ionization) system. We are making semiconductor grade water for our boilers. There is NOTHING in it. We have a lot of problems with analyzer maintenance reading that low. Our limits for any kind of hardness is 10 ppb...yes parts per BILLION. Our water is also about as chemically pure as you can get it outside of lab conditions. We can make up to 500 gallons per minute, but the norm is around 250.

Fun stuff!:D

[JStor]

I store 6 fifty-five gallon plastic drums in the basement. They are filled with well water, but I added a spoon of bleach to each one when filling.

When the power is out the water is heated via the wood stove or LP powered stove. I finally gave up on the Coleman white gas, pump up stoves. The needles and other small parts were always causing problems.