View Full Version : First AR build, Daniel Defense, Magpul
hondakilla98
11-08-10, 06:34
I'm building my first AR15. I don't have an assault rifle right now, so this build needs to be decent at everything. I ordered a Daniel Defense(DD) upper with a 16" 1in7 government profile CHF barrel, midlength gas system, low profile gas block, DD lite 14" free float quad rail, YHM 5C2 compensator/flash hider, and DD BCM and charging handle. I also ordered a DD stripped lower, Bill springfield LPK with 4lb trigger, Magpul MIAD grip, ACS milspec stock, Milspec buffer tube kit, Enhanced trigger guard, 3 Pmags with ranger plates, MBUS front and rear, AFG1, B.A.D lever, Ladder rail covers, Tacstrap 1/2 point sling, and slap plate, 1000 rounds of fiocchi 55 grain, and 120 rounds of hornady 75gn match. I haven't decided what to run for an optic yet. This will be primarily used for practical rifle, and also be my SHTF gun. Once I get it put together and assembled I'll get it to the range and see what it'll do. If it won't do MOA then I may swap the barrel out for a WOA 18" midlength SPR barrel, or something similar.
Looks like a good build.
Between you and the rifle, 1 MOA will probably be the best you could hope for...so don't be disappointed...it's perfectly acceptable for a "battle" rifle.
Looks like you did your research...:)
Sounds like a great first rifle! Any reason why you went with the 14" rail over a 12"?
hondakilla98
11-11-10, 05:35
Sounds like a great first rifle! Any reason why you went with the 14" rail over a 12"?
Well, it looks cool, increases site radius, in the future I may go with an 18" barrel, and it was the same price no matter what length rail I chose, but is worth more if I decide to sell it later. And being a big guy I'm not that worried about a few extra ounces.
Well, it looks cool, increases site radius, in the future I may go with an 18" barrel, and it was the same price no matter what length rail I chose, but is worth more if I decide to sell it later. And being a big guy I'm not that worried about a few extra ounces.
If your going with an 18" barrel it should be fine. But, anything over 12" on a 16/14.5" barrel tends to be very front heavy.
Hey, if it works for you, do it.
I can't see anything there to criticize.
If your going with an 18" barrel it should be fine. But, anything over 12" on a 16/14.5" barrel tends to be very front heavy.
Hey, if it works for you, do it.
Wouldn't the balance (front or rear bias) depend on the stock and optic also?
Cameron
hondakilla98
11-11-10, 13:30
If your going with an 18" barrel it should be fine. But, anything over 12" on a 16/14.5" barrel tends to be very front heavy.
Hey, if it works for you, do it.
That's another reason I went with the ACS stock. I can always put some ballast in the battery compartments to help shift the center of gravity rearward.
Steve99Slomaro
11-11-10, 14:12
Why 55gr? 1/7 twist tends not to like rounds that are below 60gr.
Did you read that on the internet? 55gr. ammo works fine in most every 1/7 rifle. For example- my 11.5" SBR will hit steel plates consistently at 300 yards.
I also recently used 55gr. TAP ammo in the same gun in a Patrol Rifle Course and had no issues punching steel and plates out to 100 yards.
Why 55gr? 1/7 twist tends not to like rounds that are below 60gr.
What is your experience with the AR? I think that you should look at the weapon as a SHTF weapon first and a "practical" rifle second. Or build it strictly as a practical gun.
I would also lose the the B.A.D lever unless you have mastered the basic operation techniques first.
Is there a reason why you need it to shoot 1 MOA? I seriously doubt any off the shelf standard barrel will shoot 1 MOA. My Noveske Recon shoots about 1.25 MOA and it isn't off the shelf.
I'm building my first AR15. I don't have an assault rifle right now, so this build needs to be decent at everything. I ordered a Daniel Defense(DD) upper with a 16" 1in7 government profile CHF barrel, midlength gas system, low profile gas block, DD lite 14" free float quad rail, YHM 5C2 compensator/flash hider, and DD BCM and charging handle. I also ordered a DD stripped lower, Bill springfield LPK with 4lb trigger, Magpul MIAD grip, ACS milspec stock, Milspec buffer tube kit, Enhanced trigger guard, 3 Pmags with ranger plates, MBUS front and rear, AFG1, B.A.D lever, Ladder rail covers, Tacstrap 1/2 point sling, and slap plate, 1000 rounds of fiocchi 55 grain, and 120 rounds of hornady 75gn match. I haven't decided what to run for an optic yet. This will be primarily used for practical rifle, and also be my SHTF gun. Once I get it put together and assembled I'll get it to the range and see what it'll do. If it won't do MOA then I may swap the barrel out for a WOA 18" midlength SPR barrel, or something similar.
That's another reason I went with the ACS stock. I can always put some ballast in the battery compartments to help shift the center of gravity rearward.
That's a good idea! I have the 12" RIS II with a MOE stock and its a bit front heavy but that would solve the problem.
I learn something new everyday on this fabulous website.
Wouldn't the balance (front or rear bias) depend on the stock and optic also?
Cameron
Yes it would. I made the mistake of not taking the stock and optic weight into account at the time. My bad...
Is there a reason why you need it to shoot 1 MOA? I seriously doubt any off the shelf standard barrel will shoot 1 MOA. My Noveske Recon shoots about 1.25 MOA and it isn't off the shelf.
It might of been my imagination, but I'm pretty sure I read somewhere about a centurion arms 16" barrel being 1 moa. But, I could be wrong. (Like I usually am :D)
hondakilla98
11-11-10, 17:48
Why 55gr? 1/7 twist tends not to like rounds that are below 60gr.
From what I've read. The 1in7 twist is great for the heavier 223 bullets.
hondakilla98
11-11-10, 18:01
What is your experience with the AR? I think that you should look at the weapon as a SHTF weapon first and a "practical" rifle second. Or build it strictly as a practical gun.
I would also lose the the B.A.D lever unless you have mastered the basic operation techniques first.
Is there a reason why you need it to shoot 1 MOA? I seriously doubt any off the shelf standard barrel will shoot 1 MOA. My Noveske Recon shoots about 1.25 MOA and it isn't off the shelf.
It's primarily a shtf gun. But practical rifle looks like fun and since I don't plan on being competitive. It'll work fine.
I don't have any real world experience. And the bad lever sounded like a good idea. But untill I try it I won't know.
It doesn't have to shoot 1 moa. But I'd like to be able to make hits at 500 yards and the more accurate the rifle, the more easily that would be.
From what I've read. The 1in7 twist is great for the heavier 223 bullets.
It is good for the heaver bullets but it works perfectly fine with 55 grain bullets as well.
hondakilla98
11-11-10, 19:45
It is good for the heaver bullets but it works perfectly fine with 55 grain bullets as well.
That's what I've heard, and why I bought 1000 55 grain to practice with. And 120 75 grain match rounds for 200 yards plus.
That's what I've heard, and why I bought 1000 55 grain to practice with. And 120 75 grain match rounds for 200 yards plus.
Id save those 75 grain bullets for distances a bit farther than 200 yards...
Scroll down to twist rates.
http://www.6mmbr.com/223Rem.html
If you ever have some down time read the entire article. Its really quite interesting.
The DD CHF Middy units should be plenty accurate - again, the limiting factor for accuracy after the user is ammunition - no way to determine the accuracy potential of a barrel until you've figured out which load works in it, and most surplus ones can really only expect to achieve 2-3MOA anyway... which is still plenty good enough to hit something at 500m.
If you're not trying to print tiny groups, 55gr will still go quite accurately at range. Won't buck wind as well, but even modestly priced ammunition through a good AR will connect at range.
The BAD lever is still a good idea, but I would agree that until you're familiar with the manual of arms, it's just another doodad.
hondakilla98
11-11-10, 23:09
Id save those 75 grain bullets for distances a bit farther than 200 yards...
Scroll down to twist rates.
http://www.6mmbr.com/223Rem.html
If you ever have some down time read the entire article. Its really quite interesting.
Thanks for the link. I'm just getting into reloading. And there is a lot of good info on that site. My range has a 200/300 yard range and once a week that gets closed and they open the 400/500/600 yard range. So I guess I'll see how they perform.
Most off the shelf Colt M4's as well as a few others I am sure can make a hit at 500 if you have the right set up.
Most experienced shooters will tell you that the average person can't shoot to the potential of their weapon.
As for the B.A.D lever I would say that I would master using the standard controls first before you install it.
It's primarily a shtf gun. But practical rifle looks like fun and since I don't plan on being competitive. It'll work fine.
I don't have any real world experience. And the bad lever sounded like a good idea. But untill I try it I won't know.
It doesn't have to shoot 1 moa. But I'd like to be able to make hits at 500 yards and the more accurate the rifle, the more easily that would be.
hondakilla98
11-12-10, 17:43
Most off the shelf Colt M4's as well as a few others I am sure can make a hit at 500 if you have the right set up.
Most experienced shooters will tell you that the average person can't shoot to the potential of their weapon.
As for the B.A.D lever I would say that I would master using the standard controls first before you install it.
As far as accuracy goes. I would like 1 moa off bags on a bench. And I've got a lot of practice shooting 22lr benchrest. If I can get close I'll be happy. After I save up some more money I plan to buy some different powders and bullets and try some other people's pet loads. To see what is possible with this barrel.
hondakilla98
11-19-10, 06:08
I assembled my lower today. Here are a couple pics
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m193/56clubsedan/d2a90bb8.jpg
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m193/56clubsedan/2a588c58.jpg
Militant83
11-19-10, 09:20
Looks like you have a great build going on there.
Looks a lot what I have planned... I like
hondakilla98
11-22-10, 21:58
My upper shipped today, and should arrive on next monday. Im almost there.:D
hondakilla98
12-01-10, 20:48
I received my upper today. My rifle is finally all together. I'm headed to the range. I'll post pics soon.
Lets hear a range report too!
hondakilla98
12-02-10, 05:16
Here are a couple pics.
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m193/56clubsedan/51057273.jpg
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m193/56clubsedan/8de642aa.jpg
I put about 200 rounds through it with no problems. She shoots smooth. It was pretty dark. And so far I'm not impressed with the magpul mbus. It's decent, but not great. At 50 yards it would put 30 rounds in a 4" circle. Now with better lighting and not holding a black post over a black target, I'm sure it'll be better. The bill Springfield trigger is nice. Just a touch of pretravel and overtravel, and a nice crisp break that feels close to the advertised 4 lbs. A good deal in my book for an LPK with 4 lb trigger for $120.
Magic_Salad0892
12-02-10, 06:27
It might of been my imagination, but I'm pretty sure I read somewhere about a centurion arms 16" barrel being 1 moa. But, I could be wrong. (Like I usually am :D)
Centurion CHF CL barrels are about 1MOA.
I've seen a few pics on TOS of guys doing around 1 MOA with the 16.1'', and 14.5''.
Monty throws out a great product.
Here are a couple pics.
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m193/56clubsedan/51057273.jpg
http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m193/56clubsedan/8de642aa.jpg
Now that's nice.
My second rifle (:sarcastic:) that I'm planning out is going to be an SPR-ish style, and you just built almost exactly what I thought up (minus a couple accessories). So it's nice to see a finished example.:cool:
Militant83
12-02-10, 12:54
Hondakilla it turned out real nice..great looking rifle
hondakilla98
12-02-10, 14:20
Thanks for the compliments guys. Now I am wondering, when I remove the lite rail and go to reinstall it. Do I loctite or torque the bolts when I put them back on?
After I Pm'd you about this, I did a little digging around for some answers, and stumbled across a couple things that might be helpful-
Stickman's guide to installing a DD Lite rail:
http://www.weaponevolution.com/forum/showthread.php?1-Daniel-Defense-Lite-Rail-install-guide-and-pictorial-review
MilitaryMoron's Review:http://www.militarymorons.com/weapons/ar.uppers.html
In a nutshell, it seems you'll need to remove your flash supressor and gas block before you can get the rail off, as they won't fit through the rear hole in the rail. Replacing the rail seems to require about 30 foot pounds of torque.
hondakilla98
12-07-10, 17:34
After I Pm'd you about this, I did a little digging around for some answers, and stumbled across a couple things that might be helpful-
Stickman's guide to installing a DD Lite rail:
http://www.weaponevolution.com/forum/showthread.php?1-Daniel-Defense-Lite-Rail-install-guide-and-pictorial-review
MilitaryMoron's Review:http://www.militarymorons.com/weapons/ar.uppers.html
In a nutshell, it seems you'll need to remove your flash supressor and gas block before you can get the rail off, as they won't fit through the rear hole in the rail. Replacing the rail seems to require about 30 foot pounds of torque.
Removing the gas block could be entertaining with my mid length system and 14" rail. Good thing there are lots of holes in the lite rail.
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