Police Officer Displays “Stunning Marksmanship”

[bulbvivid]

She even had the wherewithal to shoot off the doorknob so the perp couldn't escape.


The suspect fired four shots at Jones, narrowly missing her head with one, the commissioner recounted. She fired five shots back -- emptying her service revolver and marking the first time she'd ever fired her weapon in the line of duty -- and hit both of the man's hands, causing him to drop his 44-caliber gun.
Her shots also knocked the handle off the door of the salon, briefly trapping the man as he tried to escape, Kelly said. He eventually broke the window in the door and fled on foot.
"She knew the gunman might shoot, and when he did, she was ready for him, demonstrating stunning marksmanship in the process," the commissioner said.

CNN.com — Wash, set, and shoot: Cop takes on gunman in beauty salon (http://www.cnn.com/2010/CRIME/10/27/new.york.salon.cop/index.html?hpt=T2)

[CyberM4]

What the heck was she carrying a .38 snub nose?

[bulbvivid]

What the heck was she carrying a .38 snub nose?

It would seems so.

Good on the officer for getting the BG, but it's troublesome that she fired five shots, and, according to the story, only two hit the BG. Beyond that, I don't know how the commissioner equates that with "stunning marksmanship."

[skyugo]

i'm glad that worked out for the best, but doesn't stunning marksmanship generally consist of several A-zone hits and no collateral damage? Shooting off a doorknob in a busy city isn't generally considered responsible shooting...

[Sry0fcr]

i'm glad that worked out for the best, but doesn't stunning marksmanship generally consist of several A-zone hits and no collateral damage? Shooting off a doorknob in a busy city isn't generally considered responsible shooting...

No shit. Since when does getting lucky count as "stunning marksmanship"? Unless she was trying to shoot his hands, the doorknob and the wall... If I were her I'd first be thankful that I survived the encounter and second disappointed that I didn't permanently solve that problem.

[Abraxas]

it's troublesome that she fired six shots, and, according to the story, only two hit the BG. Beyond that, I don't know how the commissioner equates that with "stunning marksmanship."

My opinion but, obviously he is a political nitwit with no real understanding of what constitutes real marksmanship. Though having said that, maybe he is just trying to distract everyone from the glaring liability of the three shots that went god who knows where and a fourth that is also a miss, even if it did temporarily trap him:rolleyes:.

[bulbvivid]

On top of it all, go figure, CNN doesn't even question it. Just another “Oh, gettin’ my hair done, shootin’ bad guys” story.

[xpd54]

I have no idea what happened here, but it is not unusual for role players to take hits in their hands during force on force training. Very common. Especially when the role player has a gun in his hands. The officer focuses on the gun and that's where the rounds go.

[pilotguyo540]

"She knew the gunman might shoot, and when he did, she was ready for him, demonstrating stunning marksmanship in the process," the commissioner said

The suspect fired four shots at Jones, narrowly missing her head with one, the commissioner recounted. She fired five shots back :rolleyes:

I thought being ready was drilling this guy a new one before he got a shot off.

"To describe Officer Jones as cool under fire would be a gross understatement," he added :big_boss::sarcastic::sarcastic::sarcastic:

5 shots and 2 hits (lucky hits???). Very cool indeed.:cool: Good for her. I am glad that she is okay. she gets her moment in the spotlight, but who after reading that article, doesn't see the big pile of horse poo?

[Heavy Metal]

I meant to do that...

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

Sounds like they were shooting a Tarantino film....

Just have her do it again.

[skyugo]

On top of it all, go figure, CNN doesn't even question it. Just another “Oh, gettin’ my hair done, shootin’ bad guys” story.

yeah..
if i did that i'd be in jail for reckless endangerment....

[kaiservontexas]

Maybe I am too much of a percision nut and watch way to much sniper, marksman, sharpshooter stuff, but isn't a good shot one hit and drop? Silly article.

[skyugo]

Maybe I am too much of a percision nut and watch way to much sniper, marksman, sharpshooter stuff, but isn't a good shot one hit and drop? Silly article.

I guess a lot really depends on your interpretation of the word "stunning"...
:o

[jklaughrey]

She needs to ride a desk. No excuse for that shit. What a cheese dick spin move. Liberal media retards.

[skyugo]

She needs to ride a desk. No excuse for that shit. What a cheese dick spin move. Liberal media retards.

if a cop does it, it's stunning, if a civilian does it, it's reckless :o

[randolph]

this place is always good for a laugh :D

[Spiffums]

Now the "Community Activist" have a police report to point to when they say you PoPo should just shoot the gun from their hands and don't have to kill their good lil boyz. :sarcastic:

[John_Wayne777]

Remember that in NY state there are pieces of legislation submitted on a fairly regular basis that would require police officers to shoot people in the leg or in the arm so as not to kill or gravely injure the poor little lost lamb. Therefore when a police officer pulls a revolver and "shoots the gun out of" a bad guy's hands, it should come as little surprise that the municipal authorities fall all over themselves to applaud her heroism and marksmanship.

That she more than likely tunnel-visioned on the gun, pointed her gun in the general direction of it, and jerked on the trigger as fast as possible, this time with a happy result, will be lost on those municipal authorities because they know less about gunfights and firearms in general than my dog does.

[kwelz]

I have to give them credit for spinning this. To the uninitiated this probably seems great. We just happen to know better. Honestly though, a 40% hit rates seems better than a lot of police involved shootings I have seen.

[500grains]

I think we need to keep in mind that most police are not gun people and may not have a fighting mindset at all times. Unfortunately, most departments do not have the resources to give all of their officers the kind of training that keeps them honed to a sharp edge, and a lot of the officers may think of themselves more as community servants than fighters. If this cop was the more typical cop out there, then it's not surprising that adrenaline would have more influence on her response than training. I am just glad that it all ended well when it could have gone quite badly.

[bulbvivid]

The NY Times article has more information. It's behind a registration wall, so you'll have to register or go to bugmenot.com and get a username and password. In Salon Shootout, an Officer’s Well-Aimed Bullets (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/26/nyregion/26salon.html?_r=1)

Here's another story where she says that she just followed her training to shoot center mass: Cop who foiled Brooklyn salon robbery says she was following her training (http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/brooklyn/accused_salon_shooter_arraigned_dFuQWWGn52dzpY4RZMo2LP)

Some highlights:

The PO has worked in evidence collection for 12 years. After the BG herded the shop patrons into the bathroom, she took out her revolver and went out and identified herself as a PO, and then the BG started shooting.

This is the “.44-caliber Magnum” used by the BG, which he fired four times “in quick succession”:

https://www.m4carbine.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=6391&stc=1&d=1288278799
NYPD Photo

Another gem from the commissioner: “her reserve under fire was matched only by her marksmanship.”

I’m not posting this to denigrate the PO. Though I would expect better handling of the situation and better “marksmanship,” I still say good for her for getting after the guy. What bothers me is the way the press is reporting the story and the way the commissioner is playing up the stupid.

[jklaughrey]

I am of the opinion that if a sworn officer or anyone who may need to use force or a weapon in performance of said duties that relies solely upon their LEA training cycles for the needed skills to keep you alive and ready for situations of this nature. You may need to change your career to that of a "WallyWorld Door Greeter". It is bordering irresponsible behavior if you don't train and condition yourself to the rigors of LE/Military type engagements with BG's. Most LEA training cycles are at best deplorable and constrained by finances. It is not only prudent but necessary as an officer to take personal interest and responsibility in gaining the needed skills to be and remain effective in your career. My agencies training cycle is decent, but it is an election year and our Sheriff is more politician and less LEO at this time. Honestly I am voting for his opponent a fellow Sgt. for this election. But hey I am glad she lived and luck came into play. Me I don't have luck unless bad, so I choose training and vigilance as my companion instead of a "rabbits' foot".

[CarlosDJackal]

The suspect fired four shots at Jones, narrowly missing her head with one, the commissioner recounted. She fired five shots back -- emptying her service revolver and marking the first time she'd ever fired her weapon in the line of duty -- and hit both of the man's hands, causing him to drop his 44-caliber gun.

Her shots also knocked the handle off the door of the salon, briefly trapping the man as he tried to escape, Kelly said. He eventually broke the window in the door and fled on foot.

"She knew the gunman might shoot, and when he did, she was ready for him, demonstrating stunning marksmanship in the process," the commissioner said.

Kudos to her for fighting back.

But to me it sure sounds like she needs more marksmanship training because she missed with all five shots even though she did get lucky with two of them. :rolleyes:

So now that they (the City of NY and its officials) decided to sensationalize how shooting the gun out of a criminal's hands (a feat that is not easy even for the best shooters especially under pressure) is great; the ignorant public will start expecting more of the same from other Officers. JM2CW.

[JSantoro]

I have to give them credit for spinning this. To the uninitiated this probably seems great. We just happen to know better. Honestly though, a 40% hit rates seems better than a lot of police involved shootings I have seen.

I with this. Logic could have been twisted to just as easily to make out that the officer missed an incapacitating shot(s) or was shooting indiscriminately; along those lines, especially in New York. That said, Carlos makes a good point that there's plenty of wingnuts who will see this as actual capability instead of as a circumstance.

Regardless, well done goes to the officer for winning.

I still got an image in my head of some old western, title I can't remember. Near the end, there was some guy aiming in with a six-shooter on another dude on a horse, cresting a ridge over a hundred yards out. Shot, fella falls off the horse. Another guy near the shooter compliments the shot, and the shooter deadpans: "I was aiming for the horse..."

[Lumpy196]

At least she fought back and survived.

And many would be surprised at what having 4 shots aimed at you and the resulting adrenaline dump will do to your marksmanship abilities, especially when you've got minimal training and are shooting with a small gun with a heavy trigger and miniscule sights.