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GJM
12-21-10, 18:49
I recently dropped six HK pistols off with Bill Springfield for trigger work. I stressed the importance that I placed on reliability, and that far outweighed any reduction in trigger pull weight. Bill assured me that his trigger work would not compromise reliability.

After getting the pistols back, I made a functional check before test-firing them. The first pistol, a P30/S followed when I racked the slide. I then checked the second pistol, another P30/S. When I would lock the slide back, and depress the slide release, this one would follow about two in five times. I next checked an HK 45C with an LEM trigger. Intermittently, the trigger would stay back, and not release, when dry firing. The fourth pistol, an HK 45 with an LEM trigger just felt too light to me. The last two pistols, both HK 45’s with variant nine triggers, did not follow.

I didn’t bother shooting the P30/S pistols, given they were following when racking the slide. The HK 45C functioned on the range, as did the two HK 45 pistols with variant nine triggers. The HK 45 with the LEM trigger failed to ignite the first round, and about one in five rounds thereafter.

Since I happened to be in CO now, I made an appointment to drive two hours over to Colorado Springs this morning and get Bill to correct the problems. I confirmed my visit yesterday, and then about ten minutes out this morning. When I got to the door there was no response to my ringing the bell or knocking on the door. No answer to my phone call to his number. Finally, his wife appeared and said he would be with me shortly.

When I saw Bill, I was startled as he was very red in the face and forehead and looked quite disheveled. It wasn’t clear whether he recognized me, and he seemed to be slurring his words. I asked whether this was a bad time for me to be visiting and he said it was a fine time. I asked whether he wanted me to stand by and give him one pistol at a time, with an explanation of what was wrong, but he said he just wanted me to leave them with him for an hour.

I explained the defects in the two P30/S pistols, the two LEM pistols, and one HK 45 that had a somewhat creepy trigger after his work. I then asked him to repeat to me what was wrong with each pistol, and he didn’t seem to have it straight. I then took a piece of paper, listed each of the five pistols and what was wrong. I then told him that I would be waiting in his driveway, working on my computer, and that he should not hesitate to ask me questions.

As you might imagine, this was not a happy situation for me, but I felt like I owed him the opportunity to make the work right. In about an hour, Bill came out and told me that he had fixed all the pistols. I went to where he had four pistols in a box.

I first grabbed a P30/S, worked the slide vigorously and the hammer followed. Same with the second P30/S. I then grabbed the HK 45C, pulled the LEM trigger, and the trigger stayed to the rear. Bill took the pistol, worked the slide once or twice, where upon the trigger came forward, and said “I can’t replicate that problem.” I was somewhat incredulous, but calmly showed him the malfunction, and he had a puzzled look. I didn’t even discuss the HK 45 with the LEM trigger that was still dangerously light.

At that point, I realized I wanted to leave as quickly as possible, but there was no sign of the HK 45 I had left. Bill said he didn’t know where it was, and questioned whether I had left four or five pistols. I asked him to look at the piece of paper where I listed all five pistols, and their problem, and Bill then disappeared looking for the pistol, and came back saying he couldn’t find it. He then said that I should look around his sofa, which I did without success. He then questioned again whether I had left the pistol with him. A family member then arrived, and I explained that we had a missing pistol. The family member went and found the pistol. The family member and I had a brief conversation, at which point I left.

Since I have at least four pistols with safety issues, I will be sending all six pistols Bill worked on back to HK, to have Travis in Customer Service go through each one, and replace all necessary parts.

I make this report with sadness, but given the seriousness of firearms, out of an obligation to alert anyone presently considering using Bill Springfield for trigger work.

Belmont31R
12-21-10, 18:58
Sorry but not near the 1st time Ive heard of issues with his trigger work.



Sucks but I would NEVER send him a single thing to work on.

QuietShootr
12-21-10, 19:07
Holy shit, George.

KentuckyWindage
12-21-10, 19:12
I second to the HOLY SHIT remark

OldGreg
12-21-10, 19:13
He worked some magic on my P30, two weeks ago. I asked if he could clean up the long trigger rest, and he did, he got 50% of the travel out. I couldn't be happier.

To the OP... dude, wow. I'm sorry to read about your issues. It sounds so messed up, I would hesitate sending my HK off if I were a potential customer. I'm shocked!

021411
12-21-10, 19:14
I haven't dealt with Bill Springfield's stuff other than AR triggers but if I were going to send out HKs for work, I would have used Bruce Gray from all the good stuff I've read.

F-Trooper05
12-21-10, 19:25
I sent a P30 off to Bill over the summer and he did great work on it. This is the first time I've ever read any complaints about him. Sorry to hear about it, man. Hopefully Travis will square things up.

randolph
12-21-10, 20:13
Ive heard enough problems over the past two years that I would never use him.

Whootsinator
12-21-10, 20:14
Ive heard enough problems over the past two years that I would never use him.

I agree Randolph. Some swear by him, and some have this sort of thing happen.

CC556
12-21-10, 20:31
WOW! :eek:

I've heard of a number of problems with him recently, including an AR trigger that he did for me that was unusable. At this point I would never send him anything again, or recommend his work to anyone.

ranburr
12-21-10, 21:54
Is he sick, on drugs, or what?

Shotdown
12-21-10, 21:56
I had problems with his trigger work. I sent my factory LMT trigger and asked him to reduce it to 4lbs. When I got it back, the trigger pull measured 1.7lbs. The trigger was useless. I had 2 other friends that had work done by him too and they had a double fire (pull trigger it fired and fired again when the trigger was released).

Omega Man
12-21-10, 22:07
A good reputation is everything for a business. Once that goes in the tiolet, so does the business. Wow.

shadow65
12-21-10, 22:17
I was going to send an AR FCG to him but I've seen the same complaints over and over. Doubles.
He may have done a good job at one time, but that time seems to have passed.

Joeywhat
12-21-10, 22:20
He did a good job on an AR trigger I sent him, but he did botch a CZ75 I sent. First there really wasn't a huge change in the pull, and often times the trigger would not engage the hammer, sometimes it wouldn't reset...luckily the hammer wouldn't follow. Oh and a spring was missing (wasn't causing the issues).

I sent it back and it still had the same issue. I just ended up replacing the trigger group.

varoadking
12-22-10, 06:45
The lure has always been his cheap prices and fast turn-around.

I've always believed that you can have no more than 2 of the 3 - cheap, fast or good. Seems rather prophetic...

eternal24k
12-22-10, 09:19
Well,
I couple years ago I had him do my Sig 556 SBR fcg and had excellent results. This is disappointing to read, I considered sending him my P226s and P7, but I think I will pass now.
You are lucky you lived in driving distance, but even then it didnt work out.

Sorry to hear.

dccrimedog
12-22-10, 12:20
i have had mixed results with Bill. He is VERY fast, usually same day turn around and an honest guy to deal with.

That story is very disturbing.
Safety and reliability are my foremost concerns when someone is altering my pistols. I shoot HK mostly - and he has worked on a few of them. For the most part i am happy, but recently have become very dissatisfied. A USP he worked was having light primer strikes, not taking any chances I sent it back to HK, they called the next day to tell me the trigger spring had been cut down. WTF!?!?! Why would Bill do that, sacrifice reliability to reduce the pull a couple ounces. Unsat. The HK guy also said the spot weld he put on the recoil assembly and then filed down to get the barrel to lock up tight is putting "untested" stress on the frame. I had him replace everything that was out of spec.
I was pissed because I specifically told Bill safety and reliability were the priority. That USP compact is my carry gun, i would have been in a real sh!t sandwich had I needed it to protect myself or family.
Anyway, i wasn't going to pour gravy on his Wheaties in public - but it seems like more than an isolated problem.

Sry0fcr
12-22-10, 12:46
Anyway, i wasn't going to pour gravy on his Wheaties in public - but it seems like more than an isolated problem.

I don't get it. Part of the reason we're all on this forum is to help disseminate good information. And this information, while "bad" is good for the community.

Lucky Strike
12-22-10, 13:06
The lure has always been his cheap prices and fast turn-around.

I've always believed that you can have no more than 2 of the 3 - cheap, fast or good. Seems rather prophetic...

I sent my LEM P30 to Bruce Gray and it definitely wasn't cheap or fast.....but the end result was so great that it made up for it.

If anyone wants to truly give their HK an outstanding trigger i can't recommend him highly enough.

As for Bill Springfield I sent him a stock RRA trigger group and he made it into an awesome trigger for about 500 rounds. After that I got a couple random double fires so into the parts bin that trigger group went and it was replaced with a SSA.

Roadblock
12-22-10, 13:17
I found about about Bill on the HKPRO forum. I sent a P30 off to him for work and had some issues too. I mentioned this over on the HKPRO forum a while back.

It followed a couple times so I ended up sending it out to HK to have it fixed. Travis fixed it up for me actually!

I was never offered reimbursement or anything from Bill.

I think his days of working on guns are short lived.

Sounds like you have a real cluster fu__ going on there GJM... If it was 1 out of 5 guns OK, shit happens... However 4 out of 5? WOW! Guy needs to lay off the sauce when he is playing with firearms, that's for sure!

DireWulf
12-22-10, 14:16
Tale of woe...


I nearly sent a USP 40 that I've owned for many years (an oldie with lands and grooves rifling) to him for trigger work about a year ago, but didn't because an officer that I used to work with received his back from Bill Springfield with a very dangerous trigger condition. The pull was about one or one-and-a-half pounds at the most. My friend wouldn't even load the pistol, let alone fire it. I pulled the trigger about twenty times or so and was stunned that Mr. Springfield would let that thing go back to a customer in that condition. Back to HK it went.

Butch
12-22-10, 15:51
From Bill's WEBSITE (http://www.triggerwork.net/index.html):

"Satisfaction guaranteed or your money back."

Suwannee Tim
12-22-10, 16:04
The loss of a gun astonishes me. I had in mind to send him several. I don't suppose he is paying for the repairs? I am not sure I would be as restrained in my narrative as GJM.

operator81
12-22-10, 20:08
What's scarier? A butched trigger job by BS or a law enforcement officer having said trigger job done by a private gunsmith. This wasn't a duty weapon was it?

2 wrongs there in my opinion.

All said, I haven't had the nerve to use Bill's services and I'm glad I didn't.

This was my conclusion. I had sent him the trigger from my duty AR to work over. After I mailed it I called him on the phone and asked him to send a photocopy of his gunsmith credentials (certifications, etc) so I could provide them to my dept and keep for my records in the event the weapon was used in a shooting. He told me he has no formal training and taught himself by tinkering on his own guns. That was enough of a red flag for me and I asked that he simply send my trigger back untouched, which he did.

For me, if it is going to be used for any purpose other than pleasure, such as duty, ccw, etc, any modifications concerning the trigger or safety (if applicable) need to be done by someone who is trained and certified. I had some trigger work done to my duty P226R by Bruce Gray and he was more than happy to send copies of his credentials back with the completed work. Using Bill Springfield for your trigger job needs is a recipe for disaster.

NCPatrolAR
12-22-10, 22:49
I moved the talk of gunsmithing a duty gun to its own thread.

kartoffel
12-23-10, 00:11
From Bill's WEBSITE (http://www.triggerwork.net/index.html):

"Satisfaction guaranteed or your money back."

While a lawsuit stemming from a trigger malfunction would certainly be unsatisfying, the original $35 for the trigger job won't even begin to cover your liability. But hey, it's your money.

I think maybe Bill's word-of-mouth reputation has gotten ahead of what he's actually selling. Note that they VERY FIRST sentence on his website is "I cater to the weekend target shooter". These aren't duty triggers, folks. Sorry to burst your bubble. The fact that he has LEO customers does not necessarily mean that those LEO's are getting their duty guns done.

Another thing I noticed on his website... check out the picture at http://www.triggerwork.net/images/crown.jpg
http://www.triggerwork.net/images/crown.jpg

The text below the pic says "Barrel crowning services available, 11 degree target crown. This is the most accurate barrel crown available, almost all barrels have their type of unique factory crown. Above is a completed Armalite AR-24 9mm (CZ-75 copy)."

I don't know about you all, but my Mark One eyeball says no way in heck is that an 11 degree target crown.

G34Shooter
12-23-10, 08:19
No need for this...

Lets stay on topic...

B

GJM
12-23-10, 09:40
I agree, and as the person that originated this thread, I think it may well be time to close it.

Bill has clearly done some good work in the past. I hope he does more in the future. Based on my experience with a sample of six pistols in the last month, my in person interaction with him, and a number of other posts, he shouldn't be working on firearms now. I wish him and his family well.

Buck
12-23-10, 09:50
I agree, and as the person that originated this thread, I think it may well be time to close it.

Bill has clearly done some good work in the past. I hope he does more in the future. Based on my experience with a sample of six pistols in the last month, my in person interaction with him, and a number of other posts, he shouldn't be working on firearms now. I wish him and his family well.

GJM,

Closed per your request...

B