View Full Version : President Obama Threads Go Here
Attention to All. If you want to complain, bitch, whine, moan or otherwise thank the President and or his administration for doing something or not doing something put your threads here.
It seems as if everyday more and more are popping up and then die after only a few pages. Then along comes another and another.......
If you post in anywhere else, it will be deleted and the proper course of action will follow. Thanks.
Belmont31R
11-10-10, 21:37
Good way to kill off any discussion.
Absolutely not. Trying to keep them all in one place.
Good way to kill off any discussion.
so is all obama discussion to be done in this thread, or are we to link all obama threads in here?
Belmont31R
11-10-10, 21:48
Absolutely not. Trying to keep them all in one place.
The last 2-3 times a particular topic got dumped into one thread in GD no one participates in them anymore.
I guess its better to have a sticky at the top with links to forgotten threads such as Obama AWB and ObamaCare that has little to no discussion.
Obama AWB: Last Post 9/29
ObamaCare: 5 posts in 1 1/2 months.
I hope I can still refer to him as the Usurper.
Here is another good article exposing the inner Obama:
Recent photos of Obama have been alarming; they depict a man boiling over with rage. Have we ever witnessed a U.S. president so pugnacious, so incensed and inflamed by his own people?
http://www.americanthinker.com/2010/11/obamas_slave_ship.html
If you hate him or love him it goes in this thread. Then everyone can post to their hearts content.
so is all obama discussion to be done in this thread, or are we to link all obama threads in here?
montanadave
11-11-10, 11:45
Thank you to the moderators.
Belmont31R
11-11-10, 14:19
Thank you to the moderators.
I'm sure you are thrilled.
Let's be honest, we're not trying to kill discussion. We're trying to cut out the childish bullshit and the number of threads we have to ****ing chase down to babysit ****ers who can't babysit themselves.
Want to have free reign to post and converse in separate threads? Start acting like ****ing adults and have intelligent discourse that doesn't require a moderator or staff every other minute.
Think anyone can do that? If so, and it's gets proven here, we might re-visit this thread and our current stance on Obama threads.
I wouldn't wager this moderation tactic gets changed in the near future though, based on how heated and juvenile some of the threads have been lately.
Why do some of you guys act like I just dumped a turd in your coffee? Think back a few months when we debated getting rid of the GD area all together because of the stupid and moronic behavior of some of the posters.
Some people have nothing better to do all day long except for finding stupid shit to post about the President. Well guys- we just had an election and there have been changes. The President and a majority of the Dems have been knocked down and 2012 will be a different year. Until then we have to suck it up and drive on.
Let me be 1000% clear. I don't like him, his administration or his policies. But being a member here or any other website doesn't give you carte blanche to act stupid. There is no freedom of speech on a privately owned website.
FromMyColdDeadHand
11-11-10, 15:12
The only real problem I have with this course of action is that Barry tries to get into so many facets of peoples lives from energy, healthcare, defense, immigration that one thread to cover all his crimes against humanity will become a din of crossed conversations.
If we could count on him to attack only one freedom at a time, I think we could handle it, but this full frontal assualt is hard to keep up with.
Bolt_Overide
11-11-10, 22:49
I personally detest the president and everything he stands for. Hes a socialist, a liar, and the worst sort of professional politician. Regardless of that, Im gettin kinda tired of reading about him, not because I dont think that these stories are not atleast based in truth, Im just tired of hearing about his ass...
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2010/11/10/article-1328351-0BFE746A000005DC-452_306x459.jpg
I think she is angry that the $200 million Indian vacation was not as much fun as the $40 million vacation in Spain.
Since I am a "shill" for Obama, I'll go out and say that it looks as if she possibly just stepped out from being indoors and the light is bothering her.
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2010/11/10/article-1328351-0BFE746A000005DC-452_306x459.jpg
I think she is angry that the $200 million Indian vacation was not as much fun as the $40 million vacation in Spain.
http://www.freakingnews.com/Pictures/4/Bowing-Obama.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_QqyrPAPvIxc/SwDov6yjAaI/AAAAAAAABds/NeCGIacm4h8/s400/0saveStar.png
Belmont31R
11-14-10, 01:08
Has the desired result been achieved yet?
Just so yall know I have not forgotten about Barry.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/500grains/obamaturkeyday.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/500grains/Obamasexpic-1.jpg
Has the desired result been achieved yet?
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_N2EyyrA_LPs/SwSDG44A5wI/AAAAAAAAEQc/UE2AFCa112c/s1600/obama_superman_awesome.jpg
If you guys want to act like jackasses have it. The purpose of the thread wasn't to stiffle anyones imaginary "free speech" on this site. It was to do away with the constant pop up of "I hate President Obama and everything about him" threads that received about 10 responses and then faded away into obscurity.
I am sure that if you guys comb the internet enough you can find some more stuff to post about him. If people are really interested then they will look here and respond accordingly.
If you guys want to act like jackasses have it. The purpose of the thread wasn't to stiffle anyones imaginary "free speech" on this site. It was to do away with the constant pop up of "I hate President Obama and everything about him" threads that received about 10 responses and then faded away into obscurity.
Have to agree with you. Too much, too often and usually without highlighting anything tangible. We're all frustrated with the idiot, but enough can be enough in any circumstance. The overabundance of redundant, speculative threads accompanied by too little new legitimate ground covered has led us here.
Maybe if we can keep things in better perspective down the line this will no longer be an issue. Just venting constant hate makes one lose legitimacy and takes away from what could be an otherwise good opportunity to relay and discuss viable developments.
IG, grow a sense of humor please.
My sense of humor is fine. As a matter of fact those that know me will say that I am too funny.
IG, grow a sense of humor please.
Bolt_Overide
11-14-10, 22:57
My sense of humor is fine. As a matter of fact those that know me will say that I am too funny.
Looking?
Im sure a little plastic surgery will fix that right up..... :sarcastic:
I was saving this for Belmont's turkey thread, but I guess it goes here.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/500grains/Obamaturkeydinner.jpg
wow.. i think i might be ruined on turkey, now. thanks, man.
I was saving this for Belmont's turkey thread, but I guess it goes here.
That's certainly one of the more disturbing things I've seen recently. Whoever created that must have some interesting stuff going through their mind.
And I should mention that he way undercooked the head.
Yeah, but you gotta admit the guy is a genius with photoshop.
Wanna do something constructive for truth , justice & the American
way ?
Google:
ATF : Surplus Korean firearms imports ' pose a threat to public safety ..
And
HR 6240 : Collectible Firearms Protection Act
Seems like the best opportunty to stick it to the gun-grabbers in years , maybe decades.
Plus , when it passes we get to buy metric tons of M1 Carbines and 1911 series pistols for cheap.
:secret:
Wanna do something constructive for truth , justice & the American
way ?
Google:
ATF : Surplus Korean firearms imports ' pose a threat to public safety ..
I read that as "ATF poses a threat to public safety .."
Silly me. Got to pay more attention. :laugh:
I read that as "ATF poses a threat to public safety .."
Silly me. Got to pay more attention. :laugh:
Funny you should mention that.
Goggle:
BATFE Reform and Modernization Act
The gungrabbers are going hysterical over that bill.
:laugh:
I would like to see "BATFE and DEA Dissolution Act". IMO, the FBI should perform those functions, and the FBI can hire on the ATF and DEA agents with clean records who fit FBI hiring criteria.
Takes longer if you don't start.
rickrock305
11-18-10, 11:24
about that 200 million dollar a day India trip...
US President Barack Obama has announced $10bn (£6.2bn) in new trade deals with India.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-11703626
Gutshot John
11-18-10, 11:35
about that 200 million dollar a day India trip...
US President Barack Obama has announced $10bn (£6.2bn) in new trade deals with India.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-south-asia-11703626
Dude if a salesperson spent more than 10% on travel compared to the sales he generated, he'd get a dressing down. That's a HUGE cost to benefit ratio.
rickrock305
11-18-10, 19:13
Dude if a salesperson spent more than 10% on travel compared to the sales he generated, he'd get a dressing down. That's a HUGE cost to benefit ratio.
DUDE, he didn't spend 200 million a day.
DUDE, he didn't spend 200 million a day.
how much did he spend?
Gutshot John
11-18-10, 20:00
DUDE, he didn't spend 200 million a day.
You're the one that acknowledged the number by trying to justify it.
If you have a better source for the numbers I'm all ears.
Bolt_Overide
11-18-10, 22:20
I think a question more to the point is, how is it that he and his staff dont realise that he could have gotten this done a whole hell of a lot cheaper.
Belmont31R
11-18-10, 22:24
Funny all of those companies are union shops, too.
platoonDaddy
11-19-10, 03:24
DUDE, he didn't spend 200 million a day.
NDTV provides latest news from India.
Press Trust of India, Updated: November 03, 2010 08:25 IST
http://www.ndtv.com/article/india/us-to-spend-200-mn-a-day-on-obama-s-mumbai-visit-64106
Texas State Representative Leo Berman (R) furthered his campaign against xxxx Tuesday, a man that he has before characterized as "God's punishment on us," by introducing a bill that would require future presidential and vice-presidential candidates to produce "the original birth certificate indicating that the person is a natural-born United States citizen" to the Texas secretary of state.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/1..._n_784914.html
Mayor Bloomberg Called President Obongo the Most "Arrogant" Man He Ever Met
You may recall that during President Obama’s vacation at Martha’s Vineyard, on August 27 he took in a round of golf at the Vineyard Golf Club in Edgartown, playing golf with New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg; Democratic lawyer, business man and éminence grise Vernon Jordan; and White House trip director (and former golf pro) Marvin Nicholson.
The pool report at the time said that "We are told Bloomberg and Obama talked in the clubhouse for about 15 mins about the economy. They then went to the driving range.”
Apparently – at least from a second-hand report – the Obama-Bloomberg convo could have gone better.
In an interview with The Australian Financial Review, conservative media magnate Rupert Murdoch says ''Bloomberg said it was a pleasant day. In conversation he put a few ideas … He said it was like verbal ping pong.”
Bloomberg, according to Murdoch, “came back and said 'I never met in my life such an arrogant man'."
...
Barack likes TSA groping:
“”At this point, the Transportation Security Administration, in consultation with our counterterrorism experts, have indicated to me that the procedures that they’ve been putting in place are the only ones right now that they consider to be effective against the kind of threat that we saw in the Christmas Day bombing,” said Obama, in regards to the new procedures. http://indiepropub.com/obama-defends...ctices/312453/
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/500grains/brocobama.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/500grains/ObamaLouisXIV.jpg
Bolt_Overide
11-23-10, 02:22
I dont see it so much as gods punishment, but karma.
We brought this on ourselves due to our own complacency and apathy as a country.
rickrock305
11-23-10, 16:31
how much did he spend?
You're the one that acknowledged the number by trying to justify it.
If you have a better source for the numbers I'm all ears.
Lets put that number into perspective for a moment. You guys realize that the cost for the wars in Afghanistan costs $200 million a day? And thats a hundred thousand people, equipment, fuel, food, etc.
You guys are clinging to an anonymous quote in a foreign media outlet. Someone who is without a doubt NOT privileged to what this trip will entail and what it will cost.
And in fact every United States official asked about it has literally laughed at it, calling in "comical" and "nonsense".
But hey, its on the internet, it must be true!
rickrock305
11-23-10, 16:32
Texas State Representative Leo Berman (R) furthered his campaign against HNIC Tuesday, a man that he has before characterized as "God's punishment on us," by introducing a bill that would require future presidential and vice-presidential candidates to produce "the original birth certificate indicating that the person is a natural-born United States citizen" to the Texas secretary of state.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/1..._n_784914.html
Good thing Mr. Berman is choosing to spend his time on the REALLY important things huh? :sarcastic:
rickrock305
11-23-10, 16:33
Mayor Bloomberg Called President Obongo the Most "Arrogant" Man He Ever Met
You may recall that during President Obama’s vacation at Martha’s Vineyard, on August 27 he took in a round of golf at the Vineyard Golf Club in Edgartown, playing golf with New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg; Democratic lawyer, business man and éminence grise Vernon Jordan; and White House trip director (and former golf pro) Marvin Nicholson.
The pool report at the time said that "We are told Bloomberg and Obama talked in the clubhouse for about 15 mins about the economy. They then went to the driving range.”
Apparently – at least from a second-hand report – the Obama-Bloomberg convo could have gone better.
In an interview with The Australian Financial Review, conservative media magnate Rupert Murdoch says ''Bloomberg said it was a pleasant day. In conversation he put a few ideas … He said it was like verbal ping pong.”
Bloomberg, according to Murdoch, “came back and said 'I never met in my life such an arrogant man'."
...
500grains, you're a funny guy. Your news article is more than a bit misleading, and I'd bet the farm Bloomberg didn't say that.
Gutshot John
11-23-10, 16:44
Lets put that number into perspective for a moment. You guys realize that the cost for the wars in Afghanistan costs $200 million a day? And thats a hundred thousand people, equipment, fuel, food, etc.
Source? Congressional Research Service disagrees.
You guys are clinging to an anonymous quote in a foreign media outlet. Someone who is without a doubt NOT privileged to what this trip will entail and what it will cost.
Based on what? I've not repeated the number, it may be right, it may be wrong.
And in fact every United States official asked about it has literally laughed at it, calling in "comical" and "nonsense".
Yes I often find that they laugh at hard questions that they don't want to answer. Par for the course for Gibbsey. I think he similarly laughed at the notion that Obamacare would increase health care costs, that Democrats would lose the house and virtually anything else that might interrupt his "narrative" but hey if you want to buy into it...knock yourself out.
Is it possible the cost was significantly less...sure but that had nothing at all to do with my response.
But hey, its on the internet, it must be true!
Don't be dense. You didn't dispute the number in your post that I responded to initially. If you've got some subsequent information offer it up, other than that you're doing exactly what you're accusing us of doing.
Good thing Mr. Berman is choosing to spend his time on the REALLY important things huh? :sarcastic:
So you don't think that it is important for a person to be Constitutionally qualified to be President?
Bloomberg, according to Murdoch, “came back and said 'I never met in my life such an arrogant man'."
...
500grains, you're a funny guy. Your news article is more than a bit misleading, and I'd bet the farm Bloomberg didn't say that.
Perhaps you are right, but there is no way for either of us to know. In fact, I might agree that he said 'asinine' rather than 'arrogant'. But who knows.
rickrock305
11-23-10, 21:46
Source? Congressional Research Service disagrees.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0933935.html
The Congressional Research Service puts the cost of the Afghanistan war at $5.7 billion dollars a month. Thats roughly $190 million per day.
http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2010/09/08/afghanistan-war-costs-jump-congressional-report-shows/
Based on what? I've not repeated the number, it may be right, it may be wrong.
I wasn't specifically referring to you when i said "you guys".
While you have not explicitly repeated the number, your response to me indicated you believed it to be true.
Yes I often find that they laugh at hard questions that they don't want to answer. Par for the course for Gibbsey. I think he similarly laughed at the notion that Obamacare would increase health care costs, that Democrats would lose the house and virtually anything else that might interrupt his "narrative" but hey if you want to buy into it...knock yourself out.
I'm not buying into anything. I'm just using a little common sense.
Is it possible the cost was significantly less...sure but that had nothing at all to do with my response.
It had everything to do with your response because we were discussing the cost of the trip and the return on that investment.
Don't be dense. You didn't dispute the number in your post that I responded to initially. If you've got some subsequent information offer it up,
Sorry, I guess sarcasm doesn't really work too well on the internet.
Subsequent info to follow.
Andy Card, former White House chief of staff under President George W. Bush, told Anderson Cooper that the $200 million per day figure didn’t pass the smell test.
At the Pentagon, spokesman Geoff Morrell debunked the 34 warship notion.
It’s “absolutely absurd this notion that somehow we were deploying 10 percent of the Navy — some 34 ships and an aircraft carrier — in support of the president’s trip to Asia,” Morrell said. “That’s just comical.”
Obama administration officials denounced the $200 million claim as “absurd,” but stopped well short of going on an all-out attack on the right-wing pimps of the story.
White House Communications Director Dan Pfeiffer blogged that the $200 million a day figure was “a long trip from reality ... it’s not even close to being true.”
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/india.asp
other than that you're doing exactly what you're accusing us of doing.
What am I accusing you of doing?
rickrock305
11-23-10, 21:51
So you don't think that it is important for a person to be Constitutionally qualified to be President?
All Mr Berman is doing here is playing politics and trying to win a couple voters. Obama showed his birth certificate. End of story.
When our country is in the shape its in, I think there are FAR more important priorities to be worried about than the validity of a candidate's birth certificate. And apparently the majority of the country really didn't give a shit either.
Gutshot John
11-23-10, 22:06
Seriously dude give it a rest we all know which side of the fence you sit on and so no one here gives you much credibility as an apologist for the left.
You said "wars" I read that as both Iraq and Afghanistan, my mistake. My sense though is that you meant to be unclear.
One more time, I've never claimed the $200M figure was accurate. You vetted it in your original post which I responded to.
Even if it was a quarter that much, my original point still stands and in the end you have no clue how much he spent.
Belmont31R
11-23-10, 22:11
Im not a birther but Obama has never shown his birth certificate. What he showed was a certificate of live birth which legally is not the same as a birth certificate.
Saying something is not true because you said so is not a valid debate tool.
rickrock305
11-23-10, 22:30
Seriously dude give it a rest we all know which side of the fence you sit on and so no one here gives you much credibility as an apologist for the left.
Truthfully, I'm an equal opportunity hater. I think the left and right are both equally full of shit. I find it pretty damn funny that on this and other right leaning boards I'm considered a flaming lefty, but on the more liberal boards I visit I'm a rabid right winger.
But I guess when you're far enough out on the fringe, everything seems left or right, depending.
You said "wars" I read that as both, my mistake. My sense though is that you meant to be unclear.
I meant to be unclear? :D :rolleyes:
It was clearly a typo, followed immediately by the word Afghanistan. Did you see Iraq there too? No, you didn't.
My sense is that you mean to attack me personally instead of addressing the topic. Its cool, I'm not complaining. I've come to expect it from you.
One more time, I've never claimed the $200M figure was accurate. You vetted it in your original post which I responded to.
Due to my history of posts on the subject, I figured the sarcasm would be apparent.
I certainly did not vet anything in regards to affirming the $200 million number. It was sarcasm. I've told you it was sarcasm. You choose to ignore that for obvious reasons.
While not explicitly claiming the $200M figure was accurate, your post responding to me seemed to assume it was.
Even if it was a quarter that much, my original point still stands and in the end you have no clue how much he spent.
Your point doesn't stand because the numbers are inaccurate, therefore rendering your point pretty much invalid.
Gutshot John
11-23-10, 22:40
No matter how wrong you are you just dance around and refuse to concede anything.
I wish I could say debating with you was interesting but in the end your sophomoric arguments are just tedious.
You're not very clever. You're not very well informed. You certainly can't argue in good faith.
In short welcome to my ignore list.
rickrock305
11-23-10, 22:41
No matter how wrong you are you just dance around and refuse to concede anything.
I wish I could say debating with you was interesting but in the end your sophomoric arguments are just tedious.
You're not very clever. You're not very well informed. You certainly can't argue in good faith.
In short welcome to my ignore list.
Thanks. Sure was a classy way of declaring defeat! :sarcastic:
My "sophomoric arguments" just reduced you to a blathering troll who can do nothing but attack me personally. The only one dancing here is YOU!
Belmont31R
11-23-10, 23:06
Can we talk about Obamas gay lover in here now?
Man this tacked Obama thread is going great! :sarcastic:
Im not a birther but Obama has never shown his birth certificate. What he showed was a certificate of live birth which legally is not the same as a birth certificate.
.
Dr. Sun Yat-Sen, founder of modern China through the 1911 revolution, had a Hawaiian Certificate of Live Birth. Dr. Sun was born in China.
Can we talk about Obamas gay lover in here now?
Man this tacked Obama thread is going great! :sarcastic:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/500grains/limpwrist.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/500grains/brokeback-mountain-2.jpg
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a324/martin_fierro/Obama/Obama_hurr.gif
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/ap/20100731/capt.c1110a1af0554eae9869daf11ef598f8-c1110a1af0554eae9869daf11ef598f8-0.jpg?x=309&y=345&q=85&sig=x7y5CBVAgv_m.LYRN4G7cw--
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/500grains/obama-phone-birth-certificate.jpg
Belmont31R
12-04-10, 15:44
So instead of doing things like, say, using our state department and CIA to stop guys, like, say the Christmas Day Bomber Obama has them spying on countries to get dirt on them to push his climate change agenda at Copenhagen. Good use of resources there!
The Chicago way being used against countries, and diverting resources from real threats.....
Hidden behind the save-the-world rhetoric of the global climate change negotiations lies the mucky realpolitik: money and threats buy political support; spying and cyberwarfare are used to seek out leverage.
The US diplomatic cables reveal how the US seeks dirt on nations opposed to its approach to tackling global warming; how financial and other aid is used by countries to gain political backing; how distrust, broken promises and creative accounting dog negotiations; and how the US mounted a secret global diplomatic offensive to overwhelm opposition to the controversial "Copenhagen accord", the unofficial document that emerged from the ruins of the Copenhagen climate change summit in 2009.
Negotiating a climate treaty is a high-stakes game, not just because of the danger warming poses to civilisation but also because re-engineering the global economy to a low-carbon model will see the flow of billions of dollars redirected.
Seeking negotiating chips, the US state department sent a secret cable on 31 July 2009 seeking human intelligence from UN diplomats across a range of issues, including climate change. The request originated with the CIA. As well as countries' negotiating positions for Copenhagen, diplomats were asked to provide evidence of UN environmental "treaty circumvention" and deals between nations.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/dec/03/wikileaks-us-manipulated-climate-accord
Remember the world was going to LOVE Obama!
Narcissistic personality disorder plus other psychiatric problems?
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703766704576009943102291486.html?mod=WSJ_Opinion_LEADTop
We have not in our lifetimes seen a president in this position. He spent his first year losing the center, which elected him, and his second losing his base, which is supposed to provide his troops. There isn't much left to lose! Which may explain Tuesday's press conference.
President Obama was supposed to be announcing an important compromise, as he put it, on tax policy. Normally a president, having agreed with the opposition on something big, would go through certain expected motions. He would laud the specific virtues of the plan, show graciousness toward the negotiators on the other side—graciousness implies that you won—and refer respectfully to potential critics as people who'll surely come around once they are fully exposed to the deep merits of the plan.
Instead Mr. Obama said, essentially, that he hates the deal he just agreed to, hates the people he made the deal with, and hates even more the people who'll criticize it. His statement was startling in the breadth of its animosity. Republicans are "hostage takers" who worship a "holy grail" of "tax cuts for the wealthy." "That seems to be their central economic doctrine."
As for the left, they ignore his accomplishments and are always looking for "weakness and compromise." They are "sanctimonious," "purist," and just want to "feel good about" themselves. In a difficult world, they cling to their "ideal positions" and constant charges of "betrayals."
Those not of the left might view all this as straight talk, and much needed. But if you were of the left it would only deepen your anger and sharpen your response. Which it did. "Gettysburg," "sellout," "disaster."
......
Belmont31R
12-10-10, 16:37
Looks like Bill Clinton is president again. Obama hands the reigns off to him, and leaves Clinton to run the White House.
Ever see a president do anything like this?
The ****ing wookie is more important?
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2010/12/10/obama_ditches_tax_cut_presser_after_bill_clinton_takes_control.html
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/500grains/DOJmobileunitobamaimmigration-1.jpg
Sign seen in the EiC's portion of Air Force One:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/500grains/PottyInstructions.jpg
Not sure what Belmont meant by the 'wookie' reference.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o201/redeyeddawg/FirstWookie.jpg
Belmont31R
12-11-10, 18:22
Man this Obama sticky thread worked out so well.
I guess its just you and me, 500....:(
Worry not Belmont! An internet crawler will save this stuff and 20 years from now some political science student will get his Ph.D. by measuring political moods during the "historic prezdency" by looking at forum postings. :)
But at least we can all be comforted that Attorney General Eric has publicly assured muslims that the Department of Justice's anti-Christian and anti-white policy will be enforced with ever-increasing diligence, and eventually all negative remarks against Islam will be met with heavy criminal punishment. God forbid that anyone would be biased against people actively trying to kill us and destroy our way of life.
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20101211/D9K1L4081.html
Bolt_Overide
12-14-10, 05:38
Its not that I disagree with the majority of the stuff either of you are posting in regards to obama. For the most part I agree with all of it.
Im just soo tired of it, I cant beleive we've let things go this far, and at this point Id rather just ignore it.
rickrock305
12-14-10, 10:12
Department of Justice's anti-Christian and anti-white policy will be enforced with ever-increasing diligence
Do you really believe this garbage? :rolleyes:
rickrock305
12-14-10, 10:12
Man this Obama sticky thread worked out so well.
I guess its just you and me, 500....:(
I'd be glad to participate if there were more than "anti-white" murmurings and photoshopped pictures.
when you're ready to have a grown up discussion, let me know.
I'd be glad to participate if there were more than "anti-white" murmurings and photoshopped pictures...
]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v641/500grains/DOJmobileunitobamaimmigration-1.jpg
Gosh, I was absolutely certain this one was real at least.
rickrock305
12-14-10, 16:06
sorry to ruin it for you :D
Historical parallels are important. Unprecedented printing of the currency. Government usurps unjustified powers. The "leader" villifies a certain segment of the country. Do you want more?
http://pumasunleashed.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/obama-as-hitler.jpg
rickrock305
12-14-10, 17:09
Do you want more?
How about spell checking your photoshops?
Belmont31R
12-14-10, 17:18
I'd be glad to participate if there were more than "anti-white" murmurings and photoshopped pictures.
when you're ready to have a grown up discussion, let me know.
Condescending much?
Ive posted several articles/opinions no one has responded to including you. You've been more than welcome to have an "adult conversation". Frankly merging everything Obama into one thread means we can't discuss a single topic without a bunch of other shit thrown in.
Belmont31R
12-14-10, 17:20
Its not that I disagree with the majority of the stuff either of you are posting in regards to obama. For the most part I agree with all of it.
Im just soo tired of it, I cant beleive we've let things go this far, and at this point Id rather just ignore it.
And thats why people like Obama and Pelosi are in office instead of other people. America sticks its head in the sand, and then wakes up a little but when someone like Obama ruffles their feathers a little bit.
Im tired of it, too, but eternal vigilance is whats required of us least we wake up one day in a world we'd rather not be in.
rickrock305
12-14-10, 17:24
Condescending much?
How is one supposed to respond to such childishness and ignorance?
Ive posted several articles/opinions no one has responded to including you. You've been more than welcome to have an "adult conversation". Frankly merging everything Obama into one thread means we can't discuss a single topic without a bunch of other shit thrown in.
Sorry, must have missed it between the photoshops and gay lover talk.
If you're looking at me to defend all things Obama, you got the wrong guy.
Belmont31R
12-14-10, 17:33
How is one supposed to respond to such childishness and ignorance?
Sorry, must have missed it between the photoshops and gay lover talk.
If you're looking at me to defend all things Obama, you got the wrong guy.
Well this is the Obama thread now. You're free to contribute your own posts to spur discussion instead of whining about what other people are posting. Thats how we got this singular thread...a few people complaining about Obama posts like they were forced at gunpoint to read them. It certainly wasn't my decision to toss everything in one thread, and I expressed my dissatisfaction about that decision right off the bat.
Gosh, I was absolutely certain this one was real at least.
:laugh:
Did someone say Obama is gay?
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_9HbPL9CfuVc/Sw_J2IHFf6I/AAAAAAAAA9U/wbXj8551Uls/s1600/bamaa.jpg
As in a butt pirate?
http://www.freakingnews.com/pictures/32000/Pirate-Obama--32161.jpg
A steamy love affair:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lX7Hqwq2WxU
White folks not gonna take it no more:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WY6IZsZt1xw
http://0.tqn.com/d/politicalhumor/1/7/w/w/1/obama_girl.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_FclBYjz9ptU/Sr8QZ36g5RI/AAAAAAAAAA0/XGEIdqD5gCM/S700/Obamaeye.jpg
Gun regulators propose emergency plan
By James V. Grimaldi and Sari Horwitz
Friday, December 17, 2010
To stem the flow of guns to Mexico, federal firearms regulators are proposing an emergency requirement that certain gun dealers along the southwestern border report bulk sales of so-called assault weapons beginning as soon as January.
Dealers would be required to alert authorities when they sell within five consecutive business days two or more semiautomatic rifles greater than .22 caliber with detachable magazines, according to the draft obtained by The Washington Post. Semiautomatic rifles such as AK-47s and AR-15s are favored by drug-trafficking organizations fighting the Mexican government.
ATF chief spokesman Scot Thomasson declined to comment.
...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/12/16/AR2010121606749.html
http://ts1.mm.bing.net/images/thumbnail.aspx?q=389086905380&id=6d7bfdfdbacb96ecbf19fcba0d8ce874
I dont particularly care for the idea in some ways but in others it may prove a point. I also feel that there is quite a bit of info missing on the proposal. I mean the ATF already requires an FFL to report a multiple gun transfer to them if you buy two or more pistols 5 business days.
If this is in fact enacted it would most likely prove that the U.S. is not the source (as most of us already know) of the "so-called assault weapons." But that info will never make it to MSM any way, it will just magically be forgotten.
... it would most likely prove that the U.S. is not the source (as most of us already know) of the "so-called assault weapons."
Biggest supplier of weapons to Mex drug gangs: Mex police and Mex military
Biggest supplier of weapons and funds to buy weapons to Mex police and Mex military: U.S. State Department
Head of US State Dept: Hilary Clinton
=> Therefore the biggest supplier of weapons to Mex drug gangs is Hilary Clinton.
But the border remains open.
Biggest supplier of weapons to Mex drug gangs: Mex police and Mex military
Biggest supplier of weapons and funds to buy weapons to Mex police and Mex military: U.S. State Department
Head of US State Dept: Hilary Clinton
=> Therefore the biggest supplier of weapons to Mex drug gangs is Hilary Clinton.
But the border remains open.
You sir are a genius!!!
Belmont31R
12-17-10, 22:02
federal firearms regulators
Maybe Im a bit dumb but who pray tell would these people be, and what gives them the authority to institute laws on FFL dealers along the SW border?
Where in the Constitution is "federal firearms regulator" listed?
Please enjoy this quality parody video made in the 'hood.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bpq1oKOd9nE
Thank you for your attention.
When the Ursurper in Chief talked about visiting 57 of the states which make up the US I was flabbergasted. This was not so much a gaffe as pure ignorance.
Then there were many incidents that were passed off as gaffes but were probably spoken from the heart, like when he was talking to Stepheopolous about "my muslim faith".
But with Eric Holder and his deadly purses yesterday, I am once again beginning to wonder if the present administration is simply low I.Q. territory which produces an uncountable number of gaffes. Check this one out from Secretary Napolitano:
“thousands of people are working 24/7, 364 days a year to keep the American people safe.”
http://michellemalkin.com/2010/12/20/homeland-security-takes-a-day-off/
First, a totally anti-business administration expects us to have "confidence in the economy" and risk capital which they may ruin or confiscate.
And now we are expected to have no concerns about terrorism because TSA hired a bunch of pervert gropers, even though the big boss does not know how many days there are in a year.
Are there any professionals left at the federal level? I used to have a lot of faith in the FBI, but that was before the organization produced John Pistole.
http://www.fireandreamitchell.com/wp-content/gallery/obama-corrupt-cabinet/janet_napolitano.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_E4nB9I9HSIw/TQGWfn_O2SI/AAAAAAAACPY/vBVNtY-I1W4/s1600/janet_big_sister_napolitano_is_watching_bumper_sticker-p128176791868334686trl0_400.jpg
People miss speak all the time, nothing new. So she ****ed up and said 364. Do we really have so little to do that we find error in every little ****ing thing.
Whootsinator
12-21-10, 19:08
People miss speak all the time, nothing new. So she ****ed up and said 364. Do we really have so little to do that we find error in every little ****ing thing.
Agreed, regarding at least the 264 days thing.
They're doing plenty more important things we could bitch about than misspeaking.
Suwannee Tim
12-21-10, 19:23
People miss speak all the time, nothing new. So she ****ed up and said 364. Do we really have so little to do that we find error in every little ****ing thing.
Do you remember when Dan Quayle misspelled potato smiley? Do you remember the mockery, the derision over a misspelled word? How about when Gerald Ford bumped his head? The media painted him as a bumbling klutz. This though he was an accomplished athlete. Do you remember when an intelligence failure was twisted into "Bush lied, people died!" Do you remember that? With all the garbage and bile spewed by the left you have the BALLS to begrudge us a little fun? If you don't like it then take a hike.
Don't forget how the left lambasted Bush for how he said Nuclear.
Complication
12-21-10, 20:53
I just watched the youtube clip (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EpGH02DtIws). He says he's visited "fifty.......seven" states with "one left to go" because his staff won't let him visit Alaska or Hawaii.
Sounds like he meant to say 47, with one left to go (48) not counting the two he's not planning on visiting (50). He was probably doing the math in his head (not having memorized the number of states he's visited), hence the pause and started with 50, knew he wasn't visiting 2, and there was "one left to go" which left him with 47... but he still had 50 in his head and let that slip.
I don't want to "misunderestimate" the importance of someone misspeaking but if you get up in front of a camera long enough often enough, you'll misspeak. Big deal. It's not like this is 3rd grade where we make fun of the kid who makes a mistake in front of the class.
There are plenty of valid criticisms of the President as well as his agenda and party. It seems a bit silly to make a lot of hay out of THIS.
Whootsinator
12-21-10, 21:08
If you don't like it then take a hike.
I think you've made a pretty idiotic and childish statement, Mr. Tim. What exactly do you mean by 'take a hike'? Where do you want us to leave, and where do you want us to go?
More importantly, why would you say that? Because we said give the guy a break regarding some slipped up wording? You've listed some instances where important figures in the past were criticized over small mistakes, and you're defending those figures. Now, however, you don't like the figure in question so you're doing exactly what you criticized. That SEEMS awfully hypocritical. I would think if you're so much better than 'the left' that you talk about, you would be able to stand back and say 'now wait a second, that's wrong... People shouldn't be doing that.'
We didn't say we agreed with him, we didn't say we liked him, we only said he made a small mistake of negligible consequence except to himself, and he shouldn't be criticized so harshly for it.
Do you remember when Dan Quayle misspelled potato smiley? Do you remember the mockery, the derision over a misspelled word? How about when Gerald Ford bumped his head? The media painted him as a bumbling klutz. This though he was an accomplished athlete. Do you remember when an intelligence failure was twisted into "Bush lied, people died!" Do you remember that? With all the garbage and bile spewed by the left you have the BALLS to begrudge us a little fun? If you don't like it then take a hike.
LMAO :sarcastic: You're bitching and moaning over what you see as unjust yet you choose to do the same thing... This shit is getting out of control. Let's find some real issues and not juvenile bullshit.
Sounds like he meant to say 47, with one left to go (48) not counting the two he's not planning on visiting (50). He was probably doing the math in his head (not having memorized the number of states he's visited), hence the pause and started with 50, knew he wasn't visiting 2, and there was "one left to go" which left him with 47... but he still had 50 in his head and let that slip.
I don't want to "misunderestimate" the importance of someone misspeaking but if you get up in front of a camera long enough often enough, you'll misspeak. Big deal. It's not like this is 3rd grade where we make fun of the kid who makes a mistake in front of the class.
I misspoke once during a command inspection. My first line leaders name was Stevie Watts. I was missing a name tag for the door and one of the guys told me "Stevie has it". Well Top came in and asked me where my tag was and (you guessed it) I said "Stevie has it". That went over well. :sarcastic::laugh:
Complication
12-21-10, 21:21
I'm sure he was forgiving and kindly offered you a chance to rectify your mistake...
MarshallDodge
12-21-10, 21:30
Well one thing is for sure, Obama is bad for this country.
Glenn Beck was right!!
Yet President Obama, long an ardent backer of net neutrality, is ignoring both Congress and adverse court rulings, especially by a federal appeals court in April that the agency doesn't have the power to enforce net neutrality. He is seeking to impose his will on the Internet through the executive branch. FCC Chairman Julius Genachowski, a former law school friend of Mr. Obama, has worked closely with the White House on the issue. Official visitor logs show he's had at least 11 personal meetings with the president.
The net neutrality vision for government regulation of the Internet began with the work of Robert McChesney, a University of Illinois communications professor who founded the liberal lobby Free Press in 2002. Mr. McChesney's agenda? "At the moment, the battle over network neutrality is not to completely eliminate the telephone and cable companies," he told the website SocialistProject in 2009. "But the ultimate goal is to get rid of the media capitalists in the phone and cable companies and to divest them from control."
A year earlier, Mr. McChesney wrote in the Marxist journal Monthly Review that "any serious effort to reform the media system would have to necessarily be part of a revolutionary program to overthrow the capitalist system itself." Mr. McChesney told me in an interview that some of his comments have been "taken out of context." He acknowledged that he is a socialist and said he was "hesitant to say I'm not a Marxist."
For a man with such radical views, Mr. McChesney and his Free Press group have had astonishing influence.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703886904576031512110086694.html?mod=WSJ_Opinion_LEADTop=
Well one thing is for sure, Obama is bad for this country.
I think that can be said for 95% of presidents who preceded his presidency. President George Bush wasn't exactly a great one. He spent like a drunk, and infringed on our rights every chance given by using the words "terrorism" and "security". This country has gone so far from it's founding principals I really can't see how it can ever return to them.
Please enjoy this quality parody video made in the 'hood.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bpq1oKOd9nE
Thank you for your attention.
the instrumental is pretty good. And "michelle obama" cracks me up. lol:sarcastic:
Belmont31R
12-21-10, 23:04
Glenn Beck was right!!
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703886904576031512110086694.html?mod=WSJ_Opinion_LEADTop=
If you notice since Obama took office they have done 2 things now that basically open the floodgates for communist style laws unless they are struck down in the future.
1. The government can tell individual citizens to buy certain products just for being a citizen.
2. The government can tell businesses what products they have to sell if they want to remain in business, and basically that business cannot decide for themselves what products to offer.
Putting this really simply, if these rules and laws stand, the government can tell business what products to offer and tell citizens what products they have to buy.
Quite the combo isn't it? See when these things are passed or enacted you have to think out of the box, and look at what else this could be applied to. It would be basically like telling Remington they have to make AR15's, and every citizen has to buy an AR15. Or on the flip side every citizen has to buy insurance, and what insurance is offered is decided by the government.
A company cannot decide for itself how to use its own property. All these cable companies own these lines everyone uses to surf the net but they cannot decide for themselves how to sell access to those lines.
Imagine what else that authority/power can be used for. This is something people don't think about. Sure I don't want to see restrictions on my internet based on what sites I go to but I even moreso don't want the government to have that power because it can be turned onto to something else that is much more sinister.
ETA: The only thing left is for the gov to seize businesses, and run them much like they did with GM and Chrysler. If they can run those 2 giant companies why cant they run other ones? The trifecta is almost complete. Well actually in some cases its about 3/4ths complete. Gov tells citizens what to buy, gov tells businesses what products to offer, and gov takes 30% of their profits. Bump that last number up a little bit, and do we really have free businesses?
dont forget the guy who was worried about tipping over Guam ?
some congress guy ?
President George Bush wasn't exactly a great one. He spent like a drunk, and infringed on our rights every chance given by using the words "terrorism" and "security". =
That is true. THe current administration is doing it x10.
dont forget the guy who was worried about tipping over Guam ?
some congress guy ?
Hank Johnson capsizing Guam:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNZczIgVXjg
An artist's interpretation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITx4aFhASTE&feature=related
Scientific support for the Hank Johnson island capsizing theory:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6a7v49hXXoA&feature=related
http://i41.tinypic.com/1qlwn5.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/4h4bat.jpg
http://www.madtomatoe.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/Guam-Tip-Over-Capsize-Hank-Johnson1.jpg
http://libertyledger.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/democratic_seal.jpg
variablebinary
12-22-10, 05:19
500grains, did you ever think you might have a case of Obama Derangement Syndrome...
How about giving the forum a break from the Obama and Obama-ish related threads for a little bit or at least putting them in the one Obama master thread.
That is true. THe current administration is doing it x10.
I'm pretty sure we lost more with the last administrations, they did have 8 years however.
I'm pretty sure we lost more with the last administrations, they did have 8 years however.
Bush isnt president anymore.
move on.
we have a NEW Idiot in Chief who is doing even more damage.
Constantly falling back on the piss poor excuse of "but but but, Bush did it" is very pathetic.
How about giving the forum a break from the Obama and Obama-ish related threads for a little bit or at least putting them in the one Obama master thread.
I know, 'they all look alike' and such, but Hank Johnson is not Obama and does not appear to be have been politically affiliated with Obama except for also being a democrat.
Johnson:
http://ts1.mm.bing.net/images/thumbnail.aspx?q=322753933880&id=3b0c367262052d0514ad13059511b284
Obama:
http://ts4.mm.bing.net/images/thumbnail.aspx?q=401790735755&id=7f502446ded8f29e56265f340914399c
Bush isnt president anymore.
move on.
we have a NEW Idiot in Chief who is doing even more damage.
Constantly falling back on the piss poor excuse of "but but but, Bush did it" is very pathetic.
:sarcastic: Piss poor excuse & pathetic? Bush did **** shit up, so has Obama, so did Clinton, so did Bush Sr., so did the almighty Regan. Hell even the old peanut farmer ****ed shit up. Maybe people are so damn corrupt that you need one corrupt mf'er above all else for life. Would save a lot of time and bs arguing.
I hold no prejudice, incompetence is incompetence. I could give two shits what party they belong to. So until the shit they ****ed up is corrected the problems still exist so they're still a problem today and have led to more problems, and will continue to lead to further problems down the road. To pretend as if leaving office is a free pass to wash your hands of any wrong doings is pathetic.
Belmont31R
12-22-10, 18:15
:sarcastic: Piss poor excuse & pathetic? Bush did **** shit up, so has Obama, so did Clinton, so did Bush Sr., so did the almighty Regan. Hell even the old peanut farmer ****ed shit up. Maybe people are so damn corrupt that you need one corrupt mf'er above all else for life. Would save a lot of time and bs arguing.
I hold no prejudice, incompetence is incompetence. I could give two shits what party they belong to. So until the shit they ****ed up is corrected the problems still exist so they're still a problem today and have led to more problems, and will continue to lead to further problems down the road. To pretend as if leaving office is a free pass to wash your hands of any wrong doings is pathetic.
They all screw things up because the fed has swallowed up so much area of responsibility in this country they cannot possibly manage everything they do with any degree of success. If you read through Section 1-8, and look at what Congress is really supposed to focus on they would have all the time in the world to do things right. Now they give members 3 days (sometimes less) to review a bill before voting, and everything is constantly rushed through.
If you want the gov to "get better" at what they do they need to reduce the volume and density of what they are doing right now. Go back to what they are supposed to do, and let the states handle the rest...the way it was supposed to be done.
:sarcastic: Piss poor excuse & pathetic? Bush did **** shit up, so has Obama, so did Clinton, so did Bush Sr., so did the almighty Regan. Hell even the old peanut farmer ****ed shit up. Maybe people are so damn corrupt that you need one corrupt mf'er above all else for life. Would save a lot of time and bs arguing.
I hold no prejudice, incompetence is incompetence. I could give two shits what party they belong to. So until the shit they ****ed up is corrected the problems still exist so they're still a problem today and have led to more problems, and will continue to lead to further problems down the road. To pretend as if leaving office is a free pass to wash your hands of any wrong doings is pathetic.
no arguements here, they all ****ed things up.
but...
every time obama is brought up, here you come with
"but but but Bush"...
so you may want to work on that a bit ;)
FWIW, The BATFE and U.S. government are required to open this request in the Federal Register for public comment. Even the notice itself states:
This notice requests
comments from the public and affected agencies concerning the proposed
information collection.
However, they specifically do not want public comments and make every effort to discourage public comments in several ways. The Federal Register search engine is effectively useless. Trying to search for this specific notice using keywords, BATFE or the notice date will send you on a fruitless search designed to discourage your efforts. The notice posted on the BATFE website conveniently omits the page number, which is the only effective way to find the notice in the Federal Register. The page number for this notice is 79021 by the way. Additionally, unlike many notices they know will garner significant public interest, they have omitted the option to comment on this particular notice online. They have also omitted the physical OMB address for public comment, and instead posted a toll number (202)395-6466. Finally, in their instructions for comments, they advise you to address your comments specifically to four narrow subjects regarding the notice:
Written comments and suggestions from the public and affected
agencies concerning the proposed collection of information. Your
comments should address one or more of the following four points:
--Evaluate whether the proposed collection of information is necessary
for the proper performance of the functions of the agency, including
whether the information will have practical utility;
--Evaluate the accuracy of the agencies estimate of the burden of the
proposed collection of information, including the validity of the
methodology and assumptions used;
--Enhance the quality, utility, and clarity of the information to be
collected; and
--Minimize the burden of the collection of information on those who are
to respond, including through the use of appropriate automated,
electronic, mechanical, or other technological collection techniques or
other forms of information technology, e.g., permitting electronic
submission of responses.
For your convenience, I have attached the web addresses for the Federal Register, .pdf file of the actual notice, html file of the notice, and the press release by the BATFE regarding the notice. More importantly, I am attaching the email address of the official point of contact for this notice within BATFE. This person is responsible internally for collecting comments and suggestions for the "regular review" of the information collection request. If you, like me, find it disturbing that BATFE and OMB have by all outward appearances intentionally made it difficult to respond to this notice, I would also recommend that you contact your congressman's office to lodge a complaint. I would point out that if you wish to officially comment, it is highly recommended that you refrain from inflammatory comments. Keeping your comments fact based and to the point will make them much more effective. Feel free to post this information anywhere else you care to.
http://www.gpoaccess.gov/fr/
http://edocket.acces.../2010-31761.pdf
http://frwebgate3.ac...action=retrieve
http://www.atf.gov/p...on-webcast.html
And last but not least: Barbara.Terrell@atf.gov
While significant resistance by the NRA and GOA can affect this proposal, significant public comments in the NPRM can often defeat proposals such as these. It all counts in the final tally.
Thanks for that info.
http://iowntheworld.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/barackdouche.jpg
Obama saved us from breadlines!!!
Oprah Winfrey says America would’ve had breadlines if Barack Obama wasn’t elected. That overpaid queen of daytime TV is opening her mouth again—and when she does, it usually includes praise for President Obama. In a new interview with Parade magazine, the talk show queen, who recently refocused the priorities of America by denying in an interview that she was a lesbian, offers nothing but support for Obama. Winfrey says that she is pleased as can be with everything that number 44 has thus far accomplished in his first two years. Declaring that she’s not been disappointed in anything Obama has so far done in office, Winfrey also took the time to scold her fellow Americans by reminding them that they should instead be grateful [sic] for everything Obama has done.
http://www.examiner.com/american-politics-in-vancouver/oprah-says-america-would-ve-had-breadlines-if-barack-obama-wasn-t-elected
http://www.thelookingspoon.com/tlsimages/blog/2010/phantom_of_the_oprah-sm.jpg
Video explaining to President Soetero why America rejects his agenda:
http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=JVAhr4hZDJE&vq=medium#t=19
America's Stalin is alive and well.
http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/31587
TSA, Youth Corps Now Officially part of Obama Gestapo
By Sher Zieve Thursday, December 30, 2010
The problem with believing one is “safe” from the growing and increasingly ravenous Obama & Co Police State if one embraces—or pretends to embrace—the anti-God/anti-American Leftist viewpoint, is that the belief itself is fallacious. If you espouse these beliefs as your own, the Marxist/Leninist crocodiles currently occupying the power seats (that’s power over We-the-People) in Washington D.C. may eat you last. But, do not be fooled—they will eat you. It is within their innate, immutable and distinct nature to do so.
...
http://www.dirtydozensbunker.com/photoplog/images/36/large/1_wizardofobama.jpg
Hey Belmont, where the heck are you? :confused:
Bolt_Overide
12-30-10, 23:37
maybe one of the Marxist/Leninist crocodiles ate him ?! :sad:
Congress won't pass your legislation? No problem! Just implement it by regulation.
Government by regulation. Shhh.
charles krauthammer
Friday, December 31, 2010
Most people don't remember Obamacare's notorious Section 1233, mandating government payments for end-of-life counseling. It aroused so much anxiety as a possible first slippery step on the road to state-mandated late-life rationing that the Senate never included it in the final health-care law.
Well, it's back - by administrative fiat. A month ago, Medicare issued a regulation providing for end-of-life counseling during annual "wellness" visits. It was all nicely buried amid the simultaneous release of hundreds of new Medicare rules.
Rep. Earl Blumenauer (D-Ore.), author of Section 1233, was delighted. "Mr. Blumenauer's office celebrated 'a quiet victory,' but urged supporters not to crow about it," reports the New York Times.
...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/12/30/AR2010123004409.html
AND
he Administration's Administrative Tyranny Marches On
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This administration is abusive enough when it acts outside its constitutional authority, but it is even more tyrannical when it affirmatively thwarts the express will of the Congress on matters within the legislative domain.
When Congress denied Obama authority to transfer money to the International Monetary Fund, he did so anyway, issuing an executive order promising to give that body $140 billion for redistribution to Third World countries.
Now he's made another mockery of bipartisanship and the Constitution in making six recess appointments, including two people so objectionable that a near supermajority of Democratic senators wouldn't confirm them: James Cole as deputy attorney general, whose lax position in the war on terror is disturbing, and Francis J. Ricciardone Jr. as ambassador to Turkey.
Meanwhile, Obama's Environmental Protection Agency is gearing up to engage in a defiant end run around Congress by attempting to impose cap-and-trade-type regulations by administrative fiat after Obama's failed attempt to shove this nightmarish disaster through Congress.
http://townhall.com/columnists/DavidLimbaugh/2010/12/31/the_administrations_administrative_tyranny_marches_on
I'm pretty sure we lost more with the last administrations, they did have 8 years however.
I don't think so. They are saying that the 111th congress that just ended added more to the public debt than all the first 100 congresses together or something like that and nearly 50% more than the 110th (which was also under control of Pelosi in the House).
I don't know what the 8 year total is but on a per year basis this is the most expensive President and Congress ever and will likely way outstretch the 8 Bush years. Not that Bush didn't spend like a drunken sailor in a whorehouse. I am not excusing him.
http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/finance/2010/December/111th-Congress-Most-Expensive-in-History/
Belmont31R
12-31-10, 17:04
Bush was running around 300-500 billion a year in debt. Obama is running 1.5 trillion plus a year. So it would logically take Obama 1/3rd the time to rack up the same level of debt as Bush.
Also, although Bush signed the TARP bill which was 650 billion in debt spending all that money was paid back with interest. However Obama/Reid/Pelosi went out and spent it again and this time we are not getting that money back. Part of the TARP law that passed was the money that came back in was supposed to be used to pay down the debt. They ignored this, and just spent it instead of applying it to the debt. TARP would have paid back more than it cost us. Not that I agree with the principal of spending 650 billion bailing out banks but at least that spending was going to get paid back at some point. You can't really say it added anything to the debt.
And if you want to look Bush raised the debt less as a percent of GDP than Reagan did or many other previous presidents. The debt number's look high because we're comparing 2005 dollars as opposed to say 1916 dollars. At one point we had over 200% debt to GDP ratio. The amount Bush raised it is rather insignificant because for most of his presidency we have pretty positive economic growth.
Is my memory faulty, or do I correctly recall that Obama campaigned against Bush on the deficit?
President Obama provoked fresh outrage today after taking a 20-man motorcade to visit a childhood friend during his lavish Christmas holiday in Hawaii.
The 10-vehicle convoy drove the president and wife Michelle from his rental property in Kailua, across highways cleared of traffic and through a military community to reach Bobby Titcomb's beachfront house.
Mr Obama, who spent eight years at Punahou School in Hawaii before graduating in 1979, has splashed out $1.5m on his trip – a decision that will not endear him to the millions of Americans facing economic hardship in the New Year.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1343050/All-Presidents-men-Obama-enjoys-20-MAN-motorcade-splashes-1-5m-Hawaiian-holiday.html
Belmont31R
02-07-11, 16:56
For those who doubt Obama is a marxist check this out:
"If we're fighting to reform the tax code and increase exports, the benefits cannot just translate into greater profits and bonuses for those at the top. They have to be shared by American workers, who need to know that opening markets will lift their standard of living as well as your bottom line," President Obama told the Chamber of Commerce on Monday morning.
Vid at link: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/02/07/obama_corporate_profits_have_to_be_shared_by_american_workers.html
Still an enemy of business but like any good rich marxist he is a millionaire elitist. Did he share the millions he made off book sales with the workers who printed all those books? Or its just other people's money he wants to share.
Belmont31R
02-15-11, 10:46
British historian and professor rips Obama live on MSNBC Morning Joe...leaves Morning Joe staff speechless.
http://freedomslighthouse.net/2011/02/15/morning-joe-crew-left-shell-shocked-by-professors-dismantling-of-obama-foreign-policy-on-egypt-video-21411/
Our affirmative action president has a low I.Q.:
Is Obama Stupid and Lazy?
Obama may not be as intelligent as his supporters assure us.
By Steve Baldwin, a Western Journalism Exclusive
Is Obama Stupid and Lazy? Although that’s quite a provocative question, evidence is mounting that Obama may not be as intelligent as his supporters and cheerleaders in the media constantly assure us. The reality may be that Obama is mostly a creation of the liberal media. Indeed, the more we dig into his past, the more we find very little substance and discover how a network of liberal professors, law firms, and others, gave him a pass on performance while he pursued his political agenda.
...
http://www.westernjournalism.com/exclusive-investigative-reports/is-obama-stupid-and-lazy/
Our affirmative action president has a low I.Q.:
I've never thought him particularly bright. His ad-lib speeches can be funny.
The guy who wrote the article you linked to needs to check his own grammar however...
From the email circuit:
If George W. Bush had doubled the national debt, which had taken more than two centuries to accumulate, in one year, would you have approved?
If George W.. Bush had then proposed to double the debt again within 10 years, would you have approved?
If George W. Bush had criticized a state law that he admitted he never even read, would you think that he is just an ignorant hot head?
If George W. Bush joined the country of Mexico and sued a state in the United States to force that state to continue to allow illegal immigration, would you question his patriotism and wonder who's side he was on?
If George Bush had pronounced the Marine Corps like Marine Corpse would you think him an idiot?
If George W. Bush had put 87,000 workers out of work by arbitrarily placing a moratorium on offshore oil drilling on companies that have one of the best safety records of any industry because one company had an accident would you have agreed?
If George W. Bush had used a forged document as the basis of the moratorium that would render 87000 American workers unemployed would you support him?
If George W. Bush had been the first President to need a TelePrompTer installed to be able to get through a press conference, would you have laughed and said this is more proof of how inept he is on his own and is really controlled by smarter men behind the scenes?
If George W. Bush had spent hundreds of thousands of dollars to take Laura Bush to a play in NYC, would you have approved?
If George W. Bush had reduced your retirement plan's holdings of GM stock by 90% and given the unions a majority stake in GM, would you have approved?
If George W. Bush had made a joke at the expense of the Special Olympics, would you have approved?
If George W. Bush had given Gordon Brown a set of inexpensive and incorrectly formatted DVDs, when Gordon Brown had given him a thoughtful and historically significant gift, would you have approved?
If George W. Bush had given the Queen of England an iPod containing videos of his speeches, would you have thought this embarrassingly narcissistic and tacky?
If George W. Bush had bowed to the King of Saudi Arabia , would you have approved?
If George W.. Bush had visited Austria and made reference to the nonexistent "Austrian language," would you have brushed it off as a minor slip?
If George W. Bush had filled his cabinet and circle of advisers with people who cannot seem to keep current in their income taxes, would you have approved?
If George W. Bush had stated that there were 57 states in the United States , would you have said that he is clueless.
If George W. Bush would have flown all the way to Denmark to make a five minute speech about how the Olympics would benefit him walking out his front door in Texas , would you have thought he was a self important, conceited, egotistical jerk.
If George W. Bush had been so Spanish illiterate as to refer to "Cinco de Cuatro" in front of the Mexican ambassador when it was the 5th of May (Cinco de Mayo), and continued to flub it when he tried again, would you have winced in embarrassment?
If George W. Bush had misspelled the word "advice" would you have hammered him for it for years like Dan Quayle and potatoes as proof of what a dunce he is?
If George W. Bush had burned 9,000 gallons of jet fuel to go plant a single tree on Earth Day, would you have concluded he's a hypocrite?
If George W. Bush's administration had okayed Air Force One flying low over millions of people followed by a jet fighter in downtown Manhattan causing widespread panic, would you have wondered whether they actually get what happened on 9-11?
If George W.. Bush had failed to send relief aid to flood victims throughout the Midwest with more people killed or made homeless than in New Orleans , would you want it made into a major ongoing political issue with claims of racism and incompetence?
If George W. Bush had created the position of 32 Czars who report directly to him, bypassing the House and Senate on much of what is happening in America , would you have approved.
If George W. Bush had ordered the firing of the CEO of a major corporation, even though he had no constitutional authority to do so, would you have approved?
This topic has been touched on in some threads, but I thought I would be explicit about my view in this post (feel free to do the same).
Bill O'Reilly critizes "birthers" (people who want to see proof that Barack was born in the USA) as irrational and unreasonable looney toons, but at the same time he says, "I believe that machines are on the verge of taking over the world." I think there are some short circuits in his cranium.
"birthers?" there's actually a label for that? and a stupid label, at that.
well, bill o'reilly is an entertainer... and image is the entertainer's success or failure. he doesn't want to end up like glenn beck.
everyone knows obama is an illegal immigrant. whether people deny it or confirm it has everything to do with the image they're trying to portray- the camp(s) they ally with. nothing else.
everyone knows obama is an illegal immigrant.
They do? Everyone??
Why is this still going on here?
RogerinTPA
02-20-11, 15:13
Jeezzzz...not this shit again.:rolleyes:
Cagemonkey
02-20-11, 15:14
"birthers?" there's actually a label for that? and a stupid label, at that.
well, bill o'reilly is an entertainer... and image is the entertainer's success or failure. he doesn't want to end up like glenn beck.
everyone knows obama is an illegal immigrant. whether people deny it or confirm it has everything to do with the image they're trying to portray- the camp(s) they ally with. nothing else.everyone knows obama is an illegal immigrant. In this country its not what you know, but what you can prove. The power elites did a good job at covering their tracks. People we talking about him being President before he even entered the Senate. They had plenty of time to pave the way for Obama so that he could do their bidding.
Thomas M-4
02-20-11, 15:25
I believe that Bill was more concerned with wasting resources with the argument. Even if a doctor in Kenya stepped forward to say that he was born there and would swear on it that it still wouldn't be enough to remove him from the office.
I saw a news clip recently where someone had an original copy of a local Hawaiian newspaper from the month he was born with his birth announcement clearly visible. Could be a forgery, but I just didn't see it as such.
A birth announcement announces a birth but not the location of the birth. A certificate of live birth which Barry posted on the internet does the same. Dr. Sun Yat-sen, the father of the 1911 Chinese revolution (and born in China) lived in Hawaii in exile for a while and had a Hawaii certificate of live birth just like Barry.
But such document fails to do what a birth certificate does - identify the hospital where the baby was born, the doctor who delivered, and the time of day of the birth.
I have no proof that Obama is not a citizen. But he likewise has offered no proof that he is a citizen. All we have is a big question mark.
They do? Everyone??
Why is this still going on here?
Yeah, I think most thinking people "know" there is something to it or else he would just show the damn birth certificate. Where there is smoke, there is fire.
Having said that, I don't really care. Unless someone comes up with a smoking gun on this, this line of attack is going no where fast and is not worth the effort.
Yeah, I think most thinking people "know" there is something to it or else he would just show the damn birth certificate.
So I will assume I am then deemed as an unthinking individual. Tell me, how many other birth certificates belonging to Presidents have you been witness to?
Where there is smoke, there is fire....Unless someone comes up with a smoking gun on this...
So, there's smoke but no smoking gun? Well what created the smoke then? I know the history, but no specific facts point to the idiot being born outside the U.S.
variablebinary
02-20-11, 17:53
Obama's election is never going to be overturned by the legislative or the judicial so this birther movement is DOA
Furthermore, Obama knows all too well that by keeping this issue alive on some level he can control his adversaries to some extent and waste their resources to futile endeavors.
Furthermore, Obama knows all too well that by keeping this issue alive on some level he can control his adversaries to some extent and waste their resources to futile endeavors.
Not looking to be the dissenting voice here, but what respectable "adversaries" are still pondering this issue? No one gives a shit anymore from what I can see.
variablebinary
02-21-11, 09:52
Not looking to be the dissenting voice here, but what respectable "adversaries" are still pondering this issue? No one gives a shit anymore from what I can see.
Fragmented opposition is better than unified opposition, irrespective of the size, scope and credibility.
Personally, I care. Not that I am a birther, but I would certainly want corrective legal action taken if the issue was proven true.
rickrock305
02-21-11, 14:03
A birth announcement announces a birth but not the location of the birth. A certificate of live birth which Barry posted on the internet does the same. Dr. Sun Yat-sen, the father of the 1911 Chinese revolution (and born in China) lived in Hawaii in exile for a while and had a Hawaii certificate of live birth just like Barry.
But such document fails to do what a birth certificate does - identify the hospital where the baby was born, the doctor who delivered, and the time of day of the birth.
So according to your theory this vast conspiracy must have started with a fraudulent birth announcement from 1961 in a Hawaii paper. And the entire hospital and government system of Hawaii is also on the dole, being that they've all came out and said its legit.
So the logical progression here is that you believe that Obama is completely clueless and stupid, yet somehow created this vast conspiracy going back to the date of his birth.
I have no proof that Obama is not a citizen. But he likewise has offered no proof that he is a citizen. All we have is a big question mark.
He's a citizen. Unarguable fact.
What I find interesting is no president in history has ever been questioned in this manner.
What I find interesting is no president in history has ever been questioned in this manner.
we've never had a president from kenya before.
He's a citizen. Unarguable fact.
No one is questioning whether he is a citizen or not. What is being questioned is whether he is a so-called Natural Born Citizen.
Show me a verifiable birth announcement from a Hawaii newspaper that can be verified to mean he was born in Hawaii, not just that a citizen of Hawaii had a birth (I have seen birth announcements in my local paper that referred to a mother from the area but the actual birth took place in another state).
If he has nothing to hide, why is he hiding it?
Where there is smoke, there is usually fire. Obama is making an awful lot of smoke right now with his refusal to release his long-form birth certificate (and lots of other records).
rickrock305
02-21-11, 14:23
we've never had a president from kenya before.
we still haven't.
we still haven't.
There is NO proof of that. That is the problem. What is he hiding and why?
This whole "birther" thing could go away with just one action by Obama. He could release a verifiable long form birth certificate proving birth in Hawaii. One showing the attending physician, date and time, and hospital where the birth took place. My Arizona birth certificate from not much later than this (1966) shows these things, as do my kids Utah birth certificates (2003 and 2008).
The fact that Obama WON'T release these things is pretty telling and leads to all sorts of speculations and stuff and basically fans the fires that Obama refuses to put out.
MarshallDodge
02-21-11, 14:37
Not looking to be the dissenting voice here, but what respectable "adversaries" are still pondering this issue? No one gives a shit anymore from what I can see.
Myself included. The damage has been done, the man is in office and has proceeded to just about bankrupt this country. Time to put our efforts toward getting him replaced with someone that understands and follows the Constitution.
The fact that Obama WON'T release these things is pretty telling and leads to all sorts of speculations and stuff and basically fans the fires that Obama refuses to put out.
as a public figure, if i had the means to very, very easily put to rest any question of my eligibility for the office i held, i would release it so fast it'd give my opposition whiplash.
but i guess kenyans see things differently.
rickrock305
02-21-11, 14:43
No one is questioning whether he is a citizen or not.
Wrong. Actually multiple people in this very thread are doing just that.
Show me a verifiable birth announcement from a Hawaii newspaper that can be verified to mean he was born in Hawaii, not just that a citizen of Hawaii had a birth (I have seen birth announcements in my local paper that referred to a mother from the area but the actual birth took place in another state).
You're trying to give me a burden of proof that I could never possibly live up to so you can turn around and say "See, told ya!" Its ridiculous and disingenuous.
Hawaii has two major newspapers, the Honolulu Advertiser and the Star Bulletin.
BOTH newspapers include birth announcements, and BOTH newspapers record the August 4th, 1961 birth of Barack Obama.
http://whatreallyhappened.com/IMAGES/SMALL_obama-1961-birth-announcement-from-honolulu-advertiser0000.gif
http://whatreallyhappened.com/IMAGES/SMALL_ObamaBirthStarBulletin.jpg
Here's some more supporting evidence.
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html
State Health Director confirms...
The Associated Press quoted Chiyome Fukino as saying that both she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama's original birth certificate.
The certificate has all the elements the State Department requires for proving citizenship to obtain a U.S. passport: "your full name, the full name of your parent(s), date and place of birth, sex, date the birth record was filed, and the seal or other certification of the official custodian of such records." The names, date and place of birth, and filing date are all evident on the scanned version, and you can see the seal above.
The document is a "certification of birth," also known as a short-form birth certificate. The long form is drawn up by the hospital and includes additional information such as birth weight and parents' hometowns. The short form is printed by the state and draws from a database with fewer details. The Hawaii Department of Health's birth record request form does not give the option to request a photocopy of your long-form birth certificate, but their short form has enough information to be acceptable to the State Department. We tried to ask the Hawaii DOH why they only offer the short form, among other questions, but they have not given a response.
The scan released by the campaign shows halos around the black text, making it look (to some) as though the text might have been pasted on top of an image of security paper. But the document itself has no such halos, nor do the close-up photos we took of it. We conclude that the halo seen in the image produced by the campaign is a digital artifact from the scanning process.
We asked the Obama campaign about the date stamp and the blacked-out certificate number. The certificate is stamped June 2007, because that's when Hawaii officials produced it for the campaign, which requested that document and "all the records we could get our hands on" according to spokesperson Shauna Daly. The campaign didn't release its copy until 2008, after speculation began to appear on the Internet questioning Obama's citizenship. The campaign then rushed to release the document, and the rush is responsible for the blacked-out certificate number. Says Shauna: "[We] couldn't get someone on the phone in Hawaii to tell us whether the number represented some secret information, and we erred on the side of blacking it out. Since then we've found out it's pretty irrelevant for the outside world." The document we looked at did have a certificate number; it is 151 1961 - 010641.
http://www.factcheck.org/demos/factcheck/imagefiles/image/Ask%20FactCheck%20Images/Birth%20Certificate/hands.jpg
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcertificate.asp
So lets recap. We have two separate papers listing the birth announcement. We have the obstetrician who delivered him talking about it. We have the actual short form birth certificate. We have the Director of the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying its authenticity personally. We have judges dismissing these claims from their courts as "frivolous and not worth of discussion", we have people who have seen and held the actual birth certificate, etc.
Now, what more proof can be provided than that? Furthermore, what proof do you have that he is NOT a citizen? If you are making the claim that he is not a citizen, then the burden of proof lies on you. Obama has provided what he needs to have provided to prove he is a citizen according to State Department standards.
If he has nothing to hide, why is he hiding it?
Where there is smoke, there is usually fire. Obama is making an awful lot of smoke right now with his refusal to release his long-form birth certificate (and lots of other records).
He's not hiding anything. He responded, end of story. He's the president of the country, I think he has more important things to do than run around responding to every conspiracy that pops up.
Wrong. Actually multiple people in this very thread are doing just that.
No, they are not. They are saying he is not a natural born citizen. No one is denying that he would have the right to US citizenship through his US mother.
You're trying to give me a burden of proof that I could never possibly live up to so you can turn around and say "See, told ya!" Its ridiculous and disingenuous.
Hawaii has two major newspapers, the Honolulu Advertiser and the Star Bulletin.
BOTH newspapers include birth announcements, and BOTH newspapers record the August 4th, 1961 birth of Barack Obama.
http://whatreallyhappened.com/IMAGES/SMALL_obama-1961-birth-announcement-from-honolulu-advertiser0000.gif
http://whatreallyhappened.com/IMAGES/SMALL_ObamaBirthStarBulletin.jpg
your eyes must be better than mine. I cannot see anything about in those papers about BHO.
Here's some more supporting evidence.
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html
State Health Director confirms...
http://www.factcheck.org/demos/factcheck/imagefiles/image/Ask%20FactCheck%20Images/Birth%20Certificate/hands.jpg
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcertificate.asp
So lets recap. We have two separate papers listing the birth announcement. We have the obstetrician who delivered him talking about it. We have the actual short form birth certificate. We have the Director of the Hawaii State Department of Health verifying its authenticity personally. We have judges dismissing these claims from their courts as "frivolous and not worth of discussion", we have people who have seen and held the actual birth certificate, etc.
Now, what more proof can be provided than that? Furthermore, what proof do you have that he is NOT a citizen? If you are making the claim that he is not a citizen, then the burden of proof lies on you. Obama has provided what he needs to have provided to prove he is a citizen according to State Department standards.
Again, no one is seriously questioning US citizenship. They are questioning natural born citizen status. And that is anything but clear cut.
I kind of doubt that an obstetrician could remember that specific baby from 1961 48 years later.
I seem to remember reading statements by people in Kenya that remember his birth there as well.
The so-called short form of HI "birth certificate" is available to people born outside HI.
He's not hiding anything. He responded, end of story. He's the president of the country, I think he has more important things to do than run around responding to every conspiracy that pops up.
He is hiding something. His refusal to show a so-called long form shows he is hiding something.
Now, I have already agreed that it is a pretty useless line of attack as there is too much vested in this by people in power to let this go anywhere. I don't think it is worth the effort people put into it.
So I will assume I am then deemed as an unthinking individual. Tell me, how many other birth certificates belonging to Presidents have you been witness to?
.
Well, there is one that I know of, but the liberal media ignored it because to focus on it would bring Obongo's birf certificate into question. The Obama campaign sued McCain claiming that McCain was not a natural born citizen. McCain was born in the Panama Canal zone on base when his father was active duty in the USN and was stationed there. The court ruled that McCain is a natural born citizen (military bases count for sailors stationed there).
I bet you never heard a peep about that in the media.
Why?
Seems like a more noteworthy story than the mindless hope and change spiel that the press covered.
He's a citizen. Unarguable fact.
Really?
Have you actually seen his birth certificate? (not the certificate of live birth misdirection document on the internet)
Or have you drawn that conclusion from seeing his records from Pepperdine, Columbia, Harvard and from his military service records?
If not, please explain how you came to conclude that this is an "unarguable fact".
rickrock305
02-21-11, 16:01
Well, there is one that I know of, but the liberal media ignored it because to focus on it would bring Obongo's birf certificate into question. The Obama campaign sued McCain claiming that McCain was not a natural born citizen. McCain was born in the Panama Canal zone on base when his father was active duty in the USN and was stationed there. The court ruled that McCain is a natural born citizen (military bases count for sailors stationed there).
I bet you never heard a peep about that in the media.
Why?
Seems like a more noteworthy story than the mindless hope and change spiel that the press covered.
The Obama campaign did no such thing. It was the chairman-elect of California's American Independent Party.
rickrock(head) - Snopes? Really? So a left wing site makes conclusory statements and that is supposed to be ok with us???
rickrock305
02-21-11, 16:03
Really?
Have you actually seen his birth certificate? (not the certificate of live birth misdirection document on the internet)
Or have you drawn that conclusion from seeing his records from Pepperdine, Columbia, Harvard and from his military service records?
If not, please explain how you came to conclude that this is an "unarguable fact".
I just did in the LONG post above. There are a multitude of sources that confirm he was born in Hawaii. There are no sources that say otherwise.
Reasonable people look at the evidence and form the proper conclusions.
But if you still want to contend he's not eligible, the burden of proof is on you.
rickrock305
02-21-11, 16:05
rickrock(head) - Snopes? Really? So a left wing site makes conclusory statements and that is supposed to be ok with us???
Fine, throw that source out. I gave you a multitude of other sources. Two Hawaii newspapers, multiple Hawaii officials, pictures of the birth certificate, etc.
Like I said, burden of proof is on you. If you have not one iota of proof, yet still contend that what you say is true despite the reams of evidence that show otherwise, well then you are just not a rational person.
I just did in the LONG post above. There are a multitude of sources that confirm he was born in Hawaii. There are no sources that say otherwise.
So far you have listed no sources that confirm he was born in Hawaii. The Certificate of Live Birth does not do that. There are examples of people with Hawaii Certificates of Live Birth that were not born in Hawaii.
Alleged scans of newspapers that no one can read due to their size do no such thing either.
Reasonable people look at the evidence and form the proper conclusions.
But if you still want to contend he's not eligible, the burden of proof is on you.
There are also eye witness sources that say he was born in Kenya. EYE WITNESS sources. What makes these sources less credible than your eye witnesses?
Once again rickrock, explain how you reach the conclusion of the alleged "unarguable fact". Your so-called sources are fluff.
And can you explain why Obama does not produce the damn birth certificate?
rickrock305
02-21-11, 17:27
So far you have listed no sources that confirm he was born in Hawaii. The Certificate of Live Birth does not do that. There are examples of people with Hawaii Certificates of Live Birth that were not born in Hawaii.
Yes, it does exactly that according to the State Department. And also the Director of the Hawaii Department of Health and the person in charge of vital statistics have both confirmed that he was born there. And we have two separate newspapers listing the birth announcement. And we have anecdotal evidence of the obstetrician that delivered him talking about delivering him. And we have a judge who has looked at all the evidence and basically called the claim ridiculous.
Alleged scans of newspapers that no one can read due to their size do no such thing either.
If you're on a Mac you can zoom in and clearly see it. If not there are plenty of places where this info can be seen and verified. I posted it here, I'm not gonna hold your hand.
There are also eye witness sources that say he was born in Kenya. EYE WITNESS sources. What makes these sources less credible than your eye witnesses?
Where are these eyewitness sources?
And some random person in Kenya is as credible to you as the Director of the Hawaii Department of Health? Really? You don't think that in all of Kenya I couldn't find a person to say anything I wanted them to on camera for a couple hundred bucks?
rickrock305
02-21-11, 17:31
Once again rickrock, explain how you reach the conclusion of the alleged "unarguable fact". Your so-called sources are fluff.
And can you explain why Obama does not produce the damn birth certificate?
Right, so some random person from Kenya isn't fluff, yet Hawaii officials, judges, etc. are fluff?
You are completely irrational.
Yes, it does exactly that according to the State Department.
The State Dept says lots of things. There have been counter examples of people getting the Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth who were not born in Hawaii.
If you're on a Mac you can zoom in and clearly see it. If not there are plenty of places where this info can be seen and verified. I posted it here, I'm not gonna hold your hand.
I am on a Mac. Clicking your images does nothing and does not zoom into them.
And some random person in Kenya is as credible to you as the Director of the Hawaii Department of Health? Really? You don't think that in all of Kenya I couldn't find a person to say anything I wanted them to on camera for a couple hundred bucks?
And the political pressure on Hawaii officials to make the correct statements does not count? I mean the SCOTUS succumbed to pressure and made illogical rulings with regards the Chrysler bankruptcy and tiers of debt holders (I may be using the wrong words).
I personally would trust some guy in Kenya who does not have a political stake in the whole thing than someone who does have a political stake in the whole thing to say the right thing.
madisonsfinest
02-21-11, 21:04
Unless you have video of the birth happening, time dated and stamped, in front of a well known monument located within the continental United States there are some that will never be convinced. Of course you could always argue the video was altered. So you can either believe it or not. I was born in the US. I could show you a piece of paper, birth certificate, and you can either believe it or not. I guess proof in terms of a legal requirement have been satisfied. So I guess it's arguing for the sake of having an argument now
rickrock305
02-21-11, 22:07
The State Dept says lots of things.
But if the State Dept. says this satisfies the requirements of proof of citizenship, well I think that satisfies it then.
There have been counter examples of people getting the Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth who were not born in Hawaii.
Where are these examples?
I am on a Mac. Clicking your images does nothing and does not zoom into them.
Hold Cntrl and scroll your touchpad up with two fingers. You can also do it with a mouse.
And the political pressure on Hawaii officials to make the correct statements does not count?
Sure, but what does the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have to gain politically?
I personally would trust some guy in Kenya who does not have a political stake in the whole thing than someone who does have a political stake in the whole thing to say the right thing.
But its not just one person. Its newspapers, officials, doctors, the media, etc., ALL saying its valid. They've shown you the announcements and even the certificate itself. The burden of proof has clearly been met according to the State Dept. and the courts who have seen this.
You are being completely irrational.
But if the State Dept. says this satisfies the requirements of proof of citizenship, well I think that satisfies it then.
Once again, no one is questioning his citizenship. Why do you keep bringing this up. The question is whether he is a natural born citizen. Not his citizenship.
Where are these examples?
Here is the Hawaii statute, which clearly allows for out of state births to be accorded such:
“[§338-17.8] Certificates for children born out of State.
(a) Upon application of an adult or the legal parents of a minor child, the director of health shall issue a birth certificate for such adult or minor, provided that proof has been submitted to the director of health that the legal parents of such individual while living without the Territory or State of Hawaii had declared the Territory or State of Hawaii as their legal residence for at least one year immediately preceding the birth or adoption of such child.
(b) Proof of legal residency shall be submitted to the director of health in any manner that the director shall deem appropriate. The director of health may also adopt any rules pursuant to chapter 91 that he or she may deem necessary or proper to prevent fraudulent applications for birth certificates and to require any further information or proof of events necessary for completion of a birth certificate.
(c) The fee for each application for registration shall be established by rule adopted pursuant to chapter 91. [L 1982, c 182, §1]”
One example has already been given: that Chinese guy who was the father of their 1911 revolution.
For more info, see this WND article. Even some parts of the Hawaiian gocernment do not accept the short form that Obama is peddling.
http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=100451
Hold Cntrl and scroll your touchpad up with two fingers. You can also do it with a mouse.
Sorry for being so dense, but how do I scroll my mouse with two fingers?
Sure, but what does the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have to gain politically?
quite possibly his life, if nothing else.
But its not just one person. Its newspapers, officials, doctors, the media, etc., ALL saying its valid. They've shown you the announcements and even the certificate itself. The burden of proof has clearly been met according to the State Dept. and the courts who have seen this.
You are being completely irrational.
I am not being irrational. People want to see one thing: Obamas birth certificate. He has yet to produce it. It seems to be commonplace for people who claim Hawaii residency to get these so-called Certificates of Live Birth even when born elsewhere. Here is on govt official who worked in the election office who claims Obama is not born in Hawaii because there is no official record of his birth.
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=165041
rickrock305
02-21-11, 23:18
Once again, no one is questioning his citizenship. Why do you keep bringing this up. The question is whether he is a natural born citizen. Not his citizenship.
And once again, more than one person has plainly stated he is an illegal immigrant or Kenyan in this very thread.
Here is the Hawaii statute, which clearly allows for out of state births to be accorded such:
“[§338-17.8] Certificates for children born out of State.
(a) Upon application of an adult or the legal parents of a minor child, the director of health shall issue a birth certificate for such adult or minor, provided that proof has been submitted to the director of health that the legal parents of such individual while living without the Territory or State of Hawaii had declared the Territory or State of Hawaii as their legal residence for at least one year immediately preceding the birth or adoption of such child.
(b) Proof of legal residency shall be submitted to the director of health in any manner that the director shall deem appropriate. The director of health may also adopt any rules pursuant to chapter 91 that he or she may deem necessary or proper to prevent fraudulent applications for birth certificates and to require any further information or proof of events necessary for completion of a birth certificate.
(c) The fee for each application for registration shall be established by rule adopted pursuant to chapter 91. [L 1982, c 182, §1]”
I bolded the parts I found to be relevant. It only makes sense that they allow for out of state births.
One example has already been given: that Chinese guy who was the father of their 1911 revolution.
You gave the example, but you have yet to provide any evidence this ever happened. And I searched on Google but came up empty.
For more info, see this WND article. Even some parts of the Hawaiian gocernment do not accept the short form that Obama is peddling.
http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=100451
First, WND is a reliable source? :D And I get shit for MY SOURCES?!?!?! It doesn't get much more partisan or less reliable than WND.
BUT, lets break down their claim anyway. Here is their claim...
The website of the Department of Hawaiian Home Lands, however, states clearly the certification of live birth touted by the Obama campaign, White House press secretary Robert Gibbs and a host of other Obama defenders is not acceptable as a form of identification to qualify under this program.
But within two seconds of being on this site...
http://hawaii.gov/dhhl/applicants/appforms/applyhhl
I found this...
The Department of Hawaiian Home Lands accepts both Certificates of Live Birth (original birth certificate) and Certifications of Live Birth because they are official government records documenting an individual’s birth. The Certificate of Live Birth generally has more information which is useful for genealogical purposes as compared to the Certification of Live Birth which is a computer-generated printout that provides specific details of a person’s birth. Although original birth certificates (Certificates of Live Birth) are preferred for their greater detail, the State Department of Health (DOH) no longer issues Certificates of Live Birth. When a request is made for a copy of a birth certificate, the DOH issues a Certification of Live Birth.
WND just got completely debunked in all of five seconds.
Sorry for being so dense, but how do I scroll my mouse with two fingers?
Depends on the mouse you have. The newer ones allow you to do this, just hold your two fingers on the mouse and scroll up or down. Or if you have the one with the little ball in the center use that. But whatever you have just hold control and scroll up.
quite possibly his life, if nothing else.
Ok, I guess the government was responsible for 9/11 and the black helicopters are watching you too right? :fie:
I am not being irrational. People want to see one thing: Obamas birth certificate. He has yet to produce it.
YES, HE HAS. The state of Hawaii no longer issues long form birth certificates. The Department of Hawaiian Home Lands accepts both Certificates of Live Birth (original birth certificate) and Certifications of Live Birth because they are official government records documenting an individual’s birth. The State Department of Health (DOH) no longer issues Certificates of Live Birth. When a request is made for a copy of a birth certificate, the DOH issues a Certification of Live Birth.
It seems to be commonplace for people who claim Hawaii residency to get these so-called Certificates of Live Birth even when born elsewhere. Here is on govt official who worked in the election office who claims Obama is not born in Hawaii because there is no official record of his birth.
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=165041
Did you read the article? They debunked their own claim right in the article!
WND confirmed with Hawaiian officials that Adams was indeed working in their election offices during the last presidential election.
"His title was senior elections clerk in 2008," said Glen Takahashi, elections administrator for the city and county of Honolulu.
Takahashi also confirmed Adams' time frame at the office from spring until the month of August.
"We hire temporary workers, because we're seasonal," he said.
However, when WND asked Takahashi if the elections office could check on birth records, he said, "We don't have access to that kind of records. [There's] no access to birth records."
So Adams, a temp worker, couldn't have accessed the information that he said he did.
From the same article...
Hawaii's Republican Gov. Linda Lingle..."It's been an odd situation," Lingle said. "This issue kept coming up so much in the campaign, and again I think it's one of those issues that is simply a distraction from the more critical issues that are facing the country.
"So I had my health director, who is a physician by background, go personally view the birth certificate in the birth records of the Department of Health, and we issued a news release at that time saying that the president was, in fact, born at Kapi'olani Hospital in Honolulu, Hawaii. And that's just a fact and yet people continue to call up and e-mail and want to make it an issue and I think it's again a horrible distraction for the country by those people who continue this."
So what does a REPUBLICAN governor have to gain politically by debunking this myth?
I'm actually sorry to say this because I enjoy our spirited debates on things, but I've officially lost ALL respect for you. This has got to be a joke.
And once again, more than one person has plainly stated he is an illegal immigrant or Kenyan in this very thread.
No one said he was an illegal immigrant in serious tones. Calling him the Kenyan does not mean he is not a citizen. Once again, the issue is being a natural born citizen.
I bolded the parts I found to be relevant. It only makes sense that they allow for out of state births.
So you admit that the Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth is basically useless to show that Obama is a natural born citizen? According to the statute, and you seem to agree with it, his mother, a US citizen, could have claimed Hawaii residency but actually given birth in Kenya or where-ever and he still would have such a birth certificate?
And while I deleted the quote, when did the Hawaii dept you quoted change their policy?
rickrock305
02-21-11, 23:43
No one said he was an illegal immigrant in serious tones. Calling him the Kenyan does not mean he is not a citizen. Once again, the issue is being a natural born citizen.
[QUOTE=Cagemonkey;915566]everyone knows obama is an illegal immigrant.
everyone knows obama is an illegal immigrant.
These seemed pretty serious to me in context. No smilies, no jokes.
So you admit that the Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth is basically useless to show that Obama is a natural born citizen? According to the statute, and you seem to agree with it, his mother, a US citizen, could have claimed Hawaii residency but actually given birth in Kenya or where-ever and he still would have such a birth certificate?
No. Thats not at all what i said. If he has a Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth, he is a natural born citizen. End of story.
This has been confirmed by MULTIPLE officials in Hawaii, and even confirmed by United States House of Representatives...On July 27, 2009, the U.S. House of Representatives passed H.Res. 593, commemorating the 50th anniversary of Hawaii's statehood, including the text, "Whereas the 44th President of the United States, Barack Obama, was born in Hawaii on August 4, 1961." The vote passed 378-0.
And while I deleted the quote, when did the Hawaii dept you quoted change their policy?
Who said they ever changed it? WND is quite obviously full of shit. They debunk their own claims!
These seemed pretty serious to me in context. No smilies, no jokes.
i was being flippant. but now that you mention it- if only one of his parents was a citizen, and he's foreign born- DOES that make him a citizen? as i recall, both of your parents have to be citizens to get automatic citizenship... hmm.
looks like he really IS an illegal immigrant... hahahahahaha
i was being flippant. but now that you mention it- if only one of his parents was a citizen, and he's foreign born- DOES that make him a citizen? as i recall, both of your parents have to be citizens to get automatic citizenship... hmm.
looks like he really IS an illegal immigrant... hahahahahaha
No, just one is enough. When my children were born, only I was a citizen. (My wife has since become a citizen). My wife was however a legal resident at the time with Green Card.
No, just one is enough. When my children were born, only I was a citizen. (My wife has since become a citizen). My wife was however a legal resident at the time with Green Card.
were your children not born on American soil? that's the difference.
No. Thats not at all what i said. If he has a Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth, he is a natural born citizen. End of story.
No, it is not end of story. The Hawaii state law allows this Certificate of Live Birth to be given to people born outside Hawaii to parents or a parent claiming Hawaii residency. You admitted this yourself.
So the current Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth does nothing at all to prove he is a natural born citizen. Nothing. It may be OK to get a US Passport but my wife has a US Passport and she is not a natural born citizen.
Furthermore, Hawaii only stopped issuing real birth certificates in 2001 or thereafter and at the time that BHO was born they issued a normal birth certificate with Doctors names, time of birth, hospital name, etc. on it. While they only issue the Certificate of Live Birth now, that is for administrative ease (so they can provide same-day service at their service windows according to the Hawaii official). I seriously doubt that they destroyed all the existing birth certificates, or at least their microfiche/microfilm copies in the state records archives. But no one has been able to find any sort of such record for BHO. I have a copy of my birth certificate from long ago when I was born or at least a kid (plus newer certified copies I have gotten more recently) from Arizona. BHO has to have a copy some where of his real birth certificate since it was only 10 years ago or less that Hawaii stopped issuing them. If not, the State Department should have a copy in its archives to go with his passport application materials etc as he had a passport long before 2001.
Why has BHO gone to great lengths to hide this record? (along with all his other records like school records, his thesis, his billing records, etc?) Maybe because it destroys the carefully cultivated myth that surrounds him.
This has been confirmed by MULTIPLE officials in Hawaii,
Show me one Hawaii official who has confirmed that he has seen the real birth certificate data and can confirm that it shows hospital, doctor, etc.
and even confirmed by United States House of Representatives...On July 27, 2009, the U.S. House of Representatives passed H.Res. 593, commemorating the 50th anniversary of Hawaii's statehood, including the text, "Whereas the 44th President of the United States, Barack Obama, was born in Hawaii on August 4, 1961." The vote passed 378-0.
And that is really really authoritative.
What about the film of his grandma and uncle in Kenya that purports to show them saying he was born there? This is not some random off the street guy but his family.
There are also quotes from Kenyan official attesting to his birth there.
BHO could shut this whole thing up with the release of real birth records that prove he was actually born in Hawaii, not just born somewhere in the world to someone claiming Hawaiian residency. But he doesn't. Why not?
Who said they ever changed it? WND is quite obviously full of shit. They debunk their own claims!
were your children not born on American soil? that's the difference.
True. However, only one parent need be a citizen.
This mentions cases of only one parent being a citizen
http://travel.state.gov/law/citizenship/citizenship_5177.html
in some cases certain residency requirements must be met in those cases.
rickrock305
02-22-11, 06:41
No, it is not end of story. The Hawaii state law allows this Certificate of Live Birth to be given to people born outside Hawaii to parents or a parent claiming Hawaii residency. You admitted this yourself.
Of course. Its like if your parents travelled abroad and just happened to give birth to you in another country, that wouldnt make you a citizen of that country.
You can't just "claim" Hawaiian residency to get a birth certificate, you have to show proof of residency. Big difference.
So the current Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth does nothing at all to prove he is a natural born citizen. Nothing. It may be OK to get a US Passport but my wife has a US Passport and she is not a natural born citizen.
Sure it does. It proves he was born in Hawaii.
But no one has been able to find any sort of such record for BHO.
Outright false.
Director of the Hawaii State Department of Health Chiyome Fukino has said that both she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama's original birth certificate.
Why has BHO gone to great lengths to hide this record? (along with all his other records like school records, his thesis, his billing records, etc?) Maybe because it destroys the carefully cultivated myth that surrounds him.
He hasn't gone to ANY lengths to hide anything. He requested a copy from Hawaii, which only provides what you've seen. He then posted it on the internet. I'm not sure what more he could do.
Show me one Hawaii official who has confirmed that he has seen the real birth certificate data and can confirm that it shows hospital, doctor, etc.
I've already done this, multiple times.
Director of the Hawaii State Department of Health Chiyome Fukino has said that both she and the registrar of vital statistics, Alvin Onaka, have personally verified that the health department holds Obama's original birth certificate.
Hawaii's Republican Gov. Linda Lingle..."It's been an odd situation," Lingle said. "This issue kept coming up so much in the campaign, and again I think it's one of those issues that is simply a distraction from the more critical issues that are facing the country.
"So I had my health director, who is a physician by background, go personally view the birth certificate in the birth records of the Department of Health, and we issued a news release at that time saying that the president was, in fact, born at Kapi'olani Hospital in Honolulu, Hawaii. And that's just a fact and yet people continue to call up and e-mail and want to make it an issue and I think it's again a horrible distraction for the country by those people who continue this."
What about the film of his grandma and uncle in Kenya that purports to show them saying he was born there? This is not some random off the street guy but his family.
There are also quotes from Kenyan official attesting to his birth there.
Ok, then it should be pretty easy for you to find some record of his birth there. (Other than the birth certificate that has already proved to be a forgery)
BHO could shut this whole thing up with the release of real birth records that prove he was actually born in Hawaii, not just born somewhere in the world to someone claiming Hawaiian residency. But he doesn't. Why not?
Thats exactly what he has already done.
I'll leave you with the judge's opinion who saw this case in his court...
"Finally, in a remarkable shifting of the traditional legal burden of proof, plaintiff unashamedly alleges that defendant has the burden to prove his ‘natural born’ status,” Land states. “Any middle school civics student would readily recognize the irony of abandoning fundamental principles upon which our country was founded in order to purportedly ‘protect and preserve’ those very principles.
“Unlike in ‘Alice in Wonderland,’ simply saying something is so does not make it so,” Land says.
Where are these examples?
I posed in detail above about a non-citizen who had a Hawaii certificate of live birth.
Reading is fundamental.
To date there has been no evidence posted in this thread that Obama was born in Hawaii.
Which hospital was he born in? Apparently Obama does not know because he mis-identified the hospital a couple of years ago.
What is the name of the doctor who delivered him?
This info would be on his birth certificate. Please post a copy of it.
OOOH rick, I just read your last post. Either you are an extreme partisan party hack or simply intellectually incapable of understanding the issue. But feel free to continue posting.
rickrock305
02-22-11, 14:01
I posed in detail above about a non-citizen who had a Hawaii certificate of live birth.
Its a pretty long thread. Mind pointing out which post #?
Reading is fundamental.
Yes, I've read and responded to every post.
To date there has been no evidence posted in this thread that Obama was born in Hawaii.
This is equivalent of sticking your fingers in your ears and screaming "I CAN'T HEAR YOU" like a child.
I posted MULTIPLE pieces of evidence of his being born in Hawaii. We have his birth certificate, we have anecdotal evidence from the doctor that delivered him, we have two separate newspaper birth announcements, we have multiple Hawaiian officials including a Republican certifying the authenticity, we have private citizens certifying the authenticity, we have a judge who has viewed the evidence and dismissed this case from court, we have the entire House of Representatives voting on a measure that says he was born in Hawaii. I'm not sure what more could be provided other than you traveling back in time and witnessing the birth yourself
This info would be on his birth certificate. Please post a copy of it.
Apparently you missed the postings that said this is the only type of birth certificate Hawaii now issues. You are asking for a burden of proof that is impossible to meet. Quite intellectually dishonest of you.
And really, the burden of proof lays with you. If you want to claim he is not a citizen of the United States or was born in Kenya, PROVE IT. Show ONE SHRED of evidence.
OOOH rick, I just read your last post. Either you are an extreme partisan party hack or simply intellectually incapable of understanding the issue. But feel free to continue posting.
Is the Republican Governor of Hawaii and every Republican member of the House of Representatives also a partisan hack for the Democrats? Because they all claim Obama was born in Hawaii.
I
I posted MULTIPLE pieces of evidence of his being born in Hawaii. We have his birth certificate, we have anecdotal evidence from the doctor that delivered him, we have two separate newspaper birth announcements, we have multiple Hawaiian officials including a Republican certifying the authenticity, we have private citizens certifying the authenticity, we have a judge who has viewed the evidence and dismissed this case from court, we have the entire House of Representatives voting on a measure that says he was born in Hawaii. I'm not sure what more could be provided other than you traveling back in time and witnessing the birth yourself
You did not post any such evidence. We are still waiting for a real birth certificate. As has been pointed out MANY MANY times, the Certificate of Live Birth from Hawaii does not prove he was born in Hawaii. All it does is prove he was born, live, somewhere in the world, to a person who claimed Hawaii residency. Is this so hard to understand. Pull your fingers out of your ears and stop yelling "I CAN'T HEAR YOU' and you may get it.
Birth announcements in newspapers prove nothing. I have seen many times birth announcements of babies born far away from the area they are published, but were born to someone originally from that area.
We have shown counter anecdotes of people in HIS FAMILY who say he was born in Kenya and then taken to Hawaii as an infant.
Hawaii only recently stopped issuing real birth certificates (why they stopped I don't know -- Utah has the same electronic reporting that Hawaii claims to use and can print on demand and they still list the doctor, hospital, etc). And they have state records archives that would have the real birth original birth certificate or at least microfilm or microfiche or even digital scans of the original in them. They may not make that normally available but it would exist and someone like POTUS probably has enough pull to get it out of the archive if it existed.
We have lots of statements from people in Hawaii that such records do not exist.
There is no proof that Obama was born in Hawaii.
Of course it is all academic. There is no birth certificate (that does not seem fake) showing he was born elsewhere and there is too much money and political power behind it to make it worth fighting about. Better to just un-elect him.
This question would disappear if
rickrock305
02-22-11, 14:58
You did not post any such evidence. We are still waiting for a real birth certificate.
You got a real birth certificate.
“I, Dr. Chiyome Fukino, Director of the Hawai‛i State Department of Health, have seen the original vital records maintained on file by the Hawai‘i State Department of Health verifying Barack Hussein Obama
was born in Hawai‘i and is a natural-born American citizen."
From Politifact...
As a fact-checking news Web site, we went to extensive lengths to sort out the truth. We got a copy of his 1992 marriage certificate from the Cook County (Ill.) Bureau of Vital Statistics. His driver's license record from the Illinois Secretary of State's office. His registration and disciplinary record with the Attorney Registration & Disciplinary Commission of the Supreme Court of Illinois. Not to mention all of his property records.
Not one of these documents shows a Muhammed (or Mohammed) in Obama's name. They all read "Barack H. Obama" or "Barack Hussein Obama."
The ultimate document we sought was Obama's birth certificate. Unlike the other documents, Hawaii birth certificates aren't public record. Only family members can request copies, so when the campaign declined to give us one, we were stalled.
On June 13, 2008, Obama's campaign finally released a copy, while launching a fact-check Web site of its own, Fightthesmears.com. The site is a direct response to allegations about Obama that won't go away: He's Muslim. He took the oath of office on a Koran. He refuses to say the Pledge of Allegiance. PolitiFact has researched all of these accusations and none of them are true.
When the birth certificate arrived from the Obama campaign it confirmed his name as the other documents already showed it. Still, we took an extra step: We e-mailed it to the Hawaii Department of Health, which maintains such records, to ask if it was real.
"It's a valid Hawaii state birth certificate," spokesman Janice Okubo told us.
Then the firestorm started.
• Where is the embossed seal and the registrar's signature?
• Comparing it to other Hawaii birth certificates, the color shade is different.
• Isn't the date stamp bleeding through the back of the document "June 2007?" (Odd since it was supposedly released in June 2008.)
• There's no crease from being folded and mailed.
• It's clearly Photoshopped and a wholesale fraud.
• • •
At PolitiFact.com, we're all about original sources. We don't take anyone at their word or take the reporting of other media organizations as proof. We go to the heart of the story, the source of the truth — original, corroborating documents.
When the official documents were questioned, we went looking for more answers. We circled back to the Department of Health, had a newsroom colleague bring in her own Hawaii birth certificate to see if it looks the same (it's identical). But every answer triggered more questions.
And soon enough, after going to every length possible to confirm the birth certificate's authenticity, you start asking, what is reasonable here?
Because if this document is forged, then they all are.
If this document is forged, a U.S. senator and his presidential campaign have perpetrated a vast, long-term fraud. They have done it with conspiring officials at the Hawaii Department of Health, the Cook County (Ill.) Bureau of Vital Statistics, the Illinois Secretary of State's office, the Attorney Registration & Disciplinary Commission of the Supreme Court of Illinois and many other government agencies.
Sounds like a Vince Flynn novel.
• • •
Peter Goelz knows a little something about conspiracy theorists.
He was managing director of the National Transportation Safety Board in 1996 when TWA Flight 800 crashed off Long Island, killing 230 people. While the NTSB's investigation found no evidence of sabotage or terrorism, the Internet was stocked with insistent accusations.
"We were right at the beginning of this Internet lunacy," Goelz said in an interview with PolitiFact. "And there were a variety of crackpot Web sites and Web commentators that generated all sorts of rumors. The principle one was that TWA in fact was shot down by an errant Navy missile in ... a live-fire exercise off the Hamptons."
Nine miles off Long Island, in the middle of summer. And then a full-scale coverup by the Navy and all the sailors involved.
"I am sure that we spent another $10-million, perhaps $20-million, out of a $50-million investigation, to just knock down and put to bed these kinds of rumors, these insidious rumors," Goelz said. "We felt like we had to answer every question because it was such a public and dreadful and confounding event."
Goelz, who is now a communications consultant in Washington, D.C., says the Internet has given a platform to anyone to say anything. And a way to find others who want to hear it.
"Online, they can be almost anything," he said. "They can be the crusading investigators that they always wanted to be."
• • •
The Hawaii Department of Health receives about a dozen e-mail inquiries a day about Obama's birth certificate, spokesman Okubo said.
"I guess the big issue that's being raised is the lack of an embossed seal and a signature," Okubo said, pointing out that in Hawaii, both those things are on the back of the document. "Because they scanned the front … you wouldn't see those things."
Okubo says she got a copy of her own birth certificate last year and it is identical to the Obama one we received.
And about the copy we e-mailed her for verification? "When we looked at that image you guys sent us, our registrar, he thought he could see pieces of the embossed image through it."
Still, she acknowledges: "I don't know that it's possible for us to even say beyond a doubt what the image on the site represents."
• • •
And there's the rub. It is possible that Obama conspired his way to the precipice of the world's biggest job, involving a vast network of people and government agencies over decades of lies. Anything's possible.
But step back and look at the overwhelming evidence to the contrary and your sense of what's reasonable has to take over.
There is not one shred of evidence to disprove PolitiFact's conclusion that the candidate's name is Barack Hussein Obama, or to support allegations that the birth certificate he released isn't authentic.
And that's true no matter how many people cling to some hint of doubt and use the Internet to fuel their innate sense of distrust.
As has been pointed out MANY MANY times, the Certificate of Live Birth from Hawaii does not prove he was born in Hawaii. All it does is prove he was born, live, somewhere in the world, to a person who claimed Hawaii residency. Is this so hard to understand. Pull your fingers out of your ears and stop yelling "I CAN'T HEAR YOU' and you may get it.
It means that he is a natural born citizen of the state of Hawaii. The end.
Birth announcements in newspapers prove nothing. I have seen many times birth announcements of babies born far away from the area they are published, but were born to someone originally from that area.
Its just a one piece in a long evidence trail that all leads to him being born in Hawaii.
But why would someone do this? Are you suggesting that this vast conspiracy started on the day of Obama's birth, that his parents set up these birth announcements because one day they knew he would try to be president? His mother was not originally from Hawaii, so her connection there is not that strong.
We have shown counter anecdotes of people in HIS FAMILY who say he was born in Kenya and then taken to Hawaii as an infant.
No, you have shown nothing. You said this was the case, but failed to show anything. You also quoted WND as a source. They are completely full of shit.
Hawaii only recently stopped issuing real birth certificates (why they stopped I don't know -- Utah has the same electronic reporting that Hawaii claims to use and can print on demand and they still list the doctor, hospital, etc).
Its quite obviously just another part of the vast conspiracy to elect Obama.
And they have state records archives that would have the real birth original birth certificate or at least microfilm or microfiche or even digital scans of the original in them.
Yes, which have been verified to exist.
They may not make that normally available but it would exist and someone like POTUS probably has enough pull to get it out of the archive if it existed.
Sure, thats what I want the President to do. Use his position to satisfy a bunch of lunatics on the internet. Thats a wise use of time.
We have lots of statements from people in Hawaii that such records do not exist.
You have statements from a handful of idiots who wouldn't even know.
There is no proof that Obama was born in Hawaii.
There is plenty of proof, you just choose to ignore it and dismiss it so you can push your partisan crap. Its embarrassing.
Of course it is all academic. There is no birth certificate (that does not seem fake) showing he was born elsewhere and there is too much money and political power behind it to make it worth fighting about. Better to just un-elect him.
Ahhh, so the complete lack of evidence of your case somehow proves your case! RIGHT!
So the fact that he has a Hawaii birth certificate that you refute, saying he doesn't have a birth certificate, is any better than saying he was born in Kenya yet you can't provide a Kenyan birth record? Really? Thats logical to you? Sorry, but I think my elementary school kid can see the ridiculousness of that position.
No, it is not a traditional birth certificate. It may be all that Hawaii can muster now according to their policies but it does not prove that he was actually born in Hawaii. Lots of people who were not born in Hawaii have these certificates and the state law, which was quoted here, allows them to be issued to people born elsewhere.
A statement by a political hack is of no value unless backed up with physical proof.
Again, what is BHO hiding? Why won't he allow release of physical copies of actual birth records from the state vital records archives? Maybe because they don't exist according to statements from several people familiar with the situation in Hawaii.
Note: I am not saying that the Certificate of Live Birth is a forgery, so spare us please all your "proof." I am saying, and Hawaii law backs this up, that such a Certificate of Live Birth does not show that one is actually born in Hawaii. It only shows that one is born to someone who claims Hawaiian residency. Said birth could be anywhere in the world.
This has yet to be refuted (kind of hard when it is in the Hawaii state law).
"real" birth certificates show the attending doctor (if any) and the place of birth (hospital) and the time. These are sworn statements by the doctor/hospital. And that was the case in Hawaii as well when Obama was born.
rickrock305
02-22-11, 16:12
No, it is not a traditional birth certificate.
Traditional? No. But an official legal document proving citizenship, yes. When you request your certified birth certificate, thats what you get.
It may be all that Hawaii can muster now according to their policies but it does not prove that he was actually born in Hawaii.
Yes, it does.
Lots of people who were not born in Hawaii have these certificates and the state law,
Where are these people? You have yet to produce one.
which was quoted here, allows them to be issued to people born elsewhere.
Yes. If you are from Hawaii and you happen to have your baby in Australia, the baby is not an Australian citizen. The baby is still an American citizen.
A statement by a political hack is of no value unless backed up with physical proof.
Then why do you quote WND as a source?
Who is a political hack?
Are you saying the REPUBLICAN Governor of Hawaii and the entire House of Representatives of the United States (including Republicans and Independents) are ALL political hacks for Obama?
Again, what is BHO hiding? Why won't he allow release of physical copies of actual birth records from the state vital records archives?
He's not hiding anything. He has met the burden of proof for all but a few lunatics on the internet.
Maybe because they don't exist according to statements from several people familiar with the situation in Hawaii.
Again, simply not true.
Note: I am not saying that the Certificate of Live Birth is a forgery, so spare us please all your "proof." I am saying, and Hawaii law backs this up, that such a Certificate of Live Birth does not show that one is actually born in Hawaii. It only shows that one is born to someone who claims Hawaiian residency. Said birth could be anywhere in the world.
Look at the certificate. It clearly says he was born IN HONOLULU.
This has yet to be refuted (kind of hard when it is in the Hawaii state law).
Yes it has. But that would require you to actually look at the evidence.
"real" birth certificates show the attending doctor (if any) and the place of birth (hospital) and the time. These are sworn statements by the doctor/hospital. And that was the case in Hawaii as well when Obama was born.
Yes. And this exists in the Hawaiian database. Its been seen and confirmed by multiple people.
Traditional? No. But an official legal document proving citizenship, yes. When you request your certified birth certificate, thats what you get.
We are not talking about citizenship. We are talking about natural born citizen.
See here. This article states he was born in China but also that he had a Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth.
The Hawaii state laws allow births from elsewhere -- you admitted as such when the statute was posted. And there are statements from lots of people that the situation actually exists. That lots of people have them but were born elsewhere.
The Hawaii document does not prove he was in Hawaii. The state statute says that.
rickrock305
02-22-11, 16:28
Give it a rest, you are being completely irrational
Give it a rest, you are being completely irrational
I am sorry, but I am not being irrational. Obama has shown no proof he was born in Hawaii. The Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth has been shown to not be reliable in that regard. The state statute explicitly allows non Hawaii births to be accorded such a certificate. In addition it is known that many people have them even when not physically born in Hawaii.
If there exists a real vital statistics birth certificate with doctor, hospital, etc it has been suppressed. Several people in Hawaii have claimed no such record exists. Obama certainly has avoided and paid lots of money to have this suppressed.
I am only stating facts. There is nothing irrational about drawing the conclusion that there is no proof of being born in Hawaii based on these facts.
I also have said in the long run that it does not matter.
rickrock305
02-22-11, 16:59
I am sorry, but I am not being irrational. Obama has shown no proof he was born in Hawaii. The Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth has been shown to not be reliable in that regard. The state statute explicitly allows non Hawaii births to be accorded such a certificate. In addition it is known that many people have them even when not physically born in Hawaii.
Wrong. You have not shown this at all. You've said it, which hardly makes it true. You have shown not ONE shred of evidence that this is the case. And I'm quite sure that EVERY state would have a similar provision to allow for home births, births while travelling, etc.
If there exists a real vital statistics birth certificate with doctor, hospital, etc it has been suppressed. Several people in Hawaii have claimed no such record exists. Obama certainly has avoided and paid lots of money to have this suppressed.
Yet you have no evidence of ANY of this. NOTHING but WND conjecture. Who has he paid this money to? How do you know this? YOU DON'T. You are simply making shit up. Its ridiculous. More than one person has seen the original document.
I am only stating facts. There is nothing irrational about drawing the conclusion that there is no proof of being born in Hawaii based on these facts.
Far from it. You have not stated ONE verifiable fact. Not one. All you have is speculation, conjecture, and outright lies. You have not shown one shred of evidence that Obama was not born in Hawaii. Meanwhile you have ignored a MOUNTAIN of evidence to show that he was. That makes your position irrational, hence why it is a position only held by the lunatic fringe of the extreme right wing.
I also have said in the long run that it does not matter.
Exactly. If it doesn't matter, why make an ass out of yourself?
Wrong. You have not shown this at all. You've said it, which hardly makes it true. You have shown not ONE shred of evidence that this is the case.
That chinese guy is one example. And there are also many quotes from people that state this is the case in Hawaii. And it is explicitly allowed by the law in Hawaii. It is not wrong. It is 100% correct.
And I'm quite sure that EVERY state would have a similar provision to allow for home births, births while travelling, etc.
Really, show me one state that will issue a birth certificate to a resident who gives birth in another state (besides Hawaii). Home births or traveling in the state outside of a hospital still need to be attested to with sworn statements as to the birth.
Yet you have no evidence of ANY of this. NOTHING but WND conjecture. Who has he paid this money to? How do you know this? YOU DON'T. You are simply making shit up. Its ridiculous. More than one person has seen the original document.
Really? The one that does not exist? If it exists they would show it.
Far from it. You have not stated ONE verifiable fact. Not one. All you have is speculation, conjecture, and outright lies. You have not shown one shred of evidence that Obama was not born in Hawaii. Meanwhile you have ignored a MOUNTAIN of evidence to show that he was. That makes your position irrational, hence why it is a position only held by the lunatic fringe of the extreme right wing.
Once again, where is this mountain of evidence? Newspaper clippings? Easily shown to have no bearing as there is no requirement to be born there to have an announcement there. Hawaii Certificate of live birth? Again, state law allows these to be issued to births outside of Hawaii.
Statements by officials? Show me the physical proof. There are also statements by people inside the govt that show the opposite.
There is no conclusive proof and they refuse to show the one thing that would stop all this.
Where there is smoke there is fire and Obama has refused to stop the smoke the one way that he could.
Exactly. If it doesn't matter, why make an ass out of yourself?
You are the one making an ass of yourself. You keep bringing up the same points which have been shown to not be conclusive.
A CBS news reporter went to the Wailing Wall in Jerusalem and spoke to an Israeli praying there.
"I have been praying here for 61 years," the Israeli said.
"Have you received an answer to any of your prayers?" asked the reporter.
"No, it's like talking to a ****ing wall."
Moving on, what ever happened to the Gov of Hawaii, Neil Abercrombie, promising to release Obama's birth certificate to put this issue to rest?
In an interview he said that he found a handwritten notation of Barack's birth (which could have led to issuance of the irrelevant COLB). But he did not say he found a birth certificate.
And since then, he has shut his trap about the birth certificate. Why?
New post for new topic.
State of Hawaii did not certify that Obama is constitutionally eligible, although it certify that Kerry and Gore were eligible.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/37528165/2000-2004-2008-Democratic-Party-of-Hawaii-Certifications-of-Nomination-for-Presidential-Candidates
Obama's sister born in Indonesia has a Hawaii certificate of live birth.
http://giveusliberty1776.blogspot.com/2011/02/must-watchyou-too-obots.html
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_1lGFYYNkw_o/S5n-hzhs-9I/AAAAAAAAAUE/AamDGrC0f1I/S220/Aundocumentedobama.jpg
rickrock305
02-22-11, 17:43
Let me know when you can show me one shred of evidence to support your claim. You saying so does not make it true.
A CBS news reporter went to the Wailing Wall in Jerusalem and spoke to an Israeli praying there.
"I have been praying here for 61 years," the Israeli said.
"Have you received an answer to any of your prayers?" asked the reporter.
"No, it's like talking to a ****ing wall."
Despite your often outlandish nonsense, I have to admit that this is pretty funny.
Let me know when you can show me one shred of evidence to support your claim. You saying so does not make it true.
I don't have to prove anything. You do (well, not really, Obama does). You have failed miserably.
I am not claiming Obama was not born in Hawaii. I am not claiming anything about where Obama was born. What I am claiming is that Obama has failed to prove he was born in Hawaii.
His so-called birth certificate fails that test. It is right in the Hawaii statute. While there are supposedly lots of people born outside of Hawaii to Hawaii residents with these certificates, according to people from Hawaii, I have no need to show that they exist, only that they CAN exist. And that is right in the statute.
The newspaper clippings are hearsay evidence that can be easily discounted since there is no requirement for the birth to have been local for it to be in a newspaper. I personally have seen birth announcements where the birth took place in another state to a woman who was originally from the local area of the newspaper.
Statements by various officials in Hawaii are merely hearsay evidence -- he said she said -- unless backed by physical proof, which they have refused to provide. There are also statements by people in Hawaii with a claim to know that he is not born there and there are no state documents to show he was born there. Again, this is just hearsay from the other side, but it is a counterweight to the hearsay from Obama's side.
This totally discounts the statements from his family in Kenya about his birth etc. All that is irrelevant because I don't care where he was actually born, only that he can prove he is natural born citizen, which so far he hasn't.
Rickrock, you are being used by Obama as a proxy to fight his battle. He attempts to obfuscate the issue with all sorts of non-proof like this "Certificate of Live Birth" and then he tries to impugn the people asking for proof by trying to make the request for proof seem outlandish and fringe. He tries to marginalize those who ask for proof. You are doing a good job in that obfuscation and marginalizing.
People want to see one thing -- his long-form birth certificate. The kind that DID exist when he was born and for 30 some odd years of his life. Hawaii only went to this strange short-form version recently, around 2001 from the best I can ascertain. So if he was born in Hawaii there will be records in the state vital statistics archives that could be produced if it was needed. But those records have not been produced and Obama has spent lots of money to suppress them with legal challenges etc. Why?
There you have it. The burden is on Obama to prove he is a natural born citizen and so far he has failed to do so. He could if he really is but so far he has refused.
rickrock305
02-22-11, 20:54
The burden of proof has been met according to the courts. End of story.
The burden of proof has been met according to the courts. End of story.
Really? It has not gone to the courts as far as I know. No court wants to touch this with a 10 foot pole due to the political considerations.
So no, the burden of proof has not been met.
Obama has never proved and has actively sought to avoid the question of being a natural born citizen. He has actively sought to deflect the question by trying to marginalize the people asking it.
He has only one way of answering the question and that is by releasing his birth certificate (the long form one that existed up until Hawaii stopped issuing those but which surely must still exist in their state vital records archives). He has refused.
The question is not settled and as far as I know no court has adjudicated it and all courts have tried to avoid the issue all together.
Case is not settled and never will be since Obama will be thrown out of office first or will term limit out.
Let me know when you can show me one shred of evidence to support your claim. You saying so does not make it true.
500grains showed an example, using Obamas 1/2 sister, that it is possible to have a Hawaii birth record but be born elsewhere.
rickrock305
02-22-11, 21:22
Really? It has not gone to the courts as far as I know. No court wants to touch this with a 10 foot pole due to the political considerations.
So no, the burden of proof has not been met.
Obama has never proved and has actively sought to avoid the question of being a natural born citizen. He has actively sought to deflect the question by trying to marginalize the people asking it.
He has only one way of answering the question and that is by releasing his birth certificate (the long form one that existed up until Hawaii stopped issuing those but which surely must still exist in their state vital records archives). He has refused.
The question is not settled and as far as I know no court has adjudicated it and all courts have tried to avoid the issue all together.
Case is not settled and never will be since Obama will be thrown out of office first or will term limit out.
You know why it hasn't actually reached a trial? Because every judge has thrown it out based on its frivolousness before people like you could waste any more time with it.
Nobody has "refused" anything. You're just getting treated like the lunatics you are and simply ignored.
Judge David O. Carter, Oct. 29, 2009: Plaintiffs have encouraged the Court to ignore … mandates of the Constitution; to disregard the limits on its power put in place by the Constitution; and to effectively overthrow a sitting president who was popularly elected by “We the People”–over sixty-nine million of the people. Plaintiffs have attacked the judiciary, including every prior court that has dismissed their claim, as unpatriotic and even treasonous for refusing to grant their requests and for adhering to the terms of the Constitution which set forth its jurisdiction. Respecting the constitutional role and jurisdiction of this Court is not unpatriotic. Quite the contrary, this Court considers commitment to that constitutional role to be the ultimate reflection of patriotism.
Therefore, for the reasons stated above, Defendants’ Motion to Dismiss is GRANTED.
Judge David O. Carter, Oct. 29, 2009: There may very well be a legitimate role for the judiciary to interpret whether the natural born citizen requirement has been satisfied in the case of a presidential candidate who has not already won the election and taken office. However, on the day that President Obama took the presidential oath and was sworn in, he became President of the United States. Any removal of him from the presidency must be accomplished through the Constitution’s mechanisms for the removal of a President, either through impeachment or the succession process set forth in the Twenty-Fifth Amendment.
Judge Carter was less harsh in his opinion than another federal judge who threw out a similar lawsuit brought by the same attorney, Orly Taitz, in Georgia. Judge Clay D. Land issued a ruling declaring the suit before him to be "frivolous." He also said it "has no merit." And he later fined Taitz $20,000 for wasting the court’s time. He said:
Judge Clay D. Land, Oct. 13, 2009: When a lawyer files complaints and motions without a reasonable basis for believing that they are supported by existing law or a modification or extension of existing law, that lawyer abuses her privilege to practice law. When a lawyer uses the courts as a platform for a political agenda disconnected from any legitimate legal cause of action, that lawyer abuses her privilege to practice law.
Give it up, its over, you lost. Start dealing with it like a grown up instead of children who didn't get their way and throw temper tantrums.
rickrock305
02-22-11, 21:25
500grains showed an example, using Obamas 1/2 sister, that it is possible to have a Hawaii birth record but be born elsewhere.
Yea, a hastily put together YouTube video is proof. Right. :D :rolleyes:
You know why it hasn't actually reached a trial? Because every judge has thrown it out based on its frivolousness before people like you could waste any more time with it.
Nobody has "refused" anything. You're just getting treated like the lunatics you are and simply ignored.
Some of the cases I have seen were frivolous. Others were tossed as the judge did not want to have anything to do with it.
Btw, I am not a birther. I am not saying he was or was not born anywhere. I am merely asking for proof that he is a natural born citizen. He has refused to show that. No court has touched the subject -- too politically dangerous to do so.
Again, provide proof that Obama was born in Hawaii.
Any claims based on his Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth would fail 1st year law school based on the statute alone.
Asking for that proof does not make one a lunatic.
And as I have said many times, where there is smoke there is usually fire. Why does not Obama just dump a ton of cold water on the fire? He doesn't and instead tries to marginalize those who ask the question and frame them as lunatics. Age old diversion strategy. He spends lots of money on lawyers suppressing documents (if they exist). Why? Why go to all the trouble?
There is one sure way to dump that cold water (and only one way). Produce a verifiable certified record of birth that list hospital or place of birth if not a hospital, and sworn statements of those attending (physician etc). Like every other birth certificate in the country at the time (and it appears still except in Hawaii).
The irrational lunatics are the ones who fail to ask questions and accept whole heartedly "evidence" that is full of holes that even 1st year law students can drive semi trucks through.
Give it up, its over, you lost. Start dealing with it like a grown up instead of children who didn't get their way and throw temper tantrums.
rickrock305
02-22-11, 22:49
Btw, I am not a birther. I am not saying he was or was not born anywhere. I am merely asking for proof that he is a natural born citizen. He has refused to show that. No court has touched the subject -- too politically dangerous to do so.
Of course you're not a birther. You just espouse every one of their talking points.
Again, provide proof that Obama was born in Hawaii.
Any claims based on his Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth would fail 1st year law school based on the statute alone.
Asking for that proof does not make one a lunatic.
Sure, asking for proof doesn't make one a lunatic. Ignoring the proof when its provided does. Cherry picking and twisting a statute to fit your argument makes you irrational.
The Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth, which is an official legal document, and official statements from the Director of Health for the state of Hawaii certifying the records exist are enough to satisfy the burden of proof for most rational individuals. Add to that the other evidence and the picture is pretty clear.
And as I have said many times, where there is smoke there is usually fire. Why does not Obama just dump a ton of cold water on the fire? He doesn't and instead tries to marginalize those who ask the question and frame them as lunatics. Age old diversion strategy. He spends lots of money on lawyers suppressing documents (if they exist). Why? Why go to all the trouble?
He's not marginalizing or framing anyone. He's not spending any money to suppress documents. Where do you come up with this crap?
He's treating this drivel how you would expect someone would treat ridiculous nonsense and simply ignoring it. Should he also address the people who say 9/11 was an inside job, or that we never landed on the moon? I mean hey, he's never shown that we actually landed on the moon right?
Yep, thats what I want the President doing. Chasing around ridiculous internet rumors. Screw running the country, he should really be worried about chasing around ridiculous fringe conspiracy theorists.
There is one sure way to dump that cold water (and only one way). Produce a verifiable certified record of birth that list hospital or place of birth if not a hospital,
Thats exactly what he's done.
and sworn statements of those attending (physician etc).
The physician is dead. You have statements of those who have seen the official records though.
The irrational lunatics are the ones who fail to ask questions and accept whole heartedly "evidence" that is full of holes that even 1st year law students can drive semi trucks through.
There was a reason they were thrown out of court as "frivolous". I guess the lawyers just weren't too good at driving semi trucks.
you guys sure do have a lot of stamina.
rickrock305
02-22-11, 23:01
you guys sure do have a lot of stamina.
Yep. And a good dose of stubbornness as well :D
Of course you're not a birther. You just espouse every one of their talking points.
not really. You should read up on what they claim.
Sure, asking for proof doesn't make one a lunatic. Ignoring the proof when its provided does. Cherry picking and twisting a statute to fit your argument makes you irrational.
no proof has been given. Your Certificate of Live Birth would be thrown out of court once it was shown that they issue to them to people born elsewhere.
The Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth, which is an official legal document, and official statements from the Director of Health for the state of Hawaii certifying the records exist are enough to satisfy the burden of proof for most rational individuals. Add to that the other evidence and the picture is pretty clear.
See, you are clever. You try and use a document for something which it is not. It is sufficient to show US Citizenship perhaps, but that is not the question. The document is a legal document, but does not show what you claim it shows.
There is no other evidence of any merit -- all hearsay evidence that amounts to a he-said she-said situation.
There is one piece of evidence that proves this but it is missing.
He's not marginalizing or framing anyone. He's not spending any money to suppress documents. Where do you come up with this crap?
He's treating this drivel how you would expect someone would treat ridiculous nonsense and simply ignoring it. Should he also address the people who say 9/11 was an inside job, or that we never landed on the moon? I mean hey, he's never shown that we actually landed on the moon right?
Yep, thats what I want the President doing. Chasing around ridiculous internet rumors. Screw running the country, he should really be worried about chasing around ridiculous fringe conspiracy theorists.
he pays other people to do so. He does pay people to suppress documents. Look into getting any sort of record on BHO. His school records, his real birth certificate showing place / hospital and attending doctor, etc, his billing records, his masters thesis. None of this is available. Some of it would be available normally (like masters thesis) and others would be released by the parties. BHO has not released it and has lawyers making sure it is not released. This is not conspiracy fantasy.
He (through his lawyers and other helpers) very much marginalizes people who ask questions in order to evade the question.
Thats exactly what he's done.
The physician is dead. You have statements of those who have seen the official records though.
There was a reason they were thrown out of court as "frivolous". I guess the lawyers just weren't too good at driving semi trucks.
That question has never come up. The cases thrown out have tried to show he was born in kenya with phony birth certificates, claims of indonesia citizenship, and that sort of thing (none of which I am claiming). Or they get thrown out on some (phony) basis of "standing." The question of the suitability of his COLB from Hawaii has not come up as far as I know.
rickrock305
02-22-11, 23:11
no proof has been given. Your Certificate of Live Birth would be thrown out of court once it was shown that they issue to them to people born elsewhere.
If that were the case he would have never been sworn in as president. You think people don't check this sort of thing?
See, you are clever. You try and use a document for something which it is not. It is sufficient to show US Citizenship perhaps, but that is not the question. The document is a legal document, but does not show what you claim it shows.
It shows his place of birth as Honolulu.
There is no other evidence of any merit -- all hearsay evidence that amounts to a he-said she-said situation.
Not hearsay. Circumstantial maybe, but not hearsay. Statements from government officials on official government letterhead does not constitute hearsay.
There is one piece of evidence that proves this but it is missing.
No, its not. Its sitting on a computer in Hawaii.
he pays other people to do so. He does pay people to suppress documents. Look into getting any sort of record on BHO. His school records, his real birth certificate showing place / hospital and attending doctor, etc, his billing records, his masters thesis. None of this is available. Some of it would be available normally (like masters thesis) and others would be released by the parties. BHO has not released it and has lawyers making sure it is not released. This is not conspiracy fantasy.
Billing records? WTF do you need with his billing records? :rolleyes:
Eventually the truth will come out and it will likely cause the destruction of the Dem party (if unions do not achieve that first).
Billing records? WTF do you need with his billing records? :rolleyes:
Do you even know what he's talking about? If not, maybe it'd be best to keep the little eye-roll emoticon in check..?
He does pay people to suppress documents. Look into getting any sort of record on BHO. His school records, his real birth certificate showing place / hospital and attending doctor, etc, his billing records, his masters thesis. None of this is available. Some of it would be available normally (like masters thesis) and others would be released by the parties. BHO has not released it and has lawyers making sure it is not released. This is not conspiracy fantasy.
He (through his lawyers and other helpers) very much marginalizes people who ask questions in order to evade the question.
Chad, I admire your patience man. You have presented sound arguments and have only been asking for clarification of the hidden facts.
Do you even know what he's talking about? If not, maybe it'd be best to keep the little eye-roll emoticon in check..?
I agree. The man doesn't even understand the nuances of the argument and the complexity of the topic.
Not sure where to put this, so it goes in this dustbin thread.
Lindsay Lohan is beginning to resemble Michael Jackson. Can you guess which is which?
http://d.yimg.com/a/p/ap/20110223/capt.5c840a25154e419fbba3689ffaac0b12-5c840a25154e419fbba3689ffaac0b12-0.jpg?x=213&y=164&xc=1&yc=1&wc=409&hc=315&q=85&sig=1GwzoCmNmR_MBn_nDjgoMg--
http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRDegGOuGry8d3KYL8ly0b-j9ybu5LBvJUFmlOUqpERoCmapVKf
And now back to his Highness Obama.
Obama falsely believes that taking the WI union fight national will help Democrats. He misunderstands that the sense of the common man today is that unions are corrupt, heavy-handed, way too expensive, and unnecessary. In the year 1900, unions helped eliminate atrocious working conditions. Today, federal and state laws prevent those atrocious conditions so unions serve no function except to coerce a higher than market wage for union workers.
...
The Obama campaign and other liberals are looking to tap into the populist current of today's politics and turn the Wisconsin union fight into a national issue in the 2012 election. While the liberals can wield rhetorical pitchforks and light political torches, they should realize that it's their guys who are living inside the castle today. Specifically, public-sector unions -- by many measures the most entrenched special interest in American politics -- are not fighting against The Man, which is to say the entrenched powers of government. In this struggle, The Man is the government unions, which are sitting in the smoky back room divvying up the spoils of a crooked racket. And cronyism -- not wealth -- is the object of today's populist ire.
The Left has misread the postbailout populist sentiment all along, assuming public anger was directed at the rich. But American anger, I suspect, is directed not at some people who have money or success, but at those who profit through cronyism and their connections to power.
In other words, anti-bailout anger is not anger at the rich, but anger at those unfairly getting rich -- at the taxpayer's expense.
The Obama administration was startled in March 2009 when Americans exploded with anger at AIG executives -- living off the taxpayer dime -- who pocketed huge bonuses. There was plenty of anti-Wall Street feeling, and (to the confusion and consternation of liberals) it helped Republicans win many congressional races in 2010. Democrats apparently learned the wrong lessons.
Just after the election, public sentiment didn't favor the Democratic efforts to reinstate the old death tax -- which only affects the upper class. Class warfare talk didn't help the Left's efforts to increase taxes on the rich.
Even so, Obama's Democratic National Committee now thinks it has the winning hand in the labor scuffles that began in Wisconsin this month. In the view of the Left, the Democrats are standing with the working man against the greedy. The acrid Paul Krugman wrote in the New York Times that government unions provide a "counterweight to the political power of big money."
Hard facts utterly contradict Krugman's claim. First, unions are "Big Money." ...
Union-funded lawmakers take money from taxpayers and give it the government unions, who kick some of it back to union-funded lawmakers. It's not too different from banks or defense contractors donating to politicians who bail them out or give them no-bid contracts.
As long as Democrats think they're on the side of "the people" because the unions agree with them, they're politically lost.
...
The same anti-elite sentiment could persist in 2012. Democrats' nationalizing of Wisconsin shows they misunderstand it.
http://washingtonexaminer.com/politics/2011/02/democrats-wage-populist-fight-against-their-allies
http://cbswocl.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/tsa-patdown.jpg?w=385&h=240
TSA Groping and Obama's Black Revenge Narrative
The American Thinker ^ | November 24, 2010 | James Lewis
Posted on Wednesday, November 24, 2010 2:33:20 AM by Scanian
The growing TSA groping scandal is another Obama political fiasco, almost a comical way for an American president to commit political suicide. TSA's groping of little kids and their moms instead of going for the bad guys who blew up the Twin Towers fits the narrative of radical black revenge. Now all the rich white folks are treated as police suspects. Let's see how they like it! Or as the hippies used to say, "Up against the wall, m-f!"
The cops are the traditional target of radical Left scapegoating, and even more so for Black Leftists. Obama showed it when Harvard Professor Henry Louis Gates, Jr., himself a racial demagogue, was stopped by an interracial team of cops while breaking and entering into his own house at night. Gates immediately cried "police brutality!," and Obama immediately fell into line. Stupidly, in public. Obama paid a political price for that knee-jerk reaction, but he did not learn from it.
Gates is director of the W.E.B. DuBois Institute for African and African American Research at Harvard, where they dig out new and ever more outrageous reasons to be mad at white folks. It's their version of "research." DuBois was a Communist during the Stalin years, and he was surely well-known to Frank Marshall Davis, Obama's surrogate father in Hawaii.
So Obama hates the cops, even the ones who risk their lives to protect black communities all over the country. In the TSA he has found his perfect instrument of symbolic revenge. If you remember how Hillary Rodham Clinton treated men in uniform at the White House, no matter what the uniform was, you'll get the idea.
Now everybody who flies over Thanksgiving, the quintessential American family holiday, will be dissed by uniformed cops, many of them black, because affirmative action rules the roost at the TSA. If you don't get the role-reversal joke, you're not listening to Obama.
You can bet your last dollar that Rev. Jerry Wright gets the joke. So do Louis Farrakhan; Father Pfleger, the Catholic race-monger; and everybody except Justice Clarence Thomas and Congressman Alan West, who are not laughing. Actually, they get it, too, but it looks more like tragedy than comedy to them. (Colin Powell, as usual, has gone missing in this one.)
http://www.securitygeneration.com/wp-content/gallery/random/tsa-touch-balls.jpg
rickrock305
02-27-11, 13:03
Do you even know what he's talking about? If not, maybe it'd be best to keep the little eye-roll emoticon in check..?
Not specifically, no. But what do billing records have to do with a man's citizenship status?
Chad, I admire your patience man. You have presented sound arguments and have only been asking for clarification of the hidden facts.
What hidden facts? There ARE NO HIDDEN FACTS. Its been presented in courts and thrown out. Its been pored over by countless lawyers. Give it up.
I agree. The man doesn't even understand the nuances of the argument and the complexity of the topic.
I completely understand. But the fact remains, the determination has been made that he is in fact a natural born citizen. End of story. You lost the election, grow up and deal with it. I'd bet my life had McCain won, we wouldn't be arguing about his citizenship status, which is just as questionable if not MORE SO than Obama's.
the determination has been made that he is in fact a natural born citizen.
No it hasn't. No court has reached the substance of the issue. As you said, the courts threw the cases out (lack of standing to bring suit). I think most judges do not have the balls to reach the substance of the issue because they fear they will be blamed for our inner cities burning.
Would it be bad if our inner cities burned? Or good?
Ahem.
President Obama must embrace Islam as a way of life or face the consequences of a trial under the Shariah Islamic court system, declared British extremist cleric Anjem Choudary. Choudary, founder and former chief of two Islamic groups disbanded by the British authorities under anti-terror legislation, is planning a Washington protest later this week in which he says he will call on American Muslims to revolt against the country and implement Shariah law.
More good stuff. Storing here for the later reference of all who may be interested.
Barack Obama, during his Cairo speech, said: "I know, too, that Islam has always been a part of America's story."
AN AMERICAN CITIZEN'S RESPONSE:
Dear Mr. Obama,
Were those Muslims that were in America when the Pilgrims first landed? Funny, I thought they were Native American Indians.
Were those Muslims that celebrated the first Thanksgiving day? Sorry again. Those were Pilgrims and Native American Indians.
Can you show me one Muslim signature on the United States Constitution?
Declaration of Independence ?
Bill of Rights?
Didn't think so.
Did Muslims fight for this country's freedom from England? No.
Did Muslims fight during the Civil War to free the slaves in America? No, they did not.
In fact, Muslims to this day are still the largest traffickers in human slavery. Your own half brother, a devout Muslim, still advocates slavery himself, even though Muslims of Arabic descent refer to black Muslims as "pug nosed slaves." Says a lot of what the Muslim world really thinks of your family's "rich Islamic heritage," doesn't it, Mr. Obama?
Where were Muslims during the Civil Rights era of this country? Not present.
There are no pictures or media accounts of Muslims walking side by side with Martin Luther King, Jr. or helping to advance the cause of Civil Rights.
Where were Muslims during this country's Woman's Suffrage era? Again, not present.
In fact, devout Muslims demand that women are subservient to men in the Islamic culture. So much so, that often they are beaten for not wearing the 'hajib' or for talking to a man who is not a direct family member or their husband. Yep, the Muslims are all for women's rights, aren't they?
Where were Muslims during World War II? They were aligned with Adolf Hitler. The Muslim grand mufti himself met with Adolf Hitler, reviewed the troops and accepted support from the Nazis in killing Jews.
Finally, Mr. Obama, where were Muslims on Sept. 11th, 2001? If they weren't flying planes into the World Trade Center, the Pentagon or a field in Pennsylvania, killing nearly 3,000 people on our own soil, they were rejoicing in the Middle East. No one can dispute the pictures shown from all parts of the Muslim world celebrating on CNN, Fox News, MSNBC and other cable news networks that day. Strangely, the very "moderate" Muslims who's asses you bent over backwards to kiss in Cairo, Egypt on June 4th, 2010 were stone cold silent post 9-11. To many Americans, their silence has meant approval for the acts of that day.
And THAT, Mr. Obama, is the "rich heritage" Muslims have here in America.
Oh, I'm sorry, I forgot to mention the Barbary Pirates. They were Muslim.
And now we can add November 5, 2009 -- the slaughter of American soldiers at Fort Hood by a Muslim major who is a doctor and a psychiatrist and who was supposed to be counseling soldiers returning from battle in Iraq and Afghanistan.
That, Mr. Obama is your "Muslim heritage" in America.
rickrock305
02-28-11, 15:12
No it hasn't. No court has reached the substance of the issue. As you said, the courts threw the cases out (lack of standing to bring suit). I think most judges do not have the balls to reach the substance of the issue because they fear they will be blamed for our inner cities burning.
See bold for the "substance of the issue" (or lack thereof)
See bold for the "substance of the issue" (or lack thereof)
All this means is that a judge did not want to touch this with a 10ft pole and decided the plaintiffs had no standing as a way to dodge it.
No court has ruled he is a natural born citizen. Cases have either been rejected to be heard due to "standing" or because they were bringing in "fake" Kenyan birth certificates etc, which has nothing to do with the questions being posed, namely, prove you are a natural born citizen.
BHO has not proven it and has decided to deflect it instead. Why?
The substance of the issue is whether he is a natural born citizen.
Standing has nothing to do with how the substance of the issue would be decided if any court had the balls to see it litigated. Standing just gets the plaintiff in the door.
Substance not ruled on:
http://truebluenz.wordpress.com/2011/03/02/notre-dame-law-school-professor-says-obama-eligibility-issue-should-be-resolved/
Charles E. Rice, professor emeritus at Notre Dame Law School (retired) argues that it’s “time for a new approach” on the eligibility controversy. He suggests the Supreme Court is understandably reluctant to rule on the issue, given that so far all cases have been dismissed for lack of standing or incorrect process. The substance of Obama’s eligibility has never been tested in court. He further suggests that the issue can perhaps be resolved by means of the investigative power of Congress. A committee of the House of Representatives could be authorized to conduct an investigation into the eligibility issue.
montanadave
03-02-11, 06:45
Seriously, dude, you need to give your Orly Taitz blow-up doll a day off. :haha:
ATLANTA – Georgia is the latest state to propose legislation that questions whether President Barack Obama was born in the U.S., joining 10 other states who have measures that want more proof before his name is put on the 2012 ballot.
Even though Hawaii officials have repeatedly confirmed Obama's citizenship, his birth certificate has been made public and courts have rebuffed challenges, the so-called "birther" issue hasn't gone away.
Read more: http://nation.foxnews.com/birthers/2011/03/02/ap-birther-bills-sweep-state-legislatures#ixzz1FTfAHfuX
rickrock305
03-03-11, 21:07
ATLANTA – Georgia is the latest state to propose legislation that questions whether President Barack Obama was born in the U.S., joining 10 other states who have measures that want more proof before his name is put on the 2012 ballot.
Even though Hawaii officials have repeatedly confirmed Obama's citizenship, his birth certificate has been made public and courts have rebuffed challenges, the so-called "birther" issue hasn't gone away.
Read more: http://nation.foxnews.com/birthers/2011/03/02/ap-birther-bills-sweep-state-legislatures#ixzz1FTfAHfuX
ATLANTA-Some Georgia lawmakers couldn’t backpedal fast enough Thursday on a “birther” bill supported earlier this week by a majority of House members.
http://www.ajc.com/news/georgia-politics-elections/birther-bill-losing-supporters-860164.html
So no one wants the Usurper to speak at their high school graduation?
The White House is ramping up an effort to promote a nationwide competition to decide which high school wins a commencement speech by President Obama.
An internal White House memo indicates that the White House is facing a shortage of applications less than a week before the deadline.
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20040100-503544.html
Even Democrats think Obama sucks:
Obama Has 'Failed to Lead' on Spending Cuts, Democratic Senator Says
Freshman Democratic Sen. Joe Manchin accused President Obama of sitting on the sidelines Tuesday while Congress debates "wildly different" budget bills that are expected to fail.
"Our president has failed to lead this debate or offer a serious proposal for spending and cuts that he would be willing to fight for," Manchin, D-W.Va., said on the Senate floor.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/03/08/obama-failed-lead-spending-cuts-democratic-senator-says/#ixzz1G2M4rqQf
Who would have ever guessed it? "Rising commodity prices are a direct result of the weaker dollar"
Rising Gas Prices are News Only to Obama Administration
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ac/20110308/pl_ac/8016032_rising_gas_prices_are_news_only_to_obama_administration
http://www.politicallyerectshirts.com/designs/obama-worst225.jpg
OBAMA thinks it would be easier to be President of China!!
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/president-china_554012.html?nopager=1
Can you believe this crap. The man is whining about how difficult his job is and would rather be the leader of a Communist country.
Belmont31R
03-17-11, 18:52
This is a coward....Obama has to ask the UN to do the right thing in Libya. Wouldn't just do it....now its probably too late.
Also something Ive noticed. People protest in Iran, and it takes him days to even get in front of the TV, and then issues a weak statement. Egypt protests, and he's there immediately with the rest of his goons telling the president to "leave now". Not tomorrow, today. Almost immediately, and Egypt is an ally of ours.
People protest and take military action in Libya, and this ****er is sitting back asking to the UN if its ok if he can do anything...waiting and waiting and waiting to where the opportunity is lost as far as I can tell.
So when it comes to friendly nations he tells them to GTFO but enemies he does nothing for weeks then sheepishly asks the UN if its ok to take any action.
I think a case can be made for the idea that the administration's dithering on Libya might be attributed to a significant, latent undercurrent of hostility towards England. Obama's overtly shabby treatment of certain allies- the UK and Israel chief among them- makes this theory seem possible, if not probable.
We get a bit of oil from Libya, mostly sourced on the global market. IIRC, though, the UK and some other Euro nations get a disproportionately high quantity of oil from Libya. Unrest in Libya makes things tough for the Brits, more so than most any other nation.
Every day, the guy shows he is really the Amateur-in-Chief in way over his head and out of his league.
Cagemonkey
03-18-11, 15:24
OBAMA thinks it would be easier to be President of China!!
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/president-china_554012.html?nopager=1
Can you believe this crap. The man is whining about how difficult his job is and would rather be the leader of a Communist country. Obama is actually being honest for once and is leading on his true intentions. Theirs nothing more he'd like, than to be a Dictator ruling over a communist utopia.
Every day, the guy shows he is really the Amateur-in-Chief in way over his head and out of his league.
Damn straight. He isn't fit to lead a girl scout troop.
Bill Ayers (commie terrorist) confirms that he, not Barry, wrote "Dreams of My Mau Mau Rebel Father".
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2011/03/ayers_affirms_he_wrote_dreams.html
Bill Ayers (commie terrorist) confirms that he, not Barry, wrote "Dreams of My Mau Mau Rebel Father".
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2011/03/ayers_affirms_he_wrote_dreams.html
I've heard this guy ( not Ayers ) interviewed before. He comes across as _very_ credible. IMO his thesis is likely correct.
I know a guy who knows Ayers and Dorn. He says Ayers is a plotter, but Dorn is a Khmer Rouge type communist would would just as soon slit your throat as not.
And now for the World's policeman:
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a319/fladj11/Obama%209/Obama-Fife.jpg
Cagemonkey
03-30-11, 06:35
Bill Ayers (commie terrorist) confirms that he, not Barry, wrote "Dreams of My Mau Mau Rebel Father".
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2011/03/ayers_affirms_he_wrote_dreams.htmlI like how it mentions that Donald Trump is the only one with enough balls to go after Barry and his birth status.
Update on the birf certificate.
A Colorado Springs “birther,” retired Air Force Col. Gregory Hollister, has Internet blogs abuzz with what may be an illegal foray into an online Social Security data base and how he obtained a copy of President Barack Obama’s draft registration from 1980.
...
Hollister said Tuesday a private investigator, Susan Daniels of Ohio, gave him what is purported to be the president’s Social Security number. He then accessed the Social Security Number Verification Service to find out to whom it was issued and to access Selective Service documents.
...
“According to the Social Security Administration, that number was never issued,” said Hollister, who challenged whether the president is an American citizen in a lawsuit the U.S. Supreme Court refused to hear Jan. 18 without requiring a response from the White House.
However, that’s the Social Security number that appears on the Selective Service documents Hollister obtained.
Read more: http://www.gazette.com/articles/springs-115381-colorado-obama.html#ixzz1IC8rj5L2
Obongo attended Columbia for only 9 months? He must indeed must bet the most intelligent person ever...
http://www.sandiego.com/news/opinion-feature-the-obama-birth-certificate-debate
* Recent documents substantiate that Obama only attended Columbia University for 9 months in 1982-1983, contrary to official accounts.
* FOIA and other requests have been submitted to the State Department for passport and travel records.
* The Selective Service and Social Security Administrations have been asked for documentation regarding Obama’s Connecticut-based social security number 042-68-4425.
* Investigators have traced the number prior to Obama’s [ending in 4424] to Newington, Conn. resident Thomas Wood, deceased at age 19.
* To date no government agency can explain how Obama obtained the Connecticut number when at no point in his child or early adult years was he a resident of the state.
* Investigations continue into Hawaiian infant-death records for sequential relationships with Obama’s COLB record number 151 01961 010641.
* The Nordyke twins have made public their long-form certificates with numbers ending in 37 and 38.
* There are several infant-death candidates that may have had birth certificate numbers issued during the August 1961 time frame. These efforts hope to yield more information now kept from the public.
Documents tending to show 'bongo's fake Columbia degree and apparently stolen SS no:
http://www.orlytaitzesq.com/?p=20018
And now Hermain Cain is asking to see Obozo's birth certificate.
Mr. Goodtimes
04-03-11, 22:41
why isn't this shit all over the news?
http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2010/01/ap_afghanistan_010710/
surprised he hasn't had a stroke or a aneurisym after hearing about his image being burned and stepped on like Bush's.
rickrock305
04-04-11, 22:53
why isn't this shit all over the news?
Because its even dumber than the "we never went to the moon" people.
Because its even dumber than the "we never went to the moon" people.
Notice that liberals never address the substance. Because there is no substance to their Messiah's made up resume.
rickrock305
04-05-11, 00:43
Notice that liberals never address the substance. Because there is no substance to their Messiah's made up resume.
Notice that right wing nuts have to immediately label someone as "liberal" like its a dirty word. This thread is 7 pages long because I attempted to address the substance, which you are quite short on by the way. You ignore the actual substance when put in front of your face. The birth certificate crap is a perfect example. Whats the point when one can't be swayed in the face of overwhelming fact and evidence? You think American Thinker, WND, and Orly Taitz are reliable sources of information. They're completely full of shit. I showed you they're completely full of shit. They proved themselves wrong. And yet you continue to bury your head in the sand and pretend its all good. It would be funny if you weren't raising children.
I'm really glad you care about all this stuff now that a Democrat is in office. I look forward to the days of a Republican president so you can stop caring again.
You never addressed the substance.
Notice that right wing nuts have to immediately label someone as "liberal" like its a dirty word. This thread is 7 pages long because I attempted to address the substance, which you are quite short on by the way. You ignore the actual substance when put in front of your face. The birth certificate crap is a perfect example. Whats the point when one can't be swayed in the face of overwhelming fact and evidence? You think American Thinker, WND, and Orly Taitz are reliable sources of information. They're completely full of shit. I showed you they're completely full of shit. They proved themselves wrong. And yet you continue to bury your head in the sand and pretend its all good. It would be funny if you weren't raising children.
I'm really glad you care about all this stuff now that a Democrat is in office. I look forward to the days of a Republican president so you can stop caring again.
You ignore the actual substance when put in front of your face. The birth certificate crap is a perfect example. Whats the point when one can't be swayed in the face of overwhelming fact and evidence?
What facts?
What substance?
Show me his real birth certificate.
Show me his college transcripts.
Show me the passport he used to travel to Pakistan in 1981 or so.
So far you haven't shown anything. Your statements have been completely conclusory with no support at all.
rickrock305
04-05-11, 14:05
You never addressed the substance.
Yes...I showed you the birth certificate, I showed you two newspaper birth announcements, I showed you anecdotal evidence from the doctor that delivered him, I showed you the State of Hawaii officials who certify it is real and accurate, I have shown court cases where this has been thrown out and the lawyers fined for abusing the judicial system.
If that doesn't meet your burden of proof, then you are simply irrational.
Yes...I showed you the birth certificate, I showed you two newspaper birth announcements, I showed you anecdotal evidence from the doctor that delivered him, I showed you the State of Hawaii officials who certify it is real and accurate, I have shown court cases where this has been thrown out and the lawyers fined for abusing the judicial system.
If that doesn't meet your burden of proof, then you are simply irrational.
You did not show the birth certificate. You showed a modern copy of th certificate of live birth. That does not show he was born in Hawaii. His real birth certificate that shows attending doctor, place, etc exists in the records of Hawaii. They only started using the certificate of live birth as you showed in it in the last 10 or so years. Why does he hide it?
Birth announcements in the newspaper mean nothing. I have seen local birth announcements for babies born in other states in our local paper because the family was originally from here.
You have shown nothing of substance.
You did not show the birth certificate. You showed a modern copy of th certificate of live birth. That does not show he was born in Hawaii.
As stated above, but I will repeat it for those with short memories, persons who were NOT born in the USA also have Hawaii certificates of live birth. For example, Obama's Soetero half sister.
Funny article by a guy who actually has a fake birth certificate:
http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/04/the_perils_of_a_birth_certific.html
rickrock305
04-05-11, 23:26
As stated above, but I will repeat it for those with short memories, persons who were NOT born in the USA also have Hawaii certificates of live birth. For example, Obama's Soetero half sister.
Show me these people.
And please spare me the WND and American Thinker links. Reputable sources please.
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