UPDATE "Problem" SOLVED!! My FN SCAR 16s /PVS-14/ Aimpoint M4s/ Surefire KM3 issues

[DocMinster]

Hello All!!

I have an Aimpoint M4s /PVS14/ and surefire millennium with KM3 led/ir head...
I am running it on a SCAR 16s
(PHOTO REMOVED..... UPDATES BELOW) any suggestions on set up??

I currently have the Aimpoint all the way forward allowing front BUIS room for flip up and PVS at the rear allowing rear BUIS flip up...

this has increased my FOV x300% in NV mode ... as I have to focus ring at infinity ...as a result my Aimpoint is almost non existent when viewing in NV because the PVS14 is not focused on the Aimpoint.

BUT I have difficultly seeing my dot on the highest NV setting when using my Aimpoint KM3 in IR.

when I had the PVS and Aimpoint up close together FOV ...was not optimal.

BTW..... I know a PEQ would solve this problem... but that is not in the cards right now

any input would help

[payj]

Sick ass gun...About your problem, have you tried using both eyes open when the aimpoint is close to the nv?

[DocMinster]

yes funny you asked....actually tried both eyes open .... closed near and far....thanks for the kudos

[DocMinster]

Hey all!

C'mon I know you guys can give me some solid feedback on this.

You are not discriminating because its a SCAR are you???? that would be silly. :sarcastic:


:laugh:

[militarymoron]

so, your dot is 'washing out' as the illumination from the KM3 overpowers it against the background?
not much you can do about it, i think, except turn the dot up a bit when you know you're going to use the KM3. or, only use the KM3 for longer distances.

[IPSC_GUY]

I haven't used a KM3 yet. How is the IR light spill on the ground immediately in front of you?

I run a SCAR with a Aimpoint M4S and the same mounting system for the PVS-14 but I run my Aimpoint closer to the center of the rail. I will try the forward mounting position tonight just to see.

But back to your question and I have a suggestion just to try out and an theory as to what might be happening. The reason I ask about spill on the ground in front of you is the spread of the IR light might be so much and so wide that the reflection is actually kicking in the ABC of the PVS 14 causing it to dim down as such you may have a hard time seeing the dot. I also suspect the extreme forward mounting of the Aimpoint might be adding to the problem.

My suggestion is to take some cardboard, make a tube out of the card board, the diameter of the head of the IR light and slip in over the head. Make the tube about 6 inches long and see if that redirects or blocks some of the spill and there by allowing you to see the dot better. This is just a test to see if spill if blinding your PVS 14.

Try it and see if that helps.

IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA

[rrpederson]

This is just my opinion. I haven't had to setup a weapon system to fight at night in about 5 years but, it looks like you might have to pick one way or the other. The focal point of the pvs-14, as you have already figured out is very finite. So you need to make a decision, either focus the night vision so that you can use it with the m4s, or focus it so that you can see everything in the background. I ran into this problem in Iraq a while back. I was issued the pvs-14 with a weapon mount, and a IR flashlight. The only difference was I had to make it work with a Ta-31 ACOG. I would imagine the two problems would be somewhat similar. I ended up leaving the night vision on the helmet and using the peq-2a to aim. I know you said you don't have one but that is one of the few solutions. You need to decide which setup best suits your mission requirements. In my humble opinion, I would say, if most of my mission involved CQB, then leave the night vision on the helmet and find yourself a peq-2 or something similar. If accuracy at long range is going to be the most important part of your mission, then go with the weapon mounted night vision route. I hope this novel here helped you out.


Richie

[IPSC_GUY]

This is just my opinion. I haven't had to setup a weapon system to fight at night in about 5 years but, it looks like you might have to pick one way or the other. The focal point of the pvs-14, as you have already figured out is very finite. So you need to make a decision, either focus the night vision so that you can use it with the m4s, or focus it so that you can see everything in the background. I ran into this problem in Iraq a while back. I was issued the pvs-14 with a weapon mount, and a IR flashlight. The only difference was I had to make it work with a Ta-31 ACOG. I would imagine the two problems would be somewhat similar. I ended up leaving the night vision on the helmet and using the peq-2a to aim. I know you said you don't have one but that is one of the few solutions. You need to decide which setup best suits your mission requirements. In my humble opinion, I would say, if most of my mission involved CQB, then leave the night vision on the helmet and find yourself a peq-2 or something similar. If accuracy at long range is going to be the most important part of your mission, then go with the weapon mounted night vision route. I hope this novel here helped you out.


Richie

Good advice there,

With his set up (or any Red Dot / Night Vision Mono combo) the mono has to be focused at infinity for the dot in the Aimpoint (or other) to be in focus.

I can't imagine trying to clear rooms with a Mono mounted on the rifle, that would be really slow, so your 100% on the money with put the mono on your helmet and aim with a laser. I know he said he cant afford one right now. About the only time I weapons mount a PVS 14 is with a 3X on it as an improvised weapons sight. but then again I cheat and use Dual tube goggles on my head all the time, as this allows me to see the Aimpoint dot as if it were daytime out.

Also the ONLY Night Vision Device that ANY ACOG plays nice with are clip ons like the UBNS SR and the like. TRUST ME I have tried everything, to include having the tritium removed from an ACOG.

IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA

[DocMinster]

Hey guys thanks so much for the input

this is kind of how things played out since I acquired the GG&G PVS-14 mount.

it was my first experience with a weapons mount for the pvs14 as when I was AD and in the sand box ONLY used my Helmet mount ..thats all I had, I totally agree "clearing rooms would be slow" with the weapons mount (man could you imagine... pointing a hot weapon because you have a weapons mounted PVS-14 at your teammate to observe a hand signal ...."bad form" to say the least.

so when I had my 6920...
I purchased this GG&G weapons mount. So I put my PVS-14 to the rear with an Aimpoint M3 directly in front of it .... with some electrical tape to obscure any light ...and without
Of course ....the FOV sucked so I moved the aimpoint as forward as I could and even with the forward angled A.R.M.S. spacer it wasnt enough.

So I went with a DD FSP 9.5 rail system tried to move it a bit forward....but you guessed it since it was not a mono Rail it really was not holding zero because of the rail shift (1-3 moa variance @ 100 )...AND the FOV still sucked as the FSB was in the FOV along with the aimpoint tube.

So for various reasons I sold the 6920 to my best friend who is a Federal Police officer.... I purchased the SCAR and the M4s.....

HERE is the root of the problem.....

I like the SCAR charging handle on the LEFT side of the weapon. but if I keep the M4s at the 50yard line on the rail the M4s "mount torque knob" is totally in the way on the left side. I know there will be some kind of racking of my knuckles when I charge my weapon.

So I moved the charging handle to the right ...moved the M4s to the 50 yrd line on the Rail.... being a righty it doesnt seem natural charging the weapon on the right side and supporting the weapon by the Vertical Grip. (BTW you cant flip the M4s mount to the other side on the M4"s" the battery tube is too low and interferes)

Sooo finally I moved the M4s to the front . I figured if they can do it on the Gunsite Scout rifle hey I will give it a try.

The result was surprising ....the FOV opened up about 300% and since I was focused at infinity on the PVS-14 the main tube of the M4s is almost non existent. I mean the FOV is really awesome

so here I am thinking man this is going to work ...turn the M4s on working good .... hit the KM3 ......wash out.

I tried pumping up the dot to daytime settings ..but I am afraid that it is going to result in a burn spot on the tube (after long time use)

So I am thinking here are my choices for a solution:

1) buy/TRADE for a different mount for my M4s and keep it at the 50 yrd line and sacrifice my FOV.

2) keep it all the way forward and pump up the intensity of the M4s to daytime but use it sparingly at this setting as I will only be using the weapons mount for Coyote hunting.

3) (and I know most Ideal) Keep the pvs-14 on my Helmet... move the M4s to the 50Yrd line AND purchase/Trade for a new M4s Mount.... and an IR laser.

So with that being said has anyone done any PEQ pricing and availibility...AND does ANYONE have a used LP Mount for my M4s they are willing to TRADE for a GG&G PVS-14 QD mount (first Gen) and an Aimpoint Torque mount to this now poor 41y/o Disabled Combat Vet college student :laugh:

Any further input would be appreciated

[IPSC_GUY]

The LaRue M4S, Aimpoint mount (I like the medium height) will solve the mounting issues as the throw lever is on the Right side. No more racking your knuckles. This will allow you to move the charging handle back to the left side (more natural) plus you can lock the bolt back with the left hand by hitting the bolt catch with your thumb.

As for washing out from the IR trying moving the light as ABSOLUTELY far forward as you can.

In addition try and keep the Aimpoint setting in the range of the bottom few clicks to still be night vision compatible.

Try these things and let us know. Your on the right track with the GG&G multiflex base. You can also use this base for a 3X magnifier down the road.



IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA

[DocMinster]

Well ...broke down and .....did the "right thing"


http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/q542/combatmedicvet/scarfinal.jpg


:dance3:
Doc

[IPSC_GUY]

Nice VERY NICE ! ! !

IPSC_GUY
SIERRA II ALPHA